The Name thing by GinoBiffaroni

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

The Name thing

POSTED BY: GINOBIFFARONI
UPDATED: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 17:59
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Saturday, June 25, 2005 4:05 PM

Was just over at IMDB flipping around and found a list of character names for the BDM...

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0379786/

Nathan Fillion .... Capt. Malcolm "Mal" Reynolds
Gina Torres .... Zoë Warren
Alan Tudyk .... Hoban 'Wash' Washburne
Morena Baccarin .... Inara Serra
Adam Baldwin .... Jayne Cobb
Jewel Staite .... Kaylee Frye
Sean Maher .... Dr. Simon Tam
Summer Glau .... River Tam
Ron Glass .... Shepherd Meria Book

Hoban ??? no wonder the poor bastard goes by Wash

Meria Book... I wonder if this is a reference to Beria, the guy who ran the NKVD for Stalin

http://www.factmonster.com/ce6/people/A0807165.html

Really makes me want to know more about our good Shepard

When my eloquence escapes you
My logic ties you up and rapes you

http://www.oldielyrics.com/lyrics/the_police/de_do_do_do_de_da_da_da.h
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Saturday, June 25, 2005 5:05 PM

LAILING

That's funny, because when the IMDB page on Serenity first went up, Wash's name was credited as "Wash" Warren (same last name, obviously, as Zoe's). So, do they now figure that Zoe kept her maiden name?

^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*
"They've gone to *plaid*!"

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Saturday, June 25, 2005 5:23 PM

R1Z

That's SHEPHERD Book

shepherd —n. 1 (fem. shepherdess) person employed to tend sheep. 2 member of the clergy in charge of a congregation. —v. 1 a tend (sheep etc.). b guide (followers etc.). 2 marshal or drive (a crowd etc.) like sheep. [Old English: related to *sheep, *herd]

To enjoy the flavor of life, take big bites. Moderation is for monks. --Robt. Heinlein

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Saturday, June 25, 2005 5:38 PM

BASSGRAVI

In the episode shindig, if I'm not mistaken, Kaylee was announced as something like Kaywinnith Lee Frye.
Or does that not count?

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Sunday, June 26, 2005 6:02 AM

HILDY

Well, according to some baby name sites I've checked, Meria is a African name meaning rebellious one. It's also a girl's name.

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Sunday, June 26, 2005 9:38 AM

SIGMANUNKI

Quote:
Originally posted by bassgravi:
In the episode shindig, if I'm not mistaken, Kaylee was announced as something like Kaywinnith Lee Frye.
Or does that not count?

Might have been the announcer guy adding some flavour.

----
"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show

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Sunday, June 26, 2005 10:56 AM

SPOONGIRLTRINITY

Quote:
Originally posted by SigmaNunki:
Might have been the announcer guy adding some flavour.

Well, if you IMDb Firefly, Jewel Staite is listed as playing "Kaywinnit Lee 'Kaylee' Frye." So I guess her real name is Kaywinnit. What a bizarre name.

Shepherd's first name isn't listed in the IMDb for Firefly, either, just for Serenity. And Wash's first name is listed, although I don't remember ever hearing anyone call him by it.

---
"Captain, don't you know that kissing girls makes you sleepy?"

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Monday, June 27, 2005 7:10 AM

CHRISTHECYNIC

Quote:
Originally posted by spoongirltrinity:
So I guess her real name is Kaywinnit. What a bizarre name.

Not all that much when you consider that there is no rule that you must use a preexisting name.

My cousin named her daughter Meleka. Ashamed to say I don’t know how she spells it, but the point is the name didn’t come from anywhere. It is just what she came up with.

Considering that my cousin named her daughter while under the influence of hormones and pain I think it’s amazing she came up with a name as normal sounding as "Meleka."

For every Meleka there must be at least one with a stranger name, and names can get much stranger than “Kaywinnit.”

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Monday, June 27, 2005 8:23 AM

STEVETHEPIRATE

Story told 'round here has a mom giving birth to twin boys and naming them - pronunciation - O'RON'juh'low and Luh'MON'juh'low. Orangelo and Lemonjelo. Orange Jello and Lemon Jello.

Yeah. Hormones. Glad my wife and I already have a name picked.

----------------------------------------------
"MY APOCALYPTIC TENOR HAS NOT BEEN DISPELLED!" - T-Rex ( www.qwantz.com)

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Monday, June 27, 2005 10:16 AM

BATMARLOWE

The first time I heard that story was 1979.

And isn't Meleka Fray's first name? Or is it Melaka?

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Monday, June 27, 2005 12:17 PM

INDIGO

A rather long riff on one of my favorite games:

I've always wondered if Joss was giving a nod to the sci-fi and fantasy writer Russell Hoban when he so named Wash. Washburne may just be a play on words relating to his job as a pilot: engine"burn" and engine"wash".

Zoe: Greek, "life". Warren is English and German for "protecting friend". Well, duh.

The man called Jayne. Strangely enough, it's starting to seem not all that weird to me. Perhaps his parents got confused between Jean (John) and Jayme. Both Jayme and Cob/Cobb mean exactly the same thing: from the Hebrew Jacob, "Supplanter" or, "heel". Wayne means wagonbuilder. Thinking John Wayne here?

Tam comes from Thomas, the Aramaic for "Twin", which fits the siblings well.

Kaywinnit. Hmm... Kaylee is obviously a nickname contraction. Wyn/Win/Wynn/Wynne are from the German for "Friend of the field", whatever that means. Kay and Kayla, from Katherine, and Greek "katharos" for "pure". A pure friend? Kayle/Kayley/Kaylee, etc. is also from the Arabic Kalila for "girlfriend" or "sweetheart". :) Frye is possibly related to Freya, the Norse goddess of love, beauty, and fertility, or even Frey, her partner? Lee...Lei is Chinese for "thunder" ((the thunder of Firefly's engines?) Lee has the English meaning of "meadow".

Quote:
Well, according to some baby name sites I've checked, Meria is a African name meaning rebellious one. It's also a girl's name.

Very interesting -- it makes a fair amount of sense... especially if we consider that he may have chosen *both* names himself. A rebellious priest. That fits. Also, Joss hasn't hesitated to cross-gender character names (that is, challenge our prejudices). I'd also like to point out that "Meria" has a significant etymological relationship to the root name "Mar"; whence comes Mary, Maria, Marie, Maren, Mare, Miriam, Mariah, Mariel, Marion (my grandfather's name, so it is not unheard of for men to carry it), Morena (Ms. Baccarin's name), etc. Meaning: from the Hebrew "Bitterness", "rebellion", "wished for child", or "sea" (as in "sea of stars", or "space" for him perhaps? Like Isis, the Lady Mary was called the Lady of [the] Heaven[s]. Hmm, this character intrigues me more and more.

Serra: Serra, I believe has been discussed earlier as possibly being a variant of Sarah (Hebrew, meaning "princess"). It could also be related to Seraphina (Hebrew, "Angel" or "ardent"). Ardent of course means "burning, passionate, spirited." The Aramaic name Shera means "Light". Then again, there's the American place name for the beautiful "Sierra" mountains.

Etymologically, the name Inara bears a relationship to the Japanese Shinto god/dess, or Kami (a spirit of nature), "Inari" -- who was a cross-gendering deity of the rice harvest, merchants, sword smiths, and foxes (Kitsune); associated with brothels and entertainers. The shrines of Inari are the most pervasive and famous throughout Japan (some 20,000 shrines nationwide).

The god/dess Inari employed sacred, shape shifting foxes (a type of white furred Kitsune called Myobu, or "Celestial Fox") to be temple guardians and messengers. They were given special court/caste status and capable of joining the royal line. Some people think that the white foxes, the guardian and messengers of the [Inari] shrine[s], are identical with the deity Inari. "Although the lore of fox magic was introduced to Japan from China and Korea, it originated in India. Nonetheless, the supernatural powers of the fox are not exclusive to Asia, for fox mythology exists -- quite independently -- in many non-Asian nations as well.... Kitsune are renowned tricksters. In many Japanese folk tales, the kitsune appears in the form of a bewitching woman who seduces and tricks unworthy men or rewards and protects deserving people. In human disguise, the she-fox can breed with a man. Fox folk can also cast illusions, appear in dreams, and read thoughts." http://www.onmarkproductions.com/html/oinari.shtml

Foxes, or vixen in particular, have a wide mythological reputation for extreme sexuality and sensuality, which fits Inara well. Female Kitsune can shape shift to human form to have sex and gain energy. They were accorded to be supernaturally attractive, rare, and rather dangerous. Interestingly, the other shape changer in Japanese folklore is the Tanuki, or badger.

In Chinese mythology, "Huli Jing" are Fox spirits. Literally, "exquisite fox. Also a modern colloquial term for a dangerous seductress, a slut, or a whore. "Foxes reached their full flower in China. Chinese foxes are earnest scholars, dedicated rakes, devoted lovers, seductresses par excellence, tricksters, poltergeists, drinking companions, karmic avengers, and always, always great moralizers". http://academia.issendai.com/fox-chinese.shtml
This, from a Chinese folktale call The False Concubine, can almost perfectly relate the angst resonating between Inara and Mal:

Cheng Yumen [Cheng Jinfang] also told of a certain traveller who took a concubine in Guangling [present-day Yangzhou, Jiangsu]. She was rather refined, being an adept at literary pursuits. The two, being extremely close to one another, enjoyed nuptial harmony in the boudoir. One day the traveller returned from a drinking bout, only to find the maids and servants already asleep, with not a candle lit in the darkness. There was a deep silence in the inner chambers, and he found a letter on the table, which read:

"I was originally a vixen leading a solitary life amidst mountains and forests. For half a year I stayed with you to repay a debt I owed you previously. My karmic destiny having been fulfilled, I would not dare to linger any further. At first I intended to stay behind temporarily to take care of you, and to reveal why we were parting for good. Fearing, however, that our intense mutual devotion would make separation extremely difficult, in excruciating pain I decided to depart, rather than see you one more time. I looked back, bracing the wind; a thousand emotions beset me. who knows if, with such thoughts, I will not find my destiny further intertwined with yours on the Rock-of-Three-Lives?"* You should take good care of yourself, and not let your pure spirit be tarnished for the sake of one woman. If so, though I have to leave, I will feel slightly consoled."

My personal thought is that by lucky accident or Joss's attention to detail, Inara's name and character is very closely tied to Inari and the Kitsune. Coincidently, the Cherokee word "Inari" means "grey fox".

Beware of Geeks bearing gifs.
Blessed are the Geeks for they shall internet the world.

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Monday, June 27, 2005 4:41 PM

RYCE

Thanks, Indigo, for that very insightful look into the meaning of names. It's really making me start to thing, especially about Inara's name coming from Japan/China, since China was one of the superpowers of the Alliance. Are you an etymologist (is that a word?) by profession, or is it just a hobby?

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Tuesday, June 28, 2005 5:59 PM

INDIGO

Heya Ryce --

Not by profession, I just think that words and names are fun (yes, I read dictionaries for enjoyment, I'm sick). I research alot of mythology and history for my work (archeaology/science illustration) because I document alot of iconography. So... etymology and semiotics are my braincandy, relaxation.

Beware of Geeks bearing gifs.
Blessed are the Geeks for they shall internet the world.

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