Wash- Serenity - Combat Experiance by Booksword

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Wash- Serenity - Combat Experiance

POSTED BY: BOOKSWORD
UPDATED: Tuesday, February 8, 2005 06:55
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Wednesday, December 29, 2004 11:54 AM

Sorry was watching Firefly Pilot - Serenity for the tenth time.

Research purpose- honest.

When the Reavers where coming after the ship near the end it just hit me how cool Wash was.

I dont mean as Fonz Cool( which he was by the by ) but how collected and focused he was.

The man was in his enviroment.

In anything else he is a jokester, sometime a little out of his depth or just going on impulse his heart on his sleeve.

But behind the wheel in a combat like situation he is cool as a cool cumber.

Giving out orders ( get Kaylee in the engine room ) thinking tactically ( get her ready to burn).

I mean Reavers passing by he is near panic. But when he has to take action he is calm as ice.

Almost like he has done this kind of thing before.

What if he has.

What if he was trained for this kind of thing. A pilot in a war. The war.

But why doesnt he tell Mal or Zoe ?

Maybe because he was an alliance fighter pilot.

Not something you wanna mention to he missus with the pinkie of death.

And when Zoe met Wash didnt she find something about him that was off.

Also if you listen carefully he doesnt sound like he was born in the outskirts. He sounds a bit like Simon, Inara and Book.

Maybe from a Core world perhaps?

I mean if this was the case it would have been interesting should it come out. We may not like the Alliance but they had brave men and women fighting in the big War too.

Skilled men and women.

Like Wash

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Wednesday, December 29, 2004 2:48 PM

RANDOMLING

That's a really interesting theory, Booksword. It's struck me before that Wash doesn't seem to hail from a far-out border planet like some of the others, although I'd argue against him being from a Core world. (He doesn't seem to be as educated or as used to money as, say, Simon or Book, but his home planet is highly industrialized, hence all the pollution.)

We've never heard much about Wash's political allegiances or his background. If he was an Alliance fighter pilot, you have to ask some pretty searching questions about what happened after the war: why wasn't he offered a cushy job with the Alliance, like the rest of the military seem to have been? Did he defect? Did he desert? If he was offered a job, why didn't he take it? Most importantly, if he spent years of his life fighting the Browncoats, why was he then prepared to work for one and marry another?

The most compelling argument against this I can find is that anybody in the military (even an air force) would likely be given at least some training in personal combat. Wash doesn't seem to have had that (he clearly knows how to use a gun, but not, I think, in a military way). He has a very different demeanour from Mal or Zoe, and I have a sneaking suspicion that if he was in the army, he probably didn't last long...

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Thursday, December 30, 2004 7:27 AM

XENOCIDE

Sorta like Han Solo? From the books?

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Thursday, December 30, 2004 9:13 AM

PURPLEBELLY

My take is that Wash doesn't have combat experience, doesn't have experience of combat vehicles. He comes from an industrial world, thick with pollution. His family is rich enough to pay for flight school and to keep him on the Transport Division of the Permanent Reserve so he does not enter combat, but does enjoy practicing unconventional vehicle-handling if only to impress the chicks. He follows a relaxed life-style of loud music and clothes, fast vehicles and women, recreational booze and drugs. At war's end, he segues into piloting transports for petty crooks to supply his drug habit and get away from the family mineral extraction business. By the time we see him, Zoe has brought some discipline into his life, but he still enjoys throwing a ship around the sky with the odd handbrake-turn or two.

Only Purplebelly believes this

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Thursday, December 30, 2004 10:39 AM

HOTPOINT

Quote:
Originally posted by randomling:
That's a really interesting theory, Booksword. It's struck me before that Wash doesn't seem to hail from a far-out border planet like some of the others, although I'd argue against him being from a Core world. (He doesn't seem to be as educated or as used to money as, say, Simon or Book, but his home planet is highly industrialized, hence all the pollution.)

The war supposedly lasted some years and the armies on both sides apparently numbered in the hundreds of thousands (maybe millions given the number fighting in Serenity Valley alone) this must mean at least a few of the Independent Worlds were Industrial. If all the Independent worlds were undeveloped border planets then logically the Alliance would have crushed the Browncoats much quicker than they did (amateurs talk tactics professionals talk logistics as they say).

Theorising the Browncoat military was formed from scratch in a great hurry it might very well be that Wash was a military pilot but the training was along the lines of "You already know how to fly. Here's the fire-button for the Lasers, only shoot at the ships with an Alliance logo on them and happy hunting Independent Navy Class of 09:30 in the morning"

...................................
Hurrah, hurrah, when things are at their worst
With cries of “Death or Glory” comes the mighty Twenty-First

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Wednesday, January 5, 2005 8:38 AM

BOOKSWORD

Theorising the Browncoat military was formed from scratch in a great hurry it might very well be that Wash was a military pilot but the training was along the lines of "You already know how to fly. Here's the fire-button for the Lasers, only shoot at the ships with an Alliance logo on them and happy hunting Independent Navy Class of 09:30 in the morning"

I can actually picture that.
Congratualations on your graduation, please dont let the door his you on the ass on the way out and let the other dead mea...I mean recruits in.

Still, I kind of thought he was a little too calm, smugglers keep a cool head I suppose but still he was frankly chilly under pressure.

He does sound a little like someone from the core and his past Alliance days would account his some discomfert with Mal and his all associated with the Alliance are basicly scum attitude.

In fact Wash has a real attitude regarding Authority which could explain why he is no longer with the Allince. I mean he doesnt like it when Mal pulls rank and all.

Maybe he was a bomber or something, you know. Keeping focused while flying into enemy batteries to drop a payload on Browncoats.

Also it was his professinelism that made him in high demand (out of Gas ) so maybe he earned that kind of cool under fire.

Hopefully the BDM will shed some light.

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Wednesday, January 5, 2005 8:50 AM

JAYNEZTOWN

It's a question I've thought of aswell

http://fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=4&t=6616

but still, back then we didn't really come up with answers just some good theory

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Wednesday, January 5, 2005 9:48 AM

TRAGICSTORY

Quote:
Originally posted by Hotpoint:
Quote:
Originally posted by randomling:
That's a really interesting theory, Booksword. It's struck me before that Wash doesn't seem to hail from a far-out border planet like some of the others, although I'd argue against him being from a Core world. (He doesn't seem to be as educated or as used to money as, say, Simon or Book, but his home planet is highly industrialized, hence all the pollution.)

The war supposedly lasted some years and the armies on both sides apparently numbered in the hundreds of thousands (maybe millions given the number fighting in Serenity Valley alone) this must mean at least a few of the Independent Worlds were Industrial. If all the Independent worlds were undeveloped border planets then logically the Alliance would have crushed the Browncoats much quicker than they did (amateurs talk tactics professionals talk logistics as they say).

Theorising the Browncoat military was formed from scratch in a great hurry it might very well be that Wash was a military pilot but the training was along the lines of "You already know how to fly. Here's the fire-button for the Lasers, only shoot at the ships with an Alliance logo on them and happy hunting Independent Navy Class of 09:30 in the morning"

...................................
Hurrah, hurrah, when things are at their worst
With cries of “Death or Glory” comes the mighty Twenty-First

You know, that is exactly what happened in the Great War. (WWI for you non buffs) To guard the channel they commandered the pleasure yachts of the rich along with the rich kids who knew how to drive them, retrofitted them to hold a torpedo and put them on patrol. That was the origin of the PT boats which Kennedy made famous.

So it could be very possible that he was "recruited" because he knew how to fly and once the war was over he was drummed out due to behavior which could be overlooked during war.

[edited to add in] Anyone notice anything between Wash and Book? If they were both Alliance in the past, maybe a recognition? (though that isn't the right word I am after. Like when 2 strangers know the other has been in the military)

-----------
"Societies are supported by human activity, therefore they are constantly threatened by the human facts of self-intrest and stupidity." --Peter Berger

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Saturday, January 8, 2005 8:35 AM

CYBERSNARK

Quote:
Originally posted by Booksword:
Congratualations on your graduation, please dont let the door his you on the ass on the way out and let the other dead mea...I mean recruits in.

Heh. Now I'm picturing Anya & Xander at the Browncoat recruiting desk.

"Let's go get the cannon fodder."
"We don't call them that, dear."
"Well, not to their faces!"

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Saturday, January 8, 2005 10:18 AM

GUNRUNNER

Quote:
Originally posted by TragicStory:
You know, that is exactly what happened in the Great War. (WWI for you non buffs) To guard the channel they commandered the pleasure yachts of the rich along with the rich kids who knew how to drive them, retrofitted them to hold a torpedo and put them on patrol. That was the origin of the PT boats which Kennedy made famous.

A similar thing happened in WWII along the US Atlantic Coast. Numbers of fishing boat crews volunteered to patrol the coast during Operation Paukenschlag (Drumroll/Drumbeat) in early 42. The US Navy attempted to arm them with Depth Charges but several fishing boats where sunk by them because they couldn't escape the blast area, due to slow speeds. But on a few occasions they harassed U-Boats with their presence forcing the U-Boat to leave. They became known as the “Hooligan Navy”.

Also numbers of civilian pilots volunteered to fly older combat aircraft or their own private planes on U-Boat patrol. The private planes were occasionally retrofitted with a pair of depth charges or bombs. I don’t think they scored any kills but they kept the U-Boats submerged during the day.

Additionally in WWI and latter early WWII some British fishing trawler crews were part of a reserve Mine Sweeping unit since they were the only ones with the specialized equipment, and their wooden boats were immune to magnetic influence mines.

Anyway in the commentary for “The Message” Alan said Wash was a pilot on one side of the war and on his first mission he was shot down and spent the rest of the time entertaining POWs with shadow puppets.

I always thought he Washed out of flight school because of some practical joke but due to the war he was given some lousy non-combat job far from the front lines where he learned to fly older craft to the limit.

BTW the PT Boat predates WWI by about 10 years. The Destroyer was originally the “Torpedo Boat Destroyer” but became a more generalized craft for fleet use around WWI. But it was the British that did develop the torpedo boat.

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Saturday, January 8, 2005 4:54 PM

RANDOMLING

Quote:
Originally posted by Hotpoint:
Quote:
Originally posted by randomling:
That's a really interesting theory, Booksword. It's struck me before that Wash doesn't seem to hail from a far-out border planet like some of the others, although I'd argue against him being from a Core world. (He doesn't seem to be as educated or as used to money as, say, Simon or Book, but his home planet is highly industrialized, hence all the pollution.)

The war supposedly lasted some years and the armies on both sides apparently numbered in the hundreds of thousands (maybe millions given the number fighting in Serenity Valley alone) this must mean at least a few of the Independent Worlds were Industrial. If all the Independent worlds were undeveloped border planets then logically the Alliance would have crushed the Browncoats much quicker than they did (amateurs talk tactics professionals talk logistics as they say).

Core pretty much equals Alliance, but Border does not necessarily equal Independent... neither does Independent necessarily mean far-out-on-the-Border world. I'd guess that Wash hails from a world that isn't in the Core, but isn't quite on the frontier either - a middleish sort of world?

Booksword, you may have convinced me: I can picture that he might well have been kicked for insubordination (which means he's made an interesting choice of wife - insubordinate ex-Purplebelly marries highly subordinate ex-Browncoat). His annoyance with Zoe's war stories would seem to indicate that he had a pretty short war if not an nonexistent one. Maybe he was trained, but kicked out before he ever got in the fight?

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Sunday, January 9, 2005 3:34 PM

JAYNEZTOWN

Quote:
Originally posted by randomling:
Quote:
Originally posted by Hotpoint:
Quote:
Originally posted by randomling:
That's a really interesting theory, Booksword. It's struck me before that Wash doesn't seem to hail from a far-out border planet like some of the others, although I'd argue against him being from a Core world. (He doesn't seem to be as educated or as used to money as, say, Simon or Book, but his home planet is highly industrialized, hence all the pollution.)

The war supposedly lasted some years and the armies on both sides apparently numbered in the hundreds of thousands (maybe millions given the number fighting in Serenity Valley alone) this must mean at least a few of the Independent Worlds were Industrial. If all the Independent worlds were undeveloped border planets then logically the Alliance would have crushed the Browncoats much quicker than they did (amateurs talk tactics professionals talk logistics as they say).

Core pretty much equals Alliance, but Border does not necessarily equal Independent... neither does Independent necessarily mean far-out-on-the-Border world. I'd guess that Wash hails from a world that isn't in the Core, but isn't quite on the frontier either - a middleish sort of world?

Booksword, you may have convinced me: I can picture that he might well have been kicked for insubordination (which means he's made an interesting choice of wife - insubordinate ex-Purplebelly marries highly subordinate ex-Browncoat). His annoyance with Zoe's war stories would seem to indicate that he had a pretty short war if not an nonexistent one. Maybe he was trained, but kicked out before he ever got in the fight?

good points, nice arguement there it seems there may be more to Wash that what we know

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Monday, January 10, 2005 11:40 AM

JONSAN

In either an interview or episode commentary I recall Alan Tudyk talking about Wash's life during the war. He said he didn't think the character had fought, and perhaps was involved in the shadow puppet theatre. I also recall him saying that Joss wouldn't okay or squash Alan's ideas at the time. If I remember what episode I will post it.

J

Toothpaste is not a snack.

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Monday, January 10, 2005 12:11 PM

RAT

Are you new, if so, Welcome!

(sniff) Nobody noticed when I join'd a few weeks ago. (sniff) (sniff)

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Monday, January 10, 2005 1:26 PM

BENCHCOAT

I don't see wash as having fought in the war--not as a combat fighter at least--he does well with keeping it together while being shot at, but he doesn't seem much for doing the shooting.

I imagine Wash was probably doing pretty much the same thing during the war as he's doing on Serenity--flying dangerous missions of questionable legality.

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Monday, January 10, 2005 4:33 PM

VETERAN

Don't squat with your spurs on.

Quote:
Originally posted by Booksword:
Sorry was watching Firefly Pilot - Serenity for the tenth time.

Research purpose- honest.

When the Reavers where coming after the ship near the end it just hit me how cool Wash was....But behind the wheel in a combat like situation he is cool as a cool cumber.

Giving out orders ( get Kaylee in the engine room ) thinking tactically ( get her ready to burn).....Almost like he has done this kind of thing before.

What if he has.

What if he was trained for this kind of thing. A pilot in a war. The war.

But why doesnt he tell Mal or Zoe ?

Maybe because he was an alliance fighter pilot.
...I mean if this was the case it would have been interesting should it come out. We may not like the Alliance but they had brave men and women fighting in the big War too.

Skilled men and women.

Like Wash

Man I like your thinking. But it kind of nullifys the whole "frycook opportunity firing" speech.

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Tuesday, January 11, 2005 6:29 AM

CYBERSNARK

Quote:
Originally posted by randomling:
I'd guess that Wash hails from a world that isn't in the Core, but isn't quite on the frontier either - a middleish sort of world?

Wash is a Hobbit?!?

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Tuesday, January 11, 2005 6:56 AM

JONSAN

Quote:
Originally posted by Rat:
Are you new, if so, Welcome!
(sniff) Nobody noticed when I join'd a few weeks ago. (sniff) (sniff)

Sorry to hear that your arrival was not met with trumpets and feasts and belly-dancers and spwhores (if thats your thing). I am sure you deserve it!

I used to post under the name Ariya, but I mostly lurk. It's called stealth, little one. The first rule of message boards: Never let them know where you are. Of course...there are different schools of thought.

Toothpaste is not a snack.

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Tuesday, January 11, 2005 8:41 AM

RAT

Quote:
Originally posted by jonsan:
Sorry to hear that your arrival was not met with trumpets and feasts and belly-dancers and spwhores (if thats your thing). I am sure you deserve it!

I'm sure I don't.

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Tuesday, January 11, 2005 10:12 AM

RANDOMLING

Quote:
Originally posted by Cybersnark:
Quote:
Originally posted by randomling:
I'd guess that Wash hails from a world that isn't in the Core, but isn't quite on the frontier either - a middleish sort of world?
Wash is a Hobbit?!?

Well, he *is* shorter than Zoe... *cough*

(Did I SAY Middle Earth?

)

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Tuesday, January 11, 2005 10:30 AM

RANDOMLING

Jonsan: I believe than Alan Tudyk's theory was that Wash had been in the war as a pilot (he didn't say which side) but had flown one sortie, been shot down and spent the rest of the war in a POW camp, entertaining the other prisoners with Javanese shadow puppets.

Veteran: you can probably be a fry-cook (and no doubt be fired!) before you're old enough to be conscripted...

It's an interesting line: "Actually I was fired, from a fry-cook opportunity. I can handle myself." What the hell kind of restaurant did he work in?

One thing that argues against him having been in the army is that prior to War Stories he has apparently never been in a fire-fight before. That's interesting. Have people never attacked the ship (The Train Job) before? Has he never been in a bar brawl turned ugly? It's not the fact that he might have seen action in the army, though he might; but that is one mollycoddled pilot. Has he never been to a bar with Jayne?

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Wednesday, January 12, 2005 11:21 AM

BOOKSWORD

Actually I noticed on the Pilot they ran with ( The Train Job ) Zoe commented that the Captain went looking for Alliance friendly Bars to start a fight in.
Now if Im Wash, and flew for the Alliance, would I want to hang in an Alliance friendly Bar with my Browncoat wife.
Actually I dont blame Wash for not hanging around Jayne in Bars, I mean that big lug of toughness is a fight waiting to happen.

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 3:28 AM

RANDOMLING

Quote:
Originally posted by Booksword:
Actually I noticed on the Pilot they ran with ( The Train Job ) Zoe commented that the Captain went looking for Alliance friendly Bars to start a fight in.
Now if Im Wash, and flew for the Alliance, would I want to hang in an Alliance friendly Bar with my Browncoat wife.
Actually I dont blame Wash for not hanging around Jayne in Bars, I mean that big lug of toughness is a fight waiting to happen.

True enough, but Mal apparently only does that on Unification Day.

I do see your point though: I'd think a turncoat Alliance pilot would be even less thrilled by the prospect of hanging around Alliance-friendly people than a Browncoat. Of course, there's an even better reason for Wash not to be in that bar at the beginning of The Train Job - Mal, Zoe and Jayne are working, and it's his job to stay with the ship.

And he has been to a bar with Jayne at least once (Jaynestown). Granted it didn't turn into a bar brawl that time... but I'm struggling to believe that the man's never been in a firefight before War Stories. He was technically *in* a firefight in The Train Job, though he didn't use a gun.

Like I say, though - that is one mollycoddled pilot. (Makes sense, I guess. If your pilot dies, you're not going anywhere.)

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Wednesday, February 2, 2005 11:14 AM

BOOKSWORD

Sorry, can someone clear up my memory some. Did he ever state he was never in a fire fight.

Maybe as a pilot he had no need to be in a firefight landside, if he did get shot down and captured all that training to be a top gun gone to waste.

Maybe in Warstories he was just bowing to Zoe and Jaynes more obvious skill in that department.

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Friday, February 4, 2005 5:47 AM

CYBERSNARK

Quote:
Originally posted by Booksword:
Sorry, can someone clear up my memory some. Did he ever state he was never in a fire fight.

Actually no. He just followed the statement with a funnier observation that grabbed the attention. Some people do that (I'm one of them); tell a half-lie by omission ('cause it's not necessarily anyone's business) to get a laugh.

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Friday, February 4, 2005 6:41 AM

THALOS

My suggestion is listen to the commentaries.

In almost all tense flying situations Wash is as cool as a cucumber. However, in the last episode filmed "The Message", when everyone knew they were already canceled, Wash acts all crazy in his flying. He then mentions, if memroy serves me correctly, that Joss had written Wash to be a goofy character in all circumstances except while flying. But since this was the last episode there was some flexibility allowed.

Of course now that I think about it, it may have been something Joss mentions during the end of Disc 4 "behind the scenes" stuff.

Unforetuneatly, there is no specific mention of whether or not Wash was a pilot during the war, although I remember somewhere the hypothesis that he did fly supply ships, or shipd not involved in any of the combat areas.

"Whoa, good Bible."

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Friday, February 4, 2005 9:11 AM

MICHIZURE

Pilots are a peculiar breed. They are selected on their ability to manage multiple complicated and often conflicting tasks at the same time. (E.g., the engine is on fire: do I shut off the fuel and risk a power-off landing, or do I try to set down with power before the whole thing burns? Time's up! Did you decide, or did you die?)

This usually manifests itself as compartmentalization: creating a mental "box" for each significant activity, and concentrating on one at a time to the exclusion of all others.

So, when Wash is on the ground, he's a goof. When he's with Zoe, he's an attentive husband and lover. When he's behind the controls, however, all those superfluous behaviours go back in their boxes and he's all business.

While I doubt that Mr. Whedon has read up on pilot psychology, his profound innate grasp of human nature probably led him to the same conclusion.

Bonus question: Judging by Wash, and based on the following quote (from Walter Cronkite, during Vietnam) are spacecraft in Firefly/Serenity more like helicopters or planes?

Quote:
Helicopters Are Different From Airplanes
The thing is, helicopters are different from planes. An airplane by its nature wants to fly, and if not interfered with too strongly by unusual events or by a deliberately incompetent pilot, it will fly.

A helicopter does not want to fly. It is maintained in the air by a variety of forces and controls working in opposition to each other. And if there is any disturbance in this delicate balance, the helicopter stops flying, immediately and disastrously. There is no such thing as a gliding helicopter.

This is why being a helicopter pilot is so different from being an airplane pilot. And why in generality, airplane pilots are open, clear-eyed, buoyant extroverts and helicopter pilots are brooders, introspective anticipators of trouble. They know if something bad has not happened, it is about to.

--------
http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/fartrader
Far Trader: the handbook for interstellar merchants.

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Friday, February 4, 2005 10:31 AM

NONSEQUITOR

It's just an observation, and this is the first time I have felt compelled to respond to a thread so be very impressed, but being int he war, even on the alliance side doesn't require Wash be a bomber, fighter pilot or even anything actually involved in combat. Wash doesn't strike me as the type to be involved in actual battle. But being Wash, I can see him there just not in that role.

With war, comes casualties, and with casualties come dogooders, like Simon who want to make things better. Unfortunately, the dogooders need a way to the front lines and then back, carrying whatever wounded they've collected, at least some of the time under fire from one or both sides.

If Wash served as a medevac pilot for the alliance medical core, it would jive with everything Wash is. Someone who is unable to take anything seriously except when he is down on the front lines undergoing crisis. Who thinks fast on his feet because in the midst of battle while trying to evacuate doctors and wounded things are constantly changing. Yet he is calm under pressure because face it freaking out ends up killing the soldier just as dead as the ambulence driver.

In this situation he would be disassociated from the actual fighting and even the doctoring, because his sole concern would be to get everyone there and back in one peice. He doesn't even particularly care which side is firing at him at any given time because either way, they are shooting and he is cannon fodder. From this view, authority would be his nemisis, because again from either side, they are the ones shooting.

Yes he may be Alliance, but his role in the war would be as much one of the Red Cross in a battlezone. He still wouldn't talk about it to Mal and Zoe, because they might not be kosher with that - especially considering that the medics left the independants on the field at Serenity Valley on the order of the Alliance.

Then once the war was over, while people in the battlefield were given new uniforms and nice suits, he found himself unable to take the more sane job of flying for a hospital like the one on Ariel (and face it how many of those could they possibly need) and he couldn't take the rigid authority and boredom of flying a cruiser or something as massive so instead he found a career being the getaway driver on Serenity. No rigid authority, and alliance or independant, and they don't mind shadow puppets on the bridge. What more could a luny like Wash ask for - except maybe the love of his life?

This would put him more on even keel with a helicopter pilot in my opinion. Plus I like Medevac pilot who's shot down better than even a bomber who's shot down because no one's going to intentionally kill medics or even their pilot with the exception of Niska - and he's a psychopath. Even if he does put on shadow puppet exhibitions.

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Friday, February 4, 2005 12:17 PM

VETERAN

Don't squat with your spurs on.

That's a good take on Wash. Reminds me of the Medics in M*A*S*H.

The one part I'm not sure of is the bit about the Alliance ordering the Medics not to pick up the Independents. From Zoe's conversation with Simon in War Storiesp/i] I got the idea that combatants on both sides were abandoned by the Brass.

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Monday, February 7, 2005 1:02 PM

NONSEQUITOR

Actually I think there's a lot of similarities between Wash and the medics on M*A*S*H, I just didn't comment on that initially because I wasn't sure if anyone would really get it when I pointed out that Wash kind of reminds me of Hawkey Pierce, when he's working, he's all business, but the rest of the time he needs to be check into a good sanitorium for review.

Why would the medics leave their own troops on the ground in serenity Valley though? I got the impression that the independants got left and those who died after they were abandoned on the field were either finished off by wounds that went Septic, their comrads murdering them for their rations or just committing suicied because they were so depressed they lost. You could be right that alliance troops were still on the ground though, after all just because a battle is over doesn't mean everyone knows that (I believe that's how Andrew Jackson ended up fighting the battle of Louisiana two weeks after the war was actually finished)

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Monday, February 7, 2005 2:27 PM

MIKEYMO

The Alliance troops were definitely left at Serenity, too - it's in one of the deleted scenes on Disc4, a conversation between Zoe and Simon (actually, it begins with Book and Simon). Two weeks or so, both sides, while the peace was being made.

"Be ashamed to die before you have scored some victory for humanity." -- Horace Mann

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Monday, February 7, 2005 3:58 PM

GUNRUNNER

Quote:
Originally posted by NonSequitor:
Why would the medics leave their own troops on the ground in serenity Valley though?

I think the Alliance might try to shoot down any Indi med-ships thinking they maybe trying to sneak in reinforcements, and the Indi leaders negotiating may have demanded the Alliance not send in theirs to because they might pull the same thing.

In war hospital ships have been known or suspected to have secretly carried troops or weapons because they can't be legally attacked if properly marked. (A white hull with a red cross on the bow and a green stripe.) The Japanese reinforcement of Formosa in late 1944 is one possable example of them transporting troops.

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Tuesday, February 8, 2005 6:55 AM

NONSEQUITOR

I bow to your greater wisdom.

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