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There is a strong belief that Democrats are the party of big government and the Republicans the party of big business. Seven-out-of-10 believe big government and big business work together against the rest of us. So it's no surprise that 53% believe that neither Republican nor Democratic leaders have an understanding of what the country needs today.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
NIKI - There is only one reason for vote for Obama, and that is to keep the selection of another Supreme Court judge out of Romney's hands. Personally, I don't care. The things that need to be done so outweigh the Supreme Court that if we actually DO get to start righting the wrongs, the Supreme Court won't be able to stand in the way.
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WHOZIT-
Who is the "dark side"? Ron Paul? Not on the ticket come election time. No, I intend to vote for the Green Party. I figure it I'm going to "waste my vote" by sitting out, I may as well "waste my vote" affirmatively.

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I'll let you play with my double sided Light Saber.

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BUT! If you vote for Mitt and join us on the "Dark Side" I'll let you play with my double sided Light Saber.

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all they're interested in doing is staying in power and lining their pockets.

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Hello, I have noticed that political groups (or indeed almost any group, even charities) tend to operate like animals. They quickly place their ideals on a back-burner and move things like survival and reproduction to the front. And then you can no longer count on them to serve those ideals.--Anthony

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
PZIMO, I guess I'm waiting for a more robust defense of Obama.

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And my hubby is pissed off at Obama because he ripped up the Constitution and used it as toilet paper.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
The people who voted for Obama four years ago didn't believed that "business" would solve our problems. Four years ago they had the hope the government COULD do something effective. Now they believe that government CAN'T. The paradigm of a government "of, by and for the people" has been killed. And Obama killed it. People who care about the nation are so demoralized by Obama that they will Occupy, but they no longer involve themselves in politics. An important avenue of change has been abandoned. That is the Obama legacy.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
PIZMO, there are a number of policy calls where Obama has faced intransigent and (in my view) unjustified opposition. Maybe he could have handled opposition better, maybe not. But who twisted his arm into pushing for (yet more) free trade agreements? Who MADE him "surge" more troops into Afghanistan and get involved in Libya? Two years ago, Obama spoke about indefinite preventive detention. I HEARD HIM. He just signed it into law two months ago.

What Obama does when no one is looking counts. He does just enough to pacify his base, but not so much to piss off Wall Street and the military. That's not enough to solve the problems that need to get solved.

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Originally posted by pizmobeach:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
PIZMO, there are a number of policy calls where Obama has faced intransigent and (in my view) unjustified opposition. Maybe he could have handled opposition better, maybe not. But who twisted his arm into pushing for (yet more) free trade agreements? Who MADE him "surge" more troops into Afghanistan and get involved in Libya? Two years ago, Obama spoke about indefinite preventive detention. I HEARD HIM. He just signed it into law two months ago.

What Obama does when no one is looking counts. He does just enough to pacify his base, but not so much to piss off Wall Street and the military. That's not enough to solve the problems that need to get solved.

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Deals? Fear of being an irrelevant President? Do you really know what the backroom dealings were? The system is not in favor of a single person making the kinds of changes you want. I know on a very simple level I have made the same kind of assumptions about things only to find myself later in that very position, And I was Wrong. Totally. Missed it by a mile. So I'm just not going to presume. And you simply cannot feel good about Romney, or no vote, or Paul.
Besides - I'm sorry to say that it is unlkely that any of these options will get you what you deserve for your family.

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.com

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Originally posted by RionaEire:
Signe and Whozit have convinced me not to just write in a name in the Nov. election, which was my plan, writing in Firefly charactors and my pretends charactors is what I do sometimes if I don't know who to choose, but they make a good point about how if I choose someone actually on the ballot as a third party candidate I'm sending more of a message, even if I don't actually _want that particular candidate to be chosen, at least it shows that we're tired of the status quo.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
If you can point to something significant that Obama has done for you, then by all means vote for him. AT least you're voting your interests and not some silly campaign event.

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Originally posted by FREMDFIRMA:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
If you can point to something significant that Obama has done for you, then by all means vote for him. AT least you're voting your interests and not some silly campaign event.

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I *AM* voting my interests, I have decided interest in not letting a bunch of fucking armageddon begging religiousity spouting nutcases anywhere near public offices or big red buttons - the situation is bad enough as it is without some infantile temper tantrum over not getting their own way 100% of the time causing them to start WWIII.

-Frem

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
6IX, as I see it both you and PIZMO are heading in more-or-less the same direction as I am. Maybe I'm mis-characterizing either or both of your positions but it seems to me that neither of you think that corporations are "the answer". If your enemy is my enemy, then we are fellow-travelers. What divides the two of you is that you dismiss "any" government as being beneficial, while Pizmo thinks "this" government might be helpful. I guess I'm sort of in the middle... I think "a" government can be helpful. Certainly not this current crop of politicians and probably not this kind of government tho.

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I will ALWAYS dismiss any government as being helpful, but that's only because since Reagan, no government has been helpful. As far as CORPS.. when have they EVER been helpful?

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I know that statement might be a hard pill for many to swallow, but while people were paying 20% on their mortgage rates in the early 80's Reagan years, I was getting 13% on my CD savings as a kid. (Today, I get 1%)

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The Reagan years were undoubtedly tough on a lot of people at the time, as were the Carter years before him, but at least they stood for something. We had nearly 20 years afterward that we could travel for dirt cheap and buy whatever we wanted anywhere for almost nothing.

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My parents had a 15% mortgage on their house they bought in 1982. 15%!!!!!!!!!! The only difference back than was that my old man, even though he was an Army vet, didn't have a Bachelors degree and he could make it work.... If rates ever got up to 15% today, even my union friends underwater on their mortgages would be struggling.. That's because MOST of the taxes we ALL pay today are just paying previous debts off....

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And it gets worse every single year....

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Not to brag needlessly

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or to say anything that Kwicko won't take a split-second in pointing out that I'm bringing up agian.... But THIS IS MY HOUSE.

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I pay my bills, and I begrudgingly pay my property taxes, for now... while I deem them fair.....If you want more, Big Government, I welcome you to knock on my door.

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And taking a jump from Byte's thread, I'm the guy you want to have on your side in those matters.

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I have nearly NOTHING to lose.

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If you're a friend of mine and you're being man-handled by our overbearing government, I've got your back.

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Go pick on somebody way smaller than you with no friends Big G.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
6IX, ya lost me as a fellow-traveler because you're too confused. You begin with

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I will ALWAYS dismiss any government as being helpful, but that's only because since Reagan, no government has been helpful. As far as CORPS.. when have they EVER been helpful?

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And the rest of your post is one long uninformed gripe about gubmint. Son, if you really think that corps are no help at all, why haven't you been griping about banks and offshoring jobs and invasion of privacy/ digital restrictions management with equal passion? Could it be because you really like corporations?


So, piece by piece, let me show you where you are wrong:
And this helps you... how?

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13% interest would really help me since I still have money in the bank. Right now, I get less than 1% on my money.

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That second sentence is a complete non-sequitor to the first. WHAT was that "something" they stood for? Dirt cheap travel and cheap stuff?

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No... These are just benefits I mentioned for your average American, or at least those of us who would ever bother spending money traveling. You know me Signy, I'm a minimalist. I had nothing to gain from those aspects of a VERY strong US dollar in the World currency.

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Bull. That's because MOST of the work suitable for uneducated workers has been OFFSHORED. Once upon a time, when we had the only operating factories in the free world, anyone could get a job sweeping the factory floor and move up to supervisor. But thanks the INTERNATIONAL CAPITAL, if you want THAT kind of job today you have to move to China, where the average factory-floor worker is 19 and the average manager is 22. Say, how do you feel about working for Foxconn?

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I'll agree with you about the outsourcing. In the 70's we had a lot of out of work dads when jobs went to Mexico, and that was back when usually only dad was working. This very second, the job I used to work, without a college degree, making nearly 55k a year is now being outsourced to somebody making less than 10k a year. At the same time, it costs him under 50 cents for a pack of smokes.....

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Of course. You might have noticed the riots and demonstrations in Tunisia, Egypt, most of Europe, and Canada?

EGYPT

GREECE

LONDON

SPAIN

MONTREAL CANADA

They're all protesting lack of JOBS. And that, my friend, is in the hands of international business.

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How long do you think it will be before that is a reality here? Who makes up a majority of the "Occupy" movement, when you eliminate college stoner beat-offs?

I'm definitely more capable in ANY aspect than 80% of the people state-side, yet I find myself in the 20% of unemployed or under employed now.

Maybe I should change my tactics for finding a job here. Let them know how every month that goes by makes me even more a suitable candidate for T.K. 2.0., sans any argued Frem arguments against his claims that it was a conspiracy.

After all the home improvement and yard work I've done, and the over 6k of purchases put on my Lowes credit card doing the work, they've got the F-ing Nerve to write me back an email saying that I'm not qualified to work there????

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Yanno what? We own OUR house too, free and clear. And it's worth about $650,000, even in this market. So whatever you think you got going on your favor, rest assured there are those who will best you.

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Wow. That's really great Signy. Good thing we had a mild winter. It probably still cost thousands to heat it this winter, huh?

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I'm sure they will.

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And I'll be waiting for them, 10 gallon hat on my head and six-shooter in my hand....

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Why? You'd be pointing your gun in the wrong direction half the time. An idiot with a gun is still an idiot.

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Haha... idiot. I don't care how good you're doing with your husband. I know that you and/or him have higher education and many years below your belt over me. I may not have a 650k plus house, but I can guaranty that I'm the only 32 year old who owns his house free and clear unless their rich parents bought it for them or they are Mark Zuckerburg....

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Except your house...

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I'm not even worried about that, seeing as how government benefits today will make sure that anyone with a 50 IQ can keep their house even in the worst situation. I simply have too much money left to take benefits since I'm a single male with no kids.... At the same time, my credit rating is 795 even though I haven't held a real job for over 2 years, and I have access to over 100k in credit.

Bankruptcy doesn't erase government debt, student loans or hospital bills, which I have none of...

Worst case scenario, if nobody gives me a job......?

I'm good

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Will you have my back if I'm being improperly foreclosed on? Will you have my back if the terms of my business loan suddenly become unbearable? Will you have my back when my daughter needs medical insurance but can't buy it? Or if my company runs off with my pension? Or ransacks my house looking for copyrighted material?

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First, Define "improperly" foreclosed on. If your paying your mortgage on time and you get foreclosed on, I'll definitatly join your fight. If your daughter is over 18, there's nothing I can do for her. I've been without health insurance for the majority of the last 14 years, and I drink and smoke about twice what anyone you know does. Good luck to her.

As far as ransacking your house for copyrighted material though, you've found your guy.... If you were my neighbor and I saw some black ops perusing your computers in the middle of the night with masks I'd shoot first. I'm usually up at 3AM to water my lawn I'm trying to grow. If some black ops thug crawled into my next-door neighbors window, I'd do everything I could to put them down.

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A dog, barking at cat. That's all you are.

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Sigh....

In the end, I'm glad you posted again here.

Of the people I remembered when I used to post, you're one of the few who were around back then.

In the end, our opinions don't matter, though it's cool that we're free to speak them, for now, in this country.

Right or Left.... doesn't matter.....

All of the things I absolutely hated about Bush Jr. were carried through with gusto behind the media drama.....

And I'm sure when Romney is our new President, all the things that I hated about Bush Jr. will speak to me.

The only difference is that since Obama did absolutely nothing in 4 years to repeal some established Executive powers during "war time", Romney will only be able to take those and make them stronger. The least Obama could have done was give the Constitution back to us before another Rethug was in office....

Good luck to you and yours S....

Proud to know you as an argumentative soldier as we all take the ride down the rabbit hole....

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I haven't been griping about banks though, only because it's the rules and restrictions on banks that made them lend money to people who could never afford it for "EOE" purposes that largely got us all into this mess in the first place.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

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I haven't been griping about banks though, only because it's the rules and restrictions on banks that made them lend money to people who could never afford it for "EOE" purposes that largely got us all into this mess in the first place.

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Complete and utter bullshit. If that were the case, how do you explain the financial meltdown in the EU, which had no such laws???

Oh, yeah, that's right- you don't. I sure wish you would do at least a LITTLE investigation and thinking before you bought the line of crap they're feeding you.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
6IX, I've already have posted many times on the topic, so I'm not sure what information you're lacking. Tell me.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
6IX, Greece is the exception to the rule.

First of all, let me make sure I understand what you're saying, because there really is no equivalent of Fanny or Freddie in the EU and therefore not any possible mechanism by which the banks could be "forced" to make loans to unqualified borrowers.

So you seem to be expanding your argument beyond the original idea that the banks were "forced" to make improvident loans, and kind of slide it over to the idea that it was the governments themselves which borrowed money to spend on impoverished people. In other words, a different argument than national governments twisting banks' arms into making bad loans, and more like the argument that the governments were just spending too much money on social programs. Am I correct? Before I provide you with data, I want to make sure that I'm answering your point.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Well, fiat currency is fiat currency, but that wasn't your original point. And BTW, all of the EU nations had "fiat currency" BEFORE the EU, so I fail to see how anything changed... at least, according to your contention.

So now you've made three arguments. Which one am I to address?

(1) The one that claims that the entire world's financial meltdown was caused by the US government forcing banks to make bad loans? I think TONY has already addressed that point rather thoroughly, especially from his view inside a mortgage-writing bank.

(2) The one that claims that it was bad loans/ too much social spending in the EU which led to their downfall?

(3) Or the one that claims it's all about fiat currency?

Because they can't all be true at the same time. So pick one as your argument of choice and admit the others are so much go se. Or tie them all together and tell me which is your essential point.




EDITED TO ADD:

BTW... I would like to add that in a country and/or world that was doing "good" there would be no reasons to do any "edited to adds"....

Played, Played, Played.....

Everyone is.....

2 "sides" of the same coin....

The more you struggle, the more you give in....

Good luck to you...

Just know that if things dont change they'll have no problems reprogramming your kids with at-home 3D TV in 3 years from now with Disney guys and gals who will be able to convey the "new norm" to them in 3-D HD in a maner we couldn't even comprehend at that age.

Don't worry, concerned Moms... soon you'll love Justin Beiber too...

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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Show me proof of that Signy.....

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May 23, 2015

Dear Banker,

Thank you for your cooperation in our most recent series of bank stress tests. We had hoped that these would not be required, but following the credit crises of 2007-08 and the more recent banking crises of 2014, the FDIC simply had no choice. The results of these tests are in, and they are unfortunately much worse than we had hoped for. The recent losses of billions of dollars in trading has made it apparent that nearly every major depository bank is in far worse financial condition than previously believed. The majority of top 20 banks never fully recovered from the earlier crisis, and have insufficient capital to withstand any further pressure. This is especially a concern if the economy takes another turn for the worse, or if Housing begins its third leg down.

Capital reserves are insufficient to support the trillions in deposits of yours that we guarantee. Ever since leveraged speculation has become the primary business of these banks, we have grave concerns about the promises you have made to your depositors.... the Federal Deposit Insurance Capital Reserves have fallen to perilously low levels... We cannot sit idly by while this becomes exhausted due to your speculations, thus putting taxpayers monies at great risk. Nor can we assume unlimited liability in guaranteeing deposits at firms that were once depository banks but now have morphed into giant derivative trading casinos with potential liabilities measured in the trillions of dollars.

Therefore, as chairman of the FDIC, with the full support of my Board of Governors, we have decided upon the following changes:

1. Effectively immediately, we have increased the FDIC deposit insurance for any US bank that engages in ANY trading of derivatives or underwriting securities or other investment banking activities by threefold. This 3X fee increase goes into effect immediately. It applies regardless whether these trades are hedges for proprietary trades or are made on behalf of clients.

2. Effective in 90 days, we are LOWERING the insured maximum insured deposit liability to $100,000 per account for derivative trading firms. Effective in 180 days, the insured maximum insured deposit liability drops to $50,000 per account.

3. Effective in 1 year from today, on May 23, 2016, we will no longer offer deposit insurance for any firm that engages in derivative trading, underwriting securities or engages in Investment banking.

4. Any bank with fewer than 10,000 depositors or less than $5 billion in assets may apply for a discretionary waiver of these rules.

It is not our position to tell you what sort of non depository banking activities you may engage in. Those are business choices you and your firm are free to make. However, it is also our position not to engage in foolish insurance underwriting. We have elected to be more conservative in ourrisk management and assumptions, and therefore cannot guarantee the kinds of risks that your firms have been undertaking.

This action should delight many of you. In the recent speeches of several bank CEOs, many of you have longed for a return to the days of less regulation and a truer free market. Once you no longer qualify for our insurance due to your other businesses, you will be freed up from all of the onerous bank reviews and regulations that are part and parcel of FDIC insurance.

As a bonus, without the intervention of government guarantees, those of you who continue to have depositors will finally be able to compete in a free and open market. Without FDIC insurance, your depositors will be making their decisions based on your reputation, and their assessment of the safety and security of your operations — and not Uncle Sam’s willingness to continually bail you out.

You have the FDIC’s best wishes for success in the future — just not our insurance.

If you have any further questions, feel free to contact my office.
Thomas Hoenig

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