slight confusion about the names on Firefly by Idefix

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

slight confusion about the names on Firefly

POSTED BY: IDEFIX
UPDATED: Sunday, December 1, 2002 11:32
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Tuesday, November 26, 2002 4:52 AM

as you may know by now - or not - I'm german and so my question may sound silly to you but I was very confused about the names of people in Firefly. I got used to them now but since I have the chance to ask, I'll do it here.

are names like Book, River, Wash, Jayne normal to you (americans)?

I can't think of names like that in german and so I want to know if they're just normal names or if it's some kind of special thing in Firefly.

Malcom Reynolds is a normal name and I know Simon as a given name (it's a quite common name in germany) and Zoe is a bit exotic to me but still a name and Inara sounds like a name too.

...but the others?

are there actually people called Book and River and Wash? I assume all of them are given names as they all call each other by their given name.

River and Simon have the family name of Tam, Jayne's is Cobb and Inara's is Serra. I tend to accept averything as a family name, there are very weired ones here too, but as a given name I expect something that's not a word with meaning.

I don't know anyone here that has anything other than a 'normal' name as a given name, some are unusual but I think there are rules for what you can name your children and what not here in germany.

...I just read the beginning of this post again and there comes an actor to mind by the name of River Phoenix. so is River a normal name and it can be user for men and women alike? ther wouldn't be a possibility of people in germany calling their child "Fluss", it's just not a name.

...so please shed some light on all of this for me.

Idefix

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Tuesday, November 26, 2002 5:09 AM

RHEA

Quote:
Originally posted by Idefix:
are names like Book, River, Wash, Jayne normal to you (americans)?

Inara is Arabic, I believe - it means something like "ray of light" or "heaven-sent."

Book is not a normal name - he could be named for Booker T. Washington, a famous black American, or it could be short for something else.

River can be a name - I would class it, like Saffron from Our Mrs. Reynolds, as a holdover from the 60's hippy era. Not common. But then we have Willow in Buffy, and I would put her name in the same category. OTOH, I work in special ed and we just acquired a kid whose first name is Dannyboy. My hand to God, as Wash would say.

Wash is likely short for something else like Washington or Washburn.

Jayne's not normal - but neither is the character.

I suspect it may be a play on the country song "A Boy Named Sue," but I can't prove it (in other words, it's a joke).

Does that help?

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Tuesday, November 26, 2002 5:33 AM

IDEFIX

thanks, that clears it up.

I needed some EPs to actually know what people are called because I couldn't place some of the names as names and in the beginning of a new series there's always a few EPs getting used to the peoples accents and generally the way they say something.

so you think Wash and Book are short forms of longer names or nicknames of some type. and Jayne is meant as a joke. I think I figured that one out myself but couln't be sure, I don't know the song you mentioned.

and when I hear some of the unusual names I'm almost glad for german rules about names. I usually hate unnecessary rules but if people call their kids like that and no one can stop it the poor kids are sure to have trouble with their name all their life and they didn't choose it.

names that can be femal or male seem to cause enough trouble for the ones wearing them. a male friend of mine (he's from somewhere in the former Yugoslavia) is calles Sinisa (spoken Sinisha) and all the people here in germany simply assume it is a female name. he's had telefon calls like that:
Sinisa: hello!
other person: hello, my name is ..., could I please speak your wife?
Sinisa: I'm not married.
op: oh, ahh, so could I please speak your sister Sinisa Idjuski then?
Sinisa: I have no sister, and you're already speaking to Sinisa Idjuski.
op: no, you don't understand, I want to speak to Sinisa Idjuski. did I dial the wrong number?
Sinisa: no the number is correct. what do you want. I'm Sinisa Idjuski.

...and on and on. if people believe something they're hard to get to acknowledge they're wrong.

I have a bit of a similar story in my own past: I once had a picture of my boyfriend (I'm actually female even if the nickname Idefix suggest otherwise, but I chose this so it's my own fault) on my desktop at work and a friend of mine who worked in the same building came by my place every noon to fetch me for a shared lunch. and both of them have brown shortish hair, so everyone in my office was sure the man coming to fetch be for lunch was the one on my desktop and so he was my boyfriend and they believed it even when I told them that they are two different people. and the two guys don't even look alike. they would have thought it if one was blond and the other darkhaired, they simply wanted to believe it.

...but I digress.

thanks anyway for the clarification.

Idefix

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Tuesday, November 26, 2002 6:18 AM

THELEFTHAND

I think you should also keep in mind the fact that the names are USUALLY chosen for a reason. Book may indeed be a nickname, but the character is also a preacher. Book=Bible. Jayne is a feminine sounding name, so the comic relief element with the toughest guy on the ship having a "girly" name is obvious, as noted. I have no familiarity with German entertainment, but when American entertainment throws out odd names, there are usually definite associations going on. Mythology, History, and other disciplines can play a role. Take Willow from BtVS, since it was already brought up. The willow tree is very influenced by the elements. However, it never breaks, only bending under outside influences. On the other hand, don't worry if you can't find the association. Some times the meanings are personal. And some times the writers just like the way a name sounds. =)

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Tuesday, November 26, 2002 10:02 AM

ALLRONIX

River does seem to a a hold-over from the hippie era by American standards. Zoe is also a name that came back into fashion with hippies (it means "life" in Greek). BTW, my brother-in-law's little niece is named Kayleigh (said the same as our darling engineer).

I'll agree that Wash is likely a nickname, and might not even be realted to the fellow's given name. I know several fellows who use their given names only when it comes to the IRS (Tax bureau). To their friends and family, they have their chosen names. I've even known a couple folks who have gone through the legal process to change their birth name into something more suiting.

One of my spirit-kin calls himself "Moon," and even his partner calls him that. Another local fanboy up here I knew for years as "Kevlar" before just recently finding out his legal name. It could be that Wash has a "legal" name he'd rather not be called - even by Zoe.

Co-founder of the Evil Writing Crew - causing hell, one hero at a time!

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Tuesday, November 26, 2002 4:31 PM

EVANS

Quote:
Jayne's not normal - but neither is the character. I suspect it may be a play on the country song "A Boy Named Sue," but I can't prove it (in other words, it's a joke).

There is no way I'd tell The Boy Named Sue that his name is a joke. G

Since "Jayne" with a "y" is a surname, let us suppose that Jayne's family gave him his mother's maiden name, or the name of a dear friend. One of my grandfathers was given a first name equal to the family doctor's last name. I have several "Evan Evans"es in the family tree, past and present, including an uncle and a cousin. When my brother was born, the family wanted to give him the initials RYE, so they considered Rappahanock Yarborough and Robespierre Ypsilante; believe me, they could have done it. They didn't, however. I am named after my father's great aunt, who probably was born before the Civil War.

Melissa, but I usually sign my stuff

m.
------------------------------------------------
"But ... not boring, like she made it sound." Wash, in ARIEL

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Wednesday, November 27, 2002 2:25 AM

IDEFIX

I am myself one of them who get called by their nickname instead of their given name most of the time.

all my friends call me Idefix or Ide for short. my boyfriend does, too.

my given name is Carola. it's nothing really bad but Idefix is the name I chose.

but you probably don't even know Idefix, do you? Asterix comic books? the little dog of Obelix? in the original french and in german and probably in some more languages he's called Idefix. in the english translation he's called Dogmatix.
and he's a male dog but I'm not *grin*.

and a friend of mine named her little boy Robin Aragorn Janos that's ok in germany. I heard of people who tried to name their kid Pumuckl (it's the name of a very famous german child fiction character, a little puck/sprite/imp (looked it up in a dic, don't know which one fits best) and they weren't allowed to.

Idefix

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Wednesday, November 27, 2002 10:52 AM

DAMOUTH

Quote:
Originally posted by Idefix:

are names like Book, River, Wash, Jayne normal to you (americans)?

[...]
I tend to accept averything as a family name, there are very weired ones here too, but as a given name I expect something that's not a word with meaning.

I think if you go back far enough, most names, both family and given, meant something. (And Native Americans seem/seemed to give meaningful names very frequently).

Let's not forget that two of the cast members of "Firefly" are named Summer (who plays River) and Jewel (Kaylee).

"Book" and "Wash" could easily be nicknames, unrelated to their "real" names, or they could be abbreviated versions of names such as Booker or Washington.

I don't think there are any rules about what you can name yourself or your children in the US. I believe the pop star Prince actually renamed himself to an unpronouncable symbol as part of a contract dispute with his record company.

Dan Damouth

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Wednesday, November 27, 2002 5:45 PM

POSSESSION

I went to http://www.behindthename.com which is a site that has origins and meanings of first names.

Wash, Book, Inara and Jayne are not in there. Well, Jayne is listed, but as a variant form for "Jane" and it's used in the feminine form.

The names: Malcolm is of Scottish and English decent. River is of English decent (cen be used for either male or female). Zoe is of English, Greek and Polish decent. Simon is of a lot-- English, French, Scandinavian and Hungarian decent. And Kaylee is listed as a variation of the name Kayley, which is of English and Irish decent.

I'm sure, since like mentioned above with Inara's name being Arabic, that the other names may be actual names, or just ones the writers somehow made up. Because a name search engine isn't exactly that reliable. My name wasn't even listed.

Captain Tight Pants
http://browncoats.cjb.net

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Thursday, November 28, 2002 8:52 PM

BLUEHOOT

Quote:
Originally posted by TheLeftHand:
Jayne is a feminine sounding name, so the comic relief element with the toughest guy on the ship having a "girly" name is obvious, as noted.

I actually find the name "Jayne" to be very masculine. Its the Y that does it. When I see them written, Jane=feminine and Jayne=masculine. Perhaps its the very hunky Adam Baldwin that makes me think this. Perhaps not. One of my dearest friends has the middle name of Jaynes (yes with the S) and I still found it masculine, though it belongs to a girl.

As far as naming rules goes...Why are those rules against certain names in place? Aside from trying to prevent the child from being teased.
In the US, I could name my child Craphead Stinkyfeet, and though it would be extremely cruel, I could still do it.

I wish I was a jellyfish because jellyfish dont pay rent.

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Thursday, November 28, 2002 9:02 PM

HOTFORKAYLEE

I wish I was a jellyfish because jellyfish dont pay rent.

But jellyfish don't get to watch Firefly.

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Thursday, November 28, 2002 9:35 PM

BLUEHOOT

Quote:
Originally posted by HotForKaylee:

I wish I was a jellyfish because jellyfish dont pay rent.

But jellyfish don't get to watch Firefly.

well then I'd just grow some eyeballs and get a waterproof tv.

Dont mind my Jimmy Buffett reference....I'm a Parrot-Head in training.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I wish I was a jellyfish because jellyfish dont pay rent.

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Friday, November 29, 2002 12:49 PM

GATORMARC

Quote:
Originally posted by Idefix:

but you probably don't even know Idefix, do you? Asterix comic books? the little dog of Obelix? in the original french and in german and probably in some more languages he's called Idefix. in the english translation he's called Dogmatix.
and he's a male dog but I'm not *grin*.

Idefix

Ahh.... that makes sense now...

I figured it was a screenname carryover from some tech board and you were the person to go to when someone had IDE problems

If you want interesting character names, check out http://www.homestarrunner.com

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Friday, November 29, 2002 4:48 PM

SENSOU

Quote:
Originally posted by Damouth:

I don't think there are any rules about what you can name yourself or your children in the US. I believe the pop star Prince actually renamed himself to an unpronouncable symbol as part of a contract dispute with his record company.

Dan Damouth

He was "The Artist Formerly Known As Prince." The symbol was a circle with wings and a dagger-ish thing hanging off the bottom. Didn't know why, though.

On a semi-related note, I think Wash's "real" name is Joseph Odeyuss Edwards.

Sensou
Sweet is love when all is sane
Sweet is death to end the pain
Cruel is death when all is well
Cruel is love when all is hell

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Friday, November 29, 2002 10:17 PM

IDEFIX

Quote:
Originally posted by GatorMarc:
Quote:
Originally posted by Idefix:

but you probably don't even know Idefix, do you? Asterix comic books? the little dog of Obelix? in the original french and in german and probably in some more languages he's called Idefix. in the english translation he's called Dogmatix.
and he's a male dog but I'm not *grin*.

Idefix

Ahh.... that makes sense now...

I figured it was a screenname carryover from some tech board and you were the person to go to when someone had IDE problems

If you want interesting character names, check out http://www.homestarrunner.com

nice to know this *big grin*. would it help if I posted the Dogmatix along with it? do americans know the comic books or not so much? I think about everyone in france and germany knows them. I'd be pretty sure that the english know them too, and probably most other europeans. it's famous for being translated to lots and lots of languages.

and to make it more bizarre for you. I've never liked those comic books, never even read one to the end. but there was a time when friends of mine sugested to assign 'Asterix' style names to all of us and I ended up being the little dog, because my boyfriend of that time was Obelix and I was able to pass the 'Idefix' test: scratching behind my ear with my 'hindleg'. I had to rely on my 'foreleg' for help but that was accepted.
and all the other names 'Asterix' and 'Obelix' and so on were never actually used - just mine. but I loke dogs and I think it fit's in a way.

Idefix
...who does know something about computers and is a fan of IDE as opposed to SCSI but no expert

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Saturday, November 30, 2002 8:14 PM

GATORMARC

Quote:
Originally posted by Idefix:

nice to know this *big grin*. would it help if I posted the Dogmatix along with it? do americans know the comic books or not so much? I think about everyone in france and germany knows them. I'd be pretty sure that the english know them too, and probably most other europeans. it's famous for being translated to lots and lots of languages.

I've heard of the comic and I think I've seen the main character on a show on the Discovery Channel on roller coasters because there is an Asterix themed coaster or amusement park or something.

Isn't he a Viking looking guy or something?

I've never actually read the comic. I think a lot gets lost in the translation. I can't think of any foreign comic that makes sense in the States... with the possible exception of Manga.

I, personally, enjoy the "Sunday Morning" style of comics... just 2 or 3 panels to get the entire story, not a full book. I'm pretty happy with Dilbert, Foxtrot, and Sinfest :)

Quote:

and to make it more bizarre for you. I've never liked those comic books, never even read one to the end. but there was a time when friends of mine sugested to assign 'Asterix' style names to all of us and I ended up being the little dog, because my boyfriend of that time was Obelix and I was able to pass the 'Idefix' test: scratching behind my ear with my 'hindleg'. I had to rely on my 'foreleg' for help but that was accepted.
and all the other names 'Asterix' and 'Obelix' and so on were never actually used - just mine. but I loke dogs and I think it fit's in a way.

Do these names actually mean anything? Is "asterix" in any way related to the English word "asterisk"?

Quote:

Idefix
...who does know something about computers and is a fan of IDE as opposed to SCSI but no expert

Just gimme Firewire and I'm happy :)

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Sunday, December 1, 2002 12:53 AM

IDEFIX

Quote:
Originally posted by GatorMarc:
I've heard of the comic and I think I've seen the main character on a show on the Discovery Channel on roller coasters because there is an Asterix themed coaster or amusement park or something.

Isn't he a Viking looking guy or something?

that's Asterix. but he actually is "Gallier" (don't know the english term and my dic doesn't know too). that's a people living in france when the roman empire was trying to conquer france (it actually did). and so the comics are about a small "gallic" village being the only thing standing in the way of the romans conquering all of france. Asterix is the small wise guy with the horned helm, he comes up with all the good ideas. and he drinks a magic potion when he needs more strength to beat up some romans. and then there is his very best friend Obelix. he's a very big and a bit dumb guy, when he was a kid he fell into the pod with the magic potion and so he always is very very strong. he carries a big rock around often and he loves to eat whole wild pigs. and Obelix (actually a very nice big dumb boy) has a little white dog with some black spots. the dog seems to be smarter than his owner. and that's about all I know about it.

Quote:
I've never actually read the comic. I think a lot gets lost in the translation. I can't think of any foreign comic that makes sense in the States... with the possible exception of Manga.

funny things are hard to translate but I think the german translation is done well enough and I still don't like it. but I'm no comic fan at all. I prefer books and TV and about anything else.

Quote:
Do these names actually mean anything? Is "asterix" in any way related to the English word "asterisk"?

I don't know, maybe we have a french speaking firefly fan here and he/she can enlighten us to the meaning, if there is one. in the german translation the names are just the same as in french and they don't mean nothing to me (speaking only german, english and a little bit of latin and russian).

Idefix

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Sunday, December 1, 2002 2:26 AM

TINYTIMM

Quote:
Originally posted by Idefix:
..that's Asterix. but he actually is "Gallier"

Asterix the Gaul in the English version, which I saw back in the 1970's.

Jeff
Who notes comics are immortal.

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Sunday, December 1, 2002 10:36 AM

AINEIN

So...you think some of the names on FF are a bit strange? I work in hospital call center and make appointments for kids being named "Prince Michael"
"Sir Rodrigo" "Immunique (I'm unique), MellyMel and his sisters MelQuetta and MelQuesta. Pity the poor kid running around named 'Gonja'...we know what his mama was doing now, don't we? How 'bout
Minnieconjoe (woman didn't believe me when I told it was the name of a Native American tribe of the Sioux nation) Rasin Cain...Nosmo King (no smoking)...and yeah, we've all heard the joke about the twins 'Oranjello' and 'Lemonjello'. In light of all that, I guess Wash, Book, River and Inara aren't so strange after all.

Ainein Kurogane

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Sunday, December 1, 2002 10:51 AM

EVANS

Quote:
Originally posted by Ainein:
...and yeah, we've all heard the joke about the twins 'Oranjello' and 'Lemonjello'. In light of all that, I guess Wash, Book, River and Inara aren't so strange after all.
Ainein Kurogane

There were a pair of sisters in Texas, of a prominent family named Hogg. I am not making this up. The girls were named "Ima" and "Ura." They lived to be two of the most charming and charitable ladies anyone might find in the South, and their passing was mourned.

On a lighter note, a couple in San Jose, California, whose name was Cianci, named their daughter Nancy Ann.

m.
------------------------------------------------
"But ... not boring, like she made it sound." Wash, in ARIEL

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Sunday, December 1, 2002 11:32 AM

AINEIN

I believe you...my husband's grandmother's last married named was HOGG...but being from Dayton, O-HI-YO, they preferred to pronounce it HOE-G.
Being from Oklahoma, m'self, H O G G is still 'hog'. At work we joke about being on the Name Police...some of the things people name their children is criminal.

Ainein Kurogane

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