Iraq WMD v2.0 by SIGNYM

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Iraq WMD v2.0

POSTED BY: SIGNYM
UPDATED: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 11:52
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Sunday, August 25, 2013 10:40 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Syria.

It won't matter where the evidence points, the USA is going to topple yet another regime. Just watch. You'd think that we would have learned by now. Yanno... fool me once?

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Sunday, August 25, 2013 10:45 AM

WHOZIT

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Syria.

It won't matter where the evidence points, the USA is going to topple yet another regime. Just watch. You'd think that we would have learned by now. Yanno... fool me once?

You really think Barry has the balls to send in troops? Him and the Dems and the MSM will find an excuse not to.

The differance is this time we know there are WMD's.

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Sunday, August 25, 2013 10:56 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Syria.

It won't matter where the evidence points, the USA is going to topple yet another regime. Just watch. You'd think that we would have learned by now. Yanno... fool me once?

Several reasons why I don't see this taking place as described...

The US wants no part taking sides against Putin and the Russians. Or Iran. Or China

There's no heart left in the American public to fight yet ANOTHER war, in the M.E.

Oh yeah, the side we'd be taking up with, the rebels ? Many are crazy ass fanatical Muslims, if not completely, in large part. They'll eat body organs of their fallen victims, gleefully, in front of a camera. Despite McCain bein' best buds w/ these folks, I don't see the American public, Left OR Right, wanting anything to do w/ these folks as our 'allies'.

This ain't a small, tactical, SEAL team, flying in under the cover of night, and taking out bin Laden. This would be a large scale, massive, expensive and drawn out endeavor. Maybe even costlier, and with even a less positive outcome, as Iraq.

It's too late in the game. 2 years ago, maybe, if we'd lead a full out, multi-national effort. But now ? No way.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Sunday, August 25, 2013 2:18 PM

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Aerial bombardment or missile strikes within the next week. Maybe drones. Nothing more.

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Sunday, August 25, 2013 3:57 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Yep, just dead people, that's all. Yanno, collateral damage.

Nothing to see here, move along.

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Sunday, August 25, 2013 4:28 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:
Aerial bombardment or missile strikes within the next week. Maybe drones. Nothing more.

Didn't we try guided munitions and cruise missiles for like 10 years in Iraq before we had to go in , boots on the ground ?

( And spare me the " WE DIDN'T NEED TO GO IN AT ALL! " rhetoric. I'm dealing in the real world, not some hypotheticals. We either go in heavy, or not at all. Sitting on the dock w/ our toes dangling in the water won't cut it )

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Sunday, August 25, 2013 6:39 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

WE DIDN'T NEED TO GO IN AT ALL.

There. No rhetoric, just the truth.

-------------

Now, as far as Syria is concerned, I'll bet you dollars to donuts the chemical attack was executed by our good old friends, Al Qaida in Syria.

Why do I think that, you might ask? Well, for one thing, Syrian troops have been holding their own; it would make no military or political sense to use chemical weapons and involve the USA. Also, if the Syrian military were to use chemical weapons, they would attack jihadist forces, not civilians.

OTOH, I think we all agree that if a fighting force is brutal enough to eat the raw heart of an enemy, and saw off the heads of defenseless captives with dull knives, they would be brutal enough to kill civilians just to gain sympathy and (more importantly) provide a creative excuse for USA military support.

And by the time you've seen your 20th video of the choking victims, and the rows of young children looking so peaceful in death, you too will be raging for "justice"... whatever that means.

It's hard to keep your head when everyone else is losing theirs.

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Sunday, August 25, 2013 11:50 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

For the greater cause of Allah, or some such. I guess the particulars of such an attack need to be assessed before we can really determine who did it. The spent chemical dissipates so rapidly only making matters worse, and harder to figure out the finger print of the weapon. There really seems not to be a 'good side' in this war, and it goes against human nature to just sit and watch innocent civilians get slaughtered by the truck load.

This sucks, any way ya look at it.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Monday, August 26, 2013 5:44 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Neither Syria nor Russia have a credible interest in using chemical weapons, since it was very clear that the USA would become involved as a result. Once the USA becomes involved, neither Russia nor Syria can do fuck-all about it... and that's not a position they want to be in.

There are three credible actors in this scenario:

1) Saudi-supported Al Qaida, AKA "the rebels". (As if this was some kind of Star Wars movie!)

2) Israel, which has already missiled Syria directly several times and may want/ need more military and political cover for futher action.

3) The CIA. We've already proved three times over that we're willing to destroy ME governments, and we've been angling to get rid of Syria and Iran for over a decade.

I think this is another confluence of interests, just like Iraq (the oil companies wanted the oil, we wanted the continuence of the petrodollar, Kuwait/ Saudi Arabia wanted a potential economic threat neutralized, with the added bonus feature that China is denied easy access to oil, and a convenient chemical/biological/nuclear-weapons cover story.)

The same players are still in play, and I'm beginning to see the outlines of who will tolerate what. There is a strong USA-Saudi (al Qaida)- Israeli nexus. Saudi Arabia gives fuck-all about Palestinians, but their petrodollar agreement with us protects them from Israel and Israel from them. So al Qaida doesn't attack Israel, and Israel pays them no mind. We and the Saudis are joined at the petrodollar hip, and we and Israel are joined at the religion hip.

Iran, Iraq, Libya, Egypt, Syria ... so much human excrement.

AFA evidence... if they can find the shells or delivery system (How was it emplaced? How was it dispersed?) it would help to determine who did what. Military parts... they tend to be standardized, since they're mass-produced, so there might be hard evidence above and beyond the nature and chemical makeup of the liquid (Did it have stabilizers? Did it represent a known production process?) used.

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Monday, August 26, 2013 4:44 PM

JAYNEZTOWN

Saudis offer Russia secret oil deal if it drops Syria

http://www.smh.com.au/business/world-business/saudis-offer-russia-secr
et-oil-deal-if-it-drops-syria-20130827-2smvt.html

Saudi Arabia has secretly offered Russia a sweeping deal to control the global oil market and safeguard Russia’s gas contracts, if the Kremlin backs away from the Assad regime in Syria.

As-Safir said Prince Bandar pledged to safeguard Russia’s naval base in Syria if the Assad regime is toppled, but he also hinted at Chechen terrorist attacks on Russia’s Winter Olympics in Sochi if there is no accord.

‘‘I can give you a guarantee to protect the Winter Olympics next year. The Chechen groups that threaten the security of the Games are controlled by us,’’ he allegedly said.

Prince Bandar went on to say that Chechens operating in Syria were a pressure tool that could be switched on and off.

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Monday, August 26, 2013 7:45 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

So the Saudis presumably said that they control Al Qaida and threatened the Sochi Olympics with Chechen terrorists? Well, don't know if it's true, but it wouldn't surprise me. In addition to knowing a Syrian xtian, I also know an Ethiopian. Ethiopia used to export a lot of cheap labor to Saudi Arabia, people who worked in the palaces and so forth, and a lot of the Saudi so-called royal family are as depraved in real life as anything PN can dream up.

But maybe there is another part to this. There is a huge, recently-discovered oil and gas deposit in the eastern Mediterranean. Saudi Arabia and the other ME oil exporting states depend on petroleum reserves as their economic lifeblood, but the USA is obsessed with it. Needs further thought.

In the meantime: how in hell did we wind up on the side of the terrorists?

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Monday, August 26, 2013 8:55 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

In general, the same way we ended up on the same side as a lot of brutal dictators: it seemed like a good idea, at the time.

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Wednesday, August 28, 2013 2:55 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Do we know the delivery system for the WMD used?

I'm guessing either mortor or artillery. But we're saying we have satellite evidence? Did I miss Colin Powell's slide show?

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Wednesday, August 28, 2013 3:10 AM

JAYNEZTOWN

beating the war drum

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Wednesday, August 28, 2013 10:56 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

An American military attack on Syria could begin as early as Thursday and will involve three days of missile strikes, according to "senior U.S. officials" talking to NBC News. The Washington Post has the bombing at "no more than two days," though long-range bombers could "possibly" join the missiles. "Factors weighing into the timing of any action include a desire to get it done before the president leaves for Russia next week," reports CNN, citing a "senior administration official."

The New York Times, quoting a Pentagon official, adds that "the initial target list has fewer than 50 sites, including air bases where Syria's Russian-made attack helicopters are deployed." The Times adds that "like several other military officials contacted for this report, the official agreed to discuss planning options only on condition of anonymity."

Thus do the legal and moral requirements of secret military operations lose out in this Administration to the imperatives of in-the-know spin and political gestures.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324591204579039011328308
776.html?mod=hp_opinion

Also, JT, the idiot in the posted video should either drive or vlog, not both.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Wednesday, August 28, 2013 11:04 AM

FREMDFIRMA

I think William has the best and most succinct comment on it, just in that first line - the article itself is just overkill.

War on Syria: Twenty Pounds of Stupid in a Ten-Pound Bag.

http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/18416-war-on-syria-twenty-pounds-of
-stupid-in-a-ten-pound-bag

Ask yourself this, exactly when, ever, has our interference ever actually IMPROVED the situation over there ?

Anyone ?

Bueller ?

*crickets*

Yeahhhh....

So why do we keep doin the same stupid, pointless, wasteful, futile things, save as naught more than a blood soaked excuse to keep the warfare-welfare state going ?

I say fuck it, send a couple C130s over and carpet bomb them with hashish baked brownies, then leave it alone a while.

-F

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Wednesday, August 28, 2013 11:52 AM

BYTEMITE

This is pretty amazing. I think everyone on the board uniformly hates the idea of supporting either side of this conflict.

As for the chemicals and delivery, it's all over the place. Some people are saying it's some sort of soviet origin g-shell like what was used in Syria. Some are saying Agent-15 from Iraq, some are saying some kind of nerve agent canisters fired from tanks, Israel thinks Syria has been using white phosphorus.

Wild speculation from leadership and a quick move to action while the media blares about how it's all so obvious and If we doubt the official narrative then we have no conscience... And EVERY SINGLE ONE OF US is dubious.

I'm impressed.

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