Is the idea of 'unconditional love' a joke? by chrisisall

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Is the idea of 'unconditional love' a joke?

POSTED BY: CHRISISALL
UPDATED: Sunday, February 27, 2011 20:13
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Wednesday, February 23, 2011 5:25 PM

Maybe a holdover from the sixties, I guess. To love someone for who they ARE is an anachronism, eh? Today we love someone for what they WILL be, or what they're CAPABLE of, ya?
Emotions are like Lego pieces in the scheme of life, to be applied to a work or not as it makes one comfortable.

Like Connor McCloud said in Highlander, "Love is for poets."

Please, tell me I'm wrong here....

The Sad Chrisisall

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Wednesday, February 23, 2011 5:30 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!

Baby Hippo Loves Century Old Tortoise
http://rense.com/general93/hippo.htm

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Wednesday, February 23, 2011 5:39 PM

CHRISISALL

Thanks John, that makes me feel... like a Hungry Hungry Hippo.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, February 23, 2011 5:42 PM

KANEMAN

Short answer NO.

I can't speak for everyone, but I can speak for me and Kwicko...

I can only love a woman...that is a condition

Kwicko can only love a man who will jam his ass with dick...that is a condition, a gay condition, butt a condition.

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Wednesday, February 23, 2011 7:05 PM

CANTTAKESKY

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Please, tell me I'm wrong here....

You're wrong.

You really are. :)

-------
"It is not my thorns that defend me. It is my perfume," says the rose. -- Paul Claudel

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Wednesday, February 23, 2011 7:21 PM

THEHAPPYTRADER

Emotions are kinda like legos. You can't plan on finding the pieces you need when you need 'em, but then one of them will catch your eye and you're like, "I can use that." So you start building on it and then you finally come across the peice you were looking for and you wonder what it's for, cause you can't remember.

So you set it aside so's you can find it fast in a hurry, but this is a mistake, because she won't just wait around forever. She'll graduate and move to another city and talk to you via instant message. It'll start as harmless flirting but eventually she will talk about how badly she wants to jump your man bone, but you're kind of committed to another lego piece and idea right now.

You start to wonder, what if I just spent a night working over that piece? I mean, if we're friends and all, and it's not threatening my other piece, is it okay? What the other piece don't know won't hurt it? But this is dangerous territory, and of the dark side.

The best thing you can do is encourage the two pieces to work together, with you in the middle. It'll make for one hell of a night! But don't drink too much or you might shut down early. These things don't work often and you'll want to make the most of it.

So yeah, Love is exactly like legos.

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Wednesday, February 23, 2011 7:42 PM

BYTEMITE

No, it exists. Speaking further than that will depress or disturb the hell out of everyone, so I won't say anything else.

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Wednesday, February 23, 2011 7:46 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht

Well the Bible says God loves us unconditionally, so I don't think its a joke. But can we love unconditionally? I don't think we can, some of us get closer than others but ultimately we as humans are imperfect. But we can love deeply, passionately, longterm, fulfillingly and devotedly, which are pretty cool things, and we can do it with more than one type of relationship, family, friends, offspring, spouses/lovers/significant others (I guess it depends on what stage you're at with the coupling thing).

Happy ... erm ... I think you're joking/fantasizing ... right? ... At any rate legos are fun, I built a house out of legos once, took me a couple of hours but it was beautiful.

The people I love the most in my life are my parents, my little brother, my nephews, my best friends, my good cousins, not in any particular order ... well my parents and little brother and nephews and best friends do come before the cousins and my grandmother, but I care for them a lot too. I'm someone who loves quite intensely.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Wednesday, February 23, 2011 8:09 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by RionaEire:

Happy ... erm ... I think you're joking/fantasizing ... right? ...

Yeah.
No one wants to be happy. That'd be too nice.
We're angry creatures.

The not-laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, February 23, 2011 8:29 PM

THEHAPPYTRADER

I was going to disambiguate that, but on second thought I think it's more fun to leave it ya wondering.

Select to view spoiler:

rest assured, what may or may not have happened was initiated by the ladies and I would never lie to my g/f like I insinuated in the analogy, and besides, I didn't need to

I respect women and do not view them as mere 'pieces' to be 'used.'

EDIT: But on a more serious note, Love is perfect and comes in many forms. My silliness was a play on the term 'making love' and denigrated it to 'ruttin.'

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Wednesday, February 23, 2011 8:43 PM

THEHAPPYTRADER

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by RionaEire:

Happy ... erm ... I think you're joking/fantasizing ... right? ...
Yeah.
No one wants to be happy. That'd be too nice.
We're angry creatures.

The not-laughing Chrisisall

And you wonder why I'm Happy

j/k j/k There is more to love than sex, and sex IMO is way better with someone you truly deeply care about. Might be those more conservative religious types are on to something, saving it for marriage.

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Thursday, February 24, 2011 12:15 AM

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Maybe a holdover from the sixties, I guess. To love someone for who they ARE is an anachronism, eh? Today we love someone for what they WILL be, or what they're CAPABLE of, ya?
Emotions are like Lego pieces in the scheme of life, to be applied to a work or not as it makes one comfortable.

Like Connor McCloud said in Highlander, "Love is for poets."

Please, tell me I'm wrong here....

The Sad Chrisisall

If you can't love someone the way they are, then you're in big trouble. Too many people look at their partners as 'fix-em-upperers' if you know that expression.

Having said that, don't know whether romantic love is unconditional. I think most people have things that they will not be able to tolerate about their partner. "No, I will not be able to love you now I have found out that child porn is your thang." None of us should expect that anything will be tolerated by our partners.

I feel differently about my child. I do feel that is unconditional - on my behalf, not from his. Different kind of love.

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Thursday, February 24, 2011 1:29 AM

CANTTAKESKY

What brought this on, Chris? You ok?

-------
"It is not my thorns that defend me. It is my perfume," says the rose. -- Paul Claudel

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Thursday, February 24, 2011 5:21 PM

BYTEMITE

I found a positive example. My cats seem to be able to recognize issues, cut through the bull, and demand petting, which I give to them.

EDIT: No, that's not positive, never mind.

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Thursday, February 24, 2011 5:40 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by canttakesky:
What brought this on, Chris? You ok?

I'll live, CTS, thanks for askin'.
20 years on and my marriage seems to be falling apart. Vows, what a bunch of crap. It's all about expectations & fantasy as far as I can tell.
Love is for poets, well-to-do ones I conjure.
My Son will feel it the most. I'm SO sad for him.

Chrisisall

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Thursday, February 24, 2011 5:49 PM

THEHAPPYTRADER

Oh gosh, I'm sorry to hear that. I wish I could offer more than prayers, positive thoughts and silly stories. I just hope you can all get through all this in the best manner possible.

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Thursday, February 24, 2011 5:59 PM

BYTEMITE

Sorry Chris. Try not to feel too bitter; people grow apart sometimes. Nothing bad or false about it, just happens.

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Thursday, February 24, 2011 6:01 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by TheHappyTrader:
Oh gosh, I'm sorry to hear that. I wish I could offer more than prayers, positive thoughts and silly stories. I just hope you can all get through all this in the best manner possible.

Thanks THT.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Thursday, February 24, 2011 6:33 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by Bytemite:
Sorry Chris. Try not to feel too bitter; people grow apart sometimes. Nothing bad or false about it, just happens.

Thanks Byte, it's just that I always had an idea that we had a 'soulmate'.
Feeling pretty stupid right about now.
Like when Chris Reeve died, then Dana Reeve died shortly thereafter... I cried, in part because I never felt that severe & pure a connection to anyone.

I love my Wife. Sadly, she needs more than love, money, acceptance, or anything else.

Chrisisall

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Thursday, February 24, 2011 7:39 PM

FREMDFIRMA

My advice, though I am loath to give it...

Let go.
Trying to force a relationship is like trying to hug a butterfly, all you'll do is crush something beautiful.

Remember, I have quite a few ex's, many of whom I spent a number of years with, and all but two of whom are also the very best of friends, why do you think that is ?

Because a marriage, that kind of relationship, may involve love, but isn't based on it so much as it is legal and religious structure - severing legal/religious/philosophical bonds doesn't mean severing your feelings, or theirs, and sometimes love, real love, means making the hard choice.

I love Dora, to this very day I do, very strongly, but I could NOT be part of her life without wrecking it because she is part of the alphabet soup crew, loves her job and believes in what she does, and I am a seditious anarchist with a penchant for dumping sand in the gears of the machine (and it was way more complex than that) - and so I walked away, because to be with her in that fashion would have destroyed everything ELSE she ever cared about.

Hell, I love my ex who still lives in my old township, to the point of using undue influence on the RCMP and Customs/Immigration folk to speed the emigration of her Canadian fiance, whom I approve of wholeheartedly and actually LIKE cause he makes her happier than I ever did.

And I love Wendy despite the fact that her affections in a certain way are forever doomed to be unrequited by me, so you have to think about, and ponder what love really *IS*, Chris.

Look at Alice, who earnestly loves and believes in what I do, what my purposes are, to the point of being willing to lay her very life down for them - but dislikes me, personally, very bitterly.

It's *easy* to love someone when they do what you want them to, not so much when their wants and needs are diametrically opposed to yours, and that goes beyond simple emotional maturity into true respect of a kind human beings too rarely offer each other - I am not just "playing along" with my ex and her new fiance, I *AM* truly happy for both of them, and consider them dear friends, althought admittedly being Poly that might be easier for me, but still the point remains.

Real love is caring what makes someone happy, even when that means not being with you, or doing something other than you would want them to.

As for the truest, most unconditional love I've ever known ?

Outlasted three girlfriends, mind you, two of whom are still jealous about it, one of whom insists that I love that cat like I never have a human, but only because she is an immature priss who's idea of love is entirely material.
(Of course that may also have to do with Kallista attacking her when she tried to provoke me into hitting her by flailing at me, long story, that.)

And why - because she does not judge me, she loves ME, not who she would want me to be, but who I am and have always been, and will be.
Few enough humans, ever manage that.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Thursday, February 24, 2011 8:00 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

In about 10% of marriages, when people marry they're happy and "in love" for the rest of their lives. Apparently the people who stay in love are those who admire in the other what the other admires in themselves... a mutual agreement on what is best in the other person!

But there are many ways towards love, hon. People change. The things that attracted you to a person may become less important over time because you have changed, or they have changed, or both. So it takes more than a "soulmate" feeling to keep people together over time. Sometimes just a dogged (and hopefully mutual!) commitment. Over time, you may discover new things about a person to love, and they discover new things about you.

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Thursday, February 24, 2011 10:48 PM

DREAMTROVE

Cat love is not unconditional, it has a food condition.

Depends on the age of the kid, and whether you plan on having more, and what kind of relationship you would have going forward.

My own parents I think would have fought until the end of time, like my grandparents. I know some couples who stayed together for the kids, which for some reason ipad wanted to change to "kidskin." do I want to know? Anyway, if you stay for the kids but continue to fight, its not going to be good for the kids. If not, they'll probably miss their dad or mom. Take some time maybe alone, and project that future world.

Also, consider the future possibly situation options. I think my dad is happy now, not as happy as Happy

but he wasn't for a long time.. If a new family awaits, thats a different matter than if a long lonely journey awaits.

Unconditional love exists, I find it scary. I mean, the mansion family girls had unconditional love to give. I've run into that kind, and I have definitely made the mistake from fleeing other unconditional love because I was afraid of that, when i think it wasn't. For some reason iPad, twice, changed "give" to Vivek. I don't even know what Vivek is.

Ive spent too much of my life running away. My general thoughts arel run towards something not away from something, but I wouldn't take advice from me.

Or Mel, as the ipad says. I would definitely paused before taking advice from Mel.

I usually find the Lego piece I'm looking for, but that doesn't always result in attachments with bumps. Some Legos have no bumps.

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Friday, February 25, 2011 12:07 AM

CANTTAKESKY

Chris,

I am so sorry. If anyone deserves the happiness of unconditional love, it's you.

I wish I had the right things to say, if only words could make you feel better. Well, maybe someone like HK could, but I don't have that kind of talent. Please just know you are in my thoughts and prayers, I am very concerned, and you have my support. I know this is trite, but if there is anything I can do....

I know it doesn't feel like it now, but kids are very resilient. My parents had a horrible marriage, to the point where I was relieved they broke up. I survived. Kids always want their parents together, but they'll bounce back. As long as THEY get unconditional love from at least one parent, they will be ok.

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Friday, February 25, 2011 1:35 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by canttakesky:
Kids always want their parents together, but they'll bounce back. As long as THEY get unconditional love from at least one parent, they will be ok.

Thanks CTS.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Friday, February 25, 2011 3:09 AM

PIZMOBEACH

... fully loaded, safety off...

You're a righteous dude Chris, hang in there.

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.com

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Friday, February 25, 2011 3:37 AM

DREAMTROVE

Happy, the subtext here is rapidly becoming the text.
Chris, maybe you should take happy's take:
Hey, honey, its time we start seeing other people, you know that hot redhead in the victoria's secret shop? I think we should start seeing her.

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Friday, February 25, 2011 5:41 AM

KANEMAN

Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
Happy, the subtext here is rapidly becoming the text.
Chris, maybe you should take happy's take:
Hey, honey, its time we start seeing other people, you know that hot redhead in the victoria's secret shop? I think we should start seeing her.

DT, that is funny shit. You sick puppy.

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Friday, February 25, 2011 6:44 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

I can't quite speak on love, which seems to be a form of insanity that comes over individuals. It may have an important survival purpose in that it can be used to overcome rational roadblocks that would otherwise prevent us from connecting with each other. I am in love, and I do not think that love will ever go away, even if things end badly.

I also think that in *healthy* individuals, all relationships are conditional. And I think that's a good thing.

You wouldn't want to persist in being in a relationship someone who was destroying your happiness or well-being. It is proper and healthy to say, "I love this person, but they are not for me," and to move on.

That is even proper for cats. "He is not feeding me, so while I love him, I need to escape and find food."

--Anthony

Assured by friends that the signal-to-noise ratio has improved on this forum, I have disabled web filtering.

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Friday, February 25, 2011 7:36 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Oh, now THAT kind of unconditional "love", erk!
Don't eeeven get me started on Yuriko!
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Yandere
*twitch*
She's the one who earnestly believes imma Kitsune-Kami, and it gets *more* complicated from there....

Oh, and you drastically underestimate Kallistas intelligence, for a critter with no thumbs she's amazingly resourceful - I wound up laid up in the hospital unexpectedly a while back, and by the time I got a caretaker to my place she had already opened the cabinet where the food was kept, dragged the bag over to her bowl, then proceeded to shove it open and paw the contents into her bowl (cause eating right from the bag is passe, oh she's such a priss) as well as manupulate the bathroom sink faucet (lever type handles) to supply herself with water.

I daresay she would figure out how to supply herself, especially with Puppy to boss around cause Puppy *is* capable of fetching live edibles, and even when it's just the two of em they got this brains-brawn dynamic going on anyway.

But then it's not like she *HAS* to rely on herself either, her primary trick is convincing humans or other cats to do her bidding, and golly gee, I wonder where she learned that....

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Saturday, February 26, 2011 1:37 PM

DREAMTROVE

I actually ace to backtrack to contradict myself:

My sister's cat stayed by her empty bed in an empty house for a week while she was in the hospital, awaiting her return. This is a sort of sacrificial behavior that I think of as being doglike, but I felt it needed adding in here. The cat knew very well where food could be had, but remained there until she came back.

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Saturday, February 26, 2011 6:01 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by canttakesky:
What brought this on, Chris? You ok?

I'll live, CTS, thanks for askin'.
20 years on and my marriage seems to be falling apart. Vows, what a bunch of crap. It's all about expectations & fantasy as far as I can tell.
Love is for poets, well-to-do ones I conjure.
My Son will feel it the most. I'm SO sad for him.

Chrisisall

Sorry to hear that Chris. That's a shitty place to be, no doubt about it. I hope you get through it soon, no matter which way the pendulum swings.

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Sunday, February 27, 2011 8:13 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht

Hi Chris, I'm sorry that things are going badly for you guys. I think Happy and CTS have good ideas, prayers and well wishing etc. trying to let you know they're there if you want someone to talk to etc. I don't rightly like the advice of some others here, I guess in life you have to take what will help you in your current situation and leave the other things or file them away for later. It sounds like this is a hard place for you to be. Its okay for you to feel frustrated, scared, upset, even angry, don't let others try to minimize how you're feeling. My advice would be, whatever you and your wife decide to do, make sure you are both there for your kid so he knows that you both love him and both are devoted to being good loving parents for him, no matter what happens between you two. I guess all we can do is our best, and pray, and trust and try. Do you think there is any hope of things turning around? Either way I wish you well and hope for the best.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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