CINEMA

The Marvels Failure Thread

POSTED BY: 6IXSTRINGJACK
UPDATED: Tuesday, January 9, 2024 14:56
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VIEWED: 1450
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Friday, September 22, 2023 2:53 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


In a year where there's only been one single Superhero flick out of five that even made any money, you know the sequel to Captain Marvel is going to fail hard.

We've already got a great laugh out of Vanity Fair trolling its readership and the Twitterati by telling them The Marvels cost $130 Million to make and was "the cheapest Marvel Movie yet".

I told everyone on Twitter that posted this nonsense that it was a total lie, and Reality did not disappoint.


Bounding Into Comics: After Vanity Fair Claimed ‘The Marvels’ Clocked In With A $130 Million Budget, Forbes Now Shares The Movie’s Budget Is An Enormous $274 Million

https://boundingintocomics.com/2023/09/20/after-vanity-fair-claimed-th
e-marvels-clocked-in-with-a-130-million-budget-forbes-now-shares-the-movies-budget-is-an-enormous-274-million
/

Quote:

Vanity Fair originally reported that the film’s production budget clocked in at $130 million in their most recent expose about the film’s director, Nia DaCosta. However, Vanity Fair has since updated their article and removed any mentioned of the movie’s production budget.

Nevertheless, an archive exists showing that it indeed reported, “DaCosta is still is also still grappling with the breakthroughs she’s made, including the fact that, at $130 million, The Marvels is the highest-budgeted film ever helmed by a Black woman.”



Wowie!

Quote:

This latest report from Forbes states, “The blockbuster budget is disclosed in company filings released yesterday by the Disney subsidiary which made the movie. They show that over the two-year period from the incorporation of the company to September 30, 2022, it spent $274.8 million (£221.8 million) and banked a $55 million (£44.4 million) subsidy from the government of the United Kingdom where the movie was made. This brought its net spending down to $219.8 million.”


OPPS!

There ain't no way in hell this movie is making $550 Million in 2023.

Congrats Disney and Black Lady. You now have on your hands the most expensive flop ever directed by a black woman. I hope you're happy.


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Monday, September 25, 2023 12:59 PM

JAYNEZTOWN


UPDATE: ‘The Marvels’ Actually Turns Out To Be the Most Expensive Movie of the Multiverse Saga

https://www.comicbasics.com/the-marvels-is-reportedly-among-the-lowest
-budgeted-mcu-movies-so-far
/

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Monday, September 25, 2023 2:13 PM

WHOZIT


Disney doesn't have the 'Disney Dollas' to throw around anymore. I wouldn't be surprised if they sell ABC sooner rather than later for some cash. They've mishandled Marvel and Lucasfilm so bad it'll take years to fix...unless they end up selling them too.

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Monday, September 25, 2023 2:14 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


I already put that update in the original post. I thought maybe you were posting an article that proved it was more than $274 Million.

There are some who speculate and give good reasons and evidence to believe that The Marvels actually cost over $300 Million to make and that continued reshoots haven't been calculated in the updated total that Forbes recently put out there.

I didn't mention that part in the OP because I don't particularly care to deal in rumors when I'm making my predictions, but it is possible that The Marvels cost quite a bit more than what they finally came out and admitted already.

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Monday, September 25, 2023 2:55 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by whozit:
Disney doesn't have the 'Disney Dollas' to throw around anymore. I wouldn't be surprised if they sell ABC sooner rather than later for some cash. They've mishandled Marvel and Lucasfilm so bad it'll take years to fix...unless they end up selling them too.





Yeah...

I've heard that the can't sell Lucasfilm to anyone. Not only have they damaged the brand so bad that nobody would ever pay anything close to what they bought it for, but unless they wanted to knock down all their Lucasfilm attractions at their themeparks they'd end up having to pay licensing rights in order to keep using them.

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Monday, October 2, 2023 2:09 PM

JAYNEZTOWN


The Marvels Is Going To Be The Shortest MCU Movie Ever

https://www.small-screen.co.uk/the-marvels-shortest-mcu-movie-ever/

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Monday, October 2, 2023 3:43 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


What that article fails to mention is that the runtime is 105 minutes.

So to the few people who go to the theaters and pay to see this drek, remember that it cost Disney/marvel $2,609,523.81 per minute to make at $274 Million / 105 minutes.


Then compare that with Avengers: End Game which cost "only" $1,956,043.96 per minute to create at $356 Million / 182 minutes, and wonder where the hell all the money was spent on The Marvels.





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Wednesday, October 4, 2023 8:58 AM

JAYNEZTOWN

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Wednesday, October 4, 2023 12:23 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by JAYNEZTOWN:
The Marvels Must Make $440 Million to Break Even



That's only considering the 2.0x RoT, and at this point, especially for ultra-budget movies, we've pretty much established that we're on the 2.5x RoT in 2023 now. The Marvel's likely needs more like $550 Million to break even. And since companies (theoretically) are in the business of making money, it would need at least $700 Million to even justify the time and money put into it in the first place.

Plus, that $220 Million figure after British subsidies is very likely not the full picture. That's just what they had to file with the UK when applying for that $55 Million subsidy. Word is there were pretty extensive reshoots and other post-production expenses that went into the movie. I imagine the editing team had a hell of a time chopping the movie down to only 1 hour and 45 minutes while maintaining any sense of structure and story.



Why do I give this possibility creedence?

This is why:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carolinereid/2023/10/02/disney-sinks-300-
million-into-over-budget-little-mermaid-movie
/

FORBES (October 2nd): Disney Sinks $300 Million Into ‘Over Budget’ ‘Little Mermaid’ Movie

It just came out that The Little Mermaid cost $300 Million to make. Not the already ludicris $250 Million that was reported when the movie first came out. Now that movie is loser on both the 2.0x RoT and the 2.5x RoT.

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Thursday, October 19, 2023 3:31 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


The Marvels Predicted to Flop

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/marvels-predicted-flop-160000868.html?
guccounter=1


Quote:

According to forecasts by Box Office Pro, the domestic opening of Marvel’s next big blockbuster will generate between $50 million and $75 million. That’s less than half of what Captain Marvel managed in 2019.

Reports also say presales are “alarmingly low,” down 69% behind Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3, and 72% behind Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania. All in all, it’s not looking good ahead of The Marvels’ release date on November 10, especially given its reported $270+ million gross budget.



You don't say...

Quote:

Despite damning early signs, however, it’s unlikely to cause the Marvel machine too much damage. It can recoup costs through merchandising and streaming sales. And, of course, if the film is any good, word of mouth will build. So don’t count it out just yet.


False. Marvel merchandise rots on shelves of department stores before it rots on shelves of Ollie's and Dollar General before it rots in a landfill along with Star Wars merch.

And as long as Disney+ exists and continues to lose hundreds of millions of dollars every quarter instead of licensing out the rights to its movies to other streaming services like Netflix, The Marvels will make ZERO dollars from streaming.




Brie Larson’s ‘The Marvels’ Predicted To Have One Of If Not The Worst Box Office Grosses For The Marvel Cinematic Universe Ever

https://boundingintocomics.com/2023/10/13/brie-larsons-the-marvels-pre
dicted-to-have-one-of-if-not-the-worst-box-office-grosses-for-the-marvel-cinematic-universe-ever
/

Quote:

Box Office Pro shared their projects for The Marvels claiming the film will only gross between $50 million and $75 million in its domestic opening weekend.

They also predict it will bring in between $121 million and $189 million at the domestic box office.



If those predictions remain accurate, there's a very good chance this movie does only between $300 and $400 Million worldwide and will be the biggest Disney flop of the year behind Indy 5.

With ScreenRant's recent article about The Creator stating that a film needs 2.5x the budget to break even (joining Deadline and Variety also making that claim this year), The Marvels is going to need $685 Million to break even. And that's only if we don't find out later how much more they spent on the extensive reshoots and other problems like we already did with The Little Mermaid.



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Thursday, October 19, 2023 3:37 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Director Nia DaCosta Implies She’s Done With Marvel Studios Productions After ‘The Marvels’

https://boundingintocomics.com/2023/09/20/director-nia-dacosta-implies
-shes-done-with-marvel-studios-productions-after-the-marvels
/

Oh. I see.

We're going to just pretend that you weren't fired for incompetence and that "moving on" was a choice that you made.

We look forward to your new book, Nia, where you blame Donald Trump for the bad times you had at Marvel Studios.

Keep failing upward!





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Thursday, October 19, 2023 9:14 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Personally, I'd rather go see "Dicks: The Musical", even if it's all about dicks.

And I hate musicals.



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Wednesday, November 1, 2023 2:02 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by 6ixStringJack (October 19th):
The Marvels Predicted to Flop

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/marvels-predicted-flop-160000868.html?
guccounter=1


Quote:

According to forecasts by Box Office Pro, the domestic opening of Marvel’s next big blockbuster will generate between $50 million and $75 million. That’s less than half of what Captain Marvel managed in 2019.

Reports also say presales are “alarmingly low,” down 69% behind Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3, and 72% behind Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania. All in all, it’s not looking good ahead of The Marvels’ release date on November 10, especially given its reported $270+ million gross budget.



You don't say...

Quote:

Despite damning early signs, however, it’s unlikely to cause the Marvel machine too much damage. It can recoup costs through merchandising and streaming sales. And, of course, if the film is any good, word of mouth will build. So don’t count it out just yet.


False. Marvel merchandise rots on shelves of department stores before it rots on shelves of Ollie's and Dollar General before it rots in a landfill along with Star Wars merch.

And as long as Disney+ exists and continues to lose hundreds of millions of dollars every quarter instead of licensing out the rights to its movies to other streaming services like Netflix, The Marvels will make ZERO dollars from streaming.




Brie Larson’s ‘The Marvels’ Predicted To Have One Of If Not The Worst Box Office Grosses For The Marvel Cinematic Universe Ever

https://boundingintocomics.com/2023/10/13/brie-larsons-the-marvels-pre
dicted-to-have-one-of-if-not-the-worst-box-office-grosses-for-the-marvel-cinematic-universe-ever
/

Quote:

Box Office Pro shared their projects for The Marvels claiming the film will only gross between $50 million and $75 million in its domestic opening weekend.

They also predict it will bring in between $121 million and $189 million at the domestic box office.



If those predictions remain accurate, there's a very good chance this movie does only between $300 and $400 Million worldwide and will be the biggest Disney flop of the year behind Indy 5.

With ScreenRant's recent article about The Creator stating that a film needs 2.5x the budget to break even (joining Deadline and Variety also making that claim this year), The Marvels is going to need $685 Million to break even. And that's only if we don't find out later how much more they spent on the extensive reshoots and other problems like we already did with The Little Mermaid.





It just keeps getting worse for this one...

Report: Brie Larson’s ‘The Marvels’ Now Tracking For Atrocious $45M-$50M Opening Weekend

https://boundingintocomics.com/2023/11/01/report-brie-larsons-the-marv
els-now-tracking-for-atrocious-45m-50m-opening-weekend
/



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Thursday, November 2, 2023 5:48 PM

JAYNEZTOWN


‘The Marvels’ Will Test Our Franchise Fatigue: November Box Office Preview

https://www.indiewire.com/news/box-office/the-marvels-test-franchise-f
atigue-november-box-office-preview-1234921899
/

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Tuesday, November 7, 2023 8:00 PM

WHOZIT


Even the entertainment press sez it's going to 'under preform', which is their way of saying...KABOOM!!

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Tuesday, November 7, 2023 8:41 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by whozit:
Even the entertainment press sez it's going to 'under preform', which is their way of saying...KABOOM!!







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Tuesday, November 7, 2023 9:51 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


The Marvels Opening-Weekend Box Office Projections Just Got Even Worse

The next MCU movie's first-weekend box office estimates have been lowered substantially.

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/the-marvels-opening-weekend-box-offi
ce-projections-just-got-even-worse/1100-6518979
/


Ticket presales are at $5 Million, which is lower than The Flash.

If that reflects a $55 Million like The Flash or worse, there is a very good chance that Five Nights at Freddy's with its $25 Million budget is going to beat The Marvels at the Worldwide Box Office.



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Tuesday, November 7, 2023 10:01 PM

OLDGUY

What Would Mal do ?


so, that kind of money on a director who has, what?, 4 films to her credit?

I'm sure DEIsney had a solid reason

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Wednesday, November 8, 2023 11:36 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by OLDGUY:
so, that kind of money on a director who has, what?, 4 films to her credit?

I'm sure DEIsney had a solid reason



Yeah. Looks like The Marvels makes it 5 films. The Candyman reboot in 2021 is the only movie I've ever heard of. To be fair to her, it did make $77 Million on a $25 Million budget, or a 308% return. That is a "winner" even by the 2.5x RoT, however, in 2023 where we currently see 11 of the top 20 movies in the horror genre and 6 of the top 10 movies in the horror genre, 308% would put Candyman in 24th place, with the only two other horror movies below it being M Knight Shamalyan's Knock at the Cabin and Steven King's The Bogeyman (with King's Bogeyman being the only horror movie to fail the 2.5x RoT in 2023).

Horror is a very hard genre to mess up with the reasonable budgets.



Honestly, I don't even blame Nia herself for this upcoming failure. The fact that they would even put a diversity hire with no real cred behind her in charge of a $275 Million Marvel movie just shows how little input Disney/Marvel needs (or even wants) from their directors. (And Nia's hardly the only one. Look at the list of Marvel movies since End Game). I don't think she really DID anything during this movie besides being a black lady sitting in a director's chair. These movies are made by committee now, and you could pretty much take anybody off the street and put them in that chair and the movie would be shit with or without them.

This is further evidenced by all the recent stories that came out saying that she wasn't even involved in the movie for the last 1/4 or 1/3rd of the production since she had other obligations that she finally couldn't push off anymore after Disney kept pushing the release date back. Some people are already shitting on her for doing that and blaming the failure of this movie on her skipping out before it was wrapped up.

I don't agree at all with that assessment. We're getting the exact same movie that we would have gotten if she canceled her other obligations and just continued to be the black lady sitting in the director's chair and doing nothing for another year.

I don't really know anything about her, but I do have to say I've never heard her coming out and saying dumb shit like "if my movie fails it's because white males, blah, blah, blah". I think, if she were allowed to be completely honest, she would tell the world that she resents the entire experience. She knows that she was a tool... just a mere prop. She probably has some ambitions about really being taken seriously as a director one day too, and knows full well that this was nothing more than a marketing move full of platitudes, and now that it's going to fail not only isn't she going to get all the false praise she'd get if it were a success, but having her name attached to The Marvels might actually damage her career quite a bit going forward. Especially if Hollywood goes back to making money and goes back to hiring successful directors for big-budget movies and allowing them to actually direct the movies.

I don't blame Nia at all for skipping town on this one. Hell... It's a shame for her that everybody knows she directed it already. If I were her, I'd want my name completely removed from it and make it another Alan Smithee directed flop.

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Wednesday, November 8, 2023 1:31 PM

WHOZIT


Rotten Tomato's has given it a 55% with 77 reviews so far, no audience score yet.

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Thursday, November 9, 2023 12:16 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by whozit:
Rotten Tomato's has given it a 55% with 77 reviews so far, no audience score yet.



I saw it was as low as 52% a little later too, but it looks like the fix is in and Disney was able to pay some shills to bump it up to 59% with 131 reviews.

Look at the Top Critics though. Those 38 are the ones least likely to be on the take. It's only at 42% among them.



This movie is fuckin' DOA.

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Thursday, November 9, 2023 11:06 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Hitting the Lamestream News now boys...

CNBC: ‘The Marvels’ is probably headed for one of the worst MCU box-office openings ever

Quote:

Initial predictions saw “The Marvels” opening to between $75 million and $80 million domestically, but those figures have shrunk to a range between $60 million and $65 million in recent weeks.


False. Those figures are now $45 to $55 Million.

BoxOfficePro actually has their prediction quite a bit lower than that only 2 days before release at $35M-$49M.

https://www.boxofficepro.com/weekend-box-office-forecast-the-marvels-a
nd-journey-to-bethlehem
/

Quote:

The only MCU films that have opened lower than $60 million have been 2015's “Ant-Man” and 2008's “Incredible Hulk.”


False.

With inflation considered, Ant-Man opened to $74,312,760 and Incredible Hulk opened to $71,960,387.

Quote:

Disney and Marvel Studios have struggled to reconnect with audiences in the post-“Endgame” era.


False.

Disney and Marvel Studios have actively turned hostile to the actual fanbase, even before the End Game era, and the rest of the normies are bored of anything superhero that isn't Spider-Man or Batman.

Quote:

So far, “The Marvels” has a soft score on Rotten Tomatoes. Critics particularly ripped the film’s script, calling it “paper thin,” “charmless” and “pandering in all the wrong places.”


"Soft" is certainly one way to put it.

Though Disney managed to pay enough shills that will be replaced by AI soon to bump the Tomato score to fresh at 62% last night, it was 52% yesterday evening. If you click on Top Critics, they give it 41% out of 39 reviews.

Even by bumping it up to 62% with paid reviews, it still doesn't move it up a single spot on the history of all 33 MCU movies at Rotten Tomatoes. It is still 3rd from last, only above Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania (2023) and The Eternals (2021), and below Thor: Love and Thunder (2022).

https://editorial.rottentomatoes.com/guide/all-marvel-cinematic-univer
se-movies-ranked
/



And you know it's bad when the freakin' Daily Beast says its bad...


‘The Marvels’ Is Another Fiasco in Marvel’s Road to Ruin

https://www.thedailybeast.com/obsessed/the-marvels-review-yet-another-
fiasco-in-marvels-road-to-ruin




If you said about the original Captain Marvel movie what Daily Beast is now saying about The Marvels, they would have called you a woman hating racist.

In fact, that's exactly what they did on March 6th of 2019:

How Brie Larson’s ‘Captain Marvel’ Made Angry White Men Lose Their Damn Minds

https://www.thedailybeast.com/how-brie-larsons-captain-marvel-made-ang
ry-white-men-lose-their-damn-minds



I'm loving 2023. Thanks Joe Biden*. We couldn't have done all of this without you.



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Thursday, November 9, 2023 6:23 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Looks like The Marvels only sold less than 1/4 the amount of tickets in France that Captain Marvel sold.

https://insidethemagic.net/2023/11/the-marvels-flop-50000-tickets-cj1/


Let's make this a worldwide flop, shall we?



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Thursday, November 9, 2023 11:54 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


It dropped back to 59% on RT just a moment ago, but wouldn't you know it another fresh review came in and bumped it back up to 60%.





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Friday, November 10, 2023 10:38 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Awww man. I was wrong.

Preview night is over and The Marvels is already the highest grossing movie of all time.



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Friday, November 10, 2023 11:01 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


NYT: ‘The Marvels’ Review: You’ve Seen This Movie 32 Times Before

Quote:

This is the 33rd movie in the Marvel Cinematic Universe, which continues to expand even as its cultural interest and resonance diminish. “The Marvels” will dominate the box office, of course, at least during its opening weekend, just because it will flood theaters. It’s pointless complaining, I know (believe me), but it’s frustrating what weak tea this movie is because the director, Nia DaCosta (“Little Woods,” “Candyman”), has talent, the cast is appealing, and there’s a lightly gonzo scene that shows you what the other 100 minutes could have been. It’s almost as if the suits at Marvel Studios know it doesn’t matter if their movies are any good.


Brutal.



A female critic at the NYT in November of 2023 sounds exactly like me for the last 5 years regarding superhero flicks.

Thanks again to Joe Biden* for making this all possible. Maybe he really is managing to bring us all together.


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Friday, November 10, 2023 12:45 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Uh Oh!

Preview Thursday take for the Marvels $6.6 Million.


Preview Thursday numbers for other Marvel movies since the back half of 2021:

Black Widow (07/08/2021): $13.2 Million
Shang Chi (08/02/2021): $8.8 Million
Eternals (11/4/2021): $9.5 Million
Spider-Man: No Way Home (12/16/2021): $50 Million
Dr. Strange and the Multiverse of Madness (05/05/2022): $36 Million
Thor: Love and Thunder (07/07/2022): $29 Million
Wakanda Forever (11/10/2022): $28 Million
Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania (02/16/2023): $17.5 Million
Guardians of the Galaxy: Vol 3 (05/04/2023): $17.5 Million


If you want to see comparable preview numbers to The Marvels, you've got to look elsewhere than even the new Marvel failures. We've got to look to DC.

Shazam II (03/16/2023): $3.4 Million
The Flash (06/15/2023): $9.7 Million
Blue Beetle (08/17/2023): $3.3 Million


I'm looking forward to the headlines blaming straight white males for this failure, especially from the outlets I've posted above that were shitting on the movie themselves.



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Friday, November 10, 2023 12:47 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


The Marvels being a good time feels like a bit of a surprise.

For one thing, Marvel has recently seen an uncharacteristic streak of stinkers. Eternals was a beautiful bore. Ant-Man: Quantumania was a horrendous experience. Thor: Love and Thunder was three good jokes in a trench coat masquerading as a movie. Add to that a bunch of Disney+ shows that are growing increasingly exhausting to keep up with and a main villain — Kang — who feels like the embodiment of a physics lecture (played by an actor facing domestic assault charges), and you get a studio that seems to have lost its mojo. As such, the expectations for The Marvels weren’t very high.

That’s all a bit of a shame because of how fun and charming The Marvels really is.

https://www.vox.com/culture/2023/11/10/23954984/the-marvels-review-bri
e-larson-iman-vellani-teyonah-parris


The Marvels 2023 1080p HD-TS x264-C1NEM4
Posted on Nov 10th, 2023 at 2:55 pm in Movies,Telesync by Master

Release Name: The.Marvels.2023.1080p.HD-TS.x264-C1NEM4
Size: 2.16GB
Video: MP4 | 1920×880 | 2 933 kb/s
Audio: English | AAC | 192 kb/s
Runtime: 1 h 38 min
https://rlsbb.ru/the-marvels-2023-1080p-hd-ts-x264-c1nem4/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, November 10, 2023 1:15 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK




"The movie sucks, but it's so much fun!" ~Every paid Disney shill reviewer who will be laid off and replaced with AI soon out there.

Top Critics: 42% Rotten.

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/the_marvels

Fuck you, pirate.

How's that Disney stock doing?

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Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.

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Friday, November 10, 2023 1:30 PM

WHOZIT


Quote:

Originally posted by 6ixStringJack:
NYT: ‘The Marvels’ Review: You’ve Seen This Movie 32 Times Before

Quote:

This is the 33rd movie in the Marvel Cinematic Universe, which continues to expand even as its cultural interest and resonance diminish. “The Marvels” will dominate the box office, of course, at least during its opening weekend, just because it will flood theaters. It’s pointless complaining, I know (believe me), but it’s frustrating what weak tea this movie is because the director, Nia DaCosta (“Little Woods,” “Candyman”), has talent, the cast is appealing, and there’s a lightly gonzo scene that shows you what the other 100 minutes could have been. It’s almost as if the suits at Marvel Studios know it doesn’t matter if their movies are any good.


Brutal.



A female critic at the NYT in November of 2023 sounds exactly like me for the last 5 years regarding superhero flicks.

Thanks again to Joe Biden* for making this all possible. Maybe he really is managing to bring us all together.


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Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.



Go watch Grace Randolph's review on YOUTUBE or the one on DEADLINE.com, you can tell they gave it great reviews because they're 'access' media. They're both such suck asses for the studios, I bet Randolph's 2nd home back in the day was the casting couch.

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Friday, November 10, 2023 7:10 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by whozit:
Go watch Grace Randolph's review on YOUTUBE or the one on DEADLINE.com,



I would never subject myself to that!

Quote:

you can tell they gave it great reviews because they're 'access' media. They're both such suck asses for the studios, I bet Randolph's 2nd home back in the day was the casting couch.



Yeah, Grace is a regular Pick #MeToo girl.

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Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.

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Friday, November 10, 2023 7:15 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Bruce's weekend predictions at the-numbers.com.

Weekend prediction: The Marvels will struggle to get to $50 million

https://www.the-numbers.com/news/255560830-Weekend-prediction-The-Marv
els-will-struggle-to-get-to-50-million


Quote:

Things don’t look good for The Marvels going into this weekend. After lukewarm (and sometimes hostile) buzz leading up to the release of the film, ticket pre-sales have been disappointing, and its Thursday preview numbers were a downright awful $6.6 million. That’s the worst preview number for a Marvel Cinematic Universe movie since Ant-Man back in 2015. That film went on to earn $57.2 million over its opening weekend. With sequels tending to be more front-loaded, it looks like The Marvels will struggle to reach $50 million this weekend.

That’s a far cry from what Disney would have been hoping for. The first Captain Marvel started out with $153.4 million on its opening weekend, and even with a theatrical market that’s much weaker than 2019, the studio will have been hoping for something around $100 million domestically this weekend. Our advance tracking suggested that would be hard, but still doable.



That's the thing Bruce, 'ole boy. You guys and gals are only able to lie up until the actual numbers come out.

Quote:

The warning signs were already flashing before we saw the preview numbers, with our audience tracking having the film generating about 85% of the interest that the model would expect. Note also the unusually high negative sentiment in our Sentiment Analysis. While this largely came from online trolls who weren’t going to see the film in the first place, Disney has clearly struggled to build positivity around the film.

The preview numbers are basically the final nail in the coffin of a big opening weekend.



Oooooh... "online trolls who weren't going to see the film in the first place", huh Bruce?

Spicy.

Careful there, buddy. Your fly is open and your woke widdle dicky is hanging out for the world to see.



Quote:

We’ve changed our model this week to hopefully increase the accuracy of our final prediction based on the reported previews for a film and our fundamentals prediction. Our old model would have predicted $52.1 million this weekend for The Marvels. We’ll see on Sunday if our new model’s $45.2-million prediction is closer to the mark. In either case, this looks like a poor weekend, and might go some way to explaining why Disney just moved several MCU films back from 2024 to 2025.


Bruce's final prediction for the Holiday Weekend: $45,172,440.



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Saturday, November 11, 2023 9:03 AM

WHOZIT


As of 11/11 'The Marvels' has a 62% critics rating and a 85% audience rating, and it's still going to lose $. Brie was suppose to become the new face of the MCU, but the MCU is out of ideas, they've been out of ideas for a while now. The MCU needs Joss Whedon back, he's been punished enough, give him a call Bob.

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Saturday, November 11, 2023 11:08 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by whozit:
As of 11/11 'The Marvels' has a 62% critics rating and a 85% audience rating, and it's still going to lose $. Brie was suppose to become the new face of the MCU, but the MCU is out of ideas, they've been out of ideas for a while now. The MCU needs Joss Whedon back, he's been punished enough, give him a call Bob.



They need good villains again too. That's something that DC has struggled with outside of Batman and Superman from the beginning.

It's also something that Marvel has largely struggled with outside of X-Men and Spiderman with the exception of Thanos, but they burned the whole Infinity War saga and killed off Thanos. Where do you go from there? Why should anybody even know who Kang is let alone think he's half as compelling as a character once you strip away the fact you've got a black guy playing him?

So you're going to try rebooting the Fantastic Four AGAIN? Good luck. Maybe if you get Dr. Doom right. Nobody has ever managed to get that series off the ground, even when you had peak Jessica Alba at your disposal.

Except for Guardians of the Galaxy 1, Deadpool 1, and Spider-Man: No Way Home I can't even recall an MCU movie out of the handful that I watched that weren't a waste of time. And to give credit where it's due on the first two, I don't even remember the villains they had. Those were both enjoyable because of great writing and acting. No Way Home was the single movie that capitalized on the nostalgiabait gimmic of the Multiverse before it wore out its welcome and is probably my favorite superhero flick of all time or tied with Batman (1989).

The only Marvel property since MCU's launch that I genuinely enjoyed was the first season of Jessica Jones, and I didn't even know who Jessica Jones was before I saw it. Kristen Ritter is a great actress and Jessica was a good character, but Killgrave was one of the best villains I've ever seen in a comic book property on screen. But they killed him off. And I watched the 2nd season and was bored.

I liked parts of Daredevil, especially the great choreographed fights, but as much as I've liked Vincent Denofrio, I didn't care for that rendition of Kingpin and I didn't care much for that show either.


Second just called me "fundamentally evil" in the Barbie/Oppenheimer thread this morning. Maybe somebody should call up Kevin Feige and see if there's a slot for notoriously evil 6ixStringJack in the Marvel Universe.

I'll even put on a MAGA hat for the first time if the pay is good enough.




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Saturday, November 11, 2023 12:43 PM

WHOZIT


Quote:

Originally posted by 6ixStringJack:
Quote:

Originally posted by whozit:
As of 11/11 'The Marvels' has a 62% critics rating and a 85% audience rating, and it's still going to lose $. Brie was suppose to become the new face of the MCU, but the MCU is out of ideas, they've been out of ideas for a while now. The MCU needs Joss Whedon back, he's been punished enough, give him a call Bob.



They need good villains again too. That's something that DC has struggled with outside of Batman and Superman from the beginning.

It's also something that Marvel has largely struggled with outside of X-Men and Spiderman with the exception of Thanos, but they burned the whole Infinity War saga and killed off Thanos. Where do you go from there? Why should anybody even know who Kang is let alone think he's half as compelling as a character once you strip away the fact you've got a black guy playing him?

So you're going to try rebooting the Fantastic Four AGAIN? Good luck. Maybe if you get Dr. Doom right. Nobody has ever managed to get that series off the ground, even when you had peak Jessica Alba at your disposal.

Except for Guardians of the Galaxy 1, Deadpool 1, and Spider-Man: No Way Home I can't even recall an MCU movie out of the handful that I watched that weren't a waste of time. And to give credit where it's due on the first two, I don't even remember the villains they had. Those were both enjoyable because of great writing and acting. No Way Home was the single movie that capitalized on the nostalgiabait gimmic of the Multiverse before it wore out its welcome and is probably my favorite superhero flick of all time or tied with Batman (1989).

The only Marvel property since MCU's launch that I genuinely enjoyed was the first season of Jessica Jones, and I didn't even know who Jessica Jones was before I saw it. Kristen Ritter is a great actress and Jessica was a good character, but Killgrave was one of the best villains I've ever seen in a comic book property on screen. But they killed him off. And I watched the 2nd season and was bored.

I liked parts of Daredevil, especially the great choreographed fights, but as much as I've liked Vincent Denofrio, I didn't care for that rendition of Kingpin and I didn't care much for that show either.


Second just called me "fundamentally evil" in the Barbie/Oppenheimer thread this morning. Maybe somebody should call up Kevin Feige and see if there's a slot for notoriously evil 6ixStringJack in the Marvel Universe.

I'll even put on a MAGA hat for the first time if the pay is good enough.




--------------------------------------------------

Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.



'Maybe somebody should call up Kevin Feige'...and tell him to stop telling the same story over and over. I think the MCU, the DCU, Lucasfilm and the film industry in general has learned that you don't ignore AND, mock the fanbase. Without the fanbase their woke films won't make close to a Billion $, let alone make a profit, like 'Indiana Jones and the Dial of Douchebag', it'll embarrass the studio and everybody involved, then slowly be forgotten. When Disney bought 'Star Wars' everyone thought that it was the best thing ever because Disney had mega bucks to throw at these films and TV shows, now the Disney Dollars are gone. Disney flicks are money losers, theme park traffic is way down, Disney is going to sell ABC and ESPN...get woke, go fuck yourself.

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Saturday, November 11, 2023 1:35 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by whozit:
'Maybe somebody should call up Kevin Feige'...and tell him to stop telling the same story over and over. I think the MCU, the DCU, Lucasfilm and the film industry in general has learned that you don't ignore AND, mock the fanbase. Without the fanbase their woke films won't make close to a Billion $, let alone make a profit, like 'Indiana Jones and the Dial of Douchebag', it'll embarrass the studio and everybody involved, then slowly be forgotten. When Disney bought 'Star Wars' everyone thought that it was the best thing ever because Disney had mega bucks to throw at these films and TV shows, now the Disney Dollars are gone. Disney flicks are money losers, theme park traffic is way down, Disney is going to sell ABC and ESPN...get woke, go fuck yourself.



You'll get no arguments from me.

That's what all the failure threads and the Hollywood thread were about this year.

And it would appear that class is still in session.



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Saturday, November 11, 2023 2:01 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


$14.9 Million on Friday after you subtract the $6.6 Million from Thursday Previews.

Respectable, actually, given how bad things are looking for this movie. I never put a number on it, but I was thinking somewhere in the realm of $12 to $12.5 Million.

Now let's compare that to the MCU flicks that came out since the back half of 2021...

All numbers below are from The-Numbers.com and have had the Thursday Preview subtracted from them already.

Black Widow (07/09/2021): $26,310,446
Shang Chi (08/03/2021): $20,702,259
Eternals (11/05/2021): $21,344,219
Spider-Man: No Way Home (12/17/2021): $71,964,712
Dr. Strange and the Multiverse of Madness (05/06/2022): $54,720,784
Thor: Love and Thunder (07/08/2022): $40,554,073
Wakanda Forever (11/11/2022): $56,285,721
Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania (02/17/2023): $28,931,851
Guardians of the Galaxy: Vol 3 (05/05/2023): $30,603,839


The Marvels just made $11.4 Million less than Black Widow, $5.8 Million less than Shang Chi, $6.4 Million less than Eternals and $14 Million less than Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania did on Opening Night.

How did those 4 movies end up doing?

Black Widow made $379,751,131 Worldwide on a $200 Million Production Budget or 189.88% of its budget. A failure under both 2.0x and 2.5x RoT.

Shang Chi made $432,224,634 Worldwide on a $150 Million Production Budget or 288.15% of its budget. This is the single movie out of the 4 that made a profit using the 2.5x RoT, and this is due to the fact it had a budget $50 Million less than the other three.

Eternals made $401,731,759 Worldwide on a $200 Million Production Budget or 200.87% of its budget. Barely eeking out a 2.0x RoT, and losing $99 Million with 2.5x RoT.

Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania made $463,635,303 on a $200 Million Production Budget or 231.82% of its budget. Safely making a 2.0xRoT, but losing nearly $40 Million with 2.5x RoT (and called a money-losing failure even by Variety and Deadline, which further substantiated that we're now in 2.5x RoT instead of the old 2.0x RoT model.)


The Marvel's budget was at least $274 Million, that we know of. Unless we find out how much the reshoots and delays cost the production, at 2.5x RoT it will need to make $685 MILLION to break even.

That would be $228 Million more than Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania made, and on just opening night The Marvels is already $14 Million behind Quantumania. $31,531,851 behind actually, if we add the Thursday night previews back to both movies.


This probably won't end up reaching Indiana Jones 5 levels of losses for Disney, but by far it will be the biggest financial hit Disney has yet seen for a Marvel Studios release without any competition.

We're talking hundreds of millions of dollars here. Likely over a $300 Million loss.





Normally, this is where I'd mention that usually projections, especially on opening weekend, are lower than reality because the studio doesn't want to embarrass themselves, but I'm not sure about what Disney's psychology on this one is going to be right now.

Risk lowballing the numbers on opening night as per usual and make all the Saturday headlines even worse than they were going to be, or risk highballing the Friday prediction and possibly project low for Sunday to still come in lower than the actual numbers that are posted on Monday?

My money is that Disney's projected numbers for Friday are actually higher than reality just because the headlines that are going to come out today are embarrassing enough already. They might throw out convention entirely here and highball the whole damn weekend just to try to salvage some of the headlines with their shill outfits like Variety and Deadline and hope that not too many people are listening to the people like me who would catch them in the act come Monday if they try that.


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Saturday, November 11, 2023 2:09 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


The Marvels' Opening Weekend Box Office Is Set To Make MCU History In The Worst Way

https://www.looper.com/1444551/the-marvels-record-low-opening-weekend-
box-office-disney-mcu
/

Quote:

Just four years later, "The Marvels" is on track to have the lowest debut for an MCU film. No, not the lowest-grossing debut post-pandemic – just the lowest, ever. Deadline has the Nia DaCosta-directed picture coming in anywhere between $47 to $52 million this weekend. The flick had a Friday haul of $21.5 million. While Disney hasn't released official numbers, there's likely no scenario where the film sees a generous, headline-changing spike this weekend. With an opening weekend take just south of $52 million, "The Marvels" is making MCU history.

For context, the Edward Norton-starring film "The Incredible Hulk," arguably the closest thing Kevin Feige's cinematic toybox has to a black sheep, debuted at $55 million back in 2008.




Yup. Now that the actual numbers are coming out and nobody can lie for the movie anymore, The Marvels is going to be the lowest debut for any MCU film WITHOUT EVEN TAKING INFLATION INTO ACCOUNT, so they can't leave that little bit of information out of their articles and lie to idiots who don't understand how money works.

Quote:

It's all but certain that "The Marvels" will emerge as one of the lowest-grossing entries in the entire MCU, potentially achieving a worldwide haul that fails to overtake the $426 million domestic cume of the first "Captain Marvel."


Potentially nothing. This piece of shit isn't coming close to $400 Million Worldwide.

Disney should consider itself lucky if it makes $350 Million, with somewhere under $300 Million a very good possibility if the rest of the world rejects it as hard as Americans just did.

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Saturday, November 11, 2023 6:36 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


‘The Marvels’ May Be Disney’s Biggest Box Office Flop Yet

https://www.outkick.com/the-marvels-may-be-disney-biggest-flop-yet/

Quote:

‘Marvels’ May Lead To MCU Reboot

The list of Marvel Studios mistakes continues to grow. Ant Man was a bomb, Black Widow and Shang-Chi were unsuccessful and now The Marvels could lose hundreds of millions of dollars.

Swept up in a wave of political activism from vocal employees, Marvel turned its focus away from quality, inoffensive entertainment to injecting progressive messages where they don’t belong. Ant-Man’s daughter became an anti-police social justice activist. TV shows like She-Hulk were an openly political embarrassment, degrading the expectation of quality and objectivity that audiences had come to expect from Marvel.

And the awe inspiring failure of The Marvels is the inevitable result.




And now they're afraid to release black Not-Captain America and GayBlade.



What did I tell them before, Yoda?



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Saturday, November 11, 2023 8:57 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


MSNBC: 'The Marvels' is a reminder that Marvel Studios can still make fun movies

While there a few mystifying plot holes, the movie more than makes up for them with an irreverent and joyful story about found family — and great chemistry.

https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/marvels-review-brie-larson
-fun-movies-rcna124664


Yeah. It's going to "fun" and "breezy" Disney right into bankruptcy.



By Ani Bundel, cultural critic

Quote:

Despite whatever negative press you may have seen about the Marvel franchise recently, its latest film, “The Marvels,” is no flop. While there are parts that are too thin and a few mystifying plot holes, the movie more than makes up for them with an irreverent and joyful story about found family that features truly wonderful chemistry between its three leading women.


I don't know what the fuck a "cultural critic" is, but it's certainly not a movie critic.

What? They don't teach you Math in college anymore?

Somebody want to educate this dumb bitch on what constitutes a flop, because she obviously has no clue.



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Sunday, November 12, 2023 1:55 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


The Marvels has a 50 out of 100 from Critics on Metacritic.

It has a 4.0 out of 10 from users on Metacritic.

https://www.metacritic.com/movie/the-marvels/

It's got a 6.2 out of 10 on IMDB.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10676048/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_0_tt_7_nm_1_q_t
he%2520marvel




And yet it still has an 85% user score and 62% all critics score on RottenTomatoes.

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/the_marvels

Obviously, the time to throw RT out the window was years ago, but it's funny seeing Disney buy enough reviews to make it just barely fresh.

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Sunday, November 12, 2023 8:48 AM

WHOZIT


Quote:

Originally posted by 6ixStringJack:
The Marvels has a 50 out of 100 from Critics on Metacritic.

It has a 4.0 out of 10 from users on Metacritic.

https://www.metacritic.com/movie/the-marvels/

It's got a 6.2 out of 10 on IMDB.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10676048/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_0_tt_7_nm_1_q_t
he%2520marvel




And yet it still has an 85% user score and 62% all critics score on RottenTomatoes.

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/the_marvels

Obviously, the time to throw RT out the window was years ago, but it's funny seeing Disney buy enough reviews to make it just barely fresh.

--------------------------------------------------

Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.



At least we know who the 'access' critics are.

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Sunday, November 12, 2023 11:16 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


The projections are in...

$47 Million for Opening Weekend (a holiday weekend too).





Like I said before, I have no idea what Disney's psychology was with their projections this weekend. Did they highball it to give the shill outfits a chance at doing damage control, or did they lowball it as per usual so they weren't embarrassed when the actual numbers come in?

Either way, there's no way in hell this thing comes close to Incredible Hulk (2008) or Ant-Man (2015) in Domestic Gross not adjusted for inflation, so nobody can lie about it being the worst performing MCU movie of all time by ignoring the inflation factor.





Kudos to Bruce for changing the model for his prediction on this one even though he REALLY didn't want to. His old model said $52.1 Million, and his new model said $45.2 Million.

We'll see how much his new model needs tweaking after the actual numbers come in.



Everybody else aside from Bruce at the-numbers and the people at BoxOfficePro can go eat a bucket of crow with their stupid ass predictions of $60 to $80 Million or more.

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Sunday, November 12, 2023 4:30 PM

WHOZIT


Quote:

Originally posted by 6ixStringJack:
The projections are in...

$47 Million for Opening Weekend (a holiday weekend too).





Like I said before, I have no idea what Disney's psychology was with their projections this weekend. Did they highball it to give the shill outfits a chance at doing damage control, or did they lowball it as per usual so they weren't embarrassed when the actual numbers come in?

Either way, there's no way in hell this thing comes close to Incredible Hulk (2008) or Ant-Man (2015) in Domestic Gross not adjusted for inflation, so nobody can lie about it being the worst performing MCU movie of all time by ignoring the inflation factor.





Kudos to Bruce for changing the model for his prediction on this one even though he REALLY didn't want to. His old model said $52.1 Million, and his new model said $45.2 Million.

We'll see how much his new model needs tweaking after the actual numbers come in.



Everybody else aside from Bruce at the-numbers and the people at BoxOfficePro can go eat a bucket of crow with their stupid ass predictions of $60 to $80 Million or more.

--------------------------------------------------

Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.



$47 mill, wanna take bets on how bad a drop off for next weekend? I'm going to predict over 60%

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Sunday, November 12, 2023 6:53 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by whozit:
$47 mill, wanna take bets on how bad a drop off for next weekend? I'm going to predict over 60%



I really want to say you're right.

I think I'm going to have to wait until Thursday or Friday to make my prediction though.

If there were something GOOD coming out next weekend, I'd say for sure 60% or more, but we've got the Hunger Games prequel and another Trolls movie, and that's about it.

Since I'll be rooting for both of them to fail next weekend (Hunger Games and Marvels, not the Trolls flick), I don't want one of them doing so bad the other one does well. Even on slow weekends people still go out to see the movies, and with their choices pretty much limited to two blockbuster woke flicks, a failing Scorsese movie, a 4 week old horror flick, a religious flick that did lower than expected, yet another Elvis biopic and just a bunch of stuff that's been in theaters longer than they should have been, I really couldn't say how much it's going to fall next weekend.



Some people were saying it was going to fall over 75% next weekend and I don't see that happening at all. 50 to 60% is probably a pretty safe bet, considering how bad the first weekend went.

Let's say, for shits and giggles, it falls 50% every week from here on out...

Weekend 2: $23.5 Million
Weekend 3: $11.75 Million
Weekend 4: $6.46 Million
Weekend 5: $3.23 Million
Weekend 6: $1.62 Million
Weekend 7: $0.81 Million
Weekend 8: $0.40 Million

That's only $47.77 more million Domestic on weekends over the next 7 weeks plus what it makes on Mondays through Thursdays over the next 2 months.

This is what a lot of people who don't track movies really understand. If a movie with a monster budget like this doesn't catch on fire right out of the gates, it's almost certainly going to be a huge failure.



Bruce says it looks like it did okayish overseas and says the projections are another $63.3 Million. (Unfortunate it's that high, but still terrible nonetheless).



So it's got $110,300,000 projected worldwide right now.

That's only 40% of its $274.8 Million budget (as reported by Bruce at the-numbers.com)


While not quite as bad as Killers of the Flower Moon which wrapped up Opening Weekend in dead last at 62nd place for ROI Worldwide Gross vs. Production Budget, 40% of the budget puts The Marvels at 61st place for 2023, above only The Covenant and Renfield.

The Marvels needs to make $685 Million to break even. I said after Thursday previews this was going to lose $300 Million.

Bruce says now it looks as though the Marvels will make $300 to $400 Million Worldwide when its run is over, so my prediction tracks.

But boy would I love to see it come in under $300 Million and lose $400 Million for Disney in the end.

Fingers crossed that your 60%+ drop prediction on the 2nd weekend is right.






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Monday, November 13, 2023 7:16 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


“The Marvels” and the Paradox of the Superhero Franchise

How did a genre rooted in weirdness and wonder become a byword for the normative, the familiar, and the mundane?

By Richard Brody | November 9, 2023
https://www.newyorker.com/culture/the-front-row/the-marvels-and-the-pa
radox-of-the-superhero-franchise


When the best part of a superhero movie is the screenplay, you know you’re in trouble. There’s enough going on in “The Marvels” — enough situations with dramatic potential, enough twists with imaginative power — to develop several decent movies. Unfortunately, they’re snipped and clipped, jammed and rammed, dropped into the movie (and swept out of it) with an informational indifference that doesn’t even have the virtue of speed. The heedless rush to splash the story onto the screen leads to an appalling waste of the formidable talents marshalled to depict it.

There are so many undeveloped elements here, but one of the most fundamental is dramatic morality: one mode of tragedy is a conflict of virtues, but there’s hardly any villainy in “The Marvels,” and everyone, more or less, has their reasons. The movie, directed by Nia DaCosta (who co-wrote the script with Megan McDonnell and Elissa Karasik), is a follow-up to the 2019 film “Captain Marvel.” There, Carol Danvers (Brie Larson), a U.S. Air Force pilot who has gained superpowers (and the moniker of the title), was caught in a war between two space peoples, the Kree and the Skrulls. In the follow-up, Danvers, accused of accidentally extinguishing the sun that made the Kree and Skrulls’ planet habitable, is living in a guilt-ridden, self-imposed space exile. She’s called back into action by the Avengers’ handler Nick Fury (Samuel L. Jackson) to repair a so-called “jump point,” a kind of space portal. She’s joined in this mission by an astronaut named Monica Rambeau (Teyonah Parris), who was a child in the earlier movie. Their work brings them into contact, via a strange intergalactic connection, with a Jersey City teen-ager, Kamala Khan (Iman Vellani), a big fan of Captain Marvel comic books who also has secret superpowers and has a special glowing gauntlet to prove it. The gauntlet is one of a pair, the other of which is in the possession of a Kree warrior named Dar-Benn (Zawe Ashton). She hates Captain Marvel for the destruction of her planet and seeks to maximize her powers by capturing Kamala’s gauntlet. Meanwhile, when Monica and Captain Marvel meet at the jump point, they and Kamala all switch places with each other, thus making one another’s battles suddenly their own as well.

The results include a handful of showdowns — one in the Khan family house, several in outer space — and some derring-do with spacecraft. There’s also some gentle family sitcom involving Kamala’s parents (Zenobia Shroff and Mohan Kapur) and her older brother (Saagar Shaikh), who, to his parents’ dismay, is still unmarried. There’s some blunt and blundering comedy involving Captain Marvel’s marriage of convenience to a prince (Park Seo-joon) on a planet whose inhabitants communicate solely by song. There’s calculatedly sweet comedy in Kamala’s awkward fangirling of Captain Marvel. There’s the peculiarity of Captain Marvel’s cat, who has a mouthful of yards-long tentacles with which it can swallow creatures many times its own size and spit them back out intact. There’s the political wink of the efforts to help the Skrulls, now refugees, find a home. Best of all, there’s some mighty faux-scientific mumbo-jumbo involving a rip in the space-time continuum that could, and perhaps should, have been a movie all to itself, with special effects to match.

Any one of these many elements, obvious and familiar though they may be, could serve as the framework for a popular action fantasy. And the fact that none of the main characters is seriously in the wrong, that all are pursuing worthy ends in disparate ways, also sets things up for complexity. Another reason I had high hopes for this one is that DaCosta’s previous film, “Candyman,” the fourth film in a long-dormant horror franchise, was written with exploratory fervor and filmed with starkly simple yet dramatically supercharged special effects. But “The Marvels” doesn’t give her the leeway to do anything comparable here, and gradually sinks under the weight of convention, formula, and routine. The movie’s fight scenes are boilerplate, with no sense of the heroines’ vulnerabilities, no sense of what can be escaped from and what can’t. Notably, the best effects are the simplest — the sudden appearance of each of the three women in the place of the other, whether teleporting across galaxies or just across the room. (There’s nothing in such scenes that couldn’t have been done by Georges Méliès in the mid-eighteen-nineties.)

What happened to superhero movies? How did a genre rooted in astonishment, weirdness, and wonder become a byword for the normative, the familiar, and the mundane? The paradox of the superhero franchise is that it turns fans of a mythos into consumers of a brand — to the point that, often, behind-the-scenes stories about the brand and its place in the current media scene are far more intricate, impassioned, and engaging than anything happening on the screen. It never ceases to amaze me that the chief Marvel producer, Kevin Feige, with his lifelong love and deep knowledge of comic books, became the Man. Somewhere along the way, executives’ suits became more powerful than those of the superheroes they marketed.

You can see this in the way that the tight formatting of “The Marvels” gives actors as powerful as Larson and Parris and the newcomer Vellani (in her first movie role) little to do. The performances required of them are simply to emblematize emotions in an instant, like humanized emoticons. Larson does so with a steadfast sternness that’s one notch short of sheer camp, which I wish she’d unleashed. I’ve always found something essentially martial in her manner, going back to her performance as a caretaker for troubled teens in the 2013 independent film “Short Term 12.” I suspect that she finds a superhero role more artistically gratifying than many actors of her calibre do, and I wish that the movie gave her the space and the time to explore this. (That said, allowing the simple power of a dramatic performance to emerge in a film as confected as “The Marvels” might blow a hole in its own space-time continuum.)

One of the more recent developments in the Marvel franchise has been the embrace of highly distinctive filmmakers, such as DaCosta, Chloé Zhao, and Peyton Reed. This should have guaranteed an ever-expanding universe of cinematic inventiveness — with the budgets (and the hordes of skilled associates listed in the end credits) to back it. Instead, their individual artistry has been largely dominated and overwhelmed by the franchise’s systems of production. For all the efforts to widen and diversify the creative teams involved in superhero movies, their key creators are a specific bunch of stuffy and older white men. I’m referring, of course, to the United States Congress, which, in 1976 and again in 1998, extended the terms of copyright so that, under the so-called Mickey Mouse Protection Act, works published before 1978 may be kept under corporate control for ninety-five years. As a result, many of the classic comic-book superheroes remain, even now, decades away from the public domain, decades away from liberation from corporate rights holders. The sway and scope of comic-book stories — the extended universes they envision and the passionate devotion they inspire — arguably make them our contemporary equivalent of ancient religious texts. But, as long as individual studios retain the copyrights, it’s as if all representations of Biblical characters and stories were controlled by the Vatican. The result is to keep superhero movies, and much of Hollywood, in an artificial state of immaturity that’s indistinguishable from senescence. The movies’ extended universes are far narrower than life.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Monday, November 13, 2023 9:06 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


While I don't necessarily disagree with anything he had to say there, he's also making the reasoning for the failure needlessly complicated. Those are all problems, many of which I've actually spoken of at great length about here at fff.net. Some of them, such as the copyright issue, I was talking about 15 years ago or more when I was new around these parts.

I've recently come to Nia's defense here because she had nothing much to do with The Marvels other than be the black lady sitting in the director's chair while the movie was considered paint-by-numbers and virtually made by committee. Since Phase 4 started, Marvel has tapped a whole bunch of unproved talent and pretended to put them in charge of $200 Million+ projects they'd have no business directing, but since they aren't actually directing anything it's easy to fill quotas and get a bunch of likes on Twitter with these choices. Nia knows this, as do any of these diverse directors that sat in a chair and did nothing while the movies with their names attached to them failed and lost hundreds of millions of dollars. But what is she supposed to do now? Go on Twitter and put that on blast? Yeah... right. She's now the face of Marvel's biggest flop by far and she's already in a very tenuous situation. She's of a protected class. All she needs to do is either stay quiet, or take to twitter and use all the approved buzz-words to explain why the movie failed. As long as she plays ball, she should still have a long career ahead of her. Hopefully she learned a lesson about playing in the Majors along the way. Maybe one day she can be Scorcese and get companies to happily give her $200 Million to make Oscar winning flops, but until then she should go back to her roots and build her catalog on smaller projects where she maintains directorial control.

And let's not pretend that it's because of "stuffy old white men" in congress we're left with an entirely broken copyright system that harms everyone. Sure... Those were the people who started this problem, but we've got a pretty diverse cast of characters in congress today and I don't see anything changing on that front. That will never change, no matter who's in congress. Money is Money and Power is Power no matter what color your skin or which genitals you mash together. Don't ever expect our crooked copyright system to go anywhere no matter how diverse you make the bench.


Here's the problem with the Marvels...

Even if superhero flicks weren't run by DEI committee in current year, people would be tuning out anyhow. Hollywood can't help but beat a dead horse. And for most normal folk who didn't grow up reading comic books, the horse died when Infinity War ended. Even the movies that weren't particularly woke failed in 2023, with the arguable exception of Guardians Vol 3. That may have not been a financial failure on paper, but post pandemic with a much higher production budget than the first two movies and the much higher average ticket price it should have made over a Billion dollars at the box office and though it's now viewed as the only successful cape flick in 2023 (and the only big-budget Disney movie of 2023 to earn them any money), it was surely a big disappointment for Disney at the time.

Disney has killed Star Wars, Indiana Jones and superhero movies now. Their live action remakes aren't anything that anybody wants to see. And nobody is buying any of the merchandise related to any of these properties anymore.

They really need to take a step back and figure something out going forward. I think they finally realize this, and that's why their only planned Marvel release in 2024 now is Deadpool 3. And it's been what? 4 years since they made a Star Wars movie?

But they also need to stop making TV shows while they're at it too, because with the exception of The Mandalorian season 1, anything they've made and put on Disney+ for either property has done nothing but dilute and cheapen both brands.

The problem though is I don't know if they actually can stop creating that crap content with the subscription model the way it is today. They need to keep churning out new stuff to keep people from cancelling Disney+ and bouncing around to other streaming services. This is a problem that all the streaming services have.

Eventually, most streaming services are going to go the way of the dinosaur. It's only at that point where I believe they will start putting quality over quantity on the shows they make. There was a model where everybody could make money and be happy, and that's when Netflix was the only game in town and companies like Disney could license out their content and rotate it. Disney gets big bucks for its intellectual property while basically having to do nothing (ie: not spending any money), Netflix gets more subscribers and they don't go anywhere because there was nowhere else to go, but they're happy paying and staying because there was so much good content all in one place for a reasonable price.

That's not the model today. There's as many streaming services as there are cable TV channels. And they're not cheap anymore.

--------------------------------------------------

Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.

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Monday, November 13, 2023 12:37 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6ixStringJack:

The problem though is I don't know if they actually can stop creating that crap content with the subscription model the way it is today. They need to keep churning out new stuff to keep people from cancelling Disney+ and bouncing around to other streaming services. This is a problem that all the streaming services have.

Eventually, most streaming services are going to go the way of the dinosaur. It's only at that point where I believe they will start putting quality over quantity on the shows they make. There was a model where everybody could make money and be happy, and that's when Netflix was the only game in town and companies like Disney could license out their content and rotate it. Disney gets big bucks for its intellectual property while basically having to do nothing (ie: not spending any money), Netflix gets more subscribers and they don't go anywhere because there was nowhere else to go, but they're happy paying and staying because there was so much good content all in one place for a reasonable price.

That's not the model today. There's as many streaming services as there are cable TV channels. And they're not cheap anymore.

The ultimate streaming service is the one run by Pirates. Everything ever made is available all the time and the price is zero per month. Why zero? Because that is the actual cost of streaming one movie. Hollywood can't beat that price, so it will use the law to force the Pirates out of business.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Monday, November 13, 2023 4:29 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Marvel Just Had Its Worst Box-Office Weekend Ever. What Happened?

The most dominant franchise in the history of movies has taken its first major spill.
By Sam Adams | Nov 13, 2023 3:27 PM

In the days before streaming and DVD collections, I was a methodical watcher of network TV shows, tuning in every week and taping when I couldn’t, even keeping lists of episodes from past seasons I could check off when they turned up in reruns. Because I was so invested in completism, I was loyal to a fault, sticking with shows I didn’t even realize I’d stopped enjoying, because I was so dedicated to my streak. But I had a simple rule for when it was time to drop a show: when I accidentally missed an episode and realized I didn’t care. Marvel has put its fans in the position of realizing that keeping up isn’t worth the effort. They’re unlikely to abandon the franchise as a whole, but the lackluster turnout for The Marvels suggests that they’re feeling free to be a lot more selective than they’ve been in the past, to pick and choose, knowing the worst that could happen is they catch up with a thing their friends liked a little bit late.

https://slate.com/culture/2023/11/marvels-box-office-captain-marvel-mc
u-future.html


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Monday, November 13, 2023 10:12 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by 6ixStringJack (November 11th):
Normally, this is where I'd mention that usually projections, especially on opening weekend, are lower than reality because the studio doesn't want to embarrass themselves, but I'm not sure about what Disney's psychology on this one is going to be right now.

Risk lowballing the numbers on opening night as per usual and make all the Saturday headlines even worse than they were going to be, or risk highballing the Friday prediction and possibly project low for Sunday to still come in lower than the actual numbers that are posted on Monday?

My money is that Disney's projected numbers for Friday are actually higher than reality just because the headlines that are going to come out today are embarrassing enough already. They might throw out convention entirely here and highball the whole damn weekend just to try to salvage some of the headlines with their shill outfits like Variety and Deadline and hope that not too many people are listening to the people like me who would catch them in the act come Monday if they try that.



Am I awesome or am I awesome?

The Marvels ACTUAL weekend gross Domestic: $46,110,859

In the entire time that I've been tracking movies, I've NEVER seen a studio highball their weekend prediction. Not once. Until now. And I called it.

In fact, I've said on at least half a dozen occasions when posting about a new movie that just came out that it will probably have $1 or $2 Million more when the actual numbers come in (It's all in my post history).


I'm in Bob Iger's head now.

The ragebaiters on YouTube all seemed to have missed this, but I didn't Bob. I'm calling you out.




--------------------------------------------------

Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.

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