Dinosaurs and colonisation... by TheGerg

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Dinosaurs and colonisation...

POSTED BY: THEGERG
UPDATED: Thursday, September 22, 2005 12:08
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 7578
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Sunday, May 22, 2005 2:50 PM

It's been bugging me! In the 'Serenity' episode, Wash has two dinosaurs who are off to colonise a planet. But then, the predatory dinosaur, falling foul of his baser meat-eating instincts, cruelly attacks the poor plant-eater!

But what species of dinosaur were they?

Furthermore, if humans have colonised all the planets in the Serenityverse, what animals do you think they brought with them? especially as aliens are nowhere to be seen! Did some idiot bring the classic western sidekick, the rattlesnake? And if so, lots of people would get bitten, so why bring it?

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Sunday, May 22, 2005 3:23 PM

BIKISDAD

Did you see any rattlesnakes on the show? I think that answers that question.

Without looking at the dvd (so this is from my faulty memory), I think the veggie dino was a stegosaurus. It's more difficult to say what the carnivore was exactly because there were quite a few species that had that T. Rex/Allosaurus look.

Apathy on the Rise. No One Cares.

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Monday, May 23, 2005 12:14 AM

ZOID

bikisdad:

I think you nailed it: Stegosaurus and Tyrannosaurus Rex. Somewhere on his console, I suspect, is the third member of every dinogeek's Holy Trinity... Triceratops.

Things may be different in the future ("Is there a problem with the earth's gravitational pull?": name the movie and character) in which Firefly is based. Based on the undoubted 500+ years of continuing success with the Jurassic Park franchise, other dinosaurs may replace the Original Trinity, such as the Velociraptor, Deinonychus or Ozzy Osbourne...

Paleontologically,

zoid

P.S.
And I'm sure that 500 years hence they could always dig up Stevie Nix, since the fossil has already prepared itself in alcohol. *Ducks a two-weeks overipe tomato thrown from the audience* Hey there goes Stevie now! Okay, not nice picking on the girl, I know: She's just a child of her times. I was just trying to be 'fair and balanced', vis Ozzy. Geezer on one scale, lush on the other, and since they weigh about the same...

How'm I doing, Mr. Murdoch?
_________________________________________________

"Sure as I know anything, I know this: I aim to misbehave." -Capt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity, a.k.a. 'the BDM'

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Monday, May 23, 2005 12:31 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
I suspect, is the third member of every dinogeek's Holy Trinity... Triceratops.

So, where would you put the infamous Brontosaurus, if not in the dinogeek's (ahem) Holy Trinity?

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Monday, May 23, 2005 3:41 AM

SHINYSEVEN

Did you see any rattlesnakes on the show?

No! Because I sacrificed them!

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Monday, May 23, 2005 4:11 AM

ROCKETJOCK

Quote:
Originally posted by TheGerg:
Did some idiot bring the classic western sidekick, the rattlesnake? And if so, lots of people would get bitten, so why bring it?

A balanced ecology would probably require a certain amount of predators, otherwise you end up with the classic "rabbits in Australia" problem.

Of course the terraformations on Firefly have generally been characterized as being pretty slapdash/quick-and-dirty, especially off the core worlds, so who knows?

"Do you know what the definition of a hero is? It's somebody who gets somebody else killed." -- Zoë Warren

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Monday, May 23, 2005 4:54 AM

SIMONWHO

Doc Brown in BttF, obviously.

Anyway, I'd be surprised if they didn't keep full DNA records of every creature they could lay their hands on, to clone them at a later date, even if they didn't take live specimens with them on the long journey to the new galaxy.

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Monday, May 23, 2005 7:47 AM

PERIDIDDLE

Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
Doc Brown in BttF, obviously.

PFFT, you beat me to it! *Muttermumble*

Wash prolly has more than just the three dinosaurs, for it wouldn't be fair just to have a t-rex, stegosaurus and a triceratops (I was on the verge of writing 'three-horn' instead. I'm probably the only one here young enough to still like The Land Before Time and not be too ashamed to admit it, though, so...) I'd be amused to see his collection...Let's not forget, he also has plastic palm trees!

"Bwaa...it's kind of a warrior...strikes fear into the hearts of..."

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Monday, May 23, 2005 10:06 AM

ZOID

perididdle:

You could always hop into your DeLorean and get it right before DocWho.

Of course, first you'd have take the DeLorean back to a time when they still had DeLoreans... Temporal paradoxes are sooo tricky!

v/r,
-zed

P.S.
Points go to SimonWho. Maybe too easy, but I thought it might be too obscure for most to get; so I trivialized it.

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Monday, May 23, 2005 10:15 AM

ZOID

AURaptor queried:

Quote:
So, where would you put the infamous Brontosaurus, if not in the dinogeek's (ahem) Holy Trinity?

Ummm... In the gas tank of the Escalade? Along with a couple primordial forests, and that damned spotty owl if she screws up and builds her nest too close to the well.

Petrochemically,

zoid
_________________________________________________

"Out, damned spotty owl! Out, I say!" -Ladi Macbeth, Macbeth: The Wildcatter Years, Tuesdays after "American Idol" on F*x

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Monday, May 23, 2005 12:10 PM

SICKDUDE

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
So, where would you put the infamous Brontosaurus, if not in the dinogeek's (ahem) Holy Trinity?

Sorry to nitpick (not really, but it's polite to say it). I thought they found there was no such thing as a Brontosaur. The closest thing would be a Brachiosaurus.

"Don't say 'ka' until you've tried it." Daniel Jackson

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Monday, May 23, 2005 12:38 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Sickdude commented-

Quote:
Sorry to nitpick (not really, but it's polite to say it). I thought they found there was no such thing as a Brontosaur. The closest thing would be a Brachiosaurus.

Well, I was trying to keep things simple for the few NON Dinogeeks on the board. But since you mentioned it....

Brontosaurus

DESCRIBER - Marsh,1879

TIME - Jurassic Late, Kimmeridgian Tithonian

CLASSIFICATION
Saurischia Sauropodomorpha Sauropoda Diplodocidae Diplodocinae

DIET - Herbivore

FOSSILSITE - US

FALL UNDER - APATOSAURUS

INFO

Apatosaurus = Brontosaurus (Marsh,1879) Elosaurus (Peterson & Gilmore,1902) Apatosaurus > A.ajax = Atlantosaurus ajax (Marsh,1877 - Steel,1970) = Brontosaurus ajax (Marsh,1877 - Bakker,1986) = Atlantosaurus laticollis (Marsh,1879 - Steel,1970) = Atlantosaurus excelsus (Marsh,1879 - Steel,1970) = Camarasaurus excelsus (Marsh,1879 - Osborn vide von Huene,1929) = Apatosaurus amplus (Marsh,1881 - Gilmore,1936) = Atlantosaurus amplus (Marsh,1881 - Steel,1970)

A.ajax (Marsh,1877) >> A. laticollis (Marsh,1879) Atlantosaurus immanis (Marsh,1878) Apatosaurus > A.excelsus (Marsh,1879) >> Brontosaurus excelsus (Marsh,1879) >>> Brontosaurus amplus (Marsh,1881) Elosaurus parvus (Peterson & Gilmore,1902) Apatosaurus > A.louisae (Holland,1915) = Atlantosaurus louisae (Holland,1915 - Steel,1970) = Brontosaurus louisae (Holland,1915 - Bakker, 1986)

"thunder lizard" Named for its great size and powerful build ("one of the largest reptiles yet discovered"), similar in meaning to Marsh's earlier mammal name Brontotherium "thunder beast" (1873). Brontes was also the name of a giant in Greek mythology. Contrary to a common explanation for the name, Marsh did not indicate that his "thunder lizard" was supposed to make a sound like thunder when it walked.

He recognized that his Apatosaurus and Brontosaurus were closely related taxa, but distinguished the two forms primarily based on the number of fused vertebrae in the sacrum of the type specimens (three in Apatosaurus ajax, five in Brontosaurus excelsus), a feature now known to reflect the age of individuals. Elmer Riggs could not find sufficient grounds for treating both as separate genera, and made the well-known name Brontosaurus a junior synonyn of Apatosaurus in 1903.

Surprisingly, though, Riggs also thought that the type species itself could not be identified in an adult form: "Apatosaurus ajax is based upon a specimen too young to admit of specific determination"--a situation, which, arguably, could have been grounds for treating the name Apatosaurus as a nomen dubium and using Brontosaurus instead.

Modern authorities consider Apatosaurus ajax diagnosable, however. The nomenclatural issues surrounding the name are unrelated to Marsh's mistaken choice of a Camarasaurus skull for his reconstruction of "Brontosaurus."

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Monday, May 23, 2005 12:55 PM

PERIDIDDLE

Quote:
Originally posted by zoid:

perididdle:

You could always hop into your DeLorean and get it right before DocWho.

Of course, first you'd have take the DeLorean back to a time when they still had DeLoreans... Temporal paradoxes are sooo tricky!

v/r,
-zed

*Ponders this* That is correct! I shall find a way. It doesn't exactly have to be a DeLorean, but for the sake of the reference and my lack of abilities in building time travel machines, there must be some way to dig one up. Or, perhaps, I could find a train....

*Walks off ranting something about lightning and scale models*

"Bwaa...it's kind of a warrior...strikes fear into the hearts of..."

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Monday, May 23, 2005 1:01 PM

SICKDUDE

D'oh!

Auraptor, I suppose the next thing you're gonna say is that the Brachiosaurus isn't made out of those chocolate candies at all.....

"Don't say 'ka' until you've tried it." Daniel Jackson

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Monday, May 23, 2005 1:09 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Sickdude:
D'oh!

Auraptor, I suppose the next thing you're gonna say is that the Brachiosaurus isn't made out of those chocolate candies at all.....

"Don't say 'ka' until you've tried it." Daniel Jackson

Mmmmmm...Brachio-licious!!

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Monday, May 23, 2005 1:25 PM

SIMONWHO

Quote:
Originally posted by zoid:

perididdle:

You could always hop into your DeLorean and get it right before DocWho.

Of course, first you'd have take the DeLorean back to a time when they still had DeLoreans... Temporal paradoxes are sooo tricky!

v/r,
-zed

P.S.
Points go to SimonWho. Maybe too easy, but I thought it might be too obscure for most to get; so I trivialized it.

Ah, see, I have my own method of time travel so I waited until someone (perididdle) got the answer right, travelled back before their post and then put it up to beat them to it. A plan I learned off the editor of some travellers guide, I forget which one.

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Wednesday, May 25, 2005 1:55 PM

THEGERG

Sorry, doin a dissertation at the mo so my comments come not too often.

Me was wonderin if it may not be a Tyrannosaurus as it seems to have little flap-like bits on its head! Did they have those? I'm thinking it's more likely to be an Allosaurus! Though i am basing my seriously limited dinosaur knowledge firmly on the BBC "Walking With Dinosaurs" program.

Also, just watched Firefly again (obviously i'm dissertating as I do) and Mal mentions farmers bringing mangy cattle to backwater planets, he also mentions terraforming. So obviously most of the terraforming has been based on western scrubland and coastal formal gardens. How can a planet survive with just these biomes? I've never seen rainforest, estuaries, coral, nothin else but scrubland and coastal formal gardens! And lots of mountains, but even they have scrub!

Maybe global warming killed off EVERYTHING else! Or maybe it was rabbits! And you talk of the damage that predators would do to an ecology, but without them we'd get overpopulation? I also think i've solved the predator mystery, I'm sure i've seen a hawk in one episode! I'll look back over - God! I am now sadly looking out for these things!

I feel that Kakapo's are a likely addition as they are cool and given that Firefly is cool, it is likely that cool creatures exist in Firefly!

By the way, if you have to take DeLoreans back to a time when they still had DeLoreans, how did Marty take his DeLorean back in time then? The 1950's and the Wild West had never heard of DeLoreans.

Also temporal paradoxes aren't tricky if you subscribe to the multiple timeline theory. Based on that, you can go back, kill your grandfather, kill your mother, kill yourself, and you'd still be going strong after decimating every relative you could trace!

I speak of the computer who will come after me!

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Wednesday, May 25, 2005 1:58 PM

THEGERG

p.s. Wash also seems to have a green plastic man! I'm looking out for his dashboard ecology when I see the movie and hope he has added some new items to his obviously burgeoning collection.

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Wednesday, May 25, 2005 5:19 PM

MONTANAGIRL

Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
Ah, see, I have my own method of time travel so I waited until someone (perididdle) got the answer right, travelled back before their post and then put it up to beat them to it. A plan I learned off the editor of some travellers guide, I forget which one.

Yes, but did you then proceed to sue them for copyright infringement for using your answer?

"One day, lad, all this will be yours ..."
"What - the curtains?"

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Wednesday, May 25, 2005 11:02 PM

REAVERINA1985RIVIERA

Quote:
Originally posted by perididdle:
Quote:
Originally posted by zoid:

perididdle:

You could always hop into your DeLorean and get it right before DocWho.

Of course, first you'd have take the DeLorean back to a time when they still had DeLoreans... Temporal paradoxes are sooo tricky!

v/r,
-zed

*Ponders this* That is correct! I shall find a way. It doesn't exactly have to be a DeLorean, but for the sake of the reference and my lack of abilities in building time travel machines, there must be some way to dig one up. Or, perhaps, I could find a train....

*Walks off ranting something about lightning and scale models*

"Bwaa...it's kind of a warrior...strikes fear into the hearts of..."

Somebody could've taken a DMC-12 off of Earth as part of a automotive collection when the planets where done being terraformed. Some of those cars ('70 Hemi 'Cuda, Duesenburgs, Packards) are worth millions, it doesn't make any sense to just leave them on a soon-to-be dead planet. If someone can fly an SR-71 Blackbird in the episode "Trash", then some one could be driving a Delorean on a planet like Arial (sp?)

---------------------------------------------
The real-life box droppin', man-ape gone wrong thing, now without the pesky falling boxes

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Wednesday, May 25, 2005 11:25 PM

EMMA

*head explodes*

extremely dimensionally transcendental

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Thursday, May 26, 2005 1:31 AM

CHRISTHECYNIC

Quote:
Originally posted by perididdle:
(I was on the verge of writing 'three-horn' instead. I'm probably the only one here young enough to still like The Land Before Time and not be too ashamed to admit it, though, so...)

Blasphemy! Everyone, regardless of age, is required by law to like The Land Before Time. It’s the sequels where both the law and dogma get hazy.

-

-

I'm surprised no one mentioned this but the three-horn isn’t just a supposition, it is in fact right there on the console. Poor thing gets shoved off when Wash hears the alarm. Cera really had it coming though.

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Thursday, May 26, 2005 7:29 AM

ZOID

ReaverInA1985Riviera:

So, how much is an '85 Buick worth?

Inquisitively,

zoid

P.S.
"Ralph! Buick!" -Parking valet to another parking valet, Worshipping the Porcelain God
(NOTE: Unreleased, because it blew chunks.)

P.P.S.
BTW, I repeatedly enjoyed Porcelain God through the late 70's and mid 80's, when it was a de rigueur cult classic; although one reviewer bashed it, calling it a "technicolor yawn". I especially liked the 'feeding the ducks' scene.
_________________________________________________

"Sure as I know anything, I know this: I aim to misbehave." -Capt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity, a.k.a. 'the BDM'

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Saturday, May 28, 2005 10:14 AM

REAVERINA1985RIVIERA

Quote:
Originally posted by christhecynic:
Quote:
Originally posted by perididdle:

(I was on the verge of writing 'three-horn' instead. I'm probably the only one here young enough to still like The Land Before Time and not be too ashamed to admit it, though, so...)

I'm surprised no one mentioned this but the three-horn isn’t just a supposition, it is in fact right there on the console. Poor thing gets shoved off when Wash hears the alarm. Cera really had it coming though.

He also has a Brachiosaur in that same shot.

---------------------------------------------
The real-life box droppin', man-ape gone wrong thing, now without the pesky falling boxes

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Saturday, May 28, 2005 10:26 AM

REAVERINA1985RIVIERA

Quote:
Originally posted by zoid:
ReaverInA1985Riviera:

So, how much is an '85 Buick worth?

Inquisitively,

zoid

Depends on the condition it's in. I've seen some in perfect condition sell for $13,500.

My first Riviera (a deathtrap named Ravenous)was free, slapped a new water pump in and used it as a daily driver for 5 months, until it not so gently bumped into a red Jetta.

My current '85 is slowly being turned into a 50's style Leadsled. The car itself cost $997, but the mods could bring the resale value to about $45,000.

---------------------------------------------
The real-life box droppin', man-ape gone wrong thing, now without the pesky falling boxes

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Sunday, May 29, 2005 9:47 AM

THEGERG

when did this become a post advertising cars? I've been away too long!

Anyway. The Firefly dashboard biome also seems to include a Coconut tree and some form of dinosaur with a fin on it's back, face a bit like a Dionychus, but with a fin. Anyone any ideas?

Also - did you know that more people are killed annually by Coconuts than are killed by sharks. So the next time you see a Coconut sneaking up on you in the water - watch out!

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Sunday, May 29, 2005 10:02 AM

CHRISTHECYNIC

Quote:
Originally posted by TheGerg:
Also - did you know that more people are killed annually by Coconuts than are killed by sharks. So the next time you see a Coconut sneaking up on you in the water - watch out!

My god that's a great quote.

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Sunday, May 29, 2005 10:11 AM

CHRISTHECYNIC

Quote:
Originally posted by TheGerg:
Anyway. The Firefly dashboard biome also seems to include a Coconut tree and some form of dinosaur with a fin on it's back, face a bit like a Dionychus, but with a fin. Anyone any ideas?

Could it have been a Spinosaurus?
http://library.thinkquest.org/26615/data/image/Spinosaurus-warming%20u
p.GIF

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Sunday, May 29, 2005 10:38 AM

THEGERG

I think it could be! Oh yes! That's the monster! What a beauty!

Thanks for the quote reverence! I used to use that fact when I worked at the National Marine Aquarium in Plymouth.

Furthermore, more people are killed by speedboats than are killed by sharks, in the mediteranean. And more people are killed by trousers than by sharks, too!

Don't you just love statistics!

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Sunday, May 29, 2005 10:48 AM

THEGERG

I've had another idea! If it's the future and all they have to work with are earthlike animals and plants, what sort of creatures could you breed?

My idea is cows that are genetically bred with a homing instinct. They also possess wings! The cows home in on the slaughterhouse they were brought up in and get there by flying to it, so not only are transport costs cut down on, but Kentucky Fried Chicken get a whole lot more wing for the buck!

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Sunday, May 29, 2005 11:09 AM

SUBGUY

Quote:
Originally posted by zoid:

bikisdad:

I think you nailed it: Stegosaurus and Tyrannosaurus Rex. Somewhere on his console, I suspect, is the third member of every dinogeek's Holy Trinity... Triceratops.

Things may be different in the future ("Is there a problem with the earth's gravitational pull?": name the movie and character) in which Firefly is based. Based on the undoubted 500+ years of continuing success with the Jurassic Park franchise, other dinosaurs may replace the Original Trinity, such as the Velociraptor, Deinonychus or Ozzy Osbourne...

Doc Brown. Back to the Future.

Captain pete

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Sunday, May 29, 2005 11:14 AM

SUBGUY

Quote:
Originally posted by SubGuy:
Quote:
Originally posted by zoid:

bikisdad:

I think you nailed it: Stegosaurus and Tyrannosaurus Rex. Somewhere on his console, I suspect, is the third member of every dinogeek's Holy Trinity... Triceratops.

Things may be different in the future ("Is there a problem with the earth's gravitational pull?": name the movie and character) in which Firefly is based. Based on the undoubted 500+ years of continuing success with the Jurassic Park franchise, other dinosaurs may replace the Original Trinity, such as the Velociraptor, Deinonychus or Ozzy Osbourne...

Doc Brown. Back to the Future.

Captain pete

Oops. I seem to have been a bit late with my post. Must have overshot the time period when I did my slingshot around the sun.

Captain Pete

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Sunday, May 29, 2005 1:59 PM

ZOID

TheGerg:

Your secret identity is Jessica Simpson.

v/r,
-zed

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Tuesday, September 20, 2005 1:54 PM

THEGERG

God, I've been away a while! Damn thesis! Anyway, it's finished now and I am now a Master! Or am I THE Master? Mwa hah hah haaaah (evil laugh!!!).

I have to admit, I am a little confused by the Jessica Simpson ID! I googled the name and came up with a swimwear model! Am I a swimwear model? If I am, I pity the poor guy who has to take my picture, as I am a 38yr old male with a receding hairline! And I can assure you, that such a figure does not look good in a women's swimsuit!

What were you trying to say, Zoid? I'm afraid I've never heard of her, she must be famous in America, I'm assuming!

As for Dinosaurs...omigod....looks like the meteor didn't kill em after all:

http://www.bioedonline.org/news/news.cfm?art=1789

Quote:
Next time, let's all go to a crappy town where I'm a hero!Quote:

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Tuesday, September 20, 2005 1:59 PM

THEGERG

So if the meteor missed!

Are the dinosaurs still here?

And if so, why can't we see them?

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Tuesday, September 20, 2005 2:06 PM

THEGERG

Are they cloaked?

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Tuesday, September 20, 2005 5:11 PM

DIEGO

Good luck, TheGerg! I can't believe it's been half a year since I defended my Master's Thesis. Wow.

By the way, I don't recall if I saw a hawk, but I'm nigh positive I remember hearing the cry of a red-tailed hawk in one scene.

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Wednesday, September 21, 2005 3:53 PM

ZOID

TheGerg queried, belatedly:

Quote:
...What were you trying to say, Zoid? I'm afraid I've never heard of her, she must be famous in America, I'm assuming!...

Yes, Jessica Simpson is 'famous' in the US. She's a musical performer and neophyte actress ("The Dukes of Hazzard"). But mostly, she's somewhat infamous for having 'a blonde moment' during an interview, revealing her belief that bison have wings, and that this is where (food item) "Buffalo Wings" come from. Mine was a reference to a previous post of yours, in which you said,

Quote:
My idea is cows that are genetically bred with a homing instinct. They also possess wings!...

Don't worry. Nobody else on the thread got the reference/thought it was funny, either...

Explanatorily,

zoid

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Thursday, September 22, 2005 4:20 AM

THEGERG

I can sleep better at night knowing that

I shall go and see the Dukes of Hazzard for my sins!

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Thursday, September 22, 2005 12:08 PM

ZOID

TheGerg:

I can't speak for Ms. Simpson's acting ability, or for the theatrical quality of "DoH" (I have my serious reservations on both counts). But I will say Jessica is (ulp!) pretty spectacular to gaze upon, especially in those 'Daisy Dukes'...

I like to think of it as a marvelous sense of economy in costume design.

Het'rosecksh'ly,

zoid

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