ANGELUS ARCANUM

Joss is an azz

POSTED BY: PIRATEJENNY
UPDATED: Thursday, September 4, 2008 11:17
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VIEWED: 6339
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Monday, July 30, 2007 4:29 PM

PIRATEJENNY


Is it true that he got rid of Chrisma Carpenter as Cordelia because she was pregnant. Besides Angel she was the best character on the show and the show really suffered after she left and then the way he wrote that crap with Conner and Cordelia having sex... if its true it lousy!!


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Monday, July 30, 2007 4:38 PM

WTE


What I heard is that they wrote her out because she didn't tell them about the pregnancy until pretty late, so they didn't have a lot of time to prepare. Which sounds as if it'd be pretty annoying to me.

But don't quote me on the veracity of that.

HONKS

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Monday, July 30, 2007 7:28 PM

JWHEDONADDICT


The things I heard were that they had intended all along to put Angel and Cordy together in a romantic way, but when it was finally going to happen, some fans were so passionately against it that they had to abandon the plan and then couldn't figure out any other way to service the character. Also why they made her evil in season 4.

**************************************
"What if you could have the power? Now? In every generation, one Slayer is born...because a bunch of men who died thousands of years ago made up that rule...
So I say we change the rule. I say my power should be our power...
Every girl who could have the power, will have the power. Can stand up, will stand up...
Make your choice. Are you ready to be strong?"--Buffy Summers, May 20, 2003


"In Joss We Trust."

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Monday, July 30, 2007 7:49 PM

AMYEL


Whatever happened between them, Charisma didn't get fired when she was pregnant--she was filming the series up until a week before she gave birth. She was gone from the show after she had her baby, and it would be dumb to retroactively fire someone for getting pregnant, and I don't think that's what exactly happened.

Some of the mumblings from around the set was that the relationship between Charisma and the producers were getting really frazzled in the third season. She was having personal problems (she and her eventual husband were having problems or something) and she asked to be written out for a month to settle her issues-- that's when Cordelia went to Mexico with Groo. At the end of the third season, she was wishy washy about whether she wanted to come back. She didn't decide anything until the fourth season was going into production. She decided to come back - and oh by the way she was pregnant and due before the end of the season. They had to replan everything to fit in her pregnancy. I think Cordelia was going to be possessed by an evil being anyways, but they attempted to work in her pregnancy with the crazy Connor/Cordevila/Jasmine giving birth to herself wackiness.

So if she was fired, I don't think she was fired for getting pregnant specifically, I think it was that the show's powers that be had written themselves into a corner with her character for the past two seasons, and they had partially blamed her actions for it.

And another thing, Cordelia was David Greenwalt's baby. Joss was never deeply into the character, and it was Greenie that wanted CC for Angel. Greenwalt left during like the 3rd season and obviously her character went downhill afterwards.

Whatever their problems, Charisma and Joss seem to have reconciled. Charisma appeared on the bonus disc for the Buffy box set and did the round table discussion with Joss and some cast/crew. Their comments about each other have been tons nicer since then.

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 7:56 AM

JWHEDONADDICT


I was coming back to bring up the box-set thing.

Since Amyel beat me to it, I'm gonna remind everyone of what a big ass feminist Joss is. No way in hell would he fire a woman for getting pregnant.

That was Aaron Spelling's thing.

**************************************
"What if you could have the power? Now? In every generation, one Slayer is born...because a bunch of men who died thousands of years ago made up that rule...
So I say we change the rule. I say my power should be our power...
Every girl who could have the power, will have the power. Can stand up, will stand up...
Make your choice. Are you ready to be strong?"--Buffy Summers, May 20, 2003


"In Joss We Trust."

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Thursday, August 2, 2007 11:32 AM

EMBERS


They had wanted her character to turn evil,
but she wasn't up to the physical demands of the show arc,
so they rewrote it to accommodate her and her pregnancy....
allowing her to spend time in bed instead of kick boxing.

However in spite of making the role easier, I understood that she wasn't able to show up on time to set, and needed all kinds of special handling,
so they decided a coma would work out better for everyone.

IMO her acting ability was not up to the role during the last couple of years she was on the show....



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Thursday, August 2, 2007 12:08 PM

ZEEK


Quote:

Originally posted by embers:
IMO her acting ability was not up to the role during the last couple of years she was on the show....


Totally agreed. She's not exactly the greatest actress in the world. Though she did do a pretty decent job on her Season 5 cameo. Personally I think they could have done without her on Angel all together. She seemed forced just to give the audience another familiar face.

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Monday, February 18, 2008 6:27 PM

RIVER6213


It really doesn't matter in the end because ALL the women die in Angel.
Just goes to show what happens when men are in charge of a show.

-River

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Monday, February 18, 2008 10:58 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Not for or against, but on a similar note, I've wondered about Joss being displeased that Alan went off-character in The Message, becoming the wild-and-crazy pilot instead of the Ice Cool Pilot as written - Tim and alan said "yeah, we're going for the laughs. Did this departure from character and lack of consistency merely due to series cancellation affect Joss' decision to have Wash die in BDM? Alan had become the least reliable actor? The rest of the cast worked through the final shootings in character, even when they were goofing off a bit, just not in the filming.

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Tuesday, February 19, 2008 7:40 AM

EMBERS


Quote:

Originally posted by jewelstaitefan:
Not for or against, but on a similar note, I've wondered about Joss being displeased that Alan went off-character in The Message, becoming the wild-and-crazy pilot instead of the Ice Cool Pilot as written - Tim and alan said "yeah, we're going for the laughs. Did this departure from character and lack of consistency merely due to series cancellation affect Joss' decision to have Wash die in BDM? Alan had become the least reliable actor? The rest of the cast worked through the final shootings in character, even when they were goofing off a bit, just not in the filming.



oh I think that Joss was a little put out that Alan and Tim decided to go for the joke, but it was just one scene...
if you listen to all of Joss' commentaries then you know that Joss LOVED Alan's acting, how Alan (with no lines in a scene) could do a reaction that would really bring out the full emotional impact of a scene (I think he mentioned that in 'Objects in Space' when Alan is silently reacting to River telling Jubal Early that she'll go with him because she doesn't belong).

More recently Joss remarked that Alan's was the great performance in '3:10 to Yuma', he posted at a thread at Whedonesque....
so no, I don't think that Joss EVER considered Alan to be an unreliable actor (he may have thought that Tim was an unreliable director, but even that isn't a problem since Joss' first call was to Tim to help him w/Dollhouse).

Besides, if and when we get a sequel, I can assure you that Alan Tudyk will be in it (if only in Zoe's dreams).



New Firefly fans should check this out: http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=2&t=15816

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Tuesday, March 4, 2008 10:57 PM

RIVER6213


Well the whole thing sucked any way. In Angel all the women DIE. Cordelia is in coma forever, and Fred dies, AND has her soul destroyed!?? Joss should go to hell and be ass-raped by monkeys for all of eternity.

-River


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Wednesday, March 5, 2008 6:19 PM

ECAMBER


Classy.

Not adding a lot here, I know. But I'm lucky to not be the only one adding very little.

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Wednesday, March 5, 2008 10:27 PM

MACBAKER


Quote:

Originally posted by RiveR6213:
Well the whole thing sucked any way. In Angel all the women DIE. Cordelia is in coma forever, and Fred dies, AND has her soul destroyed!?? Joss should go to hell and be ass-raped by monkeys for all of eternity.

-River




Did someone take a dump on your pillow or something? You've got issues! Why don't you go away until you've matured enough to be civil in a public forum.

Last time I checked, the men don't do much better. Doyle died in the first season, Wes the last episode, and it certainly looked like Gunn wasn't long for this world either.

If you paid attention, it was hinted that Fred's soul wasn't completely extinguished after all. That certainly didn't seem like an act, when Fred was there to meet her parents, or when Wes died! If the show had continued past the 5th season, I believe that Fred would have shown herself even more. Possibly a hybrid personality of Illiria and Fred.

One other point! Joss did Amy a big favor. By Killing off Fred, but keeping her body for Illiria, he gave Amy a chance to demonstrate her acting range. If this hadn't happened, she might have been type cast playing the quirky southern girl forever!

BTW: Again, using your flawed logic, I guess Firefly/Serenity sucked too, because only the men die (Book, Wash).

I'd given some thought to movin' off the edge -- not an ideal location -- thinkin' a place in the middle.

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Thursday, September 4, 2008 11:17 AM

WENDYPOPS


Quote:

Originally posted by MacBaker:
Joss did Amy a big favor. By Killing off Fred, but keeping her body for Illiria, he gave Amy a chance to demonstrate her acting range. If this hadn't happened, she might have been type cast playing the quirky southern girl forever!



YES! Illiria really showed off Amy Acker's acting skills.

As for Cordelia... i think she brought a lot to the first 2/3 series. Especially series 1. Not just because she was a familiar face for the veiwers, but because she was someone Angel knew. Someone 'normal' that Angel knew. I think she helped him be a person and not just a moody-hero-of-the-night.

But series 4 was and is a bit of a let down. They came right back up with series 5, though, i thought. Again, helped by a character Angel already knew and had chemistry with. Great stuff.

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