Saddam's On the Clock by Geezer

It’s about time. He should have been hung a long time ago, except for the need for the Iraqi government to appear to demonstrate a fair and transparent trial. And as far as Middle Eastern courts go, this one was probably the most fair and transparent in history, outside of maybe Israel.

Certainly the EU will complain, they already are, but that’s hardly anything new. If certain politically commanding nations, like France and Russia, had stood up to Hussein to begin with, there might be no need for an execution, and possibly even the war.

Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.

Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.

-- Cicero

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Wednesday, December 27, 2006 8:38 AM

HKCAVALIER

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
If certain politically commanding nations, like France and Russia, had stood up to Hussein to begin with, there might be no need for an execution, and possibly even the war.

And there is need for an execution now? Why, exactly? What will it accomplish, in your eyes?

And if Hussein is being justly executed for his many crimes, how was this execution avoidable in any way?

And what inactions of France and Russia precipitated the war in Iraq?

Sure, I got a feeling I'm not going to agree with your assessment of the situation, Finn, but nevertheless, I'd like a better understanding of where you stand.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Wednesday, December 27, 2006 8:54 AM

BAGHEERA

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
Certainly the EU will complain, they already are, but that’s hardly anything new. If certain politically commanding nations, like France and Russia, had stood up to Hussein to begin with, there might be no need for an execution, and possibly even the war.

And yet, that would have created a whole different war as the US rose to Saddam's defense....

oh... you meant the beginning's of the US's current "kill now, think later" agenda, and not the beginning's of the troubles with Saddam ?

Hang him or not, the problems in Iraq are far removed from Saddam, and far far worse then when he was in power.

Too bad all dictators arent treated equal to Saddam, might end up with some real democracies and not the shams of "the country with the most guns and the least qualms about using them".

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Wednesday, December 27, 2006 9:02 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:
And there is need for an execution now? Why, exactly?

It will act as a deterrant for other would-be fiends to curb their..uh, fiendishness!!!
It will prove what a great nation we, uh.. I mean Iraq is, and...

..it's cheaper than feeding him for 20 years....

Awwww...I got nuthin.

Weak Chrisisall

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Wednesday, December 27, 2006 9:07 AM

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

It might be the first step to getting U.S. out of Iraq. Prez Bush isn't gonna do what his Daddy did- leave town and let Saddam take over AGAIN. Which is what might happen as long as he's alive, but can't once he's dead.

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Wednesday, December 27, 2006 10:47 AM

And there is need for an execution now? Why, exactly? What will it accomplish, in your eyes?

It will help to affirm the Iraqi governments and in particular the courts power, and by extension the Iraqi people who elected the government, and eliminate a rallying point or motivation for Ba’ath insurgents. But perhaps most important to me, it also will help to disincentivize belligerent opposition to international opinion by other rogue nations. Kim Jung Il may not be so hasty to lobe a nuke at Japan or South Korea if he feels, he personally will meet a similar fate.

And if Hussein is being justly executed for his many crimes, how was this execution avoidable in any way?

The same way anyone avoids sentencing of a crime they are justly accused, he could have not committed his many crimes. Hussein could have not invaded Kuwait, or could have cooperated with the international community with respect to cease fires and UN resolutions, then the war would never have occurred and he would still be in power. Or perhaps, he could have just not killed or tortured so many Kurds and Shiites, so that the court might have found some reason for leniency.

And what inactions of France and Russia precipitated the war in Iraq?

France and Russia routinely vetoed or threatened vetoing action against Iraq and lobbied in sympathy for the Iraqi regime within the UNSC and possibly other more nefarious things as well, such as providing Hussein with intelligence and weapons to fight US/UK troops, and Hussein believed that he could count on France and Russia to hold off any coalition action. Why France and Russia did this probably has a lot to do with their various lucrative oil contracts with Iraq, but I suspect there is much more to it, and even still whether the actions of France and Russia were just financial or pacifist/ideological, the end result was that it affirmed Hussein’s miscalculations. And while Hussein was wrong in assuming that France and Russia had the political capital or will to stop the US/UK, nonetheless that was what he was being told by his advisors and what appeared to be coming out of the international community, and what may have been coming from France and Russia as well. And of course there is precedent for that. Arafat rose from obscurity to a position in the UNGA and a Nobel Peace Prize largely on the capitulations of France, Germany and Italy to his terrorist activities. Hussein, or certainly his advisors, knew that Iraq couldn’t defeat or defend a US/UK lead military action. If they didn’t know it before 1991, they certainly knew it afterwards, so there’s no reason to believe that Iraq would have ever pushed things as far as they had unless they believed that the West would not actually follow through with the implied threats in the Chapter 7 Resolutions. So if France and Russia had stood firmly with the US and the UK and not provided Hussein with any hope (justified or not) that he was safe from a US/UK invasion, I don’t think the war would ever have occurred.

And whatever comments are made about the US having once supported Saddam, the fact is that neither the US nor the UK supported him after the 1991 Gulf War and the inception of UN Chapter Seven Resolutions. France and Russia did.

Sure, I got a feeling I'm not going to agree with your assessment of the situation, Finn, but nevertheless, I'd like a better understanding of where you stand.

Well, agree or not, that’s my story.

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Wednesday, December 27, 2006 4:32 PM

BAGHEERA

Quote:

The same way anyone avoids sentencing of a crime they are justly accused, he could have not committed his many crimes.

If he wasnt the man he was, and committed the crimes he did one of two situations would have arisen... either he wouldnt have gotten the backing to the position in the first place, or someone would have ousted him at the first sign of weakness.

The vast majority of regions upon the Earth are not inherited by the meek.

Quote:
Hussein could have not invaded Kuwait, or could have cooperated with the international community with respect to cease fires and UN resolutions, then the war would never have occurred and he would still be in power.

Oddly enough, I remember he was still in power at the end of that war.... is "well, they did something a decade ago" REALLY going to be a justification for killing thousands of people... whats next ? the US decides to declare war on Japan for pearl harbor again ?

Quote:
Or perhaps, he could have just not killed or tortured so many Kurds and Shiites, so that the court might have found some reason for leniency.

While I'm a bit draconian, and do feel he should be executed... I'd like the US to acknowledge its hypocrisy and submit Bush to the same courts... but that sort of thing only happens when the power of a dictatorship is waning, not when its waxing.

Quote:

Why France and Russia did this probably has a lot to do with their various lucrative oil contracts with Iraq, but I suspect there is much more to it

and the US's choice to invade again had NOTHING to do with oil ?

France has been open in its rivalry with the US economy, and has acted openly and honestly.

The same cannot be said of the Bush administration, and I find it odd that the "big reasons" for the war... the whole "iraq was behind 9/11 and will launch nuclear weapons on Des Moines, Iowa if Saddam isnt killed" concept truly baffled me... and THAT was the reason France and Russia generally stood at arms distance from the US whenever they went off on a rant to the UN... and their caution proved true as the lies of the Bush administration proved to be just that.

Quote:
the end result was that it affirmed Hussein’s miscalculations.

Miscalculations ?

"YOU HAVE A NUCLEAR BOMB IN YOUR GARAGE !!! HAND IT OVER !!!"

"I dont have a bomb in my garage, you idiot. I dont even have a fooking garage."

"LET OUR INSPECTORS IN TO SEARCH YOUR GARAGE FOR BOMBS !!!"

"I told you... I DONT HAVE A GARAGE !"

"We gave you a chance for peace... now DIE INFIDELS !!!"

Quote:
Hussein, or certainly his advisors, knew that Iraq couldn’t defeat or defend a US/UK lead military action.

This just goes to show that you can have the knowledge and the just cause, and still lose to an idiot with a gun.

Quote:
So if France and Russia had stood firmly with the US and the UK and not provided Hussein with any hope (justified or not) that he was safe from a US/UK invasion, I don’t think the war would ever have occurred.

?

Iraq's invasion was priority one from 9/11. The reasons given have been shown to be total fabrications or falsehoods. Do you HONESTLY think there was anything Hussein could have done to prevent the US from annexing his country ?

Quote:
And whatever comments are made about the US having once supported Saddam, the fact is that neither the US nor the UK supported him after the 1991 Gulf War and the inception of UN Chapter Seven Resolutions.

Except in putting down the rebellion within Iraq... which gave him a firmer hand on his country then the current puppets have.

.....

Oh, and for the record, I think Hussein should be executed.

But I also believe that Bush and his administration should be held accountable for the lies and deaths that they have caused.

and that IF killing saddam and stabilizing the country is going to be the excuse of the day.... then there were far more... efficient... ways of doing so...

but if your goal is to conquer, subdue, and annex a region... and to subvert the economic interests of rival countries to yours.... then a fullscale war is ... slightly... efficient.

so what did the US go into Iraq for... justice or oil ?

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Wednesday, December 27, 2006 6:15 PM

YINYANG

You were busy trying to get yourself lit on fire. It happens.

Quote:
so what did the US go into Iraq for... justice or oil ?

Both?

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Wednesday, December 27, 2006 7:09 PM

HKCAVALIER

Quote:
Originally posted by yinyang:
Quote:
so what did the US go into Iraq for... justice or oil ?

Both?

Yes, both: Just oil! *rimshot* Haha! Get it? I'll be here all week!

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Wednesday, December 27, 2006 7:56 PM

YINYANG

You were busy trying to get yourself lit on fire. It happens.

HK, really - you should leave that kind of stuff to Chrisisall.

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Thursday, December 28, 2006 7:25 AM

Neither. One is fallacious; the other is too simplistic.

The whole war for oil stuff is just one big false cause fallacy. Just because oil exists in Iraq does not mean the war is for oil. It’s hard to imagine how the US could be getting more or cheaper oil as a result of its policy towards Iraq.

The justice thing is romantic, but overly simplistic, although probably more true then the oil argument. It is true that much of the Iraqi people were handed justice when their brutal tyrant was unseated, and it is also true that the liberation of Iraq has been a principle concern of the US since at least 1998. Still, I think there were other motivations that were probably more influential in the decision to go to war with Iraq.

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Thursday, December 28, 2006 8:44 AM

HERO

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
The whole war for oil stuff is just one big false cause fallacy.

The justice thing is romantic, but overly simplistic,

So if it wasn't the oil and it wasn't for justice...has anyone considered the possibility thay the war isn't really happening?

Kind of like the Democratic commitment to national security and economic growth...we talk about it, but its not really there.

H

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Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
So if it wasn't the oil and it wasn't for justice...has anyone considered the possibility thay the war isn't really happening?

I beleive Europe has probably considered that. In fact, it seems like that's often their approach to most things in the world.

"C'est pas vraiment se produit!"

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Thursday, December 28, 2006 12:13 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
I beleive Europe has probably considered that. In fact, it seems like that's often their approach to most things in the world.

"C'est pas vraiment se produit!"

Well we tried the whole medelling thing, but it didn't pan out so we're leaving the empire building to you yanks.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Thursday, December 28, 2006 12:32 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by yinyang:
HK, really - you should leave that kind of stuff to Chrisisall.

Thanks Yin, but I thought HK was pretty funny there.

I'm no Seinfeld Chrisisall

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Friday, December 29, 2006 12:43 PM

CREVANREAVER

According to reports he could be executed around 10 P.M. Eastern Time, which is 6 A.M. Baghdad Time.

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Friday, December 29, 2006 12:56 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

Let the pacification begin !

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Friday, December 29, 2006 1:42 PM

GINOBIFFARONI

While I do think Saddam deserves his sentence, I don't think the current Iraqi government / courts should have tried him to begin with. The ICC while not completely effective should have been the ones to conduct an impartial trial and sentencing.

That said, does this bring a new president to US foreign policy ?

Will they now not shelter ousted leaders from prosecution... as they did with the Shah among others. Or are they deciding this on a case by case basis, if so the term justice doesn't seem to be applicable.

" Fighting them at their own game
Murder for freedom the stab in the back
Women and children and cowards attack

Run to the hills run for your lives "

http://www.darklyrics.com/lyrics/ironmaiden/liveafterdeath.html#12

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Friday, December 29, 2006 2:32 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Yes, dead men don't tell tales. Killing Hussein before testimony about US complicity is important. And haste is necessary.

U.S. complicity in what ???

Sorry, but Saddam's had more than enough time to sing. Seems he has only hours now.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Friday, December 29, 2006 3:15 PM

HERO

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Sorry, but Saddam's had more than enough time to sing. Seems he has only hours now.

He doesn't seem the singing type, but he'd make a good judge on American Idol.

I hope they play the same music the Undertaker enters to from the WWE. And I think it would be cool if for no apparent reason Saddam was put to death wearing a Cleveland Browns throwback jersey. If I were a crazy Iraqi dictator/mass murderer thats how I'd want to go...give the people something to talk about.

"Yes, he killed people and brought ruin to his country...but what was up with the Browns jersey?"

H

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Friday, December 29, 2006 5:12 PM

CREVANREAVER

Al Arabiya is reporting that it has been done. Saddam Hussein is dead!

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Friday, December 29, 2006 5:50 PM

PIRATECAT

Cool, I was hoping for a snuff movie. We hang em he turns blue. Tongue and foam come out. Then we cut the rope with his last breath bam right into a meat grinder. Of course all on 9mm for historical posperity.

"Battle of Serenity, Mal. Besides Zoe here, how many-" "I'm talkin at you! How many men in your platoon came out of their alive".

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 1:17 AM

PIRATEJENNY

I don't think his crimes is much worse then George Bush's so until George hangs I don't necessiarly thing Saddam should.

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 2:01 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by piratejenny:

I don't think his crimes is much worse then George Bush's so until George hangs I don't necessiarly thing Saddam should.

Woah, I'm no fan of George Bush, but he hasn't the intelligence to be as bad as Saddam Hussein.

George Bush isn't in the same league as far as evil dictator goes.

Well it's true! He's semi-evil. He's quasi-evil. He's the margarine of evil. He's the Diet Coke of evil. Just one calorie, not evil enough.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 2:48 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by piratejenny:

I don't think his crimes is much worse then George Bush's so until George hangs I don't necessiarly thing Saddam should.

With out question the most idiotic and ignorant comment on this, or any other board. Ever.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 4:33 AM

SUCCATASH

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
With out question the most idiotic and ignorant comment on this, or any other board. Ever.

I don't know, this one's hard to beat:
http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=18&t=26219#431542

Jenny is quite justified being utterly disgusted with all the blood on Bush's hands.

"Gott kann dich nicht vor mir beschuetzen, weil ich nicht boese bin."

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 6:11 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Succatash:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
With out question the most idiotic and ignorant comment on this, or any other board. Ever.

I don't know, this one's hard to beat:
http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=18&t=26219#431542

Jenny is quite justified being utterly disgusted with all the blood on Bush's hands.
"

All the blood ? That would be 'none', actually.

As for 'Democratic/ Democrats / Democrat' , I've never heard them referred to as Democratic party. If that's their name, then that's their name. Hardly rises to the same level of absurdity that compares Saddam to Bush. I freely admit my error, where as others likely won't. No biggie.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 6:18 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:
Originally posted by piratejenny:

I don't think his crimes is much worse then George Bush's so until George hangs I don't necessiarly thing Saddam should.

With out question the most idiotic and ignorant comment on this, or any other board. Ever.

With all the really, REALLY stupid things I've seen posted in so many places, this response to Jenny's exagguration is now a candidate in the running for the 'most idiotic and ignorant' comment, and it just shows the insane level of blind trust and worship you hold for the office/the man.

You need to evolve beyond it Chrisisall

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 6:25 AM

NECROSCAPE

Quote:
Originally posted by piratejenny:

I don't think his crimes is much worse then George Bush's so until George hangs I don't necessiarly thing Saddam should.

I'll agree with that fact that this is completely ignorant and at the very least horribly disrespectful. You don't have to like Bush but at least make an informed comment.

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 6:28 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
With all the really, REALLY stupid things I've seen posted in so many places, this response to Jenny's exagguration is now a candidate in the running for the 'most idiotic and ignorant' comment, and it just shows the insane level of blind trust and worship you hold for the office/the man.

There's nothing in the way of 'blind trust / worship' involved here w/ Bush. The key factor that you're overlooking here is that Jenny isn't 'exaggurating'. In here demented world, Saddam = Bush. That's where my response is valid, and her comment is so ridiculous.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 7:03 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
The key factor that you're overlooking here is that Jenny isn't 'exaggurating'. In here demented world, Saddam = Bush. That's where my response is valid, and her comment is so ridiculous.

Everyone here knows I'm no fan of Bush, but to compare Saddam to Bush directly and seriously is innacurate at best. Yes, troops have died that might not have had to, but they were not sent in with the expectation that they would be killed. Saddam ordered deaths. Severe incompetance does not necessarly equal evil.
Bush deserves to be impeached, and maybe serve some time for shady dealings involving conflict of interests, but not what Saddam got.
Saddam got what he ultimately deserved.

Trying to be sensible Chrisisall

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 7:11 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Succatash:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
With out question the most idiotic and ignorant comment on this, or any other board. Ever.

I don't know, this one's hard to beat:
http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=18&t=26219#431542

Wow, you’re comparing a little Bob Hope humor to priatejenny’s fruitcakey comment?

I have to admit though that I’m surprised this discussion remained as civil as it did, I thought for sure someone would have started trolling a lot sooner. Anyway, it's not like there's anymore to be said on the topic.

It's pretty much done. I can't say that I'm happy about it, necessarily, but I hope it brings some modicum of justice to those who have had to bare their children’s fingernails being pulled off, their daughters raped or their villages gassed. And ultimately, maybe other rogue leaders might take their conflicts with the UNSC seriously.

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
With all the really, REALLY stupid things I've seen posted in so many places, this response to Jenny's exagguration is now a candidate in the running for the 'most idiotic and ignorant' comment, and it just shows the insane level of blind trust and worship you hold for the office/the man.

Oh come on. So if you find fanatical rhetoric about hanging Bush offensive, that means you’re a fanatical worshiper of Bush? So what if you disagree with Bush, does that mean that you must be a supporter of assassination? The other day you condemned AURaptor for saying that Jimmy Carter is an embarrassment, now you’re condemning him for not accepting language that George Bush is as bad as Saddam Hussein and should be hung? You really can’t get too much more one-sided then that.

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 7:22 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
Oh come on. So if you find fanatical rhetoric about hanging Bush offensive, that means you’re a fanatical worshiper of Bush?

Intentional or not, there is blood on his hands, and a case can be made that he's directly responsible for needless death, so being angry at him to the point of being offensive to those who, after all they've seen, still support him doesn't make me lose any sleep.

Quote:
The other day you condemned AURaptor for saying that Jimmy Carter is an embarrassment

Condemned him to what? Death? I thought I just said he was wrong about it.

Chrisisall

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 7:46 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Intentional or not, there is blood on his hands, and a case can be made that he's directly responsible for needless death, so being angry at him to the point of being offensive to those who, after all they've seen, still support him doesn't make me lose any sleep.

People who claim Bush should be hung doesn’t bother you? Should Tony Blair be hung? Should John Howard be hung? Should Jarosław Kaczyński be hung? Should Han Myeong Sook be hung? Or just George Bush? In every war there are needless deaths. So should we hang all the world leaders or just those that you don’t like? Still regardless of all the needless deaths and world leaders who have directly supported and participated in wars in which needless deaths occur, there is a difference between Bush and Hussein or Carter and Arafat. For Hussien and Arafat, there is no such thing as needless death, accept perhaps their own.

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 8:09 AM

SUCCATASH

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
People who claim Bush should be hung doesn’t bother you?

Jenny never claimed Bush should be hanged, she said Saddam shouldn't have been.

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
So should we hang all the world leaders or just those that you don’t like?

Perhaps that's the point Jenny was trying to make?

"Gott kann dich nicht vor mir beschuetzen, weil ich nicht boese bin."

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 8:41 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Succatash:
Perhaps that's the point Jenny was trying to make?

No. The point Jenny made was that Bush’s supposed crimes are tantamount to Hussein's. And that’s nonsense.

"I don't think [Saddam Hussein's] crimes is(sic) much worse then George Bush's so until George hangs I don't necessiarly(sic) thing(sic) Saddam should." Ibid.

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 10:26 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
So should we hang all the world leaders or just those that you don’t like?

No. Historically the precident bears out that we should only hang the one's that lose.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 10:50 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Bush deserves to be impeached, and maybe serve some time for shady dealings involving conflict of interests,...

Can-o-worms time, but in all seriousness, Bush should be impeached for WHAT, specifically? What 'conflict of interests? ' ? Hell, if Clinton didn't serve time for his 'shady' campaign dealings with the Red Chinese, what's Bush got to worry ?

Not wanting a flame war- AURpator

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 12:16 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Can-o-worms time, but in all seriousness, Bush should be impeached for WHAT, specifically?

Maybe he had sex with someone once? Chris can we get a report on this development?

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 1:03 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!

Saddam was allegedly hanged for murdering 8 Iraqi citizens. Bush Sr, Clinton-Blythe and Bush Jr next to be executed for murdering 2.6-million Iraqis, for murdering 200,000 US soldiers during the 15-year Gulf War, and for murdering 1,000s of US citizens in USA.

Quote:

US Ambassador to Iraq April Glaspie: "I have direct instructions from President Bush to improve our relations with Iraq. We have considerable sympathy for your quest for higher oil prices, the immediate cause of your confrontation with Kuwait. We can see that you have deployed massive numbers of troops in the south. Normally that would be none of our business."
President Saddam Hussein: "As you know, for years now I have made every effort to reach a settlement on our dispute with Kuwait. There is to be a meeting in two days; I am prepared to give negotiations only this one more brief chance. (pause) When we (the Iraqis) meet (with the Kuwaitis) and we see there is hope, then nothing will happen. But if we are unable to find a solution, then it will be natural that Iraq will not accept death."
Glaspie: "We have no opinion on your Arab - Arab conflicts, such as your dispute with Kuwait. Secretary (of State James) Baker has directed me to emphasize the instruction, first given to Iraq in the 1960's, that the Kuwait issue is not associated with America."
President Saddam Hussein: (smiles)
-Videotaped meeting between Iraqi President Saddam Hussein and US Ambassador April Glaspie, July 25, 1990 (Eight days before the August 2, 1990 Iraqi Invasion of Kuwait)

Journalist 2: "You knew Saddam was going to invade (Kuwait) but you didn't warn him not to. You didn't tell him America would defend Kuwait. You told him the opposite - that America was not associated with Kuwait."
Journalist 1: "You encouraged this aggression - his invasion. What were you thinking?"
US Ambassador Glaspie: "Obviously, I didn't think, and nobody else did, that the Iraqis were going to take all of Kuwait."
-US Embassy, Baghdad, Iraq, September 2, 1990

Sir Donald Rumsfeld Jewish Knight of the British Empire and CEO of Searl Pharmaceuticals selling chemical and biological WMDs to Saddam to allegedly gas the Kurds (who were gassed by Bush Sr's buddies in Iran)
www.awolbush.com

Jew Clinton-Blythe sniped, machine-gunned and bombed over 80 Christians in church in 1993 (Waco = Crawford); bombed the World Trade Center in 1993, murdering at least 6 US citizens (FBI built the bomb and paid the bomb builder Emad Salem $1-million, as recorded on 100 hours of audiotape, played in federal court and reported by NY Times); bombed the OK City Fed Bldg in 1995 with preinstalled explosives inside the max-security building. Jew Bush Jr bombed the World Trade Center in 2001 with 1,000s of preinstalled bombs and Thermate incendiaries with diversion of explosive-laden robot aircraft as confessed in Pentagon/CIA's Operation Northwoods (signed confession by Jewish General Lyman Lemnitzer, chairman US joint chiefs of staff at Pentagon).
www.piratenews.org/911con.html
http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662&page=1
www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/20010430/doc1.pdf

Fake Saddam hanged claims pathological liars in Jewish Media Mafia (Blog)
www.vialls.com/iraq/vaudeville.html
www.myspace.com/piratenewsctv

Quote:

"This is not my husband but his double. Where is my husband? Take me to my husband! You think I do not know my husband? I was married to the man for more than twenty-five years!"
-Sajida Heiralla Tuffah Hussein, wife of Saddam Hussein, visiting the tortured imposter in US Death Camp, "Mrs Saddam says Saddam is not Saddam"
www.prisonplanet.tv/articles/june2004/061804saddamnotsaddam.htm
www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/iraq/saddam-pics.htm

No video exists of the "Saddam Hanging", thus no proof exists that "Saddam" was executed. The alleged video of Jewish Mossad agent Nick Berg's beheading was also faked inside his place of employment at Abu Ghraib Torture Death Camp. Berg loaned his computer to the alleged 9/11 "suicide hijackers", most of whom are still alive or were trained at US military and CIA bases. Berg's "beheading" video has edited cuts in the timeline, thus destroying the chain of custody of that evidence. Berg died while wearing a US prison uniform from Abu Ghraib.

The first terrorist bombers arrested on 9/11/2001 were JEWS from ISRAEL fleeing to Mexico.
www.whatreallyhappened.com/hundreds.html

=

The only US citizen indicted for treason in AllCIAduh is a JEW named Adam Gadahn, son and grandson of directors of Jewish ADL B'Nai B'Rith Masonic Mafia Church of Satan.
http://www.fbi.gov/page2/oct2006/gadahn101106.htm
www.infowars.net/articles/September2006/040906Al-Qaida.htm

Bush family ancestor Constable Thomas Percy's head is currently displayed on a stick in British Parliament for perping the Gunpowder Plot in 1605 to bomb Parliament. V For Vendetta is propaganda by homosexual transvestite Jews to support homosexual transvestite Bush Crime Family's long history of terrorist bombings and treason:
www.parliament.uk/parliamentary_publications_and_archives/parliamentar
y_archives/gunpowder_plot_400_pow.cfm
http://tv.groups.yahoo.com/group/piratenewsrss/message/174

"He killed me with a sword! How weird is that?"
-Mr Universe, Pirate TV

FIREFLY SERENITY PILOT MUSIC VIDEO V2
Tangerine Dream - Thief Soundtrack: Confrontation
http://radio.indymedia.org/news/2006/03/8912.php
http://video.yahoo.com/video/play?vid=8cd2bd0379340120e7a6ed00f2a53ee5
.1044556
www.myspace.com/piratenewsctv
www.piratenews.org

Does that seem right to you?
www.scifi.com/onair/

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 1:17 PM

GINOBIFFARONI

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
The key factor that you're overlooking here is that Jenny isn't 'exaggurating'. In here demented world, Saddam = Bush. That's where my response is valid, and her comment is so ridiculous.

Everyone here knows I'm no fan of Bush, but to compare Saddam to Bush directly and seriously is innacurate at best. Yes, troops have died that might not have had to, but they were not sent in with the expectation that they would be killed. Saddam ordered deaths. Severe incompetance does not necessarly equal evil.
Bush deserves to be impeached, and maybe serve some time for shady dealings involving conflict of interests, but not what Saddam got.
Saddam got what he ultimately deserved.

Trying to be sensible Chrisisall

How about instead of Bush we compare Saddam to Churchill

I mean they both used gas on the Kurds

One is still idolized, the other ...

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 1:18 PM

GINOBIFFARONI

Quote:
Originally posted by Succatash:
Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
People who claim Bush should be hung doesn’t bother you?
Jenny never claimed Bush should be hanged, she said Saddam shouldn't have been.

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
So should we hang all the world leaders or just those that you don’t like?
Perhaps that's the point Jenny was trying to make?

"Gott kann dich nicht vor mir beschuetzen, weil ich nicht boese bin."

Delete hung... insert shot and I'll agree

" Fighting them at their own game
Murder for freedom the stab in the back
Women and children and cowards attack

Run to the hills run for your lives "

http://www.darklyrics.com/lyrics/ironmaiden/liveafterdeath.html#12

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 2:57 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Saddam was allegedly hanged for murdering 8 Iraqi citizens

Wrong, Piratedork. It was for the murder of 150 Iraqis, in 1982. They didn't get to the 5k Kurds that Saddam gassed to death in the late 80's.

Go watch men rassle in tights, and leave the politics to the adults.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 3:49 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:
Saddam was allegedly hanged for murdering 8 Iraqi citizens

Wrong, Piratedork. It was for the murder of 150 Iraqis, in 1982. They didn't get to the 5k Kurds that Saddam gassed to death in the late 80's.

Go watch men rassle in tights, and leave the politics to the adults.

Please don't talk to the crazy person. You'll only encourage him.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 4:58 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Please don't talk to the crazy person. You'll only encourage him.

Who, me ? What crazy person? I wasn't talkin' to no one. Honest. Not no one , no how.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 6:04 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Bush should be impeached for WHAT, specifically? What 'conflict of interests? ' ? Hell, if Clinton didn't serve time for his 'shady' campaign dealings with the Red Chinese, what's Bush got to worry ?

I'm a little vague on Clinton's transgressions, since I tend to focus on what gets peeps killed, but if he done it, throw the book at him too.
But George should be impeached for lying to the American people about the reasons for the Iraq war (WMD's, imminent threat, etc.), at least. Just like a police officer should be kicked out for lying about seeing drugs in a kid's hands when there were none, just because he 'knew' the kid was guilty.
And the conflicts of interest are the friends of his getting jobs when they aren't qualified (FEMA), and friends getting contracts due to the war to rebuild that which we destroyed...

But, Saddam's dead now, MISSION ACCOMPLISHED.
Peace will fall on Iraq like a blanket from Heaven, I guess. As long as our troops are safe now, all is finally well.
Ooops! Fell asleep there for a second, was having a pleasant dream....

Trapped in a world he never made Chrisisall

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Saturday, December 30, 2006 6:08 PM