REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Boston

POSTED BY: MAL4PREZ
UPDATED: Friday, April 19, 2013 12:26
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 6633
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Wednesday, April 17, 2013 3:08 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:

By the way, is calling it an "act of terror" close enough to calling it terrorism?




As this posts stands, alone, with no context included, leaves it ambiguous as to who Kwickie was replying.





So first you say you "quoted" me correctly (you didn't, even when specifically asked to by me), and now you're backtracking and saying it was "ambiguous" as to whom I was replying.

You've yet to show *ANY* evidence of what you claimed.

I'll wait, but I know you won't provide evidence. And you'll never apologize for straight-up lying about what I said. Of that I'm quite sure.



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Wednesday, April 17, 2013 3:30 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


I did quote you correctly . I even copied your own words.

There's your ANY evidence.

As for the actual real story...

No law enforcement news conference in Boston tonight, at all.

Oddly, they're distributing photos of 2 suspects to *law enforcement ( and allowing the media to view ? ) , but no one on T.V. is either showing them or describing the individuals, beyond the color of their CLOTHES and backpacks. Why placate the media that way, and then tell them not to broadcast the pics ?

NOW I'm hearing it reported that indeed there WERE 2 more bombs, not detonated, after we were specifically told NO such devices were found. That's 4 bombs, I heard , were set to go off, and only 2 did.

( How long until this is walked back too ? )


This is very weird.

* They keep talking about these photos being released, but they're not showing up on any websites ( that I can find yet ) or on t.v. I don't know if this sort of move is unprecedented or not, but it sure does seem unusual.


Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Wednesday, April 17, 2013 4:39 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
FREM
It seems the online media have lately started addressing ALL the conspiracy theories on MANY events, not just this one. AFA political opportunism and whether this was a LIHOP, a MIHOP, or neither- I think we will be able to judge by the government response: Do they treat this as a criminal investigation, ramp up surveillance on everyone, invade some hapless nation (I know! It was Iran that did it!), or some combination? So far, I haven't detected the drumbeat to war, or to anything.


Finding it rather gratifying that reason is prevailing so far - by it's very definition terrorism is at its core intended to terrorise, to inflict fear, rage and confusion, and so far it's only one of three on that score.

It *smells* like a bungled sting, honestly, but also we cannot discount the possibility this really was an out-of-the-blue action by some nutter who happened to be smarter than the usual breed of cretin which would do something like this.

Which is where I wind up knocking heads with some folk, cause were this a planned event there'd BE a quick rush to take advantage, but even with plans on the shelf to exploit such things, the various political factions who generally do got caught out flatfooted, which leaves primarily the two possibilities I mention.

The lack of obvious beneficiary is a sure sign this was either something going badly wrong, or out of the blue.

-Frem

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Wednesday, April 17, 2013 7:35 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Well, since no one's taking credit ...

It may not have been a message. Someone may have thought that they really were going to destabilize the country by such a horrific act. That there would be assumptions made (it's 'the Muslim'!, as little rappy might say), actions taken, situations with other countries roiled, and everything going to hell, like a shot starting an avalanche.

I also had a thought (which I didn't entertain long, but I thought I'd put it out there) that the bomber didn't deliver the message b/c he mis-timed his exit.

But, we'll see. Also, if I see people moving this in the direction of politicization, I may re-think my list of motives and suspects.


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Wednesday, April 17, 2013 11:58 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
That there would be assumptions made (it's 'the Muslim'!, as little rappy might say), actions taken, situations with other countries roiled, and everything going to hell, like a shot starting an avalanche.




While I've not ruled anyone out, unlike the Left, I'm NOT hoping it's a member of one group over another, I just hope we catch and punish who ever did this.


Quote:



" Let’s hope the Boston Marathon bomber is a white American. "

As we now move into the official Political Aftermath period of the Boston bombing — the period that will determine the long-term legislative fallout of the atrocity — the dynamics of privilege will undoubtedly influence the nation’s collective reaction to the attacks. That’s because privilege tends to determine: 1) which groups are — and are not — collectively denigrated or targeted for the unlawful actions of individuals; and 2) how big and politically game-changing the overall reaction ends up being.

http://www.salon.com/2013/04/16/lets_hope_the_boston_marathon_bomber_i
s_a_white_american
/




* The FBI is looking at 2 individuals in photos, so it's not just 1 lone wolf, Eric Rudolph / Ted Kaczynkski at work here. Seems there was at least 1 buddy. And with still talk of there being other devices, up to 4 in total, it may be 4 people in all ? We'll find out.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Thursday, April 18, 2013 12:17 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Update: FBI releases video of 2 Boston bombing suspects



http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57580325/fbi-releases-video-of-2-b
oston-bombing-suspects/


ETA: I must have missed the notification, since I'm part of The Left; I didn't know we were "hoping it's a member of one group over another". I guess WE're not allowed to "just hope we catch and punish who ever did this". (Idiot.)



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Thursday, April 18, 2013 12:48 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



Know who those 2 look like ?

A couple of guys who need to be caught.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Thursday, April 18, 2013 2:18 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by G:
I don't know how the FBI or anyone picks those people out. If you look at all the images that have been online so far - including the PN ones (not the horrific ones) - all you have to do is look at the rest of the crowd and you'll see a lot of other people with full backpacks. I hope the FBI has more to go one than these photos. Do they have shots of them placing their bags in the detonation zones? Must be more...



This is really confusing. I was actually watching msnbc and Chris Matthews, of all people, asked the question " why would they be wearing hats ? ", and then he went on to add ' if not to appear to look like Americans '.

SAY WHAT ??

Look around the rest of the crowd. Are those 2 the only males wearing caps and carrying back packs ?

Hardly !

If everyone were in t-shirts and shorts, and these 2 were the only one in long pants, jackets and hoodies, MAYBE you could say they look a bit ' out of place', but even still, that's far from proof enough at making them Public Enemies # 1 and # 2.


Also, we have pics of these 2 WITH backpacks... do we have any of them w/ OUT the backpacks ?

I'll hang up and listen.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Thursday, April 18, 2013 3:19 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


NOT an official FBI photo, so we all should ignore this...




Lower left side, near the building, white backwards baseball cap...

Not entirely a clear pic, but it looks to be the same guy as the FBI's suspect.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Thursday, April 18, 2013 5:52 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


I can’t believe it. Little rappy managed to kill a deeply interesting thread with his repeated inanities.



ENJOY YOUR NEXT FOUR YEARS!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA - HERE'S LAUGHING AT YOU KID!

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Thursday, April 18, 2013 6:00 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



I posted an image of the suspect, post bombing, and that's what you call " repeated inanities" ?

Really?

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Thursday, April 18, 2013 7:39 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


I think they have footage of at least one of them dropping the backpack and walking off.


Must have been minutes earlier, because surely people would notice unattended baggage and see it as a threat - I know I would.

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Thursday, April 18, 2013 8:29 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Not sure if this is connected. Looks possible

Quote:


Police officers blocked off the scene of a shooting at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology in Cambridge, Mass.

Andrew Kitzenburg, 29, said he looked out of this third floor window to see two young men of slight build in jackets shooting at dozens of police officers from behind a black Mercedes SUV. The officers and the men were 70 yards apart, he said, and engaged in “constant gunfire.”

A police SUV “drove towards the shooters,” he said, and was shot at until it was severely damaged. It rolled out of control, Mr. Kitzenberg said, and crashed into two cars in his driveway.

The two shooters, he said, had a large and unwieldy bomb. “They lit it, still in the middle of the gunfire, and threw it. But it went 20 yards at most.” It exploded, he said, and one of the two men ran towards the gathered police officers. He was tackled, but it was not clear if he was shot, Mr. Kitzenberg said.

The other, he said, got back into the SUV, turned it toward the officers and “put the pedal to the metal.” The car “went right through the cops, broke right through and continued west.”

The two men left “a few backpacks right by the car, and there is a bomb robot out there now.” Police had told residents to stay away from their windows, he said.

The standoff came within hours of an incident at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology in which a campus police officer was shot and killed.

The officer, who was not named, responded to a report of a disturbance near Vassar and Main Streets, the Middlesex County District Attorney Michael Pelgro said in a statement early Friday. He was found, the statement said with “multiple gunshot wounds” and taken to Massachusetts General Hospital where he was pronounced dead.

M.I.T. said in an update on its campus alert Web site after midnight that the “shooter remains at large, police continue to search the campus,” and asked students to stay indoors until further notice.

At the campus, helicopters whirred overhead, and police cars were dotted through the streets. A crime scene was cordoned off, and at least one dog unit was on the scene.

The two incidents came as the area was already on edge following the bombings at the Boston Marathon on Monday.


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Friday, April 19, 2013 1:13 AM

MAL4PREZ


Wow Magons. Is that real? I haven't opened the news yet... That's my old neighborhood and I was there just a few weeks ago. This is all freaking me out!

Off to read the news...

Where'd you get that post, BTW?

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Friday, April 19, 2013 1:17 AM

MAL4PREZ


Shit, yeah, it's real. Still unreal though. I hope they catch the one surviving sumbitch alive. I want to see him in court.

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Friday, April 19, 2013 2:05 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



That's some crazy news.


( This doesn't look good for Al Sharpton or David Sirota. Not one bit )


" Let’s hope the Boston Marathon bomber is a white American "

They weren't. Now what ?




Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Friday, April 19, 2013 3:10 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Wow. I JUST got up (before 6am here--running dogs). Say one dead, manhunt for the other--he got away?!?--and they were brothers. No time for more now, will check back, but I scanned CNN desperately; nothing on

WHY?????

Searching around, all I can find so far is:
Quote:

According to the Associated Press, the suspects are brothers from an area of Russia near Chechnya.

“We believe this to be a terrorist,” Boston Police Commissioner Ed Davis said. “We believe this to be a man who came here to kill people.”

NBC News, citing law enforcement sources, said the two men in question have “international links” and have been in the United States legally for about a year.

Quote:

The suspects are brothers of Chechen origin with the last name Tsarnaev, law enforcement officials told NBC News. The suspect at large, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, is 19, was born in Kyrgyzstan and has a Massachusetts driver’s license, they said. The dead suspect was identified as Tamerlan Tsarnaev, 26, born in Russia.

I'll listen to the radio on our way up to Petaluma, but the burning question for me is "WHY?" Russia? Geeez...


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Friday, April 19, 2013 3:21 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



I've yet to see or hear any mention of their folks. Seems these 2 were here for ' years ', though I dunno how many yet. Legal immigrants, from Chechnya, or that part of the world.


"Why" will be the question, no doubt.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Friday, April 19, 2013 3:54 AM

MAL4PREZ


All this is seriously in my old hood. I used to live blocks from the Norfolk Street apt where these guys lived.

As far as I know, all my buddies still in Boston are locked down and safe. But how surreal is this? The whole city is shut down!

I just hope that bastard with the bomb strapped to him isn't in someone's house, holding hostages.

Man oh man.

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Friday, April 19, 2013 6:29 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Hadn't heard the one who got away had a bomb strapped to him...sure hope that's not the case!

Hearing their uncle on the radio coming home; my heart goes out to the guy. He hasn't seen them since Dec. of 2005 and is absolutely incensed. Family immigrated here from Chechnya, worked hard, never any inkling of this kind of thing, kids are a couple of "losers", if he'd had any HINT he'd have turned them in, anything to do with religion "it's a FRAUD" and on and on. Unfortunately, the family is Muslim, so I'll bet that's what it comes down to. He's been following it since it happened, is horrified and in shock--I can't imagine how he feels!

And in the middle of all this, reporter keeps repeating "How do you feel about America?"--as if he hadn't been totally clear from the minute he opened his mouth. "America a place that lets you feel like a human being,: he said, among other things.

Bastards. I hope nobody more is hurt before the catch the fucker. Crossing fingers for everyone in the neighborhood, Mal4.

How horrific to be related in any way....

...and I suppose it's time to hazard the guess that we know "why"...sadly...


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Friday, April 19, 2013 6:34 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Shit...apparently at least one more has died:
Quote:

A young college police officer has been identified by authorities as the latest casualty of the Boston Marathon bombing suspects.

The suspects robbed a convenience store, then shot Collier on the MIT campus following an altercation, according to authorities. They then allegedly carjacked a Mercedes SUV, holding the driver hostage for a half hour before freeing him at a gas station in Cambridge, according to sources.

On their way to the neighboring town of Watertown, they tossed explosive devices outside the SUV’s window, officials said. In a long exchange of gunfire between the suspects and authorities, a transit officer, Richard Donahue, was seriously injured. The older brother, Tamerlan, died after the gun battle, and a large manhunt is underway for the second suspect. http://usnews.nbcnews.com/


My heart goes out to his family and friends. Please may there be no more; or at most, only one, who deserves it.


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Friday, April 19, 2013 8:01 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


We're starting to get a picture:
Quote:

The suspects in the Boston Marathon bombing case are brothers who appear to have roots in Chechnya, a region of Russia long roiled by Islamic insurgency. But they have lived in the United States for years, and law enforcement officials remain uncertain why they might have set explosives near the finish line of Boston’s iconic footrace and whether they have ties to any international terrorist organization.

Law enforcement sources identified the suspect killed overnight in a shootout with police as Tamerlan Tsarnaev, 26, who was born in Russia. His younger brother Dzhokhar A. Tsarnaev, 19, born in Kyrgyzstan, fled the scene and on Friday was the subject of a massive manhunt in the Boston suburbs.

According to NBC News, the Tsarnaev brothers entered the US with family in 2002 or 2003. Tamerlan Tsarnaev became a permanent resident in 2007.

Other reports indicated that the Tsarnaev family had stayed for a time in Kazakhstan prior to their immigration to America.

The elder brother was studying or has studied at Bunker Hill Community College and hoped to be an engineer. He was an avid boxer who hoped to earn US citizenship by participating in the Olympics for the United States.

An album of images of Tamerlan Tsarnaev shot by photographer Johannes Hirn made this point with its title: “Will Box for Passport.”

“Unless his native Chechnya becomes independent, Tamerlan says he would rather compete for the United States than for Russia,” Mr. Hirn wrote in one caption.

Other captions depict the elder Tsarnaev as a Muslim who abstains from alcohol and is bewildered by the immorality of the surrounding American culture.

As Foreign Policy Magazine blogger David Kenner notes, at the time the photos were taken Tamerlan’s life seemed pretty good. He was enrolled in school and boxing and had a pretty half-Italian half-Portuguese girlfriend who had converted to Islam for him, according to a caption in the Hirn photo album.

“At some point, though, it all went wrong. In 2009, Tamerlan was arrested for domestic assault and battery after assaulting his girlfriend. The reasons for his descent into terrorism after that will no doubt be clear soon,” writes Mr. Kenner.

As for Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, he was a student at Cambridge Rindge and Latin School, at least for a time. Classmates speak of him as athletic and popular but quiet. He is a wrestler. He is currently enrolled at University of Massachusetts, Dartmouth.

According to a contemporaneous account on Boston.com, the city of Cambridge awarded Dzhokhar a $2,500 scholarship in 2011. Recipients of the scholarships, which are funded by local businesses, were honored in a May ceremony at Cambridge City Hall.

The Tsarnaev brothers lived in Cambridge with family members. Live news reports on Friday morning indicated that police searched the residence and exited with at least one female who appeared to be cooperating with their efforts.

Boston CBS affiliate WBZ-TV spoke with the suspects’ uncle, Ruslan Tsarni, who lives in Maryland, who said Dzhokhar and Tamerlan Tsarnaev immigrated to the United States around 2000 or 2001, and have lived at the same Cambridge address since that time. He says he hasn’t been in touch with the brothers for about five years. He described Tamerlan as a “loser” but seemed proud of Dzhokhar and more surprised that the younger brother would be involved.

Mr. Tsarni said he didn’t recognize his nephews in the images of the suspects that had circulated. When he heard about Tamerlan dying in the shootout, he said to WBZ, “He deserved his. He absolutely deserved his. They do not deserve to live on this earth.”

The CBS station interviewed a second uncle later Friday morning. Alvi Tsarni, also in Maryland, said he hadn’t spoken to the two men for a couple of years because of some family issues. He said Tamerlan called him Thursday to apologize for that. “Yesterday he called me and said, ‘forgive me,’ ” Alvi Tsarni said. Alvi Tsarni expressed disbelief that his nephews could have committed such a horrific act. “I’m sorry too if he did this. It’s crazy…. It’s not possible…. I cannot believe he did this,” he said.

In Moscow, local media indicated that the two men were from a family of refugees. The director of a school where they studied in 2001 said they came from Kirgizia, and that the family included two sisters.

Dzhokhar Tsarnaev has a page on VKontakte, a Russian social media site, where he says that his ideology is Islam and his aims in life are career and money. He describes himself as speaking Chechen as well as English and Russian. Time stamps on the site indicate that he checked in as late as 5 a.m. Moscow time on Friday.

The editor in chief of Echo Moskvi radio, Alexey Varfolomeev, said that possibly Dzhokhar was named in honor of Dzhokhar Dudaev, a Chechen president who was killed by Russian special services.

Back in the United States, former State Department spokesman Philip J. Crowley said all this emerging information reinforces the understanding of the evolving terrorist threat, which is decentralized, unpredictable, and evolves individual actors.

“The immediate question about Boston was domestic or international?” Mr. Crowley tweeted on Friday. “It appears to be a hybrid, a homegrown act and international agenda.” http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2013/0419/Boston-bombing-suspects-What-s-
known-about-Tsarnaev-brothers-so-far?nav=87-frontpage-entryLeadStory


How inexorably sad; so many lives, destroyed or damaged in so many ways, because something went wrong somewhere.


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Friday, April 19, 2013 10:46 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Seems that he was not alone in the premature ejaculatory response; Rupert Murdoch's brilliant rag, the NY Post, placed a picture of 2 high school students on the front page naming them as suspects in the bombing.

Talk about irresponsible journalism, they were runners who tried to join the Marathon at the last minute and didn't quite make it to participate.
Way to go Murdoch!!!

That could have ended badly, luckily cooler heads prevailed.

The news media, on both sides of the fence, in their eagerness to out-scoop one another nearly screwed the pooch on this one. Like I said, cooler heads prevailed.


SGG

Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
What did Mr. Thrill Down His Leg say?



Heard he blamed the conservatives, soon after it happened.

Utterly reckless on his part.

* edit *
Here's what Mr Thrill up my leg said..

Quote:

MATTHEWS: Let me ask you about domestic terrorism as a category. Normally, domestic terrorists, people tend to be on the far right, well that’s not a good category, just extremists, let’s call them that. Do they advertise after they do something like this? Do they try to get credit as a group or do they just hate America so much or its politics or its government that they just want to do the damage, they don't care if they get public credit, if you will?




Was Obama's pal, Bill Ayers, part of the " far right " ?

And I'm glad Kwickie can begin to make jokes about this. Never too soon for some, I suppose.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall


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Friday, April 19, 2013 12:26 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
Seems that he was not alone in the premature ejaculatory response; Rupert Murdoch's brilliant rag, the NY Post, placed a picture of 2 high school students on the front page naming them as suspects in the bombing.



So, just help me out here. You're going to single out Murdoch by name, for something some editor did at ONE of the papers he owns, and try to equate that to something Chris Matthews said himself, in assigning blame to an entire group of people who had ( as best we can tell to date ) absolutely nothing to do w/ the bombing?

Really?

Quote:



Talk about irresponsible journalism, they were runners who tried to join the Marathon at the last minute and didn't quite make it to participate.
Way to go Murdoch!!!




Again, it's HIS fault, entirely, because of some bad info someone gave a reporter ? And an editor decided to run w/ it ?

Where's the same level of admonishment for the head of CNN, whose network claimed the SUSPECT ( singular ) was already in custody ?

Quote:



That could have ended badly, luckily cooler heads prevailed.

The news media, on both sides of the fence, in their eagerness to out-scoop one another nearly screwed the pooch on this one. Like I said, cooler heads prevailed.


SGG



Yeah. Journalism has become less of an discipline and more of a profession for the side walk barker. Of course, I've known this for years.


ETA - And I vow to never subscribe to the NY Post again, or take anything they say seriously. Of course, I'd have to start doing either, and then stop, to make my vow mean anything.

Oh well.


Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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