What's with Jubal Early? by chrisisall

FIREFLY EPISODE DISCUSSIONS

What's with Jubal Early?

POSTED BY: CHRISISALL
UPDATED: Sunday, September 11, 2005 04:32
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Saturday, April 16, 2005 6:12 AM

In Objects in Space Jubal seems to be borderline psychic, knowin' all that he does. Is he maybe some earlier(no pun intended) version of what the Alliance was trying to make River into?
All I really know 'bout him is he seems to be a fan of a late 20th century movie called "The Empire Strikes Back", for he seems to have picked himself a ship that resembles Slave-1 (it's an obscure little movie, but it probably could gain some sort of cult status that far into the future...).

Obscure poster Chrisisall

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Saturday, April 16, 2005 8:10 AM

IMEARLY

Did you think that I wouldn’t see this? I'm shocked and appalled by your attitude.

Jubel facts:

Nathan Fillian's ancestor was the great Jubal Early a general in the civil war.

(Confederate)

Joss undoubtedly found it interesting and ran with it. From the DVD, you will hear that some of my... umm Jubel’s idiosyncrasies were intentionally made to parallel some of Rivers. I think he would have become recurring had the series prolonged.

And yes, I am, ImEarly of the clone Fett corp. notice his backpack as well.

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Saturday, April 16, 2005 9:15 AM

MANWITHPEZ

Important people don't do field work.

Early does seem to be a little psychic, or perhaps, just immensely good at what he does. Psychicness and other forms of metaphysics more than likely exist outside the realm of scientific tampering in the Firefly 'verse. To have Mal simply claim "I think she's a reader." and have no prerequisite on which to base it is just too large a jump to be made logically. I suspect that if there are sideshows on Skyplexes and carnival callers in same, then there are probably a few people claiming to be psychic around. While in the future, as now, they more than likely are fakes, Mal happens to have the real deal aboard his ship.

Bottom Line: I don't think Early is psychic, just an excellent bounty hunter who has had enough experience to know how people think.

Kaylee: "What's so damn important about being proper? It don't mean nothing out here in the black."
Simon: "It means more out here. It's all I have..."

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Saturday, April 16, 2005 11:18 AM

MISGUIDED BY VOICES

Quote:
Originally posted by manwithpez:
Psychicness and other forms of metaphysics more than likely exist outside the realm of scientific tampering in the Firefly 'verse. To have Mal simply claim "I think she's a reader." and have no prerequisite on which to base it is just too large a jump to be made logically.

I have to say that there is plenty of information for Mal to base that "jump" (more of a skip, or a stumble, nay a shuffle) on - exhibit A being what with her nearly being burned as a witch for reading people's minds, her "channeling" of Badger. Sure, Mal didn't see everything, but would have heard some of it no doubt - I would suspect that he was waiting for the pieces to come together, which they did around that table.

"I threw up on your bed"

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Saturday, April 16, 2005 12:31 PM

MANWITHPEZ

Important people don't do field work.

Yeah, but, she's a "reader". The turn of phrase almost seem familiar. Like it was something he might have heard of before. And, that its not rejected out of hand,(except by Wash, who has witnessed some of her hijinks)leads me to believe that there may be other "psychic" people in the Firefly 'verse. Whether they are charlatans, as they surely are, can not be determined. But, the crew has history to fall back on. And, we are not presented with the history of the earth and its peoples in the five hundred years between us and them. All I'm saying is that saying 100% that Jubal Early isn't psychic might be jumping the gun. But, I don't think he was subjected to anything like River was, or she would have made mention of it.

Kaylee: "What's so damn important about being proper? It don't mean nothing out here in the black."
Simon: "It means more out here. It's all I have..."

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Saturday, April 16, 2005 2:35 PM

DIETCOKE

Let's not forget the whole existential slant of the show that Joss talks about in the commentary. Both Jubal and River are existentialists and they look at the world differently. There is not right or wrong (we are merely objects in space) and our attitude toward objects give them meaning.

This was not one of my favorite episodes at first but once I listened to the commentary I understood what it had to say much better.

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Saturday, April 16, 2005 9:19 PM

the movie is not the Series. Only the facts have been changed, to irritate the innocent; the names of the actors and characters remain the same

Quote:
Originally posted by manwithpez:
Yeah, but, she's a "reader". The turn of phrase almost seem familiar.

I see nothing strange in Joss using a 20th century colloquialism as a 25th or 26th century colloquialism; there are a lot of those in Firefly. Just because you don't believe the ability exists don't mean the phrase ain't au courant.

Quote:
But, I don't think he was subjected to anything like River was, or she would have made mention of it.

I'm sure there was an earlier thread discussing this possibility that Early was an Earlier version of what River might have become, but I can't find it. Anyway, I find your point persuasive.

Keep the Shiny Side Up . . . (wutzon) Grateful Dead, "Next Time You See Me", from "Ladies & Gentlemen: Filmore East, April 1971"

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Sunday, April 17, 2005 1:47 AM

CHRISISALL

Every time Jubal says that line about 'all manner of unseemly uses...' I get a shiver. He's my favourite villan in a tv show, more cool and twisted than even Moffit in Airwolf.

Well here I am Chrisisall

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Sunday, April 17, 2005 4:59 AM

IMEARLY

He certainly does make for an interesting villain, and man I haven’t seen Airwolf in ages.

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Sunday, April 17, 2005 5:22 AM

CHRISISALL

Man, the first (and only good) season of Airwolf comes out May 10th on dvd!! If you haven't seen it in a long time, pick it up, you won't be dissapointed! The shows hold up so well, it's scary. Totally ahead of it's time.
At around $30, cheap, too.

Stringfellow Chrisisall

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Sunday, April 17, 2005 1:18 PM

IMEARLY

I'll be first in line.

After all ImEarly

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Tuesday, April 19, 2005 12:46 PM

THIEFJEHAT

Quote:
Originally posted by dietcoke:
Let's not forget the whole existential slant of the show that Joss talks about in the commentary. Both Jubal and River are existentialists and they look at the world differently.

Joss's exact words in the commentary regarding the relationship twixt Early and River is "River is psychic and Early is so intuitive as to be psychic". Early's not psychic himself, he is just naturally connected to the 'verse in a deeper fashion than normal folk. You wouldn't want to play poker with Early.

Do not fear me. Ours is a peaceful race, and we must live in harmony.

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Tuesday, April 19, 2005 12:48 PM

DIETCOKE

Quote:
Originally posted by thiefjehat:
Quote:
Originally posted by dietcoke:
Let's not forget the whole existential slant of the show that Joss talks about in the commentary. Both Jubal and River are existentialists and they look at the world differently.

Joss's exact words in the commentary regarding the relationship twixt Early and River is "River is psychic and Early is so intuitive as to be psychic". Early's not psychic himself, he is just naturally connected to the 'verse in a deeper fashion than normal folk. You wouldn't want to play poker with Early.

Do not fear me. Ours is a peaceful race, and we must live in harmony.

And certainly would want to play poker with River for a number of reasons!

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Monday, April 25, 2005 3:28 PM

MALICIOUS

Whenever I catch him on Law and Order (that's the right show, right? I don't watch it), I always look at him suspiciously, just waiting for him to stop being all normal and law abiding and do or say something psycho.

Mal-licious

I think I will add cursing and the hurling about of things to my repertoire.

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Monday, April 25, 2005 6:43 PM

SERGEANTX

I almost wonder if Early, whether he actually is or not, is supposed to represent what River could become, the inner demon she's fighting off.

The way they both move through the episode, almost like they're on opposite ends of an axis, like reflections of each other. Yet how much more opposite could they be? An innocent young girl and a hardened, dark bounty-hunter. The image that always sticks with me is that scene when they're both listening, surreptitiously, to the crew discussing the situation - her from deep within the heart of Serenity, and him from outside in the cold emptiness of space. I just love it.

SergeantX

"Dream a little dream or you can live a little dream. I'd rather live it, cause dreamers always chase but never get it." Aesop Rock

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Tuesday, April 26, 2005 4:26 AM

CHRISISALL

Yes! That's it,I think. Well put, that's the direction I was thinkin', but you nailed it in words.

Illiterate and watnot Chrisisall

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Friday, May 27, 2005 11:31 AM

KRYSTLE

I don't think that he was psychic. you have to remember that he had been tailing them for a long timegetting to know them and what not! i think that is all it is.

NO POWER IN THE 'VERS CAN STOP ME!

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Friday, May 27, 2005 11:38 AM

CHANNAIN

i DO aim to misbehave

Quote:
Originally posted by Krystle:
I don't think that he was psychic. you have to remember that he had been tailing them for a long timegetting to know them and what not! i think that is all it is.

I would have to concur. One would think that a psychic wouldn't have fallen for the "my sister's a ship" bit, even a little bit. And he would have had constant awareness of that precious ship of his.

It bears a resemblance to Slave I? Huh! So now I get to go back and watch it again and see. Bummer!

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Friday, May 27, 2005 12:23 PM

CHRISISALL

Well, I guess I meant somewhat psychic, sort of a baby version of what was able to be done with River...

Boba Early Chrisisall

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Sunday, June 5, 2005 7:36 PM

0REAVER0

Jubal isnt psychic he just has alot of background info on his targets he makes it his job to know and he is awesome at his job . but i have a theory that jubal and book know each other from there days as alliance covert commandos in the war . If you study your background info youll recall that these commandos were comprised mainly of mercs and i belive Book yes shepherd book was a merc and after his war days the shell shocked downtrodden man decided to go into hiding now you can imagine for a high finaced killer it woul dbe had to just disapper from his clientell so he went into hiding as a shepherd(sorta like how obi wan a hermit and yoda a muppet on dagobath) and jubals worked in many missions with are beloved shepherd SO WHat have we learned?
Book and Early were mercs for Alliance in the war.

0Reaver0

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Monday, June 6, 2005 3:39 AM

CHRISISALL

Whoah, totally plausible- even probable.
I think it's a good call.

Late Chrisisall

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Friday, June 17, 2005 8:53 PM

RAZEL

I really like the Jubal + Book Merc Theory except i think maybe book actually did become a true shepherd because he was so emotionally scared by the ware

Razel

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Saturday, June 18, 2005 3:58 AM

CHRISISALL

Yes. He wouldn't be the first to be askin' God's forgiveness for his merc days. He' maybe similar to Angel that way.

Makin' connections Chrisisall

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Saturday, June 18, 2005 4:30 PM

AMNESIAC

Both Early and River are gifted, but disasociated from how everyone else sees the world. The contrast between them really shows for me when they are handling guns, or what meaning...what's the word? 'Imbue' What meaning do they imbue the gun with. As River points out, Early likes to hurt people. He sees the gun as a tool to kill and maim, and he thinks it's pretty. River sees doesn't imbue the object with a violent purpose so it's a little twig.

Oh and my little fantasy about Book's history has him commanding one of the ships flying over Serenity Valley right over Mal and Zoe's heads. He was partially responsible for the Alliance victory, but is appalled by how the alliance has run the 'verse. So he sees the ship Serenity at the Eve's Down docks, and thinks it's a sign that he's on the path to redemtion... It's a little too poetic for the Firefly universe, but whatever.

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Monday, August 15, 2005 8:31 PM

DRROB

He's awfully intuitive... to the point of being psychic... seems to me he's been 'read' by River. He's all business and suddenly he's talking almost gibberish... she's messing with his mind a little, but he's capable of some defense.

He seems to know just what buttons to push on everyone except River.

He's obviously somewhat disturbed, and in that way a little like her.

But he doesn't seem to understand she's IN his head... and in the TV version she's not strong enough to 'kill him with her brain' but she's well on her way.

That's my take.

"Guess you broke into the wrong rec room."

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Sunday, September 11, 2005 4:32 AM

BROWNCOATGENERAL

When Book mentioned Shan Yu in War Stories, I wonder if he was somehow thinking of Early...he certainly seems to fit the mold. A psychotic sadist who thinks he's a philosopher/warrior-poet.

As for book, I think he was a career Special Ops agent who ran a prison camp during the war...perhaps a sort of 26th century Mengele.

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