South Dakota to allow armed teachers in schools by AgentRouka

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

South Dakota to allow armed teachers in schools

POSTED BY: AGENTROUKA
UPDATED: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 11:03
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Friday, March 8, 2013 11:25 PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-21722377

Quote:

The US state of South Dakota has enacted a law allowing school districts to arm teachers and other school staff.

The law's backers say it will prevent mass school shootings like a December massacre in Connecticut that killed 26.

Amid a push by the White House to strengthen gun laws, the bill reflects a growing divide in the US over whether more or fewer guns keep people safe.

The measure does not force school districts to arm teachers and will not require teachers to carry guns.

But it allows each school district to choose if staff could be armed. It takes effect in July.

Under the Republican-sponsored bill, school staff given permission to carry firearms on campus will be known as "school sentinels". The state has given a law enforcement commission the task of establishing a training programme for the sentinels.

Several representatives of school boards, teachers and other staff spoke against the bill in legislative hearings, arguing guns would make schools more dangerous.

But sponsor Representative Scott Craig said this week had heard from a number of school officials who back it.

Mr Craig said rural districts do not have the money to hire full-time police officers.

Oh dear.

I can think of a number of things that might go wrong here.

Guns taken into schools. Wonder how long until neglect in safe storage leads to unpleasant incidences.
Civilian teachers with no real experience in fighting violent crime and minimal training are supposed to intervene in a highly volatile, generally super-fast attack? Effectively? And safely for the other kids? Collateral damage, anyone?
They are supposed to potentially shoot a student they might have taught all through that kid's life? Without hesitation? That's a LOT to ask of a teacher.
Lawsuits if they fail to protect kids. Lawsuits if they do fatally shoot an attacker who happens to be a kid. Lawsuits of endangerment regarding whatever conduct they display.
What if a teacher misjudges a situation? Or is a prejudice-laden bigot? Or just goes nuts himself?
Teachers where school boards approve might be pressured to wear guns in spite of their personal preference.

It just... seems to have more potential downsides and a dubious potential upside. Too many things that are likely to introduce more danger and no real guarantee that this would be an effective protection in an actual incident.

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Saturday, March 9, 2013 4:25 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

I'm on the fence about this issue....

On one hand, I long for the days when I started high school and we didn't even have any security guards. By senior year, there were three rent-a-cops roaming the halls, though they were still unarmed. I hear that my high school now has armed guards and metal detectors at the doors. It's really sad that a good neighborhood like I grew up in has gone that way in this post-Columbine world we live in.

On the other hand, the major shootings we've read about in the news all seem to happen in places and/or cities where guns are banned. As we know, D.C. and Chicago have some of the highest rates of gun related fatalities while guns are banned.

Personally, I do think that there should be places where guns aren't allowed. Bars are a no brainer, as are strip-clubs, restaurants and any place that serves alcohol. I agree with airplanes as well. Many other places generally agreed upon, I'm not so sure about.

Hear me out before you just call me a crazy gun-nut.....

College campuses are my biggest gripe now.

Sure, when I tried on four separate occasions to get a degree, I didn't really think much about anybody having a gun on campus, but that was more than a baker's dozen of major shootings ago.

The problem with college campus gun bans is that there is ZERO way to really enforce them. You may be able to put metal detectors at every entrance/exit in the buildings, but how do you monitor activity in the quads outside of the buildings? Really, the only answer I can see is to hire at least 1 guard for every 5 students, but that isn't feasible since College prices are already arguably much more expensive than the degree is worth in the end.

Personally, I think that those with conceal and carry licneses should be able to do so on college campuses. That being said, I think that the conceal and carry program should be re-vamped and only those who go through and pass affordable and meaningful gun training programs can get a conceal and carry license.

The RIGHT to bear arms, is surely a RIGHT. There is NO way anyone is going to tell me that, as a homeowner, I cannot own a firearm or 10 to protect me and mine. I feel though that the ability to carry a firearm under your clothes in places like a college campus should only be allowed to the most responsible of citizens. That being said, I do think that these idiot, coward, emo-punks with a death wish would think twice about trying to shoot up a college or grade school or movie theater if they knew they were walking into a place where likely many more than one person besides them is also carrying a firearm and also knows how to use it.

Full disclosure here.... I own a firearm. I have been well within my right to secure a conceal and carry permit with no other information needed by me than to go to the police station since I've filled the 2 requirements in my state to have one (I've lived here a full year, and I have no felonys).

Even if I got the license, I still wouldn't carry the gun. I have no formal training. A gun is not a toy.

Are these teachers going to have real training, or are they just wearing the piece for show? If they're just for show, obviously this will not work. If "for show" worked, the 3 security guards at my H.S. when I graduated would have been more than sufficient and there would not be armed guards and metal detectors there today.

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Saturday, March 9, 2013 5:06 AM

JONGSSTRAW

Amazing! Who knew there were schools or even children in South Dakota.

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Saturday, March 9, 2013 6:07 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

Pretty much only the white people in South Dakota did.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_South_Dakota

"In 2005, the Census Bureau estimated that 88.5% of South Dakotans were White, 8.8% were American Indian or Alaskan Native, 2.1 were Hispanic (of any race), 0.8% were Black, 0.7% were Asian, while 2.1% belonged to more than one race."

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Saturday, March 9, 2013 6:36 AM

OLDENGLANDDRY

Cant wait for the first teacher-pupil masacre.

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Saturday, March 9, 2013 6:56 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

Sadly, this isn't a joke.....

I've witnessed first hand teachers put into impossible situations by dickhead students......

I do hope that this plan doesn't backfire......

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Saturday, March 9, 2013 7:26 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

Texas already had at least one school employee shot during a "gun safety" course he was taking. Just so long as it's gun nuts shooting each other or themselves, it will work out just fine.

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Saturday, March 9, 2013 1:02 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by oldenglanddry:
Cant wait for the first teacher-pupil masacre.

Columbine
Newtown
VA Tech

Sorry, teachers and students have already been massacred because they were defenseless.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Saturday, March 9, 2013 1:12 PM

KWICKO

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:
Originally posted by oldenglanddry:
Cant wait for the first teacher-pupil masacre.

Columbine
Newtown
VA Tech

Sorry, teachers and students have already been massacred because they were defenseless.

Sorry, but at least two of those places had armed guards, meaning they weren't defenseless.

Still no evidence that the mythical "good guy with a gun" has ever existed to step in and stop such acts.

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Saturday, March 9, 2013 1:44 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:

Sorry, but at least two of those places had armed guards, meaning they weren't defenseless.

VA Tech didn't have any guards in the building, did they ? And neither had teachers who were allowed to carry. VA Tech was a 'gun free zone' campus, wasn't it ? How'd that work out for the victims ?

Quote:

Still no evidence that the mythical "good guy with a gun" has ever existed to step in and stop such acts.

Wow. This fantasy world in which you live... are there terrifying space monkeys?

ARMED GUARD STOPS SCHOOL SHOOTER AFTER HE OPENED FIRE AT ATLANTA MIDDLE SCHOOL

ATLANTA (AP) — A student opened fire at his middle school Thursday afternoon, wounding a 14-year-old in the neck before an armed officer working at the school was able to get the gun away, police said.

Multiple shots were fired in the courtyard of Price Middle School just south of downtown about 1:50 p.m. and the one boy was hit, Atlanta Police Chief George Turner said. In the aftermath, a teacher received minor cuts, he said.

The wounded boy was taken “alert, conscious and breathing” to Grady Memorial Hospital, said police spokesman Carlos Campos. Grady Heath System Spokeswoman Denise Simpson said the teen had been discharged from the hospital Thursday night. Campos said charges against the shooter were pending.

Police swarmed the school of about 400 students after reports of the shooting while a crowd of anxious parents gathered in the streets, awaiting word on their children. Students were kept at the locked-down school for more than two hours before being dismissed.

Investigators believe the shooting was not random and that something occurred between the two students that may have led to it.

Schools Superintendent Erroll Davis said the school does have metal detectors.

“The obvious question is how did this get past a metal detector?” Davis asked about the gun. “That’s something we do not know yet.”

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/01/31/armed-guard-stops-school-sh
ooter-after-he-opened-fire-at-atlanta-middle-school/

Armed, Off-Duty Cop Stops Shooter in San Antonio

Mon, December 17, 2012 Breitbart.tv, WOAI Dateline:Texas

Off-duty cop stops shooter at the Mayan Palace Theatre Sunday night before he could kill anyone.

http://townhall.com/video/armed-off-duty-cop-stops-shooter-in-san-anto
nio

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Monday, March 11, 2013 6:54 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht

I'm fine with giving this a go. As long as:
a) Teachers who choose to carry go through classes and have their permits and have extra classes about safety etc.

b) we don't have actual cops patrolling schools, because that will scare the kids and remind everyone of badness and probably won't really solve anything but give power to specific people.

c) anyone who chooses to carry and has gone through the above things _must keep the gun on their person at all times, NEVER leaving it around. And they must keep it concealed so the kids aren't distracted by its presence and so students don't know which teachers are "packing"

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Wednesday, March 13, 2013 11:03 AM

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Geez, I thought it was bad enough when teachers had the strap in their desk...

Good luck with this one, cowboys

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