Genetic Dark Sparks by Bytemite

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Genetic Dark Sparks

POSTED BY: BYTEMITE
UPDATED: Friday, March 5, 2010 15:09
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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 7:16 PM

So was talking with someone today about family members, and my grandfather came up. As I was describing him - a snarky badass former motorcycle cop who could fix anything electronic and loved gadgets and boating and looked a little like Tom Selleck in Magnum PI - I suddenly realized.

Oh. Holy. Fuck.

Now, Frem had said before that Dark Sparks are passed down genetically. But for the life of me I couldn't think of anyone else in my family who had traits like he described. And really I'm pretty much a blend of my grandparents, outwardly my personality is charming, easygoing, and disengaging with a slightly twisted sense of humor from my paternal grandmother, and I've got my maternal grandmothers artistic ability and cloud-cuckoolander-ness, and my fix-it anti-social hyper-vigilant quick learner side from my grandfather.

Anyway. I bring this up because I wanted to add this little bit into the database about the theory of Dark Sparks being genetic, and also because I was wondering if there's any literature on dark sparks I could read? I miss my grandpa, and I think it might help me understand him better.

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 9:03 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Alas, there isn't a whole lot, Byte - primarily cause they're so rare they ought not even exist, which is in a sad way true cause most of em meet bad ends one way or another, for all too obvious reasons.

Harry Harrison comes at it sideways in the Stainless Steel Rat novels, in fact the "theoretically we can't exist" line is borrowed from the pre-quel book, which is ironic cause it's The Bishop talking to Digriz.

Generally the core personality set is ISTP, but there's variances, cause people are people...
http://www.personalitypage.com/ISTP.html
http://www.teamtechnology.co.uk/myers-briggs/istp.htm

And on a very rare basis, it goes the other way to E, instead of I - which has a unique result prized by military commanders.
https://notes.utk.edu/bio/greenberg.nsf/0/bd7eed04567bfe2b85256e3b002f
29c1?OpenDocument

But as a general rule DS are more inner than outer in their expression.

As for genetics, well, it does tend to skip generations and that is possibly why, I *can* at least point out one of the markers.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetics_of_aggression
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MAO-A
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/01/090121093343.htm
http://www.springerlink.com/content/r9475n2210578302/

And as for Prime/Trigger, usually the stimulus is traumatic, and early, in nature.
http://www.childtrauma.org/ctamaterials/trau_CAMI.asp
http://www.childtrauma.org/ctamaterials/default.asp

Alas that I am outta time, but that'll get ya started.

-F

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Thursday, March 4, 2010 7:15 AM

BYTEMITE

In retrospect, I don't actually know much about my grandfather's past. I never really asked, partially because I was young. But I wonder if he even ever talked much about it? My mom tells stories about her mother, her grandparents, but never really much about her dad, like HE never told her any stories about work or his childhood, like he kept things secret from her. It can't be that she didn't like him, because they were both the responsible ones in their family, he worked and from a young age she kind of took over where my grandmother wasn't able. I remember that he was often bitter and depressed, and frustrated by his family, but that he was very loyal to them.

That's the thing that always throws me, because the effect of childhood trauma in later developing cases of PTSD is pretty well known, but I don't have PTSD, and I can't really say I've had childhood trauma.

I do recall some particularly strong emotional events that caused me to stop trusting my parents fairly early on, but then I've always had attachment issues and trust issues. I can be cautiously optimistic about something, but if it doesn't turn out, I tend to have an immediate and extreme loss of trust and faith to whatever is in question.

Does DS mean the DiSC personality system?

What do you make of this? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiple_complex_developmental_disorder

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Friday, March 5, 2010 12:54 AM

FREMDFIRMA

That is most curious - cause that does appear that they're unknowingly trying to study the same thing.

I use DS as shorthand for Dark Spark, cause I've yet to come up with a better term that doesn't sound so... creepy.

And yes, there do seem to be some almost autism-like components to it, but never having the resources to do so I've never managed to figure out if that's biological or what - I suspect it might be cause many of them have a rejection-reflex to their primary caregiver, which is kind of frustrating and traumatic to unaware parents when they don't understand what's going on.

And of course, a breach of trust will more or less permanently damage whatever weak bond does form, as you have noted.

Also as you note, they don't tell folk a damned thing, for the most part, were it not for the internet and the ability to discuss such a thing without direct personal involvement and the attached risks, neither one of us would be having this conversation in the first place.

The bitterness, frustration and eventual depression is kind of par for the course, stemming from the desire, almost compulsive *need* to help people that often as not get right back in trouble up to the neck the moment you take your eyes off em, and all but expect you to come running, as if you didn't have your own things to do - especially an ISTP who needs a lot of "me-time" and really, severely does NOT like it interrupted by someone elses petty little emergency...

My best GUESS, and this is only a wild-hair guess with no real evidence other than observation and extrapolation, is that it is a bio-genetic misfire somehow in the autism spectrum which emulates PTSD symptoms during early development which often as not become self-fulfilling prophecy, and that the Primes are the worst cases as opposed to the "triggerable" more mild ones.

Doc Perry's team would be closest to this line of research, but they got enough on their hands with real problems which are far more common than something which is rare enough that it ought not even be possible.

Another clear indicator is the sideways-associative thought process which functions in the same manner as a Wiki-Walk, which loses most "normal" people quickly cause they have a more linear thought process instead of jump-to association.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WikiWalk

One personal observation on that is that DS collect and hoard knowledge and information like it was friggin pirate treasure, and when the right buttons are pushed are very willing (too willing in some cases) to share - and the larger their personal-comparitive mental "database" is, the faster that sidewinding thought process works, much like a brute-force type code crack.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brute_force_attack

It is VERY much a different form of problem solving, and in combination with the ability to think past social, religious, or other assumptions that present roadblocks to most folk, is unusually effective in the right circumstances, but not so much in a by-the-book environment.

As I said, there's not really a lot of data on this, since most of the folks who are like this do not make it past early adulthood.

-F

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Friday, March 5, 2010 7:13 AM

BYTEMITE

It could be dark sparks are a type of MCDD that combine elements of PTSD. Particularly in the psychosis area and the affective area, where the anxiety factor contributes to the appearance of PTSD. We seem to have these tendencies to have vivid imaginings of "what would I do/what would happen if" that suddenly intrude on everyday thinking. The imaginings are uncontrollable, hence the psychosis element, and often disturbingly violent or bloody, and strong enough to sometimes create a sympathetic psychosomatic response. Then you blink, and your hand's reattached, and the door didn't somehow tear it off after all.

Or, another example. People at a fair are gathered around a large, seemingly calm bull, petting it and taking pictures because when I say large, I mean the bastard is eight feet tall at the croup and it's head is bigger than a grown woman. But when a little kid stands too close to the bull's backside, one of those intrusions pops up about the bull kicking the kid in the head and caving in the skull. On returning to reality there's a sudden very strong urge to pull the kid out of perceived danger.

I know what you mean about the rejection response towards parents. Whenever I say something to them it's immediately assumed I'm being critical or argumentative or correcting them. They tend to get me grumpy pretty quickly, so generally I avoid talking to them.

But I've never completely detached from them, and I remember hearing you say that even though you're annoyed how your mother raised you and how it doesn't really give you a chance at a normal life, it also seems like you never really detached from her. She also seemed very protective of you whenever you started to exhibit the anti-social anti-authority tendencies. Maybe this is what makes the difference between DS who live and the ones who don't? Away from a family basis of support, a DS I can imagine they could start to engage in some very risky behaviour.

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Friday, March 5, 2010 9:33 AM

FREMDFIRMA

That's a big part of it, I think, having some kind of bond with "normals" who help put the brakes on excesses and who's continued presence and bond counters in some small way our seemingly-inherent belief that humanity would be better off as food for worms.

I didn't come by that naturally, not really, it was a teacher that noticed my ability to bond with animals was still mostly intact and got a class pet in hopes that my bond with it would bleed over on my classmates - which worked, smart lady, she was.

And yeah, it's been a rough week, most of which I cannot discuss, and it didn't help that I needed to clean out the upstairs closet in my ex's house and chanced upon a box of mementos, trinkets and gifts from folk I've associated with or assisted in the past - and as I sorted through them I realized every single one of them was dead, and this was not a small box, mind you...

Twas a rather truly, morbidly depressing experience, all the worst elements of survivors guilt combined with the bitter frustration of clawing mere inches forward in the face of folks who willingly, knowingly try their very level best to shove you backwards out of pure malice for anyone less twisted than they, and it's a real struggle to keep a lid on the rage, since the last time I had a borderline berserkerang I wound up with bloodshot eyes, severe nosebleed and disorientation/confusion, which my doc says is a very bad sign, since at my age the blood vessels in my head ain't so flexible no more and are too damn likely to go poppin like a bag of orville redenbachers if I push matters - he made no bones about it either, the next time I let that beast out is prolly gonna be the last, and that's not easy for me, keepin a leash on that, you know ?

And of course no sooner am I made aware of this than a bunch of incidents back to back all but tailor made to send me into a frenzied rage, not the least of which was a teacher deciding to more or less waterboard a student over getting up to wash her hands....
http://www.wapt.com/news/22660778/detail.html
Which coming on the heels of other incidents of this nature, case in point...
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/2010/02/08/2010-02-08_us_sold
ier_joshua_taber_waterboarded_his_daughter_4_because_she_couldnt_recite_a.html
About sends me off the edge when dickheads who KNOW better pull out the "all children are lying manipulators" line of tripe at a damned eight year old girl who couldn't lie worth a damn if you sat there and helped - children don't have the *ability* to consistently lie in the face of skeptical adults due to a combination of conditioned respect and lack of experience with dissembling or maintaining a facade, they learn that shit from US, and there's really no worse crime against a child than to belittle actual abuse by calling them a liar, or accusing them of something they didn't do, especially when they get punished for it...

That leads them down some deep, dark roads, and unless they run into someone like me early enough to make a difference, the more often than not wind up eventually spending the rest of their foreshortened and miserable lives taking revenge upon the society that mistreated them in any way possible while steeped in self-hatred and the abject misery of short-sighted misanthropy.

Of course, while itself shocking and offensive, this incident is comparitively minor as opposed to brutally abused kids laughed right off the stand because "all children are lying manipulators" and seeing their face as their abuser walks off scot-free and makes sure to flip them the bird over a nasty smirk on the way out of the courthouse...

I hope there is a hell, and I hope very earnestly that when Sembler and Lichfield die, they burn in it for all fucking eternity, roasting on a spit right next to Dobson and Ezzo.

But this I know.

The hell that was Pathway will never again be visited upon some poor kid who's only real misfortune was to have morons for parents.

-Frem

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Friday, March 5, 2010 10:11 AM

BYTEMITE

It's telling that the school says they talked to the kids and they said they didn't see anything, but it's a different story within the safety radius of their parents. Which is it, the school administrators were prompting them with what to say, or the kids are so scared to go up against authority for the same reason this kid got shoved underwater?

Also, can you do something about blood pressure?

As for all your friends, well, it sounds to me like you all have done a lot of good things. When you do good things, sometimes that's what happens to you, but it's all still worth it, isn't it? They went in open-eyed, didn't they?

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Friday, March 5, 2010 3:09 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Quote:
Which is it, the school administrators were prompting them with what to say, or the kids are so scared to go up against authority for the same reason this kid got shoved underwater?

I'd say the latter - you gotta remember just how TOTAL the control issue is in public schools these days, almost not a single moment of your own that isn't under their strict control and observation, and as the laptop mess shows, if they could push it into your home, they would!

So hell yes, those kids are scared shitless of an "authority" that has damn near complete control of every single facet of their life from what they say, do and think, to when they can go to the friggin bathroom, to what they eat for lunch... especially when they themselves have no real avenue of recourse except through their parents, who they must convince in the face of a "trusted authority" calling them a liar - it's a daunting proposition at best.

Just think how many abuses go unanswered cause no kid dares speak up, because of this ?

Or the precedent - we tell them to speak up, and then often as not, drastically and disproportionately punish them when they do, we SAY one thing, DO another, and they learn from that, you bet they do, whether it's what we meant to teach or not.

Quote:
As for all your friends, well, it sounds to me like you all have done a lot of good things. When you do good things, sometimes that's what happens to you, but it's all still worth it, isn't it? They went in open-eyed, didn't they?

They did, much as you can with something like this, most of them against my advice that it was more horrific than they could possibly imagine and would eat them alive, decent people can *not* do some of this work, and would be better and more effective in a support role, but people do what they do.

I know there's been undeniable progress, but when measured against the list of folks who martyred themselves to get it, all I can think is to rail at fate and bitterly curse the institution of religion itself, cause down where it counts I really believe that what most folk perceive as "god" is some kind of sick, twisted force that manipulates the susceptible into formenting the misery and suffering that the foul creature feeds upon, and like a junkie with a tolerance, needs more and more to get its fix...

As for the blood pressure, normally it's on the low side of average and steady as a rock, it's just when I zerk out that it rockets up like that, and the solution to that is keepin my cool, which isn't as easy as it seems when you run up against stuff so ugly it ought not even exist, and grinning sociopaths helping it right along, preaching peace and tolerance while formenting hatred and violence...

-F

"I didn't have to explore it real deeply to recognize it. I just had to think: This shouldn't be happening.
-Sailor Nothing

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