Sillytime: Who would win in a fight, Mal or Jayne? by chrisisall

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Sillytime: Who would win in a fight, Mal or Jayne?

POSTED BY: CHRISISALL
UPDATED: Sunday, August 28, 2005 14:26
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VIEWED: 6833
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Friday, August 26, 2005 3:29 PM

It's a little like askin' who would win between Kirk and Picard (Kirk, of course), but it ain't as simple.
Jayne has brawn and cunning; Mal's just plain smarter.
With no guns, out on a street, and neither drunk, what's your call?

Always thinkin' about fightin' Chrisisall

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Friday, August 26, 2005 3:47 PM

CITIZEN

I've said it before and I'll say it again...
My granma will whoop 'em both good, with one hand behind her back.

Or Mal, cause he just seems to fight better...

Q: What do you have when you are holding two little green balls in your hand.
A: Kermit's undivided attention.

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Friday, August 26, 2005 3:52 PM

BATMARLOWE

In a fair fight, Jayne. He's stronger. Unless Mal could rope-a-dope him.

In an unfair fight--well it depends on the way in which it's unfair. A savage kick-'em-in-the-nuts, eye-gouging kind of fight, Jayne. A use-any-resource-available kind of fight, Mal. Because he'll be smart enough to recognize and utilize those resources.

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Friday, August 26, 2005 4:04 PM

CHRISISALL

So, Jayne would be Bruce Lee to Mal's Jackie Chan?

I'd have to go with that.

Martial Chrisisall

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Friday, August 26, 2005 4:43 PM

EMBERS

I don't know what would make Jayne raise a hand to Mal,
Jayne has a strong respect for the chain of command:
he doesn't admit to Zoe's superiority,
but he definitely recognizes that Mal is the alpha dog.

I think that that level of respect would always make Jayne hesitate and Mal win.

If something happened to make Jayne totally forget who Mal is,
THEN Jayne would win, he is stronger, bigger, and more ruthless (and would fight dirty).
Mal is way smarter, but in a real fight I'm not sure that that would make the difference.

Gina points out that Zoe would always beat Jayne,
she'd just have to take off her shirt and Jayne would stand there dumpfounded giving Zoe plenty of chance to sucker punch him and take him down.

heck, I'm pretty sure Inara could beat Jayne in that same way (plus good w/a sword!)

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Friday, August 26, 2005 5:05 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by embers:
Mal is way smarter, but in a real fight I'm not sure that that would make the difference.

As was mentioned above, Mal might rope-a-dope him, given no 'tools' to use otherwise. But that would put Mal in the realm of near death before it was over.

Ain't theories fun Chrisisall

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Friday, August 26, 2005 5:28 PM

GUNRUNNER

Jayne would win because he would cheat and use a gun or knife.

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Friday, August 26, 2005 5:55 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Ah, but you forget... Jayne FEARS Mal.

He's afraid of him, really - watch his reaction when Mal strongarms Wash in OOG?

The incident at the end of Ariel likely didn't do wonders for Jaynes courage either.

It'd still be close, but in order to win a fight like that, you have to believe you can do so.

-F

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Friday, August 26, 2005 5:56 PM

CHRISISALL

Hey!! I said NO CHEATING!!!

Chrisisall

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Friday, August 26, 2005 6:23 PM

JUMPY

Well. Mal is probably more important to the overall story of the show so if it was to the death he would win! :D

__________________________
There's no show I'd rather see, than the one with Serenity.
You can't take the sky from me...

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Friday, August 26, 2005 6:50 PM

GUNRUNNER

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Hey!! I said NO CHEATING!!!

Chrisisall

No you didn't, and saying say no cheating after the cheating has taken place is infact changing the rules and thus cheating!

EV Nova Firefly mod Message Board:
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Friday, August 26, 2005 7:01 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Star Trek Generations was such an incredible (as in, not believable) movie. One of the things that made it unbelievable was this:

Picard had to grab Kirk to beat Soren in a brawl?

Have you looked at Picard and Kirk in that film?

Picard was in such better shape than Kirk. Maybe the Kirk of TOS could own Picard, due to youth, strength, stamina.... but the Kirk of Generations was totally inferior. Bloated, old, and weak looking. Picard certainly aged better.

Jayne versus Mal?

Depends on what they're fighting for. Mal's good at exceeding his limitations under the right circumstances. He can be stunningly dangerous when called for.

Jayne always fights the same: Competant and simple.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Friday, August 26, 2005 7:02 PM

MANOSBDH

Simple fact is, in just about every fight mal gets into, he pretty much loses, or only wins by cheating, or wins only at the verge of death. Jayne, never really seen him lose a fight. He's smart enough to not get into fights he knows he'll lose though. Kinda makes Jayne look smarter than Mal... but the trick is Jayne is opportunistic and Mal fights for what's right... problem is, what's right is far from being what's easy. Learned that from Dumbledore. (c:

Anyway, a straight fist fight in a reasonably controled situation, gonna go with Jayne.

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Saturday, August 27, 2005 1:08 AM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by GunRunner:
Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Hey!! I said NO CHEATING!!!

Chrisisall

No you didn't, and saying say no cheating after the cheating has taken place is infact changing the rules and thus cheating!

Quote:
Originally posted by Chrisisall:
With no guns, out on a street, and neither drunk, what's your call?

Game, Set, Match no?

Q: What do you have when you are holding two little green balls in your hand.
A: Kermit's undivided attention.

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Saturday, August 27, 2005 3:19 AM

SHINYSEVEN2

If Jayne thought there was any kind of fight he could win, the Interesting Damn Day would have happened already.

And the end of Ariel's been mentioned...Mal won that fight pretty quickly.

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Saturday, August 27, 2005 4:57 AM

CHRISISALL

Good point...

Chrisisall

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Saturday, August 27, 2005 6:36 AM

R1Z

Assuming that Mal and Jayne really are of a mindset to really fight to the death, Jayne would win, hands down.

He trains constantly (we never see Mal lift weights or do pull ups in the cargo bay). He has the weight advantage and we've seen him rescue Mal in several fights already (Train Job and War Stories). Jayne is a fighting machine, it's his one skill (that we know of).

'Course I'd hate to see it come to that, but it sure would make an interesting dream/nightmare sequence. It'd be interesting to see how Joss would work it into an episode.

Maybe as Enara's nightmare?

To enjoy the flavor of life, take big bites. Moderation is for monks. --Robt. Heinlein

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Saturday, August 27, 2005 6:57 AM

CHRISISALL

Maybe a galactic radiation storm swaps Jayne for the evil(er) Jayne from an alternate universe...

*choke* It's already too 'Lost in Space' for me...

Galactic radiation storm(?)Chrisisall

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Saturday, August 27, 2005 8:45 AM

TALLGRRL

It's not so much that Jayne "respects the chain of command".
It's that whole putting-a-guy-into-the-engine thing that keeps him in line.
I mean, come on, would YOU fuck with a guy that did that?
I didn't think so.
And, yep, Zoe'd undo ONE button and Jayne would stop. And Zoe'd clock 'im.
Oh, and Mal would win because he's not a really good fighter...but he looks for the advantage and when he finds it, he takes it. In other words, he's not above cheatin'.
Jayne's just a big brute. If he was smarter he'd be very, very dangerous.

"Take me, sir. Take me hard." -- Zoe
"Kill 'im, Marv. Kill 'im good." -- Sin City

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Saturday, August 27, 2005 2:00 PM

HOBANWASHBURN

Yeah, I somehow doubt that considering a fight where Mal didn't cheat would ever happen. He ends things good and quick. It's not about the glory of fighting to him. It's about finishing things as quick as possible, because, dammit, he's got better things to do!

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Saturday, August 27, 2005 7:04 PM

VISITINGMYINTENTIONS

Mal would win, because he'd have Zoe. If it was just the two of them, no weapons, no cheating (rather implausible for Mal), basically strength against strength, well, if you narrow it down to that you've got a very artificial situation. Jayne would win. He's stronger.

In any gun fight between the three of them, Zoe would win. She's fast and she doesn't miss. Mal is a little wilder, although he does often manage to win fights by doing something unexpected. Jayne's a good shot, but Zoe is faster and smarter.

What I fear is if Book ever abandoned his Christian no-kill policy. He'd be unstoppable.

---------------------------------------------------
Early: Where'd she go?

Simon: I can't keep track of her when she's NOT incorporeally possessing a spaceship, don't look at me --

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Saturday, August 27, 2005 8:17 PM

R1Z

Quote:
Jayne's just a big brute. If he was smarter he'd be very, very dangerous.

TALLGRLL, you take that back!! Jayne is not just a big brute.

Mal's nice, but I bet you can't name even one crummy town where he's a hero.

Don't make us come over there!

To enjoy the flavor of life, take big bites. Moderation is for monks. --Robt. Heinlein

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Sunday, August 28, 2005 3:15 AM

HAWK

My bet is that any fight between Mal and Jayne would end with Jayne dead and Mal hovering on the brink of death. I just have this picture in my head of Jayne being confronted as some kind of traitor by Mal and Jayne just lunging at him.

In terms of fighting skills on the Good ship Serenity, I tend to think of Zoe and Jayne occupying the top rung with Mal just below them (Book, Inara and River are mysterious and I wouldn't like to call them).

ButI think Mal's smarts would win out against Jayne along with the aforemetioned psychological edge; maybe he'd call ayne on his pride/masculinity, talk Jayne into a blind rage and get him to make a vital mistake.

----------------------

The Fantastic Adventures of Adam Crabtree

http://www.greatestjournal.com/users/sparhawk/

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Sunday, August 28, 2005 5:03 AM

R1Z

Quote:
talk Jayne into a blind rage and get him to make a vital mistake.

Don't recall ever seeing Jane in a blind rage or make a vital mistake during a fight. Jayne seems most in his element when he's fighting.

Sounds like wishful thinking to me.

You got any references to episodes to back up your speculation?

To enjoy the flavor of life, take big bites. Moderation is for monks. --Robt. Heinlein

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Sunday, August 28, 2005 5:16 AM

MANWITHPEZ

Important people don't do field work.

When I first came over to this website sometime ago, I proposed just this very match-up...

http://fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=2&t=5505

But, I think for the most part, we kinda talked circles around the actual question. Sure was neat to see it again though...

Kaylee: "What's so damn important about being proper? It don't mean nothing out here in the black."
Simon: "It means more out here. It's all I have..."

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Sunday, August 28, 2005 6:01 AM

CHRISISALL

That thread over a year ago went on about the possibility of the confrontation, and looked at Jayne's loyalty and such, an excellent thread. This time around, I think it's more technical, y'know, seein' how it would play.
Interesting how the same basic question gets two different treatments two different times.

Fight promoter Chrisisall

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Sunday, August 28, 2005 8:47 AM

KIZZIECSTARS

i reckon mal. because river'd probably be on his side given the whole jayne turnin her over to the big Al in ariel. and she kicks jayne's ass.
or if there was no river, mal might just run away.

peace out
Kizzie
XxX

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Sunday, August 28, 2005 10:49 AM

SIXGUN

In a fair one on one fight, Jayne would win. Mal knows that. That's why he sucker punched him with a wrench in Ariel. Mal wins most of his enounters with guile and cunning. He's used to going up against superior odds. "That's what makes us special," he tells Zoe in the pilot. Jayne's all about butting heads straight on. He's the muscle.

Well, as a rule I say girl folk ain't to be trusted.

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Sunday, August 28, 2005 12:51 PM

GUNRUNNER

Quote:
Originally posted by VisitingMyIntentions:
In any gun fight between the three of them, Zoe would win. She's fast and she doesn't miss. Mal is a little wilder, although he does often manage to win fights by doing something unexpected. Jayne's a good shot, but Zoe is faster and smarter.

But Jayne’s got the firepower; Vera, sniper rifles, grenades, automatic weapons etc. The biggest gun Zoe has had after the war was a lever action rifle.

Remember when Zoe got shot in the pilot? She got knocked down but survived because she wears armor. Jayne has been shot twice, all he did was swear a little then kept fighting and he doesn’t wear armor.

Zoe is a good fighter but Jayne can just pump out so much ammo she and Mal would get hit.

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Sunday, August 28, 2005 2:26 PM

R1Z

OK, so now it's Jayne against Mal AND Zoe??

Them ain't culturized rules.

And besides, Zoe would let the two of them settle it themselves. Remember in War Stories when she tell Wash and Jayne that the Cap'n had to do it for himself? (Course Mal would welcome the help, but Zoe has principles.)

To enjoy the flavor of life, take big bites. Moderation is for monks. --Robt. Heinlein

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