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Iowa grants permits for blind residents to carry guns in public

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 15:50
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Monday, September 9, 2013 2:24 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Seriously.
Quote:

Here’s some news that has law enforcement officials and lawmakers scratching their heads:

Iowa is granting permits to acquire or carry guns in public to people who are legally or completely blind.

Polk County officials say they’ve issued weapons permits to at least three people who can’t legally drive and were unable to read the application forms or had difficulty doing so because of visual impairments.

And sheriffs in three other counties — Jasper, Kossuth and Delaware — say they have granted permits to residents who they believe have severe visual impairments.

“I’m not an expert in vision,” Delaware Sheriff John LeClere said. “At what point do vision problems have a detrimental effect to fire a firearm? If you see nothing but a blurry mass in front of you, then I would say you probably shouldn’t be shooting something.”

“Although people who are blind can participate fully in nearly all life’s experiences, there are some things, like the operation of a weapon, that may very well be an exception,” Patrick Clancy, superintendent of the Iowa Braille and Sight Saving School, said.

It’s an issue that musician Stevie Wonder, who has been blind since birth, called attention to in January.

“Imagine me with a gun. It’s just crazy,” Wonder told CNN while calling for reforms to what he has previously called “ridiculous” gun laws. http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20130908/NEWS/309080061/?odys
sey=nav%7Chead&gcheck=1&nclick_check=1
]


Sorry, Stevie, it may be crazy, but it's REAL!

Sheriffs in Iowa have complained about other issues with Iowa’s 2011 law regarding permits to carry weapons in public, such as gaps in their ability to search a person’s background for mental health problems and their inability to deny permits to sex offenders, as well:

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20130505/NEWS01/305050072/100
1/news/Register-Exclusive-50-sex-offenders-gun-permits


http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20130313/NEWS/303130062/1001/
news/Sheriff-chides-Iowa-s-carry-permit-law


http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20130310/NEWS/303100059/1001/
news/4-issues-Iowa-s-gun-carry-law-concern-sheriffs


http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20130310/NEWS/130309026/1001/
news/Appealed-Man-awarded-gun-permit-despite-felony-case


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Monday, September 9, 2013 5:28 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Are blind people allowed to drive cars as well?

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Monday, September 9, 2013 10:05 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Looks like the Des Moines Register doesn't like Iowa's "Shall Issue" laws.

Legally blind is over 20/200 uncorrected vision in the best eye, or tunnel vision of 20 degrees or less. http://vision.about.com/od/faqs/f/What-Does-It-Mean-To-Be-Legally-Blin
d.htm


Now, my uncorrected vision is 20/225 in the left eye, and 20/250 in the right. I can easily recognize individuals out to 30 feet without my glasses, and can put six pistol rounds in a three inch circle at that distance, without glasses. Most data I've seen seems to indicate that almost all self-defense shootings occur at under 21 feet.

Tunnel vision doesn't mean out of focus, it just means limited peripheral vision, so seeing what you're shooting at shouldn't be a problem.

As to the "OMG! Registered Sex Offenders Might Get Carry Permits!!!" article, under Iowa law, stuff like having sex in a public place and being seen (A misdemeanor, since a felony would prohibit you from owning a firearm under Federal law) could get you on the Registry. http://www.bailbondsiniowa.com/pdf/IowaListingofCommonCrimesandPunishm
ents.pdf


So, just propaganda.


"When your heart breaks, you choose what to fill the cracks with. Love or hate. But hate won't ever heal. Only love can do that."

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Tuesday, September 10, 2013 12:11 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Are blind people allowed to drive cars as well?
Of course! That's why there's Braille instructions on drive-up ATMs! (not kidding.)


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Tuesday, September 10, 2013 11:12 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


They're not talking about CORRECTED vision. I'm legally blind--now in only one eye 'cuz of cataract surgery and in two months not at ALL 'cuz the other eye is being done. The mere idea of me with a gun without contacts is horrifying. If they were just talking about not giving permits to people with CORRECTED vision who are technically "legally blind", that's a whole different thing. But they're not.

Note: "An Iowa law allowing the legally or completely blind to acquire permits to carry guns in public..." http://abcnews.go.com/US/controversial-iowa-law-grants-permits-blind-c
arry-guns/story?id=20204245&.tsrc=opera


I, too, could recognize a person--especially if they moved--from some distance without contacts, tho' if they didn't move, not more than a few feet. But I couldn't tell who it WAS or what their INTENT was, or if there were several people, which would be "threatening" me. The idea is insane, especially when it comes to COMPLETELY BLIND people; to argue otherwise is so biased it's not worthy of discussion. It's merely "everyone should have a gun" mentality, period.
Quote:

"Up until 2011, it was solely up to the sheriff of your county who decided who got a gun permit and who did not," Cedar County Sheriff Warren Wethington, who has been granting gun permits to the visually impaired since he became sheriff in 2007, told ABCNews.com. "So you were basically at the mercy of whether you had a pro-gun sheriff or an anti-gun sheriff."

In 2010, Iowa became a "shall-issue" state when the legislature amended a law to create a uniform procedure for issuing gun permits statewide.
"Once those restrictions were limited, we basically had to approve anybody who applied for a permit," said Delaware County Sheriff John LeClere. "Our opinion no longer matters and our information on an individual, as far as their character, was something we could no longer consider."

While applicants need to take a firearm safety course to obtain a permit, it is available online and does not need to include hands-on firearms training, which "makes it a little difficult," LeClere said.

"If we have a person who is possibly eyesight impaired, he is certainly entitled to defend himself," he said. "But should he be carrying [a firearm] in public?"

"I have some reservations about full access for people who are blind," said Patrick Clancy, superintendent of the Iowa Braille and Sight Saving School in Vinton, Iowa. "That's just because shooting requires a lot of vision to be accurate outside of controlled settings with safety courses."

"We don't believe there should be a blanket prohibition on blind people owning or carrying guns," said Chris Danielsen, spokesman for the National Federation of the Blind. "It's certainly true that the blind person or visually impaired person needs to be cautious about using a firearm, but so does everybody else."

Danielsen said the issue of whether or not to use a gun is primarily an issue of common sense, not sight. "The important thing for people to realize is that our judgment is not impaired," he said.

"A visually impaired person, in my opinion, is more entitled for a permit to carry, just for the sheer fact that they don't pick up on the cues that a sighted person would have," said Wethington.

Wethington said there is no reason why someone who is blind, if properly trained, can't operate or use a handgun or any weapon just as safely as any person who isn't visually impaired.

"I have a permit to carry. It doesn't restrict me in times of low vision. My permit is still good in heavy fog, it's good in low light, it's good anytime that my vision is obstructed," he said. "If I'm in a room that is low light or total darkness, my permit is still valid, even if I can't see better than a totally blind person."



They don't pick upon the cues a sighted person would...that's MORE reason for them to carry a deadly weapon?? That is just totally insane. We have become an insane society, where guns are concerned, in my opinion.



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Tuesday, September 10, 2013 12:35 PM

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT


Quote:

Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
Are blind people allowed to drive cars as well?



Stevie Wonder himself talks about that. He goes driving in his limo, in arena parking lots, with his chauffeur beside him.

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Tuesday, September 10, 2013 10:46 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
They're not talking about CORRECTED vision.



Since the definition of "legally blind", as noted above, is based on CORRECTED vision, I'd think so.

Sorry, Niki, but this is just another anti-gun scare story.




"When your heart breaks, you choose what to fill the cracks with. Love or hate. But hate won't ever heal. Only love can do that."

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Wednesday, September 11, 2013 9:56 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Now you can't read? In the article it says clearly "An Iowa law allowing the legally or completely blind to acquire permits to carry guns in public..."


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Wednesday, September 11, 2013 3:50 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Now you can't read? In the article it says clearly "An Iowa law allowing the legally or completely blind to acquire permits to carry guns in public..."




Here's a copy of the bill that became the "Shall issue" law.

http://coolice.legis.iowa.gov/Legislation/83rdGA/enrolled/SF2379.html

It doesn't change much except to remove the requirement that one would have to reasonably justify a need to go armed before getting a permit, and instead says people not disqualified by certain prior crimes, addiction issues, etc., shall be issued a permit if they meet age and training requirements. So basically, if a completely blind person could have made the case that they could reasonably justify needing a firearms permit prior to the passage of this law, they could, and should, have gotten one.

BTW, any stats on how many completely blind folks are actually running around the streets of Iowa with permits and guns? Are there any?

And how do you feel about folks with other disabilities having carry permits? Folks who need a wheelchair or walker? The hearing-impaired?

What's interesting is that this law has been in effect for almost two years, and it took the anti-gun folks this long to come up with this red herring.


"When your heart breaks, you choose what to fill the cracks with. Love or hate. But hate won't ever heal. Only love can do that."

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