Just for fun by THGRRI

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by THGRRI:

Why firefly crew were bad guys. What's your opinion?

That Jayne is ignorant and semi-evil? Who could doubt it?

The video has one good point and a good speculation of where the series might eventually go.

1) The Alliance ain’t bad compared to the alternatives. Anywhere the Alliance isn’t, the most horrible people imaginable will swoop in to fill the power vacuum: either the mud farmer/baron or Niska or the jerk-rancher who laser attacks a brothel. Everyone who isn’t under Alliance control is getting crushed by their local lunatic.

2) There is the interesting speculation that River is Akira and the Alliance is monitoring her and will kill her if she becomes a real Akira who is capable of accidentally killing billions with her psychic powers.
http://akira.wikia.com/wiki/Akira_(Character)

I don’t think the series would go there, but you never know what desperate scriptwriters might do under the pressure of a deadline. I’ve seen some weird stories on Dark Matter, which is still in production.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dark_Matter_episodes

The Expanse is even weirder than Dark Matter or Akira, the movie, so Firefly could have gone to just as weird places with River’s psychic powers. When TV writers don't know when or where the show ends or what will please their audience, the writers start throwing every kind of odd ingredient (parallel universes, telekinesis, clones, time travel, precognition, proto-molecules, FTL, every super-science idea ) into the story in hope of getting renewed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Expanse_(TV_series)#Episodes

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, August 27, 2016 9:21 AM

There's no place I can be since I found Serenity.

Quote:
Originally posted by second:
The Expanse is even weirder than Dark Matter or Akira, the movie...When TV writers don't know when or where the show ends or what will please their audience, the writers start throwing every kind of odd ingredient (parallel universes, telekinesis, clones, time travel, precognition, proto-molecules, FTL, every super-science idea ) into the story in hope of getting renewed.

You obviously know nothing about The Expanse. There's only one of those elements (proto-molecule) in the series, or the five novels + five shorter stories (so far) that the series is based on. There is no FTL, no clones, precognition, time travel, or any other technobabble in those books. I've read them all, and have the sixth novel on pre-order. It's the most realistic, science-based show I've seen yet. Since the story is already being written in the books, the TV writers don't have to make up any other weird shit to keep the series going.

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Sunday, August 28, 2016 9:41 AM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by ecgordon:

You obviously know nothing about The Expanse. There's only one of those elements (proto-molecule) in the series, or the five novels + five shorter stories (so far) that the series is based on. There is no FTL, no clones, precognition, time travel, or any other technobabble in those books. I've read them all, and have the sixth novel on pre-order. It's the most realistic, science-based show I've seen yet. Since the story is already being written in the books, the TV writers don't have to make up any other weird shit to keep the series going.

I only watched the 10 TV episodes of The Expanse. Never read the books, but I will say that TV is always willing to throw away realism for greater dramatic impact and entertainment value.

There should be a legal disclaimer on all science fiction, especially The Expanse: “This is a work of fiction. Any similarity to actual persons in the future or realistic future technology, is purely coincidental.” You can read all about it in The Bizarre True Story behind the This is a Work of Fiction disclaimer.
www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2016/08/26/the_bizarre_true_story_behind_
the_this_is_a_work_of_fiction_disclaimer.html

Did you read the prequel to the Expanse? www.syfy.com/theexpanse/drive/ Solomon Epstein of the Epstein Drive is killed by his own absurdly effective invention. Does it sputter and quit during the first test firing? No! Too realistic. Does it instantly explode? No! because that would be realistic but not enough drama. Does Epstein understand how his invention works? No! because if he, as inventor and builder, really understood he wouldn’t be dead and a SyFy drama needs death. Rather, Epstein’s drive is so freakishly excellent on the very first test that it squashes him at 7 gees for 38 hours. It just works, like magic, like Hermione Granger doing an apparition.

No engineer smart enough to build a real equivalent to the Epstein Drive would build it without an automatic safety cutoff. But in the story there is no safety because a writer would write it that way since Hey! Drama! On the Syfi network, there is no drama unless somebody dies. It must be a network rule.

Real engineers and scientists are human and they think about the dangers to themselves of what they build and take precautions, except not in The Expanse because the writers have only 45 minutes to cram all that super-science and gunfire action. In the last episode, is it possible to kill more people in 45 minutes in a more dramatic fashion and have an experiment more out of control? I don’t see how, so the writers have done the job and earned their pay with the legal disclaimer: “This is a work of fiction. Any similarity to actual persons in the future or realistic future technology, is purely coincidental.”

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Sunday, August 28, 2016 1:02 PM

There's no place I can be since I found Serenity.

Quote:
Originally posted by second:
Did you read the prequel to the Expanse?

Ahem!

Quote:
Originally posted by ecgordon:
I've read them all...

Of course I know The Expanse is fiction, I'm not an idiot. I said it's the most realistic space-based show I've seen, not that it is totally accurate as to how space tech will be in our future, or how real people would act in a given situation. Of course the show is going to have dramatic and cliff-hanger moments. You do recall that Firefly and Serenity did the same thing, right? Totally realistic space flight would take a lot of time and be kinda boring. The show and books fit in the sub-genre of Space Opera, but they've done a great job of making the propulsion mechanics and low gravity maneuvers realistic, along with the artificial gravity through acceleration or spin. My point was that you seemed to imply The Expanse writers were going to thrown in many fantastical scenarios to "liven up" the plot, when that won't be necessary if they stick to the books. Whether that proves to be popular and successful remains to be seen.

You might think the proto-molecule is that type of plot device, but it was a creation of a far advanced alien civilization, so its properties do seem far-fetched. But don't forget Clarke's Third Law, "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." If the book writers ever introduce time travel or alternate universes then I'll back-track on these comments, but clones are not out of the question, even though they haven't used them yet. If and when the show jumps the shark I'll stop watching. But until then I will defend it every time someone else disses it.

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Monday, August 29, 2016 12:02 AM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by ecgordon:

Of course I know The Expanse is fiction, I'm not an idiot. I said it's the most realistic space-based show I've seen, not that it is totally accurate as to how space tech will be in our future, or how real people would act in a given situation. . . .

You might think the proto-molecule is that type of plot device, but it was a creation of a far advanced alien civilization, so its properties do seem far-fetched. But don't forget Clarke's Third Law, "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

The proto-molecule crashed on Venus, where it churned for months doing something. When complete, the semi-intelligent collection of chemicals flew away from Venus and built what could best be described as a star gate, called the ring, beyond the orbit of Uranus. Humanity now has access to thousands of worlds across the galaxy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abaddon%27s_Gate

That mode of travel to other planets is as realistic as Stargate SG-1 or Interstellar, the movie. I'd be more inclined to believe a story where Hermione Granger does apparitions to the stars and teaches muggles how it is done. On the other hand, there are two syfy tropes you find unacceptable, but real physicists do not.

Quote:
Originally posted by ecgordon:

If the book writers ever introduce time travel or alternate universes then I'll back-track on these comments, but clones are not out of the question, even though they haven't used them yet. If and when the show jumps the shark I'll stop watching. But until then I will defend it every time someone else disses it.

Time travel and other universes are used in fiction, but never used the way physics writes it. The scriptwriters always improvise stupid-ass fantasies when the speculations of real physicists would be good enough for stories. The more daring theoretical physicists have a chance of being right because they are careful and have reputations to protect while the scriptwriters are always ridiculously wrong because no Hollywood Production ever gave a shit about anything but money.

Paul J. Nahin Time Machines
www.amazon.com/Time-Machines-Physics-Metaphysics-Science/dp/0387985719/

Paul J. Nahin Time Travel: A Writer's Guide to the Real Science of Plausible Time Travel
www.amazon.com/Time-Travel-Writers-Science-Plausible/dp/1421400820/

David Deutsch The Fabric of Reality: The Science of Parallel Universes--and Its Implications
www.amazon.com/Fabric-Reality-Parallel-Universes---Implications/dp/014
027541X/

Brian Greene The Hidden Reality: Parallel Universes and the Deep Laws of the Cosmos
www.amazon.com/Hidden-Reality-Parallel-Universes-Cosmos/dp/0307278123/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Monday, August 29, 2016 9:52 AM

There's no place I can be since I found Serenity.

I'll try this one more time.

I was talking about the adaptation of the TV series The Expanse from the books that have already been written. I'm not saying time travel is not possible, nor that there aren't any alternate universes, just that those concepts are not in any of the books (yet). My point is that the TV writers do not have to think up any other weird shit to keep the show going, because there's plenty of weird shit already at their disposal from the books. That does not mean that any of the weird shit in the books is within the realm of possibility, just that within the world-building the book writers have established everything is explained sufficiently.

BTW, as much as I like the series, the books are better because the character development is better. Don't criticize books you have not read yourself.

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Monday, August 29, 2016 9:56 AM

There's no place I can be since I found Serenity.

Quote:
Originally posted by G:
Your line reminded me of the one a fiend of mine used when he recommended Fields without Fences to me to read

I bookmarked that the last time you mentioned it, but haven't found the time to read any of it yet. I'll try to fit it in soon. So many books, so little time.

BTW, if he's a fiend should you be taking book recommendations from him?

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Monday, August 29, 2016 11:02 AM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by ecgordon:
I'll try this one more time.

I was talking about the adaptation of the TV series The Expanse from the books that have already been written. I'm not saying time travel is not possible, nor that there aren't any alternate universes, just that those concepts are not in any of the books (yet). My point is that the TV writers do not have to think up any other weird shit to keep the show going, because there's plenty of weird shit already at their disposal from the books. That does not mean that any of the weird shit in the books is within the realm of possibility, just that within the world-building the book writers have established everything is explained sufficiently.

BTW, as much as I like the series, the books are better because the character development is better. Don't criticize books you have not read yourself.

I'll agree with you that the TV show does not add elements excluded from the books. I'm sorry that I targeted your original comment: "It's the most realistic, science-based show I've seen yet." The "realistic, science-based" triggered my rant. Real & science The Expanse is not, unless God alters the laws of physics sometime in the next thousand years to make that TV a possible future and not just a fantasy or Space Opera pretending to be hard science fiction.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_science_fiction

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Monday, August 29, 2016 12:32 PM

Some of the crew fought against a dominant government. Others wee screwed by it. It's a government I know very little about so I can't say if their effort was valiant. For this reason I look at the individual nothing more. An example would be, Mal is a criminal but has a conscious and is fair. Jayne is a mercenary. Mal is running from his past of learning an honest trade( cattle) because of all that has transpired in his life. Jayne helps him to survive in his current profession.

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Monday, August 29, 2016 6:55 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN

Quote:
Originally posted by G:
Your line reminded me of the one a fiend of mine used when he recommended Fields without Fences to me to read:

Do you have lots of fiends?

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Monday, August 29, 2016 7:10 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN

Quote:
Originally posted by THGRRI:

Why firefly crew were bad guys. What's your opinion?

http://www.cracked.com/video_19226_why-firefly-crew-were-bad-guys.html

I do not agree they were bad guys.
Mal, Zoe, Wash, Kaylee, Inara, Book, Simon and River came from honorable origins, with the most likely exception being Book.

Jayne may be closer to a bad guy, but he did meet Serenity after he tracked MAL and ZOE when they STOLE from Marcus and Jayne, so I am not sold on his dishonor. He has been known to say "Let's be bad guys" and this may be interpreted that this is a new form of fun for him. Just because he is a brawler and/or can handle himself in a fight or combat does not make him bad. Nor that he chose to remain neutral-ish for the course of the War.

I consider the Alliance to be bad, and therefore the opponents or enemies of the Alliance to be more likely good. Only gullible fools would really conjure that the people the Alliance says are bad guys are really bad guys. The Alliance insisted upon Dominance in order to distract, divert attention, cover up the Miranda disaster, and then when finished discarded, ignored, or neglected the locations it did not fancy. Folk like barons, despots, dictators, seemed to have only thrived under Alliance control - prior to 2506 they did not seem to be viable with folk like Mal around to maintain peace and order, and military personnel like Zoe to enforce law and order. But most of the honorable in the Verse were decimated during the war.

I have not seen clear evidence to contradict this.

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Tuesday, August 30, 2016 12:49 PM

Does anyone have a clue to what Kaylee's politics were?

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Tuesday, August 30, 2016 2:43 PM

There's no place I can be since I found Serenity.

Quote:
Originally posted by THGRRI:
Does anyone have a clue to what Kaylee's politics were?

I think she was a member of the Let's Party Party.

wo men ren ran zai fei xing.

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Tuesday, August 30, 2016 3:24 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ecgordon:
Quote:
Originally posted by THGRRI:
Does anyone have a clue to what Kaylee's politics were?

I think she was a member of the Let's Party Party.

wo men ren ran zai fei xing.

Yeah ok, that's as close as I think we will be able to get when it comes to Kylee's political affiliations.

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Tuesday, August 30, 2016 7:43 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN

I might also add that Jayne did not just wade willy-nilly into just any old fight - he had discretion. "Not my fight"

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Wednesday, August 31, 2016 2:18 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
I might also add that Jayne did not just wade willy-nilly into just any old fight - he had discretion. "Not my fight"

Jayne's involvement hinged on money. Or in one case, sexual favors as payment.

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Thursday, October 6, 2016 5:11 PM