REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Scary Perry, and his scary buddies

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Tuesday, August 16, 2011 16:17
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Thursday, August 11, 2011 10:56 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


This came as a real shocker to me, especially given all the talk of Rick Perry entering the 2012 race:
Quote:

As Rick Perry tests the waters for a 2012 presidential campaign, he is aligning himself with influential evangelical leaders from the Christian Right and ratcheting up his religious rhetoric.

“I’m getting more and more comfortable every day that this is what I’ve been called to do,” Perry told the Des Moines Register this weekend. “This is what America needs.”

On August 6, Perry will preside over "The Response," an all-day Christian prayer and fasting rally at Houston's Reliant Stadium. The event is to call on God to guide the United States out of its moral, financial and political morass.

"Right now, America is in crisis: we have been besieged by financial debt, terrorism, and a multitude of natural disasters," Perry says in his message on the event website. "As a nation, we must come together and call upon Jesus to guide us through unprecedented struggles."

Perry’s advisers say that the idea for The Response predates any thoughts of a White House bid. But it has deepened the Governor's relationship with a rapidly expanding national network of fundamentalist evangelicals that could provide invaluable support to his presidential campaign.

These new evangelicals are part of the New Apostolic Reformation, an increasingly influential American Christian movement whose leaders consider themselves modern-day prophets and apostles. Many of the organizers for The Response are New Apostles, and the event's official endorser list reads like a roster of virtually everyone important to the movement.

In a article for The Texas Observer, reporter Forest Wilder notes that the New Apostolic Reformation has been quietly expanding on the fringes of Christian fundamentalism since the 1990s. The New Apostles' beliefs — which focus on Christian dominion and End Times — are extreme, even for other conservative Christians.

As mainstream evangelical influence wanes, however, the New Apostolic Reformation is gaining broader acceptance among conservative Christians. The Response, whose endorsers also include more mainstream fundamentalists, is evidence of the New Apostles' emerging influence — and of its leaders growing appetite for political power. http://www.businessinsider.com/rick-perry-the-evangelicals-behind-the-
response-2011-7-21
what you need to know about the fastest-growing religious movement you've never heard of:
Quote:

New Apostles consider themselves modern-day prophets blessed with the same prophetic gifts and direct link to God as their biblical counterparts.

C. Peter Wagner, the godfather of the New Apostolic Reformation and an endorser of the The Response, claims that the 21st century is the beginning of a Second Apostolic Age in which God calls upon modern-day apostles to prepare the world for End Times. These so-called "generals in the army of god" are responsible for the cleansing and salvation of nations and communities, as well as of people.

The core leadership of the New Apostolic Reformation, the Apostolic Council of Prophetic Elders, meets every year to establish the “prophetic word.” This year’s Word of the Lord warns Americans of impending terrorist attacks. Interestingly, it also predicts youth uprisings in Syria, Egypt and Saudi Arabia.

The Apostles believe that failure to heed God's will — as they have prophesied it — has catastrophic consequences.

For example, Cindy Jacobs, a prominent leader of the New Apostolic Reformation, gained national media attention earlier this year when she said that birds were dying in Arkansas because of the repeal of "Don't Ask, Don't Tell."

Apostle Jacobs claims to have predicted the earthquake and tsunami in Japan, which she blames on Shintoism and the Emperor's pagan "sexual intercourse" with the Sun Goddess. She also claims to have foreseen the Arab Spring and says that God will use the uprisings to "shake up Israel" so Jewish people turn to Jesus.

On the flip side, the New Apostles believe their "prophetic directives" can have supernatural effects. According to Wagner, he decreed in 2001 that mad cow disease would end in Europe. Incidentally, the last case of mad cow was reported the day before.

The main divergence between the New Apostolic Reformation and other Christian fundamentalist sects is their differing views of how End Times will go down.

New Apostles reject the traditional fundamentalist belief that born-again believers will be lifted up in the Rapture.

Instead, New Apostles believe that there will be seven years of battle and calamity before the Second Coming of Christ. During those Final Days, a new generation of believers will emerge to "execute God's judgment" and cleanse the world of demons. According to this belief, the faithful must reestablish Christian control over the world — including its social institutions — before Christ can come back.

The New Apostolic Reformation sees the Book of Joel — three relatively obscure chapters from the Hebrew Bible — as an instruction manual for how to prepare for End Times.

In the Book, the prophet Joel sees a locust plague as a sign of the apocalypse and calls for national repentance. In response to the national prayer, God promises salvation and bestows the gift of prophesy on the faithful.

Prominent NAR pastor Mike Bickle, who teaches a 12-part course on the Book of Joel, writes that the Book "was meant in the mind of God to be a prophetic book to equip end-of-the-age forerunners [Apostles] to prepare the people of God" for the "wide scale of greatness and terribleness" they will experience before the Second Coming.

According to Perry, the Book of Joel is the inspiration for The Response: “With the economy in trouble, communities in crisis and people adrift in a sea of moral relativism, we need God's help,” Perry says in a video message on event website. “That's why I'm calling on Americans to pray and fast like Jesus did and as God called the Israelites to do in the Book of Joel.”

To achieve their goal of Christian dominion over the world, leaders of the New Apostolic Reformation are training a new generation of so-called "super-believers" to cleanse the world before the Second Coming.

This new breed of Christians — known as "Joel's Army" in the early days of the NAR movement — is now commonly referred to as the "Elijah Generation," or the "Elijah Revolution." NAR leaders refer to this youth movement in strikingly militant terms, referring to international missions as "military bases" and local churches as "armories."

The Elijah Generation theology is primarily directed at people in their teens and 20s — specifically anyone born after the 1973 Roe v. Wade decision — through marathon prayer revivals like TheCall and The International House of Prayer (IHOP), two Kansas City-based NAR groups actively involved in The Response.

"There's an Elijah generation that's going to be the forerunners for the coming of Jesus, a generation marked not by their niceness but by the intensity of their passion," TheCall founder Lou Engle said in 2010. "The kingdom of heaven suffers violence and the violent take it by force. Such force demands an equal response, and Jesus is going to make war on everything that hinders love, with his eyes blazing fire." More at http://www.businessinsider.com/rick-perry-the-evangelicals-behind-the-
response-2011-7-21#one-new-apostle-leader-thinks-oprah-is-a-sign-of-the-antichrist-6

That's if you can take more. There's lots, like they consider Oprah a sign of the Antichrist; they plan to cleanse society for End Times by using "spiritual warfare," to fight "social scourges,” which includes Mormonism, Catholic saint worship, homosexuality, witchcraft, and much in between; they MAP neighborhoods to locate "demons"; call for a Christian takeover of government; believe that God will transfer wealth to the faithful from the "ungodly"; and on and on and on. Pretty scary stuff to even IMAGINE a President believing!

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Thursday, August 11, 2011 12:44 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


Oprah? Sun goddess sex? uh ... ?
That does sound pretty extreme. That's even too extreme for me.

An interesting aside: Not all Christians believe we will get raptured before things get bad. Some believe it will happen in the middle of the seven years, some aren't sure when it will happen, I'm one of those. It isn't made clear, there's evidence for all those viewpoints, I think the point is that we're not supposed to know and that's fine with me.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Thursday, August 11, 2011 1:40 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


There's lots of things people don't know about Rick Perry, but should.

He ran Al Gore's presidential campaign in Texas. Seriously.

When he and Dubya hung out together in Texas, people called Bush "the smart one"!

His college grades actually bear that out, too.

There have been rumors floating around for as long as he's held elected office that Rick Perry is gay, and is on the downlow.

Rick Perry lives it up in a rented mansion that he bills the taxpayers more than $10,000 per month for, while complaining that Texas can't afford teachers. Or schools.

His "Trans-Texas Corridor" idea was a colossal failure, in which he wanted to use his "smaller government" to seize land all across the state, from the east to the west, from the north to the south, in order to build toll roads that would be run by foreign corporations and subsidized by taxpayers. He calls this "conservativism in action".

He also mandated that all school-age girls would, by law, be vaccinated with a risky vaccine that has killed dozens so far.

He ordered the execution of at least one innocent man, and when his own investigation proved that to be the case, he fired the entire panel and installed his own paid cronies to overturn their findings.

He had employees of the Texas Alcoholic Beverage Commission shaking down bar owners for "campaign donations" while they were supposed to be doing their job.

And there's so much more you don't know about Rick Perry, but should.

As the late, great Molly Ivins said, "The next time I tell you someone from Texas should not be president of the United States, please pay attention."

She sums up Rick Perry excellently.

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

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Thursday, August 11, 2011 2:15 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Ran the Gore campaign.

Thought highly of G.W. Bush.

Wanted to mandate the inoculation of young women for specious and monetary gains.

Is a Texas Aggie ..

Not seeing much upside to this guy.

Puts him behind Cain, Bachmann, Romney, Gingrich and Pawlenty in my list.

That the dead Molly Ivins spoke ill of Perry, might be his greatest asset.



" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Thursday, August 11, 2011 3:20 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Along the lines of The Onion's article ( http://www.theonion.com/articles/god-urges-rick-perry-not-to-run-for-p
resident,20981
/ ), I present The Borowitz Report's take on it:

http://www.borowitzreport.com/2011/06/20/rick-perrys-campaign-slogan-w
hat-harm-could-a-governor-of-texas-do
/






"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

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Thursday, August 11, 2011 3:29 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Riona: "there's evidence for all those viewpoints"...huh? I don't know of any "evidence" for end times...interpretation, certainly; belief, undoubtedly; prophecies, unquestionably; but no "evidence". If you want to put it that way, there's "evidence" the world will end in 2012 according to the Mayans...and many, many more things. IF you want to look at it that way. I don't, thank you.


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



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Thursday, August 11, 2011 4:26 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Of course, Rick Perry announcing his run, and Sarah Palin jump-starting her "Look at ME, America!" tour again kind of does lend some credence to the idea that the world will end in 2012...

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Friday, August 12, 2011 10:58 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


I'm afraid you might be right, Mike, and so is someone else:
Quote:

As a resident of Texas for 36 years, I keep wondering why the rest of the nation pays any attention to our political and cultural absurdities and yet still chooses Texans as presidents. Our most revered historical moment, the Alamo, was arguably a mass suicide. The slaughter in San Antonio was followed by a massacre at Goliad, the fall of the Confederacy to Union forces, and later by the Houston Astros. Texas has a legacy of losing.

None of this apparently matters, though, because America is beginning the process of electing another Texan to be president. Gigantic tax breaks for the wealthy and corporations, a trumped up war and a ruined economy from the last Texan seem incapable of dissuading supporters of Rick Perry.

His Saturday speech in South Carolina will make clear that he is entering the race for the White House and will spawn the ugliest and most expensive presidential race in U.S. history, and he will win. A C and D student, who hates to govern, loves to campaign, and barely has a sixth grader's understanding of economics, will lead our nation into oblivion.

But I'm getting ahead of myself.

The big brains gathered east of the Hudson and Potomac Rivers believe that Mitt Romney is the candidate to beat. But they are unable to hear what Rick Perry is saying. The Christian prayer rally in Houston was a very loud proclamation to fundamentalists and Teavangelicals, which said, "I am not a Mormon." The far right and Christian fundamentalists have an inordinate amount of influence in the GOP primary process and, regardless of messages of inclusion, very few of them will vote for a Mormon.

"We think a them Mormons as bein' in kind of a cult," one of the Houston rally attendees told me. "I couldn't vote for one a them when we got a real Christian like Governor Perry runnin'."

Perry, of course, can't come right out and print bumper stickers that say, "Rick Perry -- 2012 -- Not a Mormon." But he doesn't have to. He's wearing his faith like a power tie while Romney stays quiet as a tabernacle mouse on the topic of religion. Romney has business experience and intellect that are not on Perry's resume' but he is from "Massatoositts," (Webster's Texas Edition, see also "Massachusetts"), and Texans love to kick their political boots into New Englanders' squishy parts. Perry is about to remind the tea partiers and fundamentalists that Romney created a state health care plan, (the horror, affordable health care for everyone), believes global warming is real, and has a troubling history for conservatives on the matters of abortion and gay marriage.

So much for Mitt.

Michele Bachmann, who is from Iowa, and is Perry in Prada, has the same appeal among Teavangelicals. Her husband's reparative gay therapy sessions, the Newsweek cover and a few speeches that were not reality based will, eventually, make even the GOP primary voters realize she is bound for the desert and not the Promised Land.

Bachman will run close to Perry in Iowa but will disappear into the snows of New Hampshire where religious fervor isn't exactly considered a positive attribute. In South Carolina, Perry's money, image and support will become overwhelming.

Romney and Bachmann are the only serious impediments to the Perry nomination. Ron Paul, who makes more sense than any crazy person to ever run for public office, has never been able to expand his cult to the mainstream.

Herman Cain is too brutally honest and lacking political experience, and Tim Pawlenty, what's-his-face-from-Minnesota, suffers from the heartbreak of ineffectuality.

Fueled only by speculation that he might announce, Perry became the putative front-runner (heard that word at a fancy Washington restaurant and thought it was cool). Because presidential politics tend to be more visceral than intellectual, Perry's coyote-killer good looks, $2,000 hand-tooled cowboy boots, supernova smile and Armani suits, combined with podium skills to embellish the mythology of Texas, all will create a product Americans will want to believe and buy.

After he wins the nomination, protocol will require Perry to have discussions with Bachmann about the vice presidential slot, but he will, eventually, turn to Sarah Palin. The general election will force the Texan back toward the middle and he will stop talking about faith and abortion and gay marriage; Perry will campaign on jobs and the economy.

Palin, who is loved by the tea party as much as Perry, will keep the Teavangelicals animated while he tries to talk to the adults to win the election on a single issue: the economy, stupiderest!!! (Forget about Rudy Giuliani; the GOP cannot win New York, don't need it to take the election and Giuliani is wrong on gay marriage for this ticket).

The general election will, quite literally, decide the fate of a nation. Every time Team Obama criticizes the Texas economy for its minimum wage job boom, the president will be accused of attacking the working men and women of America. (Texas has created a large share of the new jobs in the United States in the last decade but studies indicate many of them are at places like Wal-Mart and Carl's Jr.)

President Obama will also get beaten up for presiding over the first bond rating downgrade in U.S. history as well as high unemployment. When the cold rains fall in early November next year, unemployed voters in places like Ohio will step into the booth and dream of a minimum wage job in the Texas sun selling fishing rods at big box sporting goods stores or working in call centers; they will vote against Barack Obama.

And in the process, they will write the epitaph to set upon the tombstone of history's greatest democracy: Perry-Palin, 2012. http://www.cnn.com/2011/OPINION/08/11/moore.perry.candidate/index.html
?hpt=hp_t1

Now THAT's even scarier!


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



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Friday, August 12, 2011 2:51 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


Niki, I just meant that the Bible isn't clear about those things, its rather vague, don't let single words liek "evidence" rile you, you seem a bit riled. I just mean that CHristians can't come to a concensus on it so anyone being sold on a particular time for any of it is silly in my opinion.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Saturday, August 13, 2011 8:19 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


I think you're reading something that isn't there, Riona; I wasn't at all "riled", merely disbelieving.


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



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Tuesday, August 16, 2011 4:17 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


I know you don't believe it, and you know that I do, so there's nothing new here. I do think these people you speak of sound very weird though and seem cultesque to me, if one man in the group gets too much power then things will get even weirder, like Waco, these guys seem like they could end up like that if things shift a bit.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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