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Hope on the gridlock easing?

POSTED BY: KPO
UPDATED: Wednesday, November 14, 2012 04:02
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Sunday, November 11, 2012 4:15 AM

KPO

Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.


Interesting article:

Quote:

“The election was a wake-up call,” said one veteran Republican in the House. For many members, “everyone they knew hated Obama. Everyone they knew agreed exactly with them. And then we lost.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/11/us/politics/boehner-tells-house-gop-
to-fall-in-line.html?_r=1&adxnnl=1&pagewanted=all&adxnnlx=1352642416-cFbJF5zVk6zO8qN0FiAOeg&
;

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Sunday, November 11, 2012 5:02 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Excerpts pro and con:
Quote:

Members on the call, subdued and dark, murmured words of support — even a few who had been a thorn in the speaker’s side for much of this Congress.

After spending two years marooned between the will of his loud and fractious members and the Democratic Senate majority, the speaker is trying to assert control, and many members seem to be offering support.
“To have a voice at the bargaining table, John Boehner has to be strong,” said Representative Tom Cole of Oklahoma, one of the speaker’s lieutenants. “Most members were just taught a lesson that you’re not going to get everything that you want. It was that kind of election.”

“I just believe John will have more leeway than in the past Congress,” said Representative Peter T. King, Republican of New York. “The election will matter.”

Mr. Boehner must decide whether he wants to seal his role as an essential player in a grand plan to restructure the nation’s fiscal condition, or continue the status quo of the very gridlock voters appear to detest.

Any deal with the president would probably lose 60 to 80 Republican votes, but the president would bring along enough Democrats to get it passed.

Mr. Boehner made an ardent plea for unity, saying they could expect a good deal out of the coming negotiations only if they stuck together.
The handful of Republican backbenchers who spoke up agreed, and those included often-rebellious conservatives like Representatives Phil Gingrey of Georgia and Virginia Foxx of North Carolina.

He told Mr. Ryan what he was about to say and assured him he would be welcomed back as chairman, even though he needs a waiver to escape rules limiting chairmen’s terms. Mr. Ryan then went hunting and left Mr. Boehner to deliver his message.

But even his vague comments last week got immediate pushback from some members, including Mr. Fleming and Representative Steve King of Iowa.

Some House Republicans have latched on to their own re-elections to claim a dual mandate. “The message from this election for me seems to be, ‘You guys keep going,’ ” said Representative James Lankford of Oklahoma. “The Senate was rewarded for inactivity, the House was rewarded for standing up for its principles and the president was rewarded for his. I was elected by my district to represent their values. I really don’t approach this and say, Now I’ve got to cave to what the Senate or president want.”

Some Republican members appear ready to accede. “The election was a wake-up call,” said one veteran Republican in the House. For many members, “everyone they knew hated Obama. Everyone they knew agreed exactly with them. And then we lost.”

But other Republicans see a different message.

Others representing staunchly conservative districts see no reason to give in, even if the nation as a whole sided with the president on taxes. “A majority of Americans thought it was just fine to raise taxes on higher income people, but that’s more of an emotional response, more ‘I’m in pain, I want someone else to pay,’ ” Mr. Fleming said. But, he added, “How does that solve America’s problems? That’s counterproductive to go down that road.”


So it looks to me like same old, same old, unless enough of them change their minds. The "emotional response" they saw is, in my opinion, not so much an emotional response as a decision that the emotional response of 2010 that "I'm in pain, let's change things" didn't work out so well.

Seeing the election result as "you guys keep going" and that the Senate was REWARDED for inactivity and the House REWARDED for standing up is a reaction too many seem to have convinced themselves of. As usual, what the American public wants is being totally ignored by some.

You can hope, but I see nothing changing...at least not enough to make a difference. I see no hope of the gridlock easing...DAMNED sadly. When you bear in mind that many of them saw the election as a failure of Romney to be conservative ENOUGH, and the hatred pouring out at the results, I'm not sure anyone can have much hope.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Sunday, November 11, 2012 1:54 PM

FREMDFIRMA



*shaking head*

You want the gridlock and sabotage to stop?
Then chase these bastards from the halls of power, flail them mercilessly in the court of public opinion, hound them incessantly about their obstructionism and failure to abide by their oath of office, refuse to do business with them, speak to them, or acknowledge them outside of calling them on their conduct, turn your back on them, shun them and cast them out.

MAKE them the pariahs they deserve to be.
And since they are mentally ill, as a general rule this will not provoke them to introspection, but to violence, at which point having showed THEIR true colors...
Far be it for me to suggest beating them Red, White and Blue - violence is a piss poor solution to any damn thing, one could only hope that the more drastically they act out their insanity the more likely they'll end up where they belong.

In a padded cell.

-Frem

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Monday, November 12, 2012 4:58 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


I don't see it the way you do, Frem. Yeah, there are some sickos within the party, BOTH parties, and yeah, those in the right are in power right now and damned vocal. No arguing with that. But I like to think the GOP tried to utilize the Tea Party and got trapped by them, and now the TP has so much power, it's screwed up the party. Them and What's His Face...Mr. No-Taxes-No-How-No-Way-Not-Never"; he's hobbled the party but good from any kind of compromise, and if they compromised on ANYTHING, I'd hope it would open the door to more. Hey, I can dream.

I just want the craziest of them out of power, national and statewide, then maybe the party could start to heal.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Monday, November 12, 2012 8:16 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


There are quite a few on the progressive side who really aren't that scared of the "Fiscal Cliff". Key entitlements and programs are going to be covered, and most of the deep cuts come out of defense spending. It was structured that way for a reason, after all - to make sure it didn't really happen.

But there are some who aren't really that scared of it actually happening, and view it as potentially a good thing.

There is no serious conservative who thinks that you can cut your way out of debt. Spending cuts are part of it, but so are revenues.



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Monday, November 12, 2012 9:32 AM

HKCAVALIER


"Fiscal cliff" is such a stupid, stupid fear mongering phrase. Right up there with "orange alert." A lot of BS and hand waving to move people away from thinking critically about what's really going on.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Wednesday, November 14, 2012 4:02 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Bang on, Cav. Also Mike; some are trying to come up with another name for it, like "fiscal curb"--I know you've heard that one 'cuz I know what you watch! ;o)--or "fiscal slop" or somesuch thing, but the righties will go on yelling about it. Fear and hatred are their stock in trade.

There's also the fact that everything could be put back together retroactively once they made a deal, if allowed to go off the "curb". It's just stupid, period.

I don't see hope in the gridlock ending. The real politicians have known for sometime what's what, and still have been unable to control their freakos. MAYBE enough of them will take the lesson of the election to heart and start playing nice (or at least going along with those who want to play nice...), but only time will tell. I'm not holding my breath.

I see a couple of potential possibilities. GOP making a feint at compromise, then backing out and screaming "SEE?! WE were willing to compromise, but Obama/the Dems..." or some compromising on fiscal stuff but continuing to be as idiotic about social issues, or...well, that's where my imagination fails, I'm sure there are other possibilities, and I'm equally sure behind closed doors they're discussing them all.

Should be interesting, if nothing else. Personally, I'd like to see Obama and the Dems grow some friggin' BALLS and start playing hardball with them. Would be REALLY interesting to see how the American public would react to THAT!

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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