GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Medical Question - Migula

POSTED BY: RAULENDYMION
UPDATED: Wednesday, December 4, 2002 11:08
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Monday, December 2, 2002 9:26 AM

RAULENDYMION


I must say that I love the character of River and the Ariel episode
has made me enjoy the show much more. I was wondering if anyone
knows any information about the supposed "Migula" (sp) section of the brain.
Is this real or just made up, also from what was said
on the show it appears that this has made River super Empathetic. It would
seem that the allience may be breeding empaths in an effort
to monitor activites of certain planets(an empath could sense a traitor in a room possibly too).
Or perhaps they are using them as truth meters like the
witches in Dune.

Comments Appreciated


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Monday, December 2, 2002 10:33 AM

NOVAGRASS


It's actually the amygdala. It's part of the limbic system (the part of the brain that controls basic emotions like fear, pain, pleasure, anger, sexual arousal, etch...). The amygdala helps in the process of memory by converting new information attached to strong emotions into long term memories.

Could this mean that River has trouble retaining information long term ever since her brain surgery?

Here's an idea:

When you feel strong emotion toward an event, the amygdala automatically stores that event in your long term memory. Since River has had her amygdala removed, these strong emotion-based memories wouldn't be stored long term. SO, it could be that River remembers long term the less emotional information (like the events that have thus happened aboard the Serenity), but the very emotional (scary, painful, ect...) events (like her torture/expermientations at the Academy) that would usually be interpreted by the amygdala bypass any sort of long term memory retention devices in the brain. This would be a good security mechanism built into the experiment by the Blue Hand Group... she can't remember anything they did to her because they're emotionally charged events, and since she has no way to interpret that information (i.e. no amygdala) she cannot remember it long term.

Keep in mind that this is all just a theory, and I have no brain research backgroud... so if any of you are the Head Brain Surgeon at Johns Hopkin's don't attack me! "You idiot, the amygdala doesn't control memory! It's the hippocampus! Moron!"

--Dylan Palmer, Pretentious Bastard at Large--

"Oh my god, I'm a hack!" - Joss Whedon

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Monday, December 2, 2002 10:43 AM

RADEGUND


Quote:

Originally posted by Novagrass:
It's actually the amygdala. It's part of the limbic system (the part of the brain that controls basic emotions like fear, pain, pleasure, anger, sexual arousal, etch...). The amygdala helps in the process of memory by converting new information into long term memories.



I found a reference to it in the online Gray's Anatomy at http://education.yahoo.com/reference/gray/189.html#120. Only a doctor would really understand it, but maybe some fanfic writers would like to cull some other official-sounding medical terms from the site.

Radegund

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Monday, December 2, 2002 1:24 PM

THELEFTHAND



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Monday, December 2, 2002 1:25 PM

THELEFTHAND


Quote:

Since River has had her amygdala removed, these strong emotion-based memories wouldn't be stored long term. SO, it could be that River remembers long term the less emotional information (like the events that have thus happened aboard the Serenity), but the very emotional (scary, painful, ect...) events (like her torture/expermientations at the Academy) that would usually be interpreted by the amygdala bypass any sort of long term memory retention devices in the brain.... she can't remember anything they did to her because they're emotionally charged events, and since she has no way to interpret that information (i.e. no amygdala) she cannot remember it long term.


From my limited knowledge, this is not completely true. The amygdala doesn't store emotion-based memories. What it does is 'charge' the body when external stimuli trigger it.

Pretend you were robbed at gunpoint. This would be an emotionally-charged event. If someone later pulled a gun on you, regardless of their intentions, your amygdala might fire up, causing you to break into a sweat, perhaps causing a panic attack, in essence placing your body on heightened alert. This could have a serious, debilitating effect. Someone without their amygdala might bypass this effect. In essence, operating without fear. This does not mean that they cannot be afraid; it simply means that they cannot be 'programmed' to be afraid during the presence of external stimuli.

The study I read concerned rats (they always use rats for these kind of things don't they) in a box. Upon the sounding of a certain tone, the rats would be shocked. The rats would come to fear the tone instinctively, regardless of an accompanying jolt. A rat without an amygdala would have no such reaction.

What does this mean for River? Who knows? The amygdala is still a mysterious structure whose purpose is not yet defined. Who knows what else the Alliance has done to River? Perhaps cutting out, or rewiring, certain parts of the brain heightens other attributes.

Did this just make everything more confusing? I'll add or respond as needed and as I discover more.

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Monday, December 2, 2002 8:44 PM

DELVO


Remember, they didn't REMOVE her amygdala, they did something else to it. Maybe the word was "stripped"? This could refer to something we're supposed to figure doesn't exist in current medical science. But her amygdala is still there, it's just not acting normal. When Simon says that she can't suppress and control her emotions like normal people can, that could be connected to the Hands Of Blue's goals, by removing interferences with her ESP.

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Wednesday, December 4, 2002 2:20 AM

PANIC


Hi all, just a comment.

No one really understands how the brain works. There are tons of theories, usually based on the weird behavior people exhibit when a specific structure in their brain gets injured.

Based on what I remember from neuroanatomy, the amygdala is part of the limbic system, which, as someone mentioned, helps to regulate our emotional response to events. It also has numerous connection to parts of the brain thought responsible for memory (chiefly, the hippocampus in the temporal lobes). Anything that is significantly more specific than that probably represents a great deal of speculation.

Cheers!

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Wednesday, December 4, 2002 4:37 AM

SENSOU


According to my friends (who took anatomy), you cannot live without the amygula(sp?). So maybe they modified River's somehow, rewired it so she would have different "triggers" like ape-men in tight shirts?

Sensou
Sweet is love when all is sane
Sweet is death to end the pain
Cruel is death when all is well
Cruel is love when all is hell

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Wednesday, December 4, 2002 6:37 AM

THELEFTHAND


While people may not be able to live, monkeys can. And I'm not saying your friend is wrong. As previously posted, they really aren't sure how the brain works in general, let alone what all happens when you start playing with individual pieces.

BTW: The monkeys lost their fear inhibitions. They would go up and investigate all kinds of dangerous things other monkeys would normally shy away from.

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Wednesday, December 4, 2002 7:49 AM

AVALON


Quote:

Originally posted by Sensou:
...so she would have different "triggers" like ape-men in tight shirts?





Hey, it's certainly one of my "triggers".

Oh, heck -- did I say that out loud?


Not sure if this is the right place to bring it up, but...I (and numerous others) have been assuming that River wigs out over "Blue Sun" because those are the people who did this to her.

What if the people who did this to her are actually some other organization, and they've intended for River to have this reaction to Blue Sun...?

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Wednesday, December 4, 2002 11:08 AM

ILOVEJAYNE


Quote:

What if the people who did this to her are actually some other organization, and they've intended for River to have this reaction to Blue Sun...?


Well, go and muddy it up for us, why don't you?


So, um, what would "stripping" the amygdala mean? That usually means removing the outer layer, doesn't it? Stripping paint off a car, stripping varnish off a table, stripping Jayne's clothes off ... Is there a membrane around the amygdala that could theoretically be removed?

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