Why Isn't Heart Of Gold Ranked Higher By Browncoats? by Jongsstraw

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Why Isn't Heart Of Gold Ranked Higher By Browncoats?

POSTED BY: JONGSSTRAW
UPDATED: Sunday, September 21, 2008 14:07
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Friday, September 19, 2008 1:48 AM

I'm certainly not a Firefly expert by any means, but I have seen the episodes at least 50 times each over the last 3 years. Every time I watch HOG ( like last night ) I am emotionally drained by the end of it. This episode has the most intense Inara/Mal interplay on a personal emotional level than any other. It's really the only episode that strips away all their mutual mind games, and draws them together to face the intense emotional connection they've had for eachother on the boat all along. I truly wonder what Mal was going to say when he was about to be truthsome to her. Unfortunately Inara didn't allow him to finish, and obviously her feelings and emotions came crashing down on her, causing her to want to run away. Even if I'm wrong on my interpretations about this, I still say it's one of the best episodes.

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Friday, September 19, 2008 3:06 AM

RALLEM

This is just my opinion, but I think the reason the episode “Heart of Gold” is not a more favored show is that there are too many other episodes like “Out of Gas,” or “Our Mrs. Reynolds,” or “Trash” to choose from.

http://swyzzlestyx.com/index.html

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Friday, September 19, 2008 3:27 AM

BROWNCOAT1

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

Quote:
Originally posted by rallem:
This is just my opinion, but I think the reason the episode “Heart of Gold” is not a more favored show is that there are too many other episodes like “Out of Gas,” or “Our Mrs. Reynolds,” or “Trash” to choose from.

Agreed. We did not get many episoded before the plug was pulled and of those that we did get, "Heart of Gold" just didn't measure up to the others. That's not to say that it was bad, only that it did not reach the very high bar set by earlier episodes.

__________________________________________
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Richmond, VA & surrounding area Firefly Fans:

http://www.richmondbrowncoats.org

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Friday, September 19, 2008 3:35 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by BrownCoat1:
"Heart of Gold" just didn't measure up to the others. That's not to say that it was bad, only that it did not reach the very high bar set by earlier episodes.

Ohhh, disagree here, HOG was great. Of the fourteen eps we got, I can only point to Bushwacked as a show I feel that didn't reach the 'bar'. Every single other is pure greatness, including HOG IMO.

Uberfanisall

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Friday, September 19, 2008 6:44 AM

NCBROWNCOAT

I happen to agree with Chrisisall. HOG is very under valued and "Bushwacked" is a bit weak when put up against OMR, WS,OIS, Shindig, Trash, just to name a few.

But the best part of "Bushwacked" are the scenes of the ball contest and the interrogation scenes. If it had included all of Alan's deleted scenes and more of the others it would have been much better.

http://fireflyfaninnc.livejournal.com/

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Friday, September 19, 2008 6:59 AM

COZEN

fwiw: Well, lady I must say --
You're my kinda stupid.

This one line actually drew tears to my eyes. After that, the emotional response in Inara's impeccable reaction shot to Nandi's murder is what completely sold me (well, actually justified the purchase of the dvd set) on this fine space western. Not that there was too much doubt on my account from the very first scene I ever caught of this show.

Perhaps not the best scripted show of the series, and certainly not the best directed -- given heavy competition with Oog, OiS... heck, several others -- but its emotional impact, for wont of a better term, just slammed me.

Having said all of that, OoG & OiS blow this ep away. But that's just pickin' nits.

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Friday, September 19, 2008 7:01 AM

WENDYPOPS

I'd say The Train Job is the weakest, followed by Shindig. Yesyesyes, Kaylee looks freaking adorable in that dress, but it's still a weak episode.

Objects In Space is eeeeasily my favourite.

And i refuse to rank the rest, i bloody well love them all.

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Friday, September 19, 2008 7:28 AM

WHOZIT

Heart of Gold is a great episode, but Our Mrs Reynolds is the best.

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Friday, September 19, 2008 7:50 AM

JAKEWOLFE

IMO... I just can't stand OiS... I don't know why, but it's way too... I dunno... River, I've no other way to explain it... it's too artsy/crazy for me... HOG on the other hand, I absolutely LOVE!!! Then again, any of the episodes that show the love that Mal and Inara have for each-other, but don't ever quite get around to showing, I love as well

OiS and OOG are actually two of my least favorite episodes *hides* please don't kill me!!!

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Friday, September 19, 2008 7:53 AM

WENDYPOPS

Quote:
Originally posted by JakeWolfe:
OiS and OOG are actually two of my least favorite episodes *hides* please don't kill me!!!

If you're that way inclined, you're that way inclined.

I'm just a sucker for the arty farty, deep and meaningful shit, me.

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Friday, September 19, 2008 8:00 AM

WHOZIT

Quote:
Originally posted by JakeWolfe:
IMO... I just can't stand OiS... I don't know why, but it's way too... I dunno... River, I've no other way to explain it... it's too artsy/crazy for me... HOG on the other hand, I absolutely LOVE!!! Then again, any of the episodes that show the love that Mal and Inara have for each-other, but don't ever quite get around to showing, I love as well

OiS and OOG are actually two of my least favorite episodes *hides* please don't kill me!!!

Whozit could never hurt a fellow Browncoat.

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Friday, September 19, 2008 8:45 AM

FREEBROWNCOAT

The thing about BUSHWHACKED is it shows Mal's personality. When push comes to shove, he riskc his own life to save others, even if they are Alliance. TO me, that is very important.

The lives of others is more important than his personal beliefs or politics.

HOG is wonderfully written in all respects and does deserve a better showing in popularity.

Train Job was okay but had little conflict to define the characters, just a hoot to watch.

Our Mrs Reynolds was great with the twist that came with the kiss. Beautifully acted.

Objects in Space was fantastic. Yes, it was different but the introspection and psychotic behavior of Jubal really made it. Having River come into her own as a planner, an Operative in training if you will, was the high point. The last words were great.

"He takes so much looking after."

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Friday, September 19, 2008 9:06 AM

JONGSSTRAW

I appreciate everyone's response to my thread question. You guys and gals are the best!

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Friday, September 19, 2008 10:06 AM

MAL4PREZ

You know, when I watch the first half of HoG I think: omg, this is so entertaining, why don't I like this episode more? And then the whole showdown with Burgess happens. The gun out of power, the scooter being run down by a horse... that part is just damned near unbearable to me. Which is sad, cause there's so much other good stuff. Like you say, the Mal/Inara interaction is beyond priceless.

In fact, there's so much other good stuff that HoG certainly is worth watching 50+ times, bad fight scene or not. The Message, however... apart from a completely fabulous opening with some insanely good lines ("They don't like it when you shoot at `em" and "Why'd you guys order a dead guy?"), it's just weak. Plots holes right and left. I can't buy into it.

Hmm. But I'd still rather watch The Message than, say, any bit of high rated shows like Lost. Or American Idol. Or Friends. Or... well, you get the idea.

-----------------------------------------------
hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left

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Friday, September 19, 2008 10:24 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by mal4prez:
The gun out of power, the scooter being run down by a horse...

So, uh, where was the part you didn't like?
The only part in any ep I don't groove to is the guy who Reaverfies himself in Bushwacked, I don't think he got Paxed...

Inara crying in HOG just did me in...*snif*

Chrisisall

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Friday, September 19, 2008 10:51 AM

TRAEHOVA

For me there isn't one epsiode that I didn't like, or that didn't "live up to" the other eps. Of course it would be unfair not to point out that, with only 14 episodes total and

no more coming, we've watch each one a million times and disected them to the nth degree. As such every episode is harder - if not impossible - to separate from the (amazing) whole.

So whether it is a few great lines, or a character-defining scene, or just a bit of heart-felt interaction between the characters, you can't really take any one episode away and still have the same, great sum total.

...or, at least that's how I feel.

Just for the record though, I really like HoG too, Jongsstraw. It's bitter-sweet because of the Mal/Inara ending, but that scene at the end is a defining moment in the series for me.

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Friday, September 19, 2008 12:09 PM

MAL4PREZ

Quote:
Inara crying in HOG just did me in...*snif*

Lord, ain't that the truth? I am so bummed about that - Morena's got acting chops that we barely got to see. So much goodness was in store for us in that dept... *bitter*

Quote:
So, uh, where was the part you didn't like?

OK, the gun looked chintzy to start with, and as for running out of charge... while I understand there might be a good Joss-joke like "ha-ha funny high tech stuff ain't worth a damn if you don't charge it" tried for there, it just didn't work for me. Because what kind of bad guy is Rance is he can't even remember to charge his weapon? Is this the badass that Mal wanted to run away from? Really? Bah. I don't believe it. Rance Burgess didn't do that, the writer forced it on him.

Then - a horse outrunning a hovercraft? Besides the fact that the shot just doesn't look realistic at all, can't a super rich guy who pockets the cash from an entire world and is really into fancy toys afford a hovercraft with more than 1 horsepower? Again, out of character and contrived. Sorry. I love Joss dearly, but that scene is just lame.

Go on, throw the rotten fruit. It's Friday and I have a beer in my hand, I can take it.

-----------------------------------------------
hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left

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Friday, September 19, 2008 12:35 PM

NCBROWNCOAT

Lets just say that every episode is much better than any thing else on TV right now.

http://fireflyfaninnc.livejournal.com/

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Friday, September 19, 2008 4:09 PM

FREEBROWNCOAT

Youi got that right. There isn't a network show out there that would compare with what onyonew might consider the weakest of FIREFLY.

None at all.

With this line there is so much said with so very few words! Awesome!

INARA
I wouldn't say I'm entirely okay.
I'm a little appalled at her taste.

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Friday, September 19, 2008 4:34 PM

BROWNCOATBEAR

Yes, I too suffer from extreme bias with regard to Firefly, and even though from a technical production standpoint Heart of Gold has a lot of cheese and boo boos, the fact remains;

- It is Firefly.

"Heart of Gold" is like the cutest little kid who you can't help but love, who got into mommy's lipstick and smeared it all over his face. You see him and laugh. You pick him up and hug him. You wipe off the lipstick, and next time you take him to the store with you, you drive out in the middle of nowhere and leave him there. Accelerating as you watch him in the rearview mirror, running to catch you.

Had Firefly continued for many more seasons, it is likely that Heart of Gold may be one of the few episodes that people skip more often in the DVD boxed set as they sit back and eat their Milk Duds and slurp their Coke Zero. But, we were short changed. We were cheated because God hates us. We are hell's children, and all we have are the very few, shiny, and cherished little episodes that the Great Christmas Pumpkin saw fit to give to us, and every scene, syllable, and nuance is precious. So precious in fact, that even the possible lesser of all the tiny few episodes we have is still cool as a cow pie in winter. Why?

- It is Firefly.

That's ruttin' why.

You're welcome JONGSSTRAW.

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Friday, September 19, 2008 4:50 PM

PLATONIST

I have a love/hate relationship with HOG. I love it, but I never watch it. It's an emotional roller coaster. When Mal is with Nandi, I want to scream at him, "No! Mal, don't do it!" "Inara's going to run away", but part of me wants to say, "Yeah, go for it, it's been a while for you" "Inara needs to face her feelings".

And then we get to the end, the screen comes back into view, and that pivotal moment, when Inara says it's not to be... and then we know she leaves... becomes sad and regretful, and Mal puts his heart back in his chest and turns into the cold bastard we see in the BDM.

Good story, yeah, a western with cheesy props, yeah.

The Message is my least favorite. It has a few great lines, but the unfilmed script “Dead or Alive” is even better.

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Friday, September 19, 2008 5:11 PM

KNIGHTREYEDER

Our society is too hooked on competition. Every bloody thing has to be rated, or in a head to head competition with something else. If we're not chosing countries, we're chosing states, then counties, then it's cities pitted against each other, regions, schools, classes, students, bloody hell!! Where does it stop? It doesn't and that's irritating as hell.

I find it much easier to pick episodes I prefer less, than to pick a champion from a pack that's already so brilliant. I won't rank Firfly episodes, suffice it to say Heart of Gold isn't on my 'less preferred' list.

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Mal's expression in the scrapyard when he first see's Serenity says it all.

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Friday, September 19, 2008 5:56 PM

TWILIGHTSEEKER

I have been thinking about what you said about HOG and can only come up with what it is to me personally. There are parts of this episode I love but on some level it disturbs me. Maybe I just dislike the Rance character so much I can not get past it. Please remember the immortal words..."a live horse is a pile a panic."

gentle journey all,
twilight seeker

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Saturday, September 20, 2008 1:58 AM

RIVERLOVE

I like Heart Of Gold a lot. One of my favorites for sure. Jayne's lines are all great and funny, River at the delivery of the baby, the Wash-Zoe having children discussion, and the series' most dramatic scenes of Mal and Inara. I like Mal's attraction to Nandi. She gives hints of her Companion training, and at times she seems to out-Companion even Inara. She can read them both. Mal's line about needing more than a few drinks to render his judgement blurry is part of that entire great scene of closeness that is pretty rare for Mal. I mean the man has some moves, but she is after all, hmm hmm , an easy lady. His respectful and innocent manner with her is very charming. I think maybe whenever this episode was rated on FFF, I think maybe some of the lady BC's voted it down, perhaps even sub-consciously due to a degree of emotional sympathy and personal empathy for Inara. Nandi's death, and the look that Inara and Mal have with each other over her body is one of the series' strongest moments.

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Saturday, September 20, 2008 2:53 AM

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Quote:
Originally posted by BrowncoatBear:

"Heart of Gold" is like the cutest little kid who you can't help but love, who got into mommy's lipstick and smeared it all over his face. You see him and laugh. You pick him up and hug him. You wipe off the lipstick, and next time you take him to the store with you, you drive out in the middle of nowhere and leave him there. Accelerating as you watch him in the rearview mirror, running to catch you.

"If ya put lipstick on a pig, it's still a pig."
Oh, sorry, that comment belongs in RWED, and ya can get in trouble with it even there. Couldn't help myself...

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Saturday, September 20, 2008 6:29 AM

RAYCHEETAH

I guess my taste is in my mouth, 'cause I still love The Train Job. That very first airing was what sold me on Firefly, and, flawed or not, Mal's chats with the Sheriff and with Crow are what did it. They defined Mal for me, and, by extension, the show.

-Raycheetah =^[.]^=
The enjoyment of any good thing is only enhanced by sharing it with others.

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=2&t=30176

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Saturday, September 20, 2008 7:29 AM

CHARLIEBZ

Exactly the same for me! I first saw The Train Job and then immediately watched it again. A first, that's for sure - never liked a show well enough to watch it over and over.

I don't really get the less than loving feeling for The Train Job.

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Saturday, September 20, 2008 7:35 AM

RALLEM

I started a reply to this thread very early this morning while I fed my dog but as I can see I must have not completed it because it is not here. I saw that some people had objections to "Train Job," and I couldn't understand why anyone would choose "Heart of Gold" over "Train Job." I think that "Serenity" should have been the opening pilot for the series, but as I think on it more, I think "Train Job" would have been a perfect follow up to "Serenity," because "Firefly" is the quintessential Science Fiction Western, and what is more perfect for that genre than a space ship performing a train job?

http://swyzzlestyx.com/index.html

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Sunday, September 21, 2008 4:44 AM

JEWELSTAITEFAN

1. HoG had a largely "western" image and feel to it, and F*x was trying to bash any western visage and kept refusing to air it, and Joss and Tim had to rework it several times, with the network still never airing it.

2. Joss re-did the script, and moved it in the chronology of the verse, inserting the Mal/Inara scene out of sequence of the rest fo the filming, crating a hodgepodge of scenes.

3. These reworked scenes were the last filmed on the entire show. The end of the show is a sore spot with browncoats.

4. The moving of the verse chronology causes discordance among the fine scripting of the show, causing some disturbance among browncoats.

5. No Alliance purple-bellies to antagonize our BDH.

6. No Hands of Blue to harrass/chase Rivernator.

7. No well-known guest stars as villiany. This ep's well known stars are allies, the whores.

The other questions you are implying or not asking are why were all the other episodes so good, so far above the level of expectation for TV - and that is another discussion.

Further, you must realize that after the final wrap of these scenes, everybody went home that Friday, 20 Dec 2002 and found the Pilot Serenity finally being aired on F*x.

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Sunday, September 21, 2008 10:32 AM

NBZ

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Ohhh, disagree here, HOG was great. Of the fourteen eps we got, I can only point to Bushwacked as a show I feel that didn't reach the 'bar'. Every single other is pure greatness, including HOG IMO.

On this we can totally and wholeheartedly disagree. Bushwacked was absolutely excellent and very very underrated. The twist where the cruiser turns up... now that ios brilliant. The story expands just out of nowhere and there are many points where things can and almost do go wrong.

HoG on the other hand... parts of it were IMO very close to being a parody of the rest of the series.

I would put it as probably the weakest episode of the lot.

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Sunday, September 21, 2008 10:41 AM

RALLEM

I will agree that “Bushwhacked” was a pretty damned good episode, and it seemed to have all of the elements needed to become great, but I think it was held back by other episodes like “Out Of Gas,” which simply outshone it.

http://swyzzlestyx.com/index.html

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Sunday, September 21, 2008 10:46 AM

NBZ

I think it is unfair to bring Out of Gas and potentially War Stories into discussions of quality of other episodes.

Watching in order, they almost make Ariel look bad! (I only really appreciated that episode after watching it on its own.)

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Sunday, September 21, 2008 11:08 AM

RALLEM

Quote:
Originally posted by nbz:
I think it is unfair to bring Out of Gas and potentially War Stories into discussions of quality of other episodes.

Watching in order, they almost make Ariel look bad! (I only really appreciated that episode after watching it on its own.)

That is pretty much what I said only more clear.

http://swyzzlestyx.com/index.html

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Sunday, September 21, 2008 12:52 PM

OPPYH

Because Firefly is a learning experience. If your a true fan, your constantly appreciating a different episode with each viewing.

Heart of Gold will be my favorite episode some day.

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Sunday, September 21, 2008 2:07 PM

PLATONIST

If you watch the episodes in order, like on the DVD set (as Joss intended) HOG succeeds in moving the story and character relations forward. I read somewhere that Joss said he had to keep reintroducing the characters in the earlier episodes through exposition, because FOX kept rejecting the scripts and showing the episodes out of order.

HOG assumes the viewer already knows the characters and that's why we get great moments like Wash's and Zoe's baby talk, Kaylee's lament, Inara's nursing to Simon's doctoring, Jayne's love of whoring, and of course the ending scene where Mal and Inara are laid bare, creating a pivotal turning point in the narrative. After all, she was just a whore.

On this basis, I think it's a solid episode. I just don't enjoy watching it often...too painful.

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