Hey- interesting discussion concerning Firefly at a Trek site... by chrisisall

And of course, I had to jump in:
http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=98221

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, July 7, 2009 9:04 AM

Wow! And nary a hint of rival fandom hatred to be seen!

I mean, what? *innocent*

*Kind of doesn't like Star Trek... At all*

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Tuesday, July 7, 2009 9:13 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bytemite:

*Kind of doesn't like Star Trek... At all*

Shirley not!

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, July 7, 2009 9:29 AM

Don't call me Shirley.

But hey, some of the conversation you got into about shades of grey, that reminds me of the "Is it okay to like the Alliance" thread that's lurking around here.

You know, I myself have some moral issues with the crew of Serenity and the jobs they take. But that's separate from their characters and personalities, which I really enjoy.

The problem with crime and justice I think nowadays is that few people are willing to understand, the people who do crime, that's not who they ARE. Criminals aren't born, they're made by circumstance. Only by addressing the environment can you help the people. Such is the case with at least Mal and Zoe, who after the war are broken, drifting, and directionless. What else would they do? Not just that they'd been changed by war, but Mal lost Shadow, I suspect Zoe's family and the ship she was born on was lost as well, they couldn't go home again. They had to start new lives, under a system that probably already considered them criminal and restricted the kinds of jobs they could get.

I can see where that guy is coming from if he's talking about wanting to shoot Jayne. Don't get me wrong, I love the big lug as much as anyone for the brand of machissmo and comedy he brings, but apart from the brief mention we get of his family and that moment at the end of Jaynestown, Jayne's pretty unrepentantly mercenary and a verbal and somatic biohazard.

But someone oughta ask that guy if he thinks Simon and River should be shot or hauled off and imprisoned by the Alliance. Or Kaylee and Wash, who strike me as innocents. And he'd really want to shoot a Preacher (the best, least preachy one EVER)? Think he's basing his generalized dislike on only a few details about a few of the characters, and missing the rest. Think he probably only really has issues with Mal, Zoe, and Jayne, and that even that dislike isn't entirely thought through beyond the ethics of what they do.

Which isn't all bad.

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Tuesday, July 7, 2009 9:51 AM

The guy on that thread (Laserwhatever) is just a polite version of the authoritarian types we see here every day. Surprising, since Trek sites are notoriously open-minded, in their own closed minded way.

I kid because I love...

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, July 7, 2009 9:56 AM

LOL! There's a guy on that site named Rush Limborg, BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, July 7, 2009 10:03 AM

PIZMOBEACH

... fully loaded, safety off...

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
LOL! There's a guy on that site named Rush Limborg, BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH.

"Intelligence is Futile"

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.com Now available on your iPhone

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Tuesday, July 7, 2009 10:05 AM

That's classic.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, July 7, 2009 10:51 AM

PDCHARLES

What happened? He see your face?

I just came REAL close to creating an account over there.

But then I read ur tagline here.

Screw the fiction, peeps like lazer scare the hell outta me RL.

Side note: After watching FF with an online friend with poor quality www.seetoo.com, I discovered FF was on HULU.

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Tuesday, July 7, 2009 11:06 AM

MUTT999

- - - - - - - - - - - - - -

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Tuesday, July 7, 2009 11:35 AM

LWAVES

I would love to see Mr Laser Brain deal with a really serious real life situation if he doesn't believe in shades of grey and everything has to be absolutely black or white.

What if one of his kids got away with committing a crime and then told him about it. Would he shop them in to the cops?
By his way of life he'd have to.

How can this guy manage to watch any TV or movies.
Even Trek was full of shades of a greyish colour. And if I remember some stories correctly wasn't the Federation also shown to be corrupt?

"I don't believe in suicide, but if you'd like to try it it might cheer me up to watch."

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Tuesday, July 7, 2009 12:13 PM

Yeah, he was too much. But that site is the place to go to get off your tech-talk.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, July 8, 2009 3:40 AM

RIPWASH

I kept thinking that Mr. Laser Beam was an incarnation of Barney Stinson. Anyone else see the "How I Met Your Mother" episode where Barney was talking about rooting for a character in "The Karate Kid" and it turns out he was rooting for that snot-nosed blonde kid? And then it turns out he roots for the bad guys in every movie?

Kind of the same thing with Laser, dontchathink? Rootin' for the Alliance and all.

I didn't read through all of it, but I guess he just couldn't take the fact that the show was written from a certain perspective. Not the "all is bright and shiny in the Federation" type of stuff. That it's from the point of view of someone whose whole life and everything (and practically everyone) he knew and loved were taken away from him by a government he felt was overstepping it's bounds.

*********************************************

"It's okay! I'm a leaf on the wind!!!"
"What does that mean?!?!?!"

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Wednesday, July 8, 2009 3:45 AM

RIPWASH

Oh! And Chris...

Found a shirt design you might like . . .

http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts-apparel/glennz/bc93/

*********************************************

"It's okay! I'm a leaf on the wind!!!"
"What does that mean?!?!?!"

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Wednesday, July 8, 2009 4:42 AM

ZEEK

I think the guy missed the point. The alliance isn't evil really. My impression is that it's a group of people who really are trying to do good. They just don't have the experience and knowledge of the outer rim or the resources to govern well. So, basically to the people on the outer rim the alliance is just a bunch of rules and regulations that don't work in practice.

I think bushwhacked is a good example. The captian of the alliance ship was wet behind the ears and went out playing everything by the book. After a brush with reality he realized that in order to do the right thing he can't work that way. He lets Mal help them hunt down the crazy guy. Then he lets Serenity and the crew go. That shows some pretty quick adaptation to the reality of the outer rim. It also shows that the captain was far from evil.

Just like someone else in the thread pointed out, most everyone views themselves as the hero of their life's story. From their point of view they are doing what's right. Not everyone will agree with that point of view, but if you can put yourself in someone else's shoes you can start to understand the decisions they make to some extent.

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Wednesday, July 8, 2009 4:45 AM

DARKFLY

WOW they are almost more hyped up than us over it

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Best forum ever, a small nice, kind,& caring community + News + Movie News & I'm on there, so come on over *WARNING WE WILL MAKE YOU FEEL WELCOME* AND if enough Browncoats join I am promised a whole brand new section just for Firefly/Serenity :D
http://s13.zetaboards.com/The_Castle_Boards/index/
Knightfly on Xfire, www.xfire.com/profile/knightfly/

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Wednesday, July 8, 2009 6:27 AM

JONGSSTRAW

Hey Chris.....I've been on a Trek-watching spree for about 2 weeks, one or two episodes a night.

Question for ya : When did Spock say "For the first time in my life I was happy." ?

If you know it, I also have a follow-up question.

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Wednesday, July 8, 2009 8:46 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:

Question for ya : When did Spock say "For the first time in my life I was happy." ?

Too easy- the end of Paradise Syndrome.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, July 8, 2009 9:15 AM

JONGSSTRAW

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:

Question for ya : When did Spock say "For the first time in my life I was happy." ?

Too easy- the end of Paradise Syndrome.

Very good.
I know the episode was intended as an anti-drug, anti-hippie commune cultural message. But when you watch it now, you almost don't want them to leave, do you? I would have always supported that position, the Kirk position, but nowadays I'm really hard-pressed to find the problem. If you could choose, would you want to live there?

In this episode, and other Season One episodes, Spock and others use the term "Vulcanian" instead of simply "Vulcan." Do you know anything about the origin/evolution of that terminology? Thanks.

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Wednesday, July 8, 2009 9:49 AM

Wow.

I may be new to Firefly, but where Star Trek is concerned, I'm proud, not ashamed, to call myself a Trekkie (not a Trekker, or a Trek fan). A Trekkie is what I am, and while I still have a lot to learn about Firefly and the Verse, nobody ought to mess with me when it comes to intimate knowledge of Star Trek (um, well, TOS through VOY, and the movies up through "Insurrection"): whatever the marketing people at Paramount wanna to call the goram crap they put out after Voyager, I'm tellin' y'all now, as a "way out there over the edge" Trekkie for over three decades now, IT AIN'T STAR TREK! Even my friend who LIKED this year's "new Star Trek movie" said she had to view it in her mind as 'alternate universe' in order to be able to enjoy it -- me, I read about it online, was thoroughly nauseated and simply refused to go.

Anyhoo, I digress, sorry. Being both a Trekkie since I was 9, and a new Firefly enthusiast, that's why this thread caught my attention, and, I clicked on the link in the OP and read what they all had to say over there about Firefly. No, I don't belong to that forum, I just read the Firefly thread.

I was pretty surprised by it too, but, obviously I belong with the group of Trek fans who love Firefly.

So, hopin' you all don't mind, I'd like to bring you some comments about Star Trek, Firefly, and exactly why I'm totally dying for this weekend to hurry up and get here so I can run a Total Firefly Marathon for my boyfriend.

I own TOS through VOY series on DVD, in their entirety. While I love and watch them all, my favorite Trek series is still TOS, but my very close second favorite is DS9. What I liked about DS9 is how we finally got to see life on a space station/starbase -- after hearing all those references to, but only brief visits at best, to space stations and starbases in TOS and TNG, I was just fascinated that a whole Trek series would be based on a space station rather than a starship. Not that I mind the starship series of course, but this was just so cool and different. DS9 was also grittier/darker than the other series -- it had those "shades of grey" that that obnoxious person at that other forum linked to in the OP was complaining about with regards to both Firefly and life in general. In that sense, I consider DS9 more "real" than the other Trek series. So why is TOS my favorite still? Because while I don't refuse, like that idiot, to acknowledge and even occasionally try to accommodate to RL's "shades of grey," I also have that longing for the impossible ideal -- if everything was black and white, how easy it would be to choose. I was an idealistic optimist when I was younger. Now I'm so cynical and jaded I mostly don't trust anybody and have basically written off most of the world, most of the time, as hopeless and horrible. The nice clean "optimistic" Trek series are the escape I need from RL.

My boyfriend (the only person in the Verse who is My Match in terms of cynicism, although he somehow retained a little more optimism than I did) --he's not the deep level Trekkie I am, but he likes it a lot (he's almost always asking me to put some Trek on when he's here), and DS9 is his favorite of the Trek series -- specifically because of the grittiness/shades of grey not present in the other series, which he says sometimes are "too nice and clean." So this is why I'm dying to show him Firefly! He's going to love it! He also loves guns and heist movies, so that'll help too.

Anyway I'd already told him, "Next time you're here, we're not watching any Star Trek, we're watching something called Firefly instead." That, plus telling him I'd watched it five times in a row and didn't put on any Trek at all for a week shocked the hell out of him. He said he'd heard OF Firefly since "some time back," but hadn't seen it and didn't remember what he'd heard about it. I babbled on with incoherent glee telling him how wonderful Firefly is and "If you thought DS9 was a gritty version of the future, wait till you see THIS!" and went on and on, I just couldn't shut my mouth. He was laughing, saying it sounded really cool and he's really looking forward to seeing it.

Two more days and I can show him Firefly...(and oh yeah also get something twixt my nethers that don't run on batteries..heh heh!)

~Yersinia.

"Call me if anyone interesting shows up..."

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Thursday, July 9, 2009 1:13 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Yersinia:
(and oh yeah also get something twixt my nethers that don't run on batteries..heh heh!)

Oh GOD! I can't KNOW that!!!

The laughing Chrisisall

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Friday, July 10, 2009 4:35 AM

BLACKOUTNIGHTS

I'm reading the forum over there now. Just reached the point where Yankster Boy (Laser Beam) wrote "depiction is advocacy" which has caused me to have an aneurism.

Haven't read on yet, but that kind of thinking scares the crap out of me and is what, if the mass majority ever started believing that, could result it ultimate censorship. I wonder what he thinks of Farenheit 451????

Depiction is NOT advocacy!!!! Some really great stories have been told through the eyes of the bad guy.

Oh, and let us know how yer bf likes the series, Ysermianiabba

"Keep Ted Turner and his gorram Crayolas away from my movie!"-Orson Welles in the verse.

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Friday, July 10, 2009 6:31 AM

MAL4PREZ

Glad to see so much Firefly love amongst the Trekkies. That Yankee fan guy is a hoot. According to him, the Alliance isn't perfectly successful because it's written that way, while the Federation works because... well, that's just reality!

Silly.

-----------------------------------------------
hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left

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Friday, July 10, 2009 7:27 AM

ZZETTA13

Just did a quick thought survey of the history of the civilized world and nowhere has there ever been a leading powerful government that has led their populous astray. I mean come on people! At no time has any parliament, I mean governing body told the peoples of their nation one thing while they secretly did another. Yepper LB has to be right, no one would ever do that!!

Z

Likely a F*>< exec

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Friday, July 10, 2009 1:34 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by Yersinia:
(and oh yeah also get something twixt my nethers that don't run on batteries..heh heh!)

Oh GOD! I can't KNOW that!!!

"Call me if anyone interesting shows up..."

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Friday, July 10, 2009 2:13 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by zzetta13:
Just did a quick thought survey of the history of the civilized world and nowhere has there ever been a leading powerful government that has led their populous astray. I mean come on people! At no time has any parliament, I mean governing body told the peoples of their nation one thing while they secretly did another. Yepper LB has to be right, no one would ever do that!!

YES! Exactly! (oh, and Z, I totally love your sarcastic-ironic style!) That's one of the reasons why I head over into Nice Clean Trek (TOS/TNG/VOY) when I'm in "I need to get on the road to Utopia" escape from reality mode because I just read the news of what's happening in the real world (world politics in particular) and something or a lot of somethings left me especially disgusted -- because, unlike real world events including, even though I'm a US natural born citizen, what IMO are bad/scary decisions made by the govt of the United States (or DS9, where they have an organization within the Federation like Section 31), you don't see the Federation deceiving its citizens (though of course you do see the bad guys killing and destroying, all so very nice black and white isn't it?).

And that's also another reason I love Firefly since IRL I do NOT trust, respect or admire my own nation's government or the society I live in (I'd leave if only there was someplace better to go, but I don't think anyplace in this world is any good) -- a lot of it for the same reasons why Mal joined up with the Independents to fight in the war against the Alliance -- not to mention what River said in the movie too, "meddlesome" -- which I actually see as a type of government which is actually a valid depiction of the kind of government we could really have in the future. When I see Mal and his crew living so rebelliously (up to and including harboring fugitives who aren't on the run because they're actual bad guys, such as wanted killers or rapists, but rather because one rescued and is trying to protect the other, his kid sister who was violated by their government!) -- for me that is an INSPIRATION, which is another reason why I love Firefly so much.

The Federation as depicted in TOS/TNG (not VOY: it's not depicted there at all really since the Voyager crew is stuck out in the Delta Quadrant away from the Federation) is the unrealistic wish I'd have for what I'd WANT the govt and human society to be like in the future, but the Alliance of Firefly is what I see as much more likely for future humanity to actually GET. Thankfully I won't live long enough to see it come true.

~Yersinia.

"Call me if anyone interesting shows up..."

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Friday, July 10, 2009 4:32 PM

CYBERSNARK

Exactly. Part of the conceit (in writerly terms) of Trek is that human society has changed (into something that actively selects for those positive qualities that Mal & company-who-aren't-Jayne typify.

As Captain Archer said: "a handful of very brave people realized that they could make a difference."

In the Federation, it's people like Mal, Zoe, Simon, River, Kaylee, Book, and Inara who are running the show, while the Badgers, Niskas, and YoSaffBridges end up pushed to the rim/arrested/in counselling. Jayne. . . Well, Jayne wouldn't fit anywhere, really.

. . . Which means he'd probably be an admiral or in politics.

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Friday, July 10, 2009 4:40 PM

ZZETTA13

Yersinia

Very interesting read you have there. I don’t want to come across as not liking or not having enjoyed Star Trek. I love the show. Fact is my sister has the entire box sets of the original series….and I have her first box set at my house right now ( I’m getting my youngest son turned on to the show).

My warped way of thinking tells me that those in power view everyone as enemies, not just the people on the other side ( kinda like in the TERMINATOR) I mean when you have people in the same city or living alone the same shoreline not trusting or getting alone with one another why should I expect the powers that be to trust their own citizens enough the tell them their secrets? Just ain’t gonna happen.

Power and control are things the ruling class mean to keep…..and if a few browncoats have to die then so be it. I do feel that most of the Alliance folk are good and decent people. It’s just the verse superiors in power are afraid of loosing control. One way to prevent this is to coral all planets and moons under one rule, ONE VERSE ORDER. That way the only information getting out is what is deliberately fed to the consuming masses and we are way to smart for then to fool us aren‘t we?

I do believe that LB on the Trek board was just arguing for arguments sake….when someone gets like that there’s just no arguing with them. You can’t ask a blind man to see the light. So he didn’t like Firefly…to each his own, he has the right. But he never came up with a good reason why IMO. Like Chris said, "just a purplebelly" that if the mayor of his town told him to move from his house because in his million dollar neighborhood property values were low….he’d do it.

Z: question everything

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Saturday, July 11, 2009 11:01 AM

I'm just heartened that such a lively (albeit smallish) discussion could show up on such a popular board (I got some folk angry by sayin' Firefly was what DS9 wished it could have been...

The laughing Chrisisall

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Sunday, July 12, 2009 8:50 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by BlackoutNights:
Oh, and let us know how yer bf likes the series

As I suspected, showing him Firefly WAS the righteous thing to do! I showed him ALL of it -- the entire series from top to bottom yesterday (we watched it from 7-something AM till 9:30 PM, only walking away from the TV set once -- we had to run out to Home Depot so I could buy fuses). Then we talked and talked about the episodes themselves, and the Verse at large. Then this morning, we watched the movie and talked more.

So what did he think of it?

In General:

1. He enjoyed it big time and was shocked that such an intelligent, well-written, versatile show like that got cancelled at all, much less after only one season, and he wishes it could/thinks it should come back somehow. (I told him I'd joined this forum and about how the fans had reacted to the cancellation at the time and what it took to get the movie even, and that while the series started and finished in 2002, the movie didn't come out until 2005, so alas, I personally don't recommend we hold our breaths waiting for more. ::sigh::)

2. He totally loved the Verse and agreed with me that this is a much more likely scenario of humanity's distant future than the one depicted in Star Trek.

A Few Other Reactions I Found Interesting:

1. Shepherd Book with that Mysterious Past/having all that knowledge about things one wouldn't expect from a preacher (and an identification card which got him lifesaving treatment in the Alliance medical facility) -- he told me Shepherd Book made him think of Garak from DS9. I mention this because Garak is his favorite character (maybe tied with Captain Sisko) in DS9.

2. Yup, he would've been a Browncoat in the war, he loved the guns and the heists, the living "under the radar...at the corner of No and Where), and yeah, agreed with me that how Kaylee and Jayne got to become Serenity crewmembers did slightly resemble and (only just barely LOL) beat his own history of "Weird Ways to Get a Job." (his work history is very colorful.) But, no surprises here.

3. In "Shindig," as soon as the swordfight between Atherton Wing and Mal started, he exclaims to me, "He's just playing with him!" (OK, he's got a friend who is a master SCA swordfighter, who he has gone to watch in fighting practice many times...so this ep inspired a lot of sword tech-talk LOL)

4. The instant Mal first saw Saffron in the cargo bay in "Our Mrs. Reynolds" (but before she said a word even), he said, "she's his wife, isn't she?" But yeah, finding out what Saffron was REALLY up to (after Mal kissed her and passed out) did surprise him, and he enjoyed the surprise.

5. He was also amazed by Summer Glau's range as an actress -- all over but notably in "Shindig," the scene in the cargo bay of River talking to Badger (one of my very favorite scenes, and we watched it twice together). And yes, he loved her dancing in "Safe," too. Her fighting in the movie just totally blew him away (exactly as it did with me).

6. For reasons that are too personal (and way too lengthy) to explain in here, the relationship between Simon and River (plus River's alternating psychotic/lucid streaks) hit him seriously "close to home" (we had to pause the DVD and talk about it on and off during various Simon and River, and just River scenes in the series). Although River is one of MY favorite Firefly characters and I knew that (a) he'd relate/find them fascinating, and (b) I remembered those certain aspects of his past, since we had discussed them at length 5-6 years ago (and it occasionally continued to come up now and then), I was really surprised at the connections he made between that and those past events of his own life. It inspired a lot of novel discussion between us, and even though we've been together 6 and a half years, it made me feel as though I got to know him even better!

7. I knew he'd like the music (which thoroughly enthralls me, personally), but he talked about it how excellent it was way more than I expected him to (I'M the "musician" in the "family," and while he and I have a good deal of common musical taste, it's not a 100% overlap).

I could go on with more we talked about while and after watching, but this post is already too long and I'm not finished yet, so I'll conclude this section by saying:

YAY! Another Firefly fan!

Quote:
Originally posted by Cybersnark:
Exactly. Part of the conceit (in writerly terms) of Trek is that human society has changed (into something that actively selects for those positive qualities that Mal & company-who-aren't-Jayne typify.

YES! And that's why I personally have so many issues with society as it is, in the real world we actually live in -- is because much more often than not, it's those who practice dishonesty (and other "bad" traits) who get rewarded, and those who practice honesty (and other "good" traits), who are punished. It makes me sick and ashamed to be part of the human race, and I need to escape to the world of Star Trek for the sake of (what passes for) my sanity, and why I find Mal and his crew's rejection of a society which is so much more like ours than Star Trek's, to be so inspirational.

Quote:
Originally posted by zzetta13:
I don’t want to come across as not liking or not having enjoyed Star Trek. I love the show. Fact is my sister has the entire box sets of the original series….and I have her first box set at my house right now ( I’m getting my youngest son turned on to the show).

You didn't strike me that way -- and cool about showing TOS to your son!

Quote:
My warped way of thinking tells me that those in power view everyone as enemies, not just the people on the other side ( kinda like in the TERMINATOR) I mean when you have people in the same city or living alone the same shoreline not trusting or getting alone with one another why should I expect the powers that be to trust their own citizens enough the tell them their secrets? Just ain’t gonna happen.

Power and control are things the ruling class mean to keep…..and if a few browncoats have to die then so be it. I do feel that most of the Alliance folk are good and decent people. It’s just the verse superiors in power are afraid of loosing control. One way to prevent this is to coral all planets and moons under one rule, ONE VERSE ORDER. That way the only information getting out is what is deliberately fed to the consuming masses and we are way to smart for then to fool us aren‘t we?

Yes, and I have to admit that part of my problem is my total lack of personal understanding of the NEED so many people (the ruling class, or those who aspire to it) seem have to be in power over others, so all the effort that governments (and corporations, through their PR departments and agencies) put into propaganda to try to make people think and believe ideas favorable to their positions is, to me, stupid. I don't give a good goram what anybody else thinks or believes: to me it's their business, to me everyone has the right to their own opinion and if others don't share mine, fine: they can go their way and let me go mine -- I am just blind to whatever the REASON is, why people, instead of leaving those they disagree with/don't live like alone, feel that compelling need to persuade others, and when that fails, use FORCE to "unite" those they can't get "voluntarily" through brainwashing (propaganda; be it governmental or commercial, in the form of advertising). The only actual justification of force, in my mind, is to use it against those who initiate it (imprisoning and/or executing those who commit violent crime, or defending against attacking invaders). But I just can't understand or countenance any of the rest of it because in my opinion, the desire to control others is plain and simply IRRATIONAL. This isn't to say that I haven't had occasional bouts of irrationality in other areas of life, but I have no experience with THIS PARTICULAR area, so therefore no understanding of it. I guess that's MY "warped" way of thinking, huh?

But yes. I may not be able to comprehend the SOURCE of the desire for the power to control others, but my observations do concur with yours that the people who ARE in control, see those who want no part of them and their regimes as enemies to be suppressed or eliminated.

Quote:
Firefly was what DS9 wished it could have been...).

This doesn't make ME mad at all! In fact, I hope to remember it so I can mention it to my boyfriend next time I talk to him.

Yeeesh. Time to end this darn "novel" by now. Besides...I actually feel like watching Firefly again!

~Yersinia.

"Call me if anyone interesting shows up..."

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Sunday, July 12, 2009 12:28 PM

Posts & peeps like the ones on this thread are why I love this place.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Sunday, July 12, 2009 2:02 PM

PIZMOBEACH

... fully loaded, safety off...

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Posts & peeps like the ones on this thread are why I love this place.

The laughing Chrisisall

Yessir, that was pretty special - thx for sharing & welcome Yersinia!

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.com Now available on your iPhone

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Sunday, July 12, 2009 2:34 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Yersinia:

Yeeesh. Time to end this darn "novel" by now.

I look forward to the next, actually.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Sunday, July 12, 2009 3:55 PM

Pizmo and Chris,

Thank you!

:::turns around and showoff-like models the virtual browncoat she got from another member of FFFNet on another thread last weekend:::

Oh, I forgot! Cybersnark, I can tell you where Jayne would fit in, in the Trekiverse: with the Nausicaans.

~Yersinia.

"Call me if anyone interesting shows up..."

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Sunday, July 12, 2009 7:04 PM

CANTTAKESKY

Quote:
Bytemite:

but apart from the brief mention we get of his family and that moment at the end of Jaynestown, Jayne's pretty unrepentantly mercenary and a verbal and somatic biohazard.

I think the point of including someone like Jayne is that people are complicated with many layers, and sometimes the outer layer is just he proverbial book cover. Ariel was just the start of revealing that Jayne can surprise us, as well as himself.

Whedon especially likes to challenge people's prejudices against characters. Cordelia, anyone? How about Wesley?

I am sure that had the series continued, Jayne's character would have evolved into someone who belonged on Serenity. He wouldn't have stayed that long otherwise.

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Sunday, July 12, 2009 7:29 PM

Oh, I don't disagree. I've likened Jayne to "Serenity's guard dog" in the past.

As he is in the first season... I can understand maybe how someone might think the world would be better without him. And I'm saying that as someone who LIKES his character because he's a good bad guy!

But I do think Jayne would get better.

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Monday, July 13, 2009 2:47 AM

CYBERSNARK

Much as I enjoy mocking Jayne (known too many Jayne-types in real life that I couldn't mock 'cause they'd hurt me), I think many of his problems might stem from an impoverished upbringing --he seems like a "wrong side of the tracks" kid (schoolin' was never much of an option, family needed money, so he went right into the easiest and most profitable business he could find; beating people up).

Actually, I think an educated, more "priviledged" Jayne would be a lot like John Casey --still combative, but more a soldier than a thug.

(So, transposed into Star Trek, I'm thinking Starfleet Security. Maybe Marines or Intel, but not Section 31 --he's too honest.)

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Monday, July 13, 2009 3:47 AM