Will we ever see an ALIEN in Firefly...? by Sardonica

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Will we ever see an ALIEN in Firefly...?

POSTED BY: SARDONICA
UPDATED: Thursday, August 26, 2004 10:28
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 10114
PAGE 1 of 1

Sunday, August 22, 2004 8:09 AM

Let's assume the best: Three or more movies, a new cable tv series that runs a full eight (or more!) seasons, continuing series, made-for-tv movies, spin-offs, tie-in novels, comics, games... the works.

One of the things that I LOVE about Firefly is its lack of aliens, and that it focuses on the human aspect for storytelling. This is just one of the many great things that sets it apart from Star Trek (don't get me wrong--I LOVE Star Trek too--well, maybe not Voyager or Enterprise...).

And we've all heard Whedon's joke about not wanting to do any more latex...

But do you think we might ever see an alien in the Firefly universe? Or some sort of extraterrestrial intelligence, life or signs of it?

Personally, I think that it would be awesome if we did somewhere down the road. Certainly if the story were a good one and were treated with the same unique respect with with Whedon makes his "space shots" silent.

I think the very fact that they've established that mankind has spread through the galaxy (or the solar system, lol) and not yet found any signs of life--that alien life is oddly absent from the 'verse--would make that episode where it is encountered all the more special, thought provoking and prescient. It wouldn't have that "been there done that" feeling that Trek has, it would feel fresh and new...

Plus, we've at least seen an indication (the "alien" exhibit in SAFE) that there is at least an interest in the Firefly universe about the possibility of alien life.

That's my two cents. What do you think?

A funny aside: When I first watched Firefly, it took me 2-3 episodes before I realized that they kept slipping into Chinese. At first, I thought it was an alien tongue--which might've been cool too.

Chief Editor, AFM
www.apocalypsefiction.com
Writer/Producer, The NUKE Brothers
www.nukebrothers.com

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 8:40 AM

FORRESTWOLF

My wife and I thought the Chinese was something made up for the show, too, at first (ah for the days that I was watching Firefly on TV...). Now, it seems such an integral part of the show.

I think there's a theme of River-turned-more-than-human in the show - the Blue Hands guys make me wonder what THEY might have been made into. I think it's more likely Joss would run with the time-honored sci-fi tradition of evolved (artificially) humans rather than aliens - and River's the first one that's not captive.

But genuine aliens? I'd be surprised. I'm sure Joss would do it right, but I'd be surprised. Vampires maybe :)

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 8:40 AM

CREVANREAVER

Quote:
Originally posted by Sardonica:
Three or more movies, a new cable tv series that runs a full eight (or more!) seasons, continuing series, made-for-tv movies, spin-offs, tie-in novels, comics, games... the works.

If all of that is indeed on the way, then I don't doubt we will eventually see extraterrestrial life in the series. I personally would be against it. I'm like Joss, in terms of intelligent life, I think we are probably alone in the universe or at least alone in this galaxy.

Check out these webpages for some good reasons why!

http://www.earthsky.com/shows/showsmore.php?t=20020225

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_6_24/ai_66496170

http://www.christiantrumpetsounding.com/evol_3.htm

http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/docs/rare_intelligent_life.html

http://astrobiology.arc.nasa.gov/news/expandnews.cfm?id=352

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 8:50 AM

SARDONICA

^Christian Trumpetsounding aside, I would be amazed if we were alone in the universe (or galaxy). The fundamental flaw with in the thinking of such books as "Rare Earth" (the topic of several of your links) is the premise that life can only develop on a world similar to Earth. This is a close-minded and flawed presumption. And don't get me started on all the problems with Christian Creationism...! But then, the two points you mentioned are mutually exclusive, no?

If one is to believe in Creationism, then "God" would be able to create life whenever, wherever he wanted--despite the theories put forth in "Rare Earth." But if one were to follow the pseudoscience of "Rare Earth" which attempts to set conditions for the evolution of life, then it would defy a belief in Creationism.

But I'd much rather stay on topic. Here's a thought re: alien life in the Firefly verse:

Do you think that all of the plants (and perhaps the molds, funguses, animals, fish, etc.) that exist on all the worlds in Firefly were brought from Earth-that-was, or do you think some may have been indigenous to the worlds?

In fact, these disease mentioned in The Train Job *may* have been an extraterrestrial virus or germ...

Chief Editor, AFM
www.apocalypsefiction.com
Writer/Producer, The NUKE Brothers
www.nukebrothers.com

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 9:50 AM

CHRONICTHEHEDGEHOG

No. I don't think we'll ever see alien life in firefly. In the intelligent, person style way anyway. I think it would destroy the whole point of the show, the idea that it's now just with more technology.

I don't even think we've seen alien plants (or alien in the sense they were already there). I think the different diseases and plants we've seen are the results of existing organisms adapting to the new environments of the terraformed worlds.

check out my WIP firefly roleplay system at www.estador.co.uk/firefly

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 9:59 AM

CREVANREAVER

Quote:
Originally posted by Sardonica:
Do you think that all of the plants (and perhaps the molds, funguses, animals, fish, etc.) that exist on all the worlds in Firefly were brought from Earth-that-was, or do you think some may have been indigenous to the worlds?

Plants, molds, fungae, horses, fish, etc. are by themselves Earth organisms. Parallel evolution could not have created them on other worlds. Even if alien life actually does exist, it would most likely be unlike anything we have ever seen or even imagined.

I'm with Chronicthehedgehog, all of those things and even the germs must have originally come from Earth and the plants are the result of terraforming.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 10:17 AM

SARDONICA

Quote:
Originally posted by CrevanReaver:
Quote:
Even if alien life actually does exist, it would most likely be unlike anything we have ever seen or even imagined.

Agreed. That's why I think Firefly has a great opportunity to do right what Trek and so many others have done wrong. ;)

Chief Editor, AFM
www.apocalypsefiction.com
Writer/Producer, The NUKE Brothers
www.nukebrothers.com

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 10:17 AM

SARDONICA

Quote:
Originally posted by CrevanReaver:
Quote:
Even if alien life actually does exist, it would most likely be unlike anything we have ever seen or even imagined.

Agreed. That's why I think Firefly has a great opportunity to do right what Trek and so many others have done wrong. ;)

Chief Editor, AFM
www.apocalypsefiction.com
Writer/Producer, The NUKE Brothers
www.nukebrothers.com

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 10:24 AM

THEREALME

For the most part, I agree that intelligent alien life is not really a part of Firefly.

BUT...

I think that Joss could do an EXCELLENT First Contact story with the crew.

No not, "Oh, THESE are the Gobuluns who have a ridge on their nose and eat grass, and THOSE are the Tortanis that have a ridge on their head and don't speak during the night..."

No, Joss could do something wonderous if he had a mind to.

A real, ALIEN first contact.

The Real Me

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 10:25 AM

CREVANREAVER

If your interested in the field of exobiology, here is a great webpage with theories on what the ecology might be like on an alien world.

http://www.contact-conference.com/archive/epona.html

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 11:59 AM

SERGEANTX

Personally, I hope not. One of the things that's made Firefly so refreshingly different is that, in many respects, its not actually science fiction. By that I mean that Firefly doesn't center its stories around imagined scientific discoveries. Even when technology does play a part, its nothing that isn't directly analagous to problems that we all deal with already(I'm thinkin of OOG here).

I've noticed this particularly running a Firefly RPG(tabletop variety). Its so easy to fall back on standard sci-fi plots (crew discovers new technology/race/phenomenon and then must deal with the resulting challenges), but whenever I do, it just doesn't seem like Firefly anymore. Firefly stories need to center around the timeless, human characters that struggle with problems all too similar to our own.

When the focus moves away from the characters and their lives and addresses the more typical sci-fi premises and hypotheticals, it loses the very thing that's made Firefly so special.

SergeantX

"Dream a little dream or you can live a little dream. I'd rather live it, cause dreamers always chase but never get it." Aesop Rock

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 12:47 PM

STANDING8

please, no aliens.

-Soul Rebel-

a love supreme dreaming...

http://www.livejournal.com/users/standing8

updated: 7/30/04!

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 12:51 PM

WILLOWY

Nope. Joss says nope:

"Human beings are a lot scarier than any monsters or aliens you can dream up."

And he's very definite about not cross-versing.

I say DARN. I think it could be great. For one thing, Mal is just about the only male character in the Jossverse man enough for Buffy. I've posted this elsewhere too, but wouldn't they just be perfect?

"Once, in flight school, I was laconic..."

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 1:03 PM

STARPILOTGRAINGER

I wouldn't be surprised if it happened way down the line, if there were a series, but I don't think it's likely wtih the current state of affairs. I really wouldn't mind seeing some kind of out-of-continuity story where the crew makes the first alien contact, but I don't think it should be part of the series.

But, to attempt to steer this thread completely off course (and because my mind wandered there when I saw the title).

Let's say it's the episode Bushwacked, or a situation like it. Abandoned derelict, one survivor. Except, the crew's just been back from an exploration mission at the edge of the known 'verse, and has made the first contact with an alien race. Yay. Unfortunately, it's the race from the Alien movies. And the survivor's infected with a chestburster. They take him on Serenity, not knowing what's going on...

What happens next? ;)

Star Pilot Grainger
"Remember, the enemy's gate is down."
LJ: http://www.livejournal.com/users/newnumber6
http://www.unreachablestar.net - Comics & SF News/Reviews/Opinions

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 1:54 PM

CALHOUN

Quote:
StarPilotGrainger wrote:
Sunday, August 22, 2004 13:03

Let's say it's the episode Bushwacked, or a situation like it. Abandoned derelict, one survivor. Except, the crew's just been back from an exploration mission at the edge of the known 'verse, and has made the first contact with an alien race. Yay. Unfortunately, it's the race from the Alien movies. And the survivor's infected with a chestburster. They take him on Serenity, not knowing what's going on...

What happens next? ;)

YES!

That would be perfect!

My 2 most favourite Sci-Fi shows, Firefly and Aliens.

I'd never even entertained the idea of interlinking Sci-Fi like this but now... WOW! That would be awesome...

The whole Alliance thing would have to be revisited though as they would be the least of the crews worries with those Aliens about.

I love Firefly the way it is but I still believe there is merit in the idea of bringing aliens onboard(so to speak).

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 3:02 PM

LOSTINTHEVERSE

Maybe we already have... there's all this talk of Inara's secret, eh? Maybe that syringe she had in the pilot was really some sort of alien nutrition supplement that she needs to maintain her health and/or humanesque physique.

More to the point, I think we should ask ourselves:
Will there ever be vampires or demons in firefly? there's already been an Angel stunt double.

~ Lost In The 'Verse

"About a year before we met, I spent 6 months on a moon where the primary form of recreation was juggling geese. My hand to god. Baby geese. Goslings. They were juggled!"

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 3:02 PM

LOSTINTHEVERSE

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 4:35 PM

WITLESSCHUM

Naw, nothing more supernatural than ESP was Joss's pronouncement.

Dan

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 5:28 PM

DIEGO

Quote:
Originally posted by CrevanReaver:
Plants, molds, fungae, horses, fish, etc. are by themselves Earth organisms. Parallel evolution could not have created them on other worlds. Even if alien life actually does exist, it would most likely be unlike anything we have ever seen or even imagined.

You took the words out of my mouth, CrevanReaver. I agree with Sardonica that the rare Earths idea does not put the nail in the coffin of extraterrestrial life that some people assume it does. But I also agree with CreevanReaver, that it would be very weird for any of the colony worlds to have evolved life that looks identical to Earth life.

This is another example of what Joss has gotten right and Star Trek hasn't. Nearly every world the Enterprise crew visited seemed to have independently evolved habitats strangely similar to southern California (when the worlds weren't entirely papier-mache). With terraforming, it makes sense that many of the worlds will look quite similar. They have to pass through the same stages in the same process and will most likely start with the same introduced "seed" species.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, August 22, 2004 8:35 PM

REGINLEIF

Quote:
Originally posted by chronicthehedgehog:
No. I don't think we'll ever see alien life in firefly. In the intelligent, person style way anyway. I think it would destroy the whole point of the show, the idea that it's now just with more technology.

I don't even think we've seen alien plants (or alien in the sense they were already there). I think the different diseases and plants we've seen are the results of existing organisms adapting to the new environments of the terraformed worlds.

Exactly what I think. Firefly is (among other things, of course) about the ways the human race evolved. An alien just won't fit in FFverse. I think one of the things Joss is trying to tell us is: "Hey guys, look - no aliens, no unknown races, and still many types of personalities." The human race is complicated enough. We don't need aliens to be mean or funny or weird, there are people like that.

You can't take the sky from me.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Monday, August 23, 2004 2:40 AM

BROWNCOAT1

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

Aliens? God I hope not!

Aliens are fine and dandy in Star Trek, Stargate (SG1 & Atlantis), but I don't want them in Firefly. To me, Firefly is about humanity and our trek through the stars, trying to find a new home, and our BDHs trying to stay beyond the reach of the Alliance. Aliens would just gum up the storyline.

"May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one."

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Monday, August 23, 2004 6:10 AM

CORWYN

Non-terrestrial life seems unlikely.

There should be none on terra-formed planets (or moons), if the terra-formers have done their job correctly. Either they start with a lifeless planet, or they clean it first, anything else is suicide. There are enough problems without life.

Bowden's could be a new 'terrestrial' disease. 500 years and 70 planets is plenty for lots of new diseases. We get many on only one planet. Firefly has 70 worlds each with its own quirks, all in constant contact. With our heros acting to circumvent any controls on cross-contamination.

_Rare Earth_ has been shown to be false in the firefly universe. 70+ earths in close proximity contradicts the conclusion. So there isn't much point in using as an arguments about that universe.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Monday, August 23, 2004 8:53 AM

TETHYS

Quote:
Originally posted by CrevanReaver:
Quote:
Originally posted by Sardonica:
Do you think that all of the plants (and perhaps the molds, funguses, animals, fish, etc.) that exist on all the worlds in Firefly were brought from Earth-that-was, or do you think some may have been indigenous to the worlds?

Plants, molds, fungae, horses, fish, etc. are by themselves Earth organisms. Parallel evolution could not have created them on other worlds. Even if alien life actually does exist, it would most likely be unlike anything we have ever seen or even imagined.
B]

Actually, there have been scientistws studying that factor of life on and off planet. It seems as though lifeforms do exist in "uninhabitable" regions of Earth, such as pools of acid. There has also been evidence of SIMILAR lifeforms on mars, and one of Jupiter's moons. And before ya attempt to debunk that, bear in mind the source: CNN and the Discovery channel.

Not so much as Humans, but as FREE-THINKING individuals, can we assume that we are the pinnacle of creation. Like humans are all that great, to be honest. We lie, cheat, steal, and slaughter ourselves on a wholesale level EVERY DAY.

And besides, the idea that life can only exist on earth is near to saying that there is no life after death (or there is, for that matter). The simple answer that no one wants to truly admit about the question: "Is there life on other planets?"
is this: "I don't know" anyone that tells you otherwise is simply STATING AN OPINION. No one knows the answer, PERIOD. If we knew the answer, then we would be traveling to other worlds, and vacationing on Alpha Centauri, or something.

The idea for no aliens in FF was a very refreshing idea for a show, and one that remains to me to be integral to the story, so I am not disputing that part of it, just simly the closed-mindedness of others (not neccessarily Joss).

"Your mouth is talking. Might wanna see to that"

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Monday, August 23, 2004 10:21 AM

TMURRIE

Well no necessarily aliens, like humanoids from Rigel-etc or whatever. But maybe anciet alien artifacts or old ruins of alien cities on a far out rim planet. Not intact buildings. But hints that there was something there a long long time ago. And who knows maybe that could have been what Bluesun bases all of its research and testing on. Old alien clues of life on other planets. But I could be completly wrong.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, August 24, 2004 5:32 AM

MICHIZURE

The problem I have with most "aliens" in science fiction is that they aren't -- alien, that is. Most of the time they are thinly disguised human subcultures, adopted to give the narrative a slightly altered perspective. That's okay for a start, but the device wears out pretty rapidly if that's all it's asked to do.

The Rare Earth hypothesis makes too many unwarranted worst case assumptions for me: it's possible, but not terribly convincing. As already pointed out, the number of terraformable worlds in Firefly points strongly in the opposite direction.

I wouldn't mind seeing a limited, really alien alien presence in Firefly. It would have to be weird and incomprehensible, except as a "black box" (i.e., stimulus "A" produces response "B," but no one knows why). Ultimately, the narrative function would be to show us the back of our own heads: it's hard to define what it is to be human, if there's nothing to which to compare.

The best approach (from a story perspective) would be a tenuous, uncertain, X-Files style contact, where no one is certain of what happened. Here's a twisted thought: what if Blue Sun were already aware of these weird aliens, and was crash-developing human psychics as a means of either communication or defense?

--------
Kotoba yori tashika na koto michizure ni shite.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, August 24, 2004 6:08 AM

SARDONICA

Quote:
I wouldn't mind seeing a limited, really alien alien presence in Firefly. It would have to be weird and incomprehensible, except as a "black box" (i.e., stimulus "A" produces response "B," but no one knows why). Ultimately, the narrative function would be to show us the back of our own heads: it's hard to define what it is to be human, if there's nothing to which to compare.

I agree 100%

Chief Editor, AFM
www.apocalypsefiction.com
Writer/Producer, The NUKE Brothers
www.nukebrothers.com

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, August 24, 2004 8:41 AM

KASUO

Quote:
Originally posted by Sardonica:
In fact, these disease mentioned in The Train Job *may* have been an extraterrestrial virus or germ...

I don't know if Bodance (sp?) was a disease so much as a condition. It was said that the miners and townsfolk got it from the ore processors mixing with "air down there", or something to that effect. Sounds like a pollutant with a degenerative side-effect.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, August 24, 2004 12:19 PM

I think I'd have a heart attack if an alien showed up in Firefly. Not just from the surprise, but also from my heart breaking at the show's wonderful premise being spectacularly and magnificently buggered up.

Seriously, it just goes against every single grain Firefly has.

Although a story where they think they've found aliens but it's actually something else, all tense and creepy and shadows zipping about; now that might be good.

JK

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, August 24, 2004 1:37 PM

THEGREYJEDI

There will be no aliens and monsters outside of the range of humans in the Firefly 'verse. Joss has said so. Many times. But to veer off that for a moment, I think that any life encountered that's not human, as we stated before, might be something wholly new. Like in Babylon 5, there was the race of aliens what lived in an atmosphere wholly toxic to humans and other similar breathing species that had a whole gamut of psychic abilities. But the Boden's Disease was a matter of pollution. And All of the planets, save maybe a bare few, were completely uninhabitable by human terms before terraforming. I think the only 'aliens' we'll see are Reavers and those BlueSun 'adjusted' humans. That's it. Those and Book's hair.

--------------------------------------------------
http://tomeofgrey.blogspot.com/

http://www.jed-soft.com/ Gamer Rigs, Budget Prices

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, August 25, 2004 8:26 AM

BADGERSHAT

Here's the thing about fungus and mold and that sort--

When you walk in a farm in some foreign country, then come to the USA, you have to tell them if you've been on farmland, touched plants or livestock in your travel.

The reason why is this--
Invading species have no predators, and take over.
Ever wonder why the USA has such trouble with those Asian tree-eating beetle things? It's because someone accidentally brought one or three back, and they had no natural predators here, so they thrived and flourished and multiplied. Same with the exotic trees, fish, weeds, etc.

So, if you're on a planet colonized by earthlings, walking through the farms, and leave, and set down on some other planet, chances are you'll have pollen or spores or whatnot in the soles of your boots. When you walk through the dirt on the new planet, those spores fall off, and if they like the ground, they grow, they spread, and they choke out the native plants.

I think that may be a reason we see so many earth-native plants on all the other planets--all them folks going back and forth are bringing they seeds and such with them wherever they go.

As for the animals, well, they probably just stock em and they thrive for similar reasons--no natural predators.

After a few decades, the colony planets would all look essentially the same, fauna- and flora-wise.

But I think it would be cool, at some point, to have an alien encounter. Nothing blatant.
Anyone remember the episode of Star Trek TNG where they were trapped in a space field, no one could dream when they slept except Troi, and she kept having nightmares about "Two eyes in the dark one moon circles" or somesuch? And it turned out that some alien presence was communicating with her, asking for help.

We never saw those aliens directly, just a weird creepy dream sequence with swirling images. I think that, not quite THAT way of course, but in a similar fashion, where it's all handled non-blatantly, would work nicely...

--Jefé The Hat

***************************
--Don't bother trying to predict, figure out, second guess, criticize, or suggest anything that comes from the mind of Joss Whedon, for you shall usually be wrong, and shall find out the Truth and Purpose in due time.
(This is the Truth of Whedoning)
"I like smackin 'em"--Jayne

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, August 25, 2004 8:52 AM

DIEGO

Quote:
Originally posted by BadgersHat:
The reason why is this--
Invading species have no predators, and take over.

Well, it's certainly true that it often doesn't take much to give an exotic species a foothold in a new area. However, not all introduced species become invasive. Some go extinct in the new habitat, while others do okay where they were introduced but do not dominate the ecosystem and do not spread. What makes some plants and animals aggresive invaders and others (often close relatives) less successful at spreading in a new place? Honestly, we have a lot of ideas, but we don't know the answer. It's a very interesting question.

But anyway, BadgerHat is right that a few spores or seeds can hitchike quite easily, but simply saying that introduced species have no native predators and will inevitably take over is an over-simplification.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, August 25, 2004 9:41 AM

BADGERSHAT

Actually, at the risk of sounding haughty...

I'm dating a girl with a Master's Degree in Environmental Education, and the entire focus of her job is the danger of introduced species.

Yes, some are less hostile, but the bottom line is, introduced speices will have less natural predators in the new environment than they have at "home"--it's not really an over-simplification, is pretty much the basic truth. Ecological systems are EXTREMELY fragile, despite the strength of Nature. Remember the snakehead fish thing a couple of years back?

They started off as a few hundred half-inch long nothings, and quickly grew to several feet, dozens of pounds, super aggressive and nasty as hell--choked out the native fish in whatever region it was to the point that the gov'mint had to forcibly eradicate them. All because nothing in the environment was a natural predator of the snakehead fish...

But, really, who gives a crap? The point is, it's pretty darn easy to just watch the show, see the trees and such, and say "Huh, looks like a spruce tree" then not think about it again.

Plus, wasn't this thread originally talking about aliens?

--Jefé The Hat

***************************
--Don't bother trying to predict, figure out, second guess, criticize, or suggest anything that comes from the mind of Joss Whedon, for you shall usually be wrong, and shall find out the Truth and Purpose in due time.
(This is the Truth of Whedoning)
"I like smackin 'em"--Jayne

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, August 25, 2004 12:22 PM

DIEGO

Quote:
Originally posted by BadgersHat:
Plus, wasn't this thread originally talking about aliens?

Aw c'mon BadgersHat, we were still talking about aliens. It's just that THESE aliens are exotic (and possibly invasive) species of earth life introduced to novel environments!

I will reserve my right to disagree with you. But I guess we have wandered off the main thread so I'll drop the argument.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, August 25, 2004 12:31 PM

GEORDIESTEVE2003

I dont think there is ever a need for an alien, its not star trek or star wars. Did you even watch Joss talking about the show and how he envisioned it? Cant relate, no need, show isnt about them or what they could offer to the story, the closest you will get is man-made ones, being the Reavers. Dont ever expect to see one.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, August 25, 2004 12:33 PM

DIEGO

Quote:
Originally posted by Michizure:
The problem I have with most "aliens" in science fiction is that they aren't -- alien, that is.
. . .
I wouldn't mind seeing a limited, really alien alien presence in Firefly. It would have to be weird and incomprehensible, except as a "black box" (i.e., stimulus "A" produces response "B," but no one knows why).

Bravo, Michizure! I agree whole-heartedly.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, August 25, 2004 1:54 PM

SARDONICA

Quote:
Originally posted by geordiesteve2003:
I dont think there is ever a need for an alien, its not star trek or star wars. Did you even watch Joss talking about the show and how he envisioned it?

Um, yes, I think most of us watched the Commentaries.

Quote:
Originally posted by JK:
Seriously, it just goes against every single grain Firefly has.

I totally disagree.

The point that I believe Joss was making was more of the "Star Trek" mentality of aliens--humans in makeup. Latex aliens that look and act very similarly to us. Aliens who are main characters, and becomes the main focus of the show.

I don't think that Whedon as a writer would EVER preclude in his own SCIFI show the possibility of touching upon one of the most fascinating and important aspects of science fiction: the possibility that there is other life life in the universe.

Of course Firefly is, at its heart, a show about the human condition. The BEST scifi uses the unknown to shed more light on ourselves and the human condition.

Chief Editor, AFM
www.apocalypsefiction.com
Writer/Producer, The NUKE Brothers
www.nukebrothers.com

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, August 25, 2004 11:58 PM

NEDWARD

Quote:
Originally posted by Sardonica:
I don't think that Whedon as a writer would EVER preclude in his own SCIFI show the possibility of touching upon one of the most fascinating and important aspects of science fiction: the possibility that there is other life life in the universe.

Sure about that?

Quote:
"I believe we are the only sentient beings in the universe, and 500 years from now we will still be the only sentient beings around. Aliens are something everyone else is doing." - Joss Whedon

Quote:
"Aliens, you know, that's something everybody else has done and is doing. It's a great metaphor to play with, but it's not what I'm interested in. I'm really interested in 'you are there,' in 'you are a part of this.' And I think aliens take you out of that. I also need to spend some time away from latex." - Joss Whedon

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Thursday, August 26, 2004 5:02 AM

PURPLEBELLY

Isn't Jayne enough?

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Thursday, August 26, 2004 5:59 AM

NEDWARD

What, you think Jayne's father threw him out of the family for turning out half-human?

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Thursday, August 26, 2004 9:17 AM

SARDONICA

Quote:
Originally posted by nedward:
Quote:
Sure about that?

Yep.

In the Whedon quote, he didn't say that we were the only life in the universe. He made a point of saying that we were the only sentient life.

I'm not lookin for a race of Klingons or Vulcans in Firefly. I'm looking for an encounter with something fantastic, unknowable and strange...

Chief Editor, AFM
www.apocalypsefiction.com
Writer/Producer, The NUKE Brothers
www.nukebrothers.com

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Thursday, August 26, 2004 9:42 AM

STARPILOTGRAINGER

Besides, I'm always a little amazed at people who throw up the Joss quote about not doing aliens, as though the man's completely incapable about either a) exaggerating his position for effect (or to make you surprised later), or b) changing his mind.

I'm sure he'll probably continue to believe (if he in fact does now) that we're alone in the Universe, but he may eventually decide that wow, he really does have a cool story he wants to tell using aliens as a metaphorical device. Sure, it probably won't happen right away, but it still could happen eventually.

Star Pilot Grainger
"Remember, the enemy's gate is down."
LJ: http://www.livejournal.com/users/newnumber6
http://www.unreachablestar.net - Comics & SF News/Reviews/Opinions

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Thursday, August 26, 2004 10:28 AM

NEDWARD

Quote:
Originally posted by Sardonica:
I'm not lookin for a race of Klingons or Vulcans in Firefly. I'm looking for an encounter with something fantastic, unknowable and strange...

Point taken, especially after properly reading your first post on the topic.

I'm just not sure how much hard sci-fi you could fit into Firefly, let alone Serenity. I think you'd run the risk of exciting exobiology fans at the expense of plot/dialogue/acting fans. Nobody watches Firefly purely for the great physics, right?

Quote:
Originally posted by StarPilotGrainger:
Besides, I'm always a little amazed at people who throw up the Joss quote about not doing aliens,

The quote (fact) I find more credible than the non-sentient-ape-gone-wrong-thing (speculation). Wasn't meaning to dampen speculation, but I like the "no aliens" thing. The closest we get to mental wacky is Objects in Space (River's a ship! Er, no, she's not. Ha!) and I think the cow fetus exhibit is the alien wacky equivalent. I speculate.

{Edited to take account of me not reading the topic properly. Apologies.}

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

YOUR OPTIONS

SHARE THREAD

NEW POSTS TODAY

USER

POST DATE