some screwups in production or 'they wouldnt get it anyhow' by GroovyAl

FIREFLY EPISODE DISCUSSIONS

some screwups in production or 'they wouldnt get it anyhow'

POSTED BY: GROOVYAL
UPDATED: Tuesday, May 30, 2006 00:59
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 11006
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Friday, April 21, 2006 4:58 AM

You guys probably dont know me well since im not posting here quite often. Still, i love the show and watch it over and over over again... just gotta love it!!!

Anyhow there are some minor things i recongnized and think they just dont seem to fit....

First one is a plot/story thing:

In serenity, the pilot, kaylee gets shot and passes out, than the whole thing with the crate opening and river happens, while lil kaylee is still uncouncious, than a while later, kaylee wakes up, and tells mal not to be mad coz the doc did it all for his sister... no my point is, how she could possibly know that, she spend the whole story in uncounciousness and just woke up... she just couldnt have known it...

the other 2 minor things are just details that became apparent to me by watching lil closer...

1. Thing
again serenity, the pilot, the first time we see inara, when she starts her shuttle to fly towards serenity you see her take the steering-wheel-controller-thing upsidedown... i mean, the scene works anyhow but its just a detail...

2. Thing
and again serenity, the pilot, when wash looses the reavers by doing the ivan and a full burn, you see mal, zoe and wash in the cocpit and they all are happy to have escaped and if you look closer wash has no controller at all in his hand, he just plays to have one... thats a detail i think does not have to be....

i still love the show... its great!!!!

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Friday, April 21, 2006 5:24 AM

DAVESHAYNE

Quote:
Originally posted by GroovyAl:
no my point is, how she could possibly know that, she spend the whole story in uncounciousness and just woke up... she just couldnt have known it...

Obviously then that couldn't have been the first time she had regained consciousness. At some earlier point she must have woken up, seen River curled up on the counter, and said something along the lines of, "who she?" - perhaps in mandarin. At which point somebody (probably either Simon or Mal) explained the situation to her. Since we the audience already knew all of that from Simon's speach Joss didn't feel the need to show us that scene.

The other points of yours are actually both mentioned in the commentary for that episode. If you haven't viewed the commentaries yet I urge you to do so. Lots of little questions are answered, a few more questions are asked, and many jocular moments are had.

Oh and howdy and welcome to the board and all. Post or lurk it's all good.

David

"Not completely as well as the series of Firefly..." - From a review at amazon.de

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Friday, April 21, 2006 6:03 AM

GOR

That commentary is really funny to listen to when they mention those two screw ups. Check it out, hi-larious stuff ;)

"These are stone killers, little man. They ain't cuddly like me."

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Friday, April 21, 2006 6:20 AM

STUBBS

when Wash is driving the Mule out of the cargo hold in the Firefly pilot, just as he starts moving down the ramp you can see a stage man run into the background. its a blink-and-you-will-miss-it moment but it is plain to see.

And welcome to the growing world of the browncoats!

can we vote on the whole killing people issue?

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Friday, April 21, 2006 8:15 AM

MER

You know, I try not to remember or notice the mistakes...it takes me out of the scene if I see it (al la Wash' missing pilot wheel). Lol

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Friday, April 21, 2006 12:20 PM

RYCE

Also in Our Mrs Reynolds, you can see a cameraman as Jayne is getting his rainstick.
And in Out of Gas when Mal is introducing Zoe to Serenity in the beginning, the cables on the ground are the camera cables, and keep sliding around.
Interesting note: when SciFi was repeating the episodes over the summer, a lot of these goofs were either fixed or otherwise deleted (at least I didn't see them, and I was sorta looking

)

No power in the 'verse can stop me!

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Sunday, April 23, 2006 11:24 AM

GROOVYAL

Quote:
Originally posted by daveshayne:

The other points of yours are actually both mentioned in the commentary for that episode. If you haven't viewed the commentaries yet I urge you to do so. Lots of little questions are answered, a few more questions are asked, and many jocular moments are had.

yeah! i checked the comments! funny thing is: when it comes to the wash-not-having-the-wheel-in-his-hands-scene joss says pretty much what i posted in the title... he says something about nobody seeing it...

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Sunday, April 23, 2006 11:30 AM

DAVESHAYNE

Quote:
Originally posted by GroovyAl:
Quote:
Originally posted by daveshayne:

The other points of yours are actually both mentioned in the commentary for that episode. If you haven't viewed the commentaries yet I urge you to do so. Lots of little questions are answered, a few more questions are asked, and many jocular moments are had.

yeah! i checked the comments! funny thing is: when it comes to the wash-not-having-the-wheel-in-his-hands-scene joss says pretty much what i posted in the title... he says something about nobody seeing it...

Well I never noticed it untill I switched on the commentary. I sometimes don't notice it now if I'm not paying close attention to the picture. I wonder if this is a tribute to Alan's mime technique that he can get us believing that a prop that isn't there is actually there?

David

"Not completely as well as the series of Firefly..." - From a review of Serenity at amazon.de

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Sunday, April 23, 2006 11:36 AM

SIMONB

Quote:
Originally posted by MER:
You know, I try not to remember or notice the mistakes...it takes me out of the scene if I see it (al la Wash' missing pilot wheel). Lol

Hmm, yeah - same here

- Shiny. Let's be bad guys.

That is not dead which can eternal lie, and with strange aeons even death may die

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Tuesday, April 25, 2006 12:29 PM

ELOISA

Once I've noticed something like that once I have trouble ignoring it in future. I'm absolutely certain that in the first deep flashback in OoG, with Mal and Zoe in the empty cargo bay, the light that's visible behind one of them at one point is part of the show's lighting rig rather than something that can possibly be explained away as shipyard equipment. I can't see that bit now without zeroing in on the light instead of on the actors.

***
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Creative Writing

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Tuesday, April 25, 2006 12:41 PM

GUYWHOWANTSAFIREFLYOFHISOWN

something I am suprised that noone mentioned becausee it is so very obvious is the fact that in the pilot episode is that the first shot of Mal in the derelict the sticky is already in place

One Day.
One Mission
One Army of Browncoats.

On June 23rd, We Aim To Misbehave.
www.SerenityJune23rd.com

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 1:23 AM

THISVICIOUSCABARET

Something in the opening scene in "Trash" doesn't really make sense to me. When Yosaffbridge and Mal are pointing guns at each other, Monty says "So, you guys have met". Then there's the fight, then Mal tells Monty what the girl has done, to which she replies "You're a liar, Malcolm Reynolds". Monty says "I haven't yet told you his name" or so, and this seems to prove that Mal's right.

But how? Monty already knows they've met before, so her knowing his name shouldn't mean a thing, should it? What do you think?

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 2:31 AM

NIKNAK

They obviously left out the bit where Mal explained everything to Monty because it was unnecessary and they wanted to get on with the story.

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 3:35 AM

THISVICIOUSCABARET

Yes, obviously. Doesn't answer my question though how knowing Mal's name proves she's guilty when it's already clear Mal and her know each other.

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 4:10 AM

REDLAVA

This isn't a mistake question, but I do have one from the BDM that has been driving me nuts ever since I saw it.

In the beginning after Mal talks to Kaylee in the engine room and is confronted by Simon, both of them walk down to the sickbay and Simon injects Mal with something and they continue to the cargo bay. What was it?

Am I missing something really obvious here, or is this another one of those question marks that have no answer yet.

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 5:32 AM

VINTERDRAKEN

I always figured it was a vaccine or immunisation shot for something that could be found on Lilac. Could also be a reference to some storyline that we never got to see played out in the first season.

You can’t stop the Signal.
Keep spreading the word about Firefly!

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 5:32 AM

VINTERDRAKEN

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 5:32 AM

VINTERDRAKEN

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 5:32 AM

VINTERDRAKEN

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 5:32 AM

VINTERDRAKEN

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 5:32 AM

VINTERDRAKEN

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 6:25 AM

THISVICIOUSCABARET

I think we don't know what Mal is injected with. Maybe they've done it to tell those who didn't watch the series something about Mal's and Simon's relationship and status; that Simon has become the ship's doctor and isn't just a passenger, and that their relationship is somewhat trustful, since they're shouting at each other pretty bad and Mal still lets Simon give him a shot without even talking about it.

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 6:47 AM

MAJORCLOD

When Simon confronts Mal, he says something along the lines of "I'm guessing I'll need to be innocked before we hit planetside."

So yeah, he means inoculated, so there must be some sort of disease, plague or condition on the planet.

This kind of links to The Train Job and Ariel too.

Main reason though is to show that Simon is a doctor.

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 6:59 AM

EMMARIGBY

Plus with Joss's genius one shot pan (two at most) through the entire ship to get you used to the layout and restore stability after the frenetic opening, I think they needed an excuse to go into the infirmary! Innoculations work as good as any, 'specially considering the afore mentioned planet-wide sicknesses.

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Sunday, May 14, 2006 7:11 AM

NUCLEARDAY

Quote:
Originally posted by thisviciouscabaret:
Something in the opening scene in "Trash" doesn't really make sense to me. When Yosaffbridge and Mal are pointing guns at each other, Monty says "So, you guys have met". Then there's the fight, then Mal tells Monty what the girl has done, to which she replies "You're a liar, Malcolm Reynolds". Monty says "I haven't yet told you his name" or so, and this seems to prove that Mal's right.

But how? Monty already knows they've met before, so her knowing his name shouldn't mean a thing, should it? What do you think?

I think Monty's remark about them having met is more a supposition than anything, sarcasm even. Just done for the comedy, I think. Seen that bit in other shows/movies, etc. Sorta a cliche they're playing on there.

Them getting in a fight doesn't really give Monty much to go on, though. Saffron's a tricky lass, and nothing's been decided. There may have been some chance for her to talk her way out of it. (Mistaken identity or something, who knows, but I'm sure she could have thought of something :) Her calling Mal by his full name just seals the deal, though. Who're you going to trust, your old war buddy, or the girl who's now obviously been holding back info? Hope that makes sense, it's been a week or so since I've watched that ep.

How I took it, though: Mal and Saff draw on each other, and Monty doesn't know why. He breaks up the fight and tries to get to the bottom of it, and catches Saff in a lie. That lends more creedence to Mal's story, and surely Monty trusts Mal quite a bit anyways.

All that said, it is a slightly sloppy bit of writing, there. (Well, gorramit, not even Whedon and crew are perfect all the time... just mostly :) I think basically the writers needed a way to get Yo/Saff/Bridge on board Serenity again. There's also a jump in time between that part and Monty flying off in the ship yelling down at Saff, so we can presume that some manner of further conversation took place, too.

(And sorry for the long post, while I'm at it. Got on a roll, there... :)

________________________________________________
You can take my hope when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers. (Or if Kaylee asks me nicely...)

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Wednesday, May 17, 2006 8:18 AM

VOLK564

Another thing about the mule in the pilot...when Mal, Jayne, and Zoe get off on Patience's Moon (dunno the name), you can see Jayne driving the mule off the ramp, presumably to bury the goods. Later, after the crazy shootout, you see all three of our BDH's riding horses back to Serenity. Where'd the mule go? I guess Jayne could have driven it out to the bury point, buried the stuff, then driven the mule back and walked back to Mal and Zoe in time for them to tell him what to do...but that seems unlikely.

_________________________________________________
So here's what I have to say about Serenity: This is the kind of movie that I have always intended Ender's Game to be... And I'll tell you this right now: If Ender's Game can't be this kind of movie, and this good a movie, then I want it never to be made. I'd rather just watch Serenity again.
-Orson Scott Card

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Wednesday, May 17, 2006 8:35 AM

SHINY

There's a whole list of bloopers (for the show and the movie) compiled here:

http://www.browncoats.com/index.php?ContentID=42e6e0aad9f9b

---

I don't need a gorram back-spaceship driver!!!

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Wednesday, May 17, 2006 9:20 AM

DAVESHAYNE

Quote:
Originally posted by Volk564:
Another thing about the mule in the pilot...when Mal, Jayne, and Zoe get off on Patience's Moon (dunno the name), you can see Jayne driving the mule off the ramp, presumably to bury the goods. Later, after the crazy shootout, you see all three of our BDH's riding horses back to Serenity. Where'd the mule go? I guess Jayne could have driven it out to the bury point, buried the stuff, then driven the mule back and walked back to Mal and Zoe in time for them to tell him what to do...but that seems unlikely.

Yet that is what happened, at least according to Jayne. Quoting from the script here since I'm too lazy to put in the disk but this is the jist of what he says at least, "I buried 'em good. Equipment's back on the boat." My guess would be that Serenity is parked fairly close to the rendevous spot (no more than a mile or two away) but that the goods were buried off in another direction. So Jayne goes puttering off with the power bars, plants them, and putters back to the ship to stow the mule and whatever shovel thing he used to bury the stuff then runs to catch up with Mal and Zoe who would be advancing toward the meeting place slowly to check out the lay of the land - trying to find the most advantageous position for the upcoming fight.

David

"Not completely as well as the series of Firefly..." - From a review of Serenity at amazon.de

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Wednesday, May 17, 2006 1:05 PM

VOLK564

Woa, you're 100% right. Just rewatched the episode, and sure enough, Jayne says just that. That cleared it up! :smile"
Sidenote - as I'm typing this, the screenshot on the left sidebar is of mal, zoe, and jayne just before the shootout in that very scene.

_________________________________________________
So here's what I have to say about Serenity: If Ender's Game can't be this kind of movie, and this good a movie, then I want it never to be made. I'd rather just watch Serenity again.
-Orson Scott Card

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Wednesday, May 17, 2006 2:59 PM

DAVESHAYNE

Quote:
Originally posted by Volk564:
Sidenote - as I'm typing this, the screenshot on the left sidebar is of mal, zoe, and jayne just before the shootout in that very scene.

Don't you just love those little flashes of synchronicity?

David

"Not completely as well as the series of Firefly..." - From a review of Serenity at amazon.de

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Thursday, May 18, 2006 8:57 AM

RUGBUG

The one that intrigues me is the Jayne's hat/straw one from The Message. I know Alan Tudyk says it's an error in the commentary but I'm not so sure it is. Here's why:

1. Jayne gets hat in box of packing. Puts it on with strands of packing still attached.
2. We see Jayne again in cargo bay with no straw packing on hat (can't remember the exact context, but there is definitely no straw).
3. The crew does their little search and Jayne has straw on his hat again.

This is easily explained (not even fanwanked) because Jayne is assigned to search through the crate that Tracy comes in. A crate filled with straw packing. Right? Or am I completely addled. I'm gonna have to watch again to make sure, but I really don't think there is an error at all.

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Thursday, May 18, 2006 12:44 PM

DAVESHAYNE

Quote:
Originally posted by RugBug:
This is easily explained (not even fanwanked) because Jayne is assigned to search through the crate that Tracy comes in. A crate filled with straw packing. Right? Or am I completely addled. I'm gonna have to watch again to make sure, but I really don't think there is an error at all.

I'm pretty sure you have it right.

David

"Not completely as well as the series of Firefly..." - From a review of Serenity at amazon.de

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Saturday, May 20, 2006 4:59 AM

TEALCANDTRIP

Actually in the commentary, Jewel and Alan have a lot of fun pointing out the continuity errors with the straw.

"I also hear that there's something called Firefly, which is either a canceled science-fiction television show or a new religion, I'm not clear on that. Either way, prayers for the resurrection are involved." – Lore Sjoberg

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Saturday, May 20, 2006 5:39 AM

DAVESHAYNE

Quote:
Originally posted by tealcandtrip:
Actually in the commentary, Jewel and Alan have a lot of fun pointing out the continuity errors with the straw.

Well Alan does at any rate but a carefull viewing of the scenes in question (as provided upthread) show that there really is no error. When the straw shows up after we saw it had been removed Jayne had just finished tearing apart a crate full of straw - a reasonable explanation for the straw on the hat to reapear.

David

"Not completely as well as the series of Firefly..." - From a review of Serenity at amazon.de

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Monday, May 22, 2006 9:03 AM

MAGHAFFAR

There's a scene in "Serenity" that bugs me to no end. It's when we see the ship descending down into some tunnel when they're landing on Haven. The next scene is the ramp lowering and we see Book and it's night -- torches going, etc. Then Mal and Book have their talk about faith and god. Then the next scene is daylight and the crew is walking up and greeting people, hugs, etc. like they didn't do all this at night when they first landed?

Then at the end, when they're repairing serenity, it sure looks like we see both engines on the ship as the crane thingy swings the replacement engine into view.

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Monday, May 22, 2006 9:21 AM

CHOO1701

About Haven, they land the ship in a huge mine shaft (vent shaft whatever.) And 'cause its dark down there, they need torches...

(Havens a mining Coloney, and also going Underground best place to find it from Mr. Operative)

Does that help....

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Monday, May 22, 2006 8:46 PM

MAGHAFFAR

Yeah, just wish there'd a been some piece of dialog about them being underground, cuz to me it sure looks like they're outside walking around & such... But thanks for the info.

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Tuesday, May 23, 2006 6:14 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Quote:
Originally posted by GroovyAl:
yeah! i checked the comments! funny thing is: when it comes to the wash-not-having-the-wheel-in-his-hands-scene joss says pretty much what i posted in the title... he says something about nobody seeing it...

That one's easy, on TV, it was shown in fullscreen, and the DVD's are... i think? 16:9 widescreen ? something like that ?

So in shot as seen on TV, his hands are off the side of the screen, and thus you'd never notice anyhows.

16:9 widescreen... coolness

4:3 postage stamp? crap crap crap

Always hated it... thanks be Joss went with the good stuff.

-F

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Tuesday, May 23, 2006 6:22 AM

THESOMNAMBULIST

I think there's one in War Stories where Mal's left ear lobe is cut, but later there is a shot which I think they flipped in the edit, where it's his right ear lobe that's been severed....

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Tuesday, May 23, 2006 6:25 AM

DAVESHAYNE

Quote:
Originally posted by MAGhaffar:
Yeah, just wish there'd a been some piece of dialog about them being underground, cuz to me it sure looks like they're outside walking around & such... But thanks for the info.

Well when they land underground it's sometime during the day (judging by the deleted scene late afternoon) they walk out of the mine shaft and then say hello to the folks of Haven. Later (after a fine meal as per the deleted scene) it's night when Mal asks Book for advice under the open sky. Does this help?

David

"Not completely as well as the series of Firefly..." - From a review of Serenity at amazon.de

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Tuesday, May 23, 2006 8:00 PM

CHOO1701

Has anyone noticed there's TWO CGI Serenity's/Firefly Class...

http://images.google.co.uk/images?hl=en&q=Firefly%20Class&btnG=Google+
Search&sa=N&tab=wi

^ Check the First and Third pictures on the top and see if you can spot the differences.

Just wondering if anyone's noticed this, and why Zoic (the effects people on Serenity) made two?....

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Wednesday, May 24, 2006 1:19 PM

MISSTRESSAHARA

Here's one I still can't get, maybe someone can help.

It always bugs me when there are words or sentences that are mumbled and can't be heard, there are quite a few of them in the series.
But the one in particular is in Ariel. It doesn't help that the subtitles say can't be read or whatever. It's after our BDH have saved the day and are standing in front of the townspeople guns drawn Mal says something to Simon, it's garbled, all I can hear is "Gotta say doctor...mumblemumblemumble.." and Simon replies to him. So my question is this. What the hell does Mal say? Anyone know? Because it's driving me nuts.

If I'm a bitch, then life just got interesting

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Thursday, May 25, 2006 4:55 AM

RUGBUG

Quote:
Originally posted by Misstressahara:

But the one in particular is in Ariel. It doesn't help that the subtitles say can't be read or whatever. It's after our BDH have saved the day and are standing in front of the townspeople guns drawn Mal says something to Simon, it's garbled, all I can hear is "Gotta say doctor...mumblemumblemumble.." and Simon replies to him. So my question is this. What the hell does Mal say? Anyone know? Because it's driving me nuts.

I know what line you're talking about...but I think it was in Safe.

I was just looking at a site with scripts and the line reads as:

Mal: "Gotta say, doctor, your talent for alientatin' folks is near miraculous."
Simon: "Yes, I'm very proud."

I'm not sure if that really is the line...but could be, I suppose.

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Monday, May 29, 2006 3:28 PM

SHINYTRINKET

I love Wash's missing controls, especially after an intense scene with such great special effects. I think they must have left that in there on purpose just to see if the viewers were paying attention, because it's just such a blatant error, how could it have been overlooked?

-------------------------------------------------
If you eat a live toad in the morning, nothing worse will happen to you all day.

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Tuesday, May 30, 2006 12:59 AM

DONCOAT

Quote:
Originally posted by ShinyTrinket:
I love Wash's missing controls, especially after an intense scene with such great special effects. I think they must have left that in there on purpose just to see if the viewers were paying attention, because it's just such a blatant error, how could it have been overlooked?

Very easily. I (for one) never spotted it until I watched the commentary. IIRC one of the two commentators also said they'd never noticed it until then, as well.

Alan does a convincing job of miming the action. No doubt someone had the idea of pulling him back into frame and adding the control yoke in CGI, but nobody noticed the problem in the dailies so it never got onto Zoic's list.

Really, it's not as uncommon as you might think for such issues to go unnoticed. Take a look at any movie's "Goofs" list on IMDB.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I don't disagree on any particular point.

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