REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

"Are Republicans at War with Reality?"

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Tuesday, August 16, 2011 16:08
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Friday, August 12, 2011 11:16 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Looks that way to me, from what I'm reading about the GOP debate...
Quote:

So here's what I learned watching Thursday night's Republican debate:

States' rights should rule the day, unless you're gay.

Small government is the rule unless a rapist impregnates his victim.

Loyalty oaths should be the new normal.

Ten-to-one spending cuts to tax increases is an ideologically unacceptable compromise.

And refusing to raise the debt ceiling is a stand for fiscal responsibility even if it were to trigger an immediate default.

The action onstage in Ames, Iowa, on Thursday night provided a portrait of a grand old party that seems increasingly at war with reality itself. Responsible governance and philosophic consistency were endangered species in this political arena.

Not that there weren't notable highlights among the low moments.

Mitt Romney appeared positively presidential next to the seven dwarfs who stood beside him. The consummate salesman bobbed and weaved to avoid answering any awkward questions directly, but in the end no one laid a glove on the de facto front-runner.

Jon Huntsman had a respectable, if subdued debut. He did not pander to the lowest common denominator. He did not flip or flop. And he rightfully criticized the pathetic attempts to recast the threat of debt-ceiling default into a badge of political courage and deficit reduction.

Michele Bachmann again proved that she is a talented debater, but her preferred tactic is simply to keep repeating baseless statements as if the rhythms of her words would provide the underlying logic. They don't.

Tim Pawlenty needed a breakout performance and a knockout punch. Instead, he got mired in a Minnesota-nice-defying back-and-forth with Bachmann that only made him seem small. And given that he had two months to practice his "Obamney-care" comeback against Romney for his Massachusetts health care program, Pawlenty's pushback fell flat. This was not the game changer "T-Paw" needed before Saturday's straw poll.

Newt Gingrich succeeded in at least briefly reminding people he was running for president, though he spent much of his time complaining about legitimate questions like why his entire senior staff fired their candidate. That isn't a process story -- it is a question of competence, judgment and substance. The most memorable policy pronouncement he made was to assert the need for a national loyalty oath. But seriously, he's not in favor of a suffocating big government nanny state.

Ron Paul again asserted himself as the most intellectually influential member of the modern GOP. Somewhere Robert A. Taft was smiling at the applause that neo-isolationism received from the heartland crowd. Auditing the Fed is also a new normal. Foreign policies defended by conservatives under George W. Bush now seem broadly controversial because they are carried out under Obama.

Rick Santorum's frustration at not being in the first tier of candidates remains clear, even as he rushes to defend the rights of gays against Islamists in Iran but would treat them as second-class citizens here in America. Likewise, a new anti-abortion standard was asserted, putting doctors in jail for performing abortions in addition to his opposition to abortion even in the case of rape and incest.

Near as I can tell, the federal marriage amendment is still the standard in the supposedly strict constructionist GOP, with the honorable exception of Huntsman, despite the fact that a majority of Americans now support freedom for gays to marry. Squaring this position with the oft-cited 10th Amendment states' rights fallback remains an impressive stretch -- and when Romney tried to bridge the logical gap, I couldn't help but thinking how state anti-miscegenation laws would have fared under this same analytic lens.

The lowest moment for responsible governance occurred when all the candidates on stage raised their hands to say that they would reject a 10-to-1 spending cut to tax hike split as a deal to reduce the deficit. That is a sign of a party that is being held intellectually captive by its most extreme activist elements, essentially forbidding the concept of constructive compromise that is at the heart of democracy, let alone divided government. Fiscal conservatism has been delinked from fiscal responsibility.

At a time when America needs a strong and vibrant center-right, that once-core Republican constituency was almost entirely unrepresented on the stage Thursday night. And not coincidentally, the two candidates closest to that zip-code -- Romney and Huntsman -- were the only ones who appeared even vaguely presidential.

If Bachmann wins the straw poll, which now seems likely, and wins the caucus, it will be a serious time for choosing within the Republican Party. The new entry of Rick Perry into the field only adjusts the timeline of that conflict slightly.

Watching the debate, it was tempting to say that President Barack Obama was the real winner because the Republican field is so weak. But with the manic recession continuing and confidence in all of Washington weakening, there is the chance that one of the people onstage Thursday night in Ames could be the next president of the United States.

It was a good debate to the extent that it was a spectacle with plenty of partisan conflict, canned applause lines and special-interest pandering. The problem is that such political circuses rarely produce statesmen. http://www.cnn.com/2011/OPINION/08/12/avlon.gop.debate/index.html

Sounds like it was fun, at least, for those watching...

But "brrrrr" regarding the underlined paragraph. I'm seriously beginning to fear for the future of our country.

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Friday, August 12, 2011 11:27 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



Nope.

The GOP is firmly planted in reality. The future is bright, should any one of these get elected to the White House , compared to the present.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Friday, August 12, 2011 11:48 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Yanno, I thought, for just a minute, I saw the spectre of ole tailgunner joe mccarthy hovering behind them, with a big shit eatin grin on his evil mug...

They are, collectively, THAT insane.

-F

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Friday, August 12, 2011 11:53 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



Far more sane than these complete nut cases...







" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Friday, August 12, 2011 2:16 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


I like the title inspite of myself, because sometimes I feel like declaring war on reality, but sometimes I'm really thankful for reality. I don't know where that puts me, or what it even has to do with this thread, but the title was thought provoking.

But yeah, we don't have any Repubs running that I think should actually win, which means, to my dismay, that Obama will probably win another term as president, even though most people think he's not doing all that well at it. Can anyone think of someone from the Repub party that they would actually like to see run? Someone not included in the debates already I mean. I might just write Malcolm Reynolds' name on the ballot, Mal For President, :)

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Friday, August 12, 2011 2:20 PM

TRAVELER


Loyalty oath. Do we need to give blood samples so everyone knows who belongs to the Master Race. Its not McCarthy smiling behind these creatures, but Adolf.


http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=28764731
Traveler

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Friday, August 12, 2011 2:30 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
The GOP is firmly planted in reality.



....if it was 1996!

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Friday, August 12, 2011 2:54 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Well, they've pretty much all already taken an oath of loyalty to Grover Norquist. They swore that particular oath before they swore their oath to protect the Constitution.

And they're only willing to live up to one of those oaths. I'll let you guess which one that is.

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Friday, August 12, 2011 9:46 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


I'll clarify: Some parts of reality I definitely feel like declaring war on, the parts that suck brick. But the good parts are the things I'm thankful for in the world.

Loyalty oaths sound rather Middle Ages to me, fun to read and play about but problematic in current times.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Saturday, August 13, 2011 12:11 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Originally posted by RionaEire:
I'll clarify: Some parts of reality I definitely feel like declaring war on, the parts that suck brick.



Excellent!

See, one of the things I firmly believe, is that when young people fail to buy the illusion and start calling us out on the parts of our world that "suck brick" (that's a good one, imma so steal it) that we should not call it a 'distorted worldview' and a mental illness needing medication or more severe... "treatment"...

But rather we should encourage and enable them to try to change it, stand behind them and support them instead of trying to crush them in the name of defending the indefensible - and should one ever, ever tell you it's "impossible"...
So too was what happened to wwasps, and for that matter, one of the things that warms my heart towards fellow browncoats is that getting our favorite crapped-on TV show on the big screen was "impossible" too - IMHO, there ain't no such animal.

"We've done the impossible, and that makes us mighty!"

So by all means, throw down the gauntlet, Riona, I'm all for it.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Tuesday, August 16, 2011 4:08 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


"suck brick" comes from one of my favorite movies growing up, I borrowed and altered it to fit my own uses, because when you say something sucks, that is too vague, but when you say something sucks brick, its way more substantive. Spread the love and use my expressions a chara, I'm happy to share them.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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