Brand spanking new thread by dreamtrove

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Brand spanking new thread

POSTED BY: DREAMTROVE
UPDATED: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 13:59
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Wednesday, October 12, 2005 6:22 AM

Okay, Cliche of the Day. I didn't want to post that as a header because it sounded like insane troll logic, but this is bugging me.

Why is it in every show or movie, even the most innovative, that the unstoppable assassin, who our characters thwart, cannot be stopped or avoided by any random character we pay no attention to.

Just once I would like it if random hit #33 can avoid being killed by the unstoppable assassin. They don't have to kill him, just make him give up, or fool him into thinking that he's killed him. But it has to be random hit, not major character. And his survival should be not the major whammy plot twist, he should just earn the right to show up later.

Kittens are stupid currency

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Wednesday, October 12, 2005 6:42 AM

FREMDFIRMA

The principle you are talkin about is often used in comics, although not (to my knowledge) television, and is called, or referred to as "revenge of the nobody".

Oh, wait... there WAS an episode of Batman, the animated series that had some random schlep the joker decided to torment turning the tables on him pretty badly, so I guess it has been used a time or two.

But yeah, makes for a nice plot twist when through some random act of fate, joe blow gets the upper hand on mister badass...

But that wouldn't be "formula", and these days, innovation is dead.

-F

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Wednesday, October 12, 2005 6:58 AM

DREAMTROVE

Yeah, it could be a nice plot twist for the random nobody to someday become a recurrent nobody, like willy the snitch. But also it would add reality to the assassin. The unstoppable by everybody but us enemy is 100% predictable.

This is part of what wrecks Xena warrior princess - the unstoppable enemy's counterpart, the unstoppable hero. I remember the first time glory through buffy through a wall my reaction was - ...Yes!

Not cause I have something against the slayer, just the unstoppable hero needed a pounding.

Here's a sort list of other things that oughtta happen more:

The reluctant hero should be a little too late. Whenever he DOES show us, we're always getting hammered and really need him, but doesn't that mean that someone got killed because he was finkecky? But writers never seem to notice that. Anyway, what if the people who died were the important ones.

The prophecy should be wrong. Joss has given us the prophecy didn't see this one coming. Maybe it's time for the prophcy is just way off.

Dying guy doesn't get his dying wisdom out. Or better yet, dying guy gets his dying wisdom out, spills the beans, all the secrets he no longer needs to guard, and then doesn't die.

Time, time, time... is what turns kittens ...into cats.

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Wednesday, October 12, 2005 7:07 AM

EMBERS

Actually Joss did this (kind of) in Angel's final season:

Select to view spoiler:

When Lyndsay thinks he is part of the group and then is blind sided when Loren shoots him,
because he was ALWAYS going to be part of the problem...
Lyndsay cries that he cannot be killed by a flunky,
that Angel has to kill him...

I thought it was very 'Godfather' the way they set that up

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Wednesday, October 12, 2005 9:24 AM

CYBERSNARK

One of my ambitions is to be able to write for a Star Trek series and introduce a random security crewman, who gets shot in his first scene. And survives.

Then he gets poisoned (but gets brought to sickbay in time to save him). Then he gets caught in an explosion (but they managed to beam him out just before the blast). Exposed to radiation, set on fire, stabbed, beaten, bit, exposed to unusual spatial distortions, possessed by alien mind-control, marooned, thrown through time, explosively decompressed --the entire litany of pointless Redshirt deaths.

But he always ends up okay. Not miraculously so, but through sickbay and procedure and not being dumb as a rock.

And we never learn his name. He's just generic crewman #5.

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Wednesday, October 12, 2005 12:22 PM

DREAMTROVE

That angel season finale thing bugged me for a different reason, like the end of buffy.
[spoilers]
It smacks strongly of ethnic cleansing. Looking at who does and doesn't survive each show.
[/spoilers]

anwyay
I'm not sure that's a reason to go to work for the high ultra-predictable world of trek, but yeah, while you write such and episode, remember to kill of troy by random shot by an unimportant bad guy; kill jordi in a transporter malfunction, and off picard by having a random bulkhead collapse under pressure and if possible eject him into space and have him splat on the viewscreen sensor. I don't hate these characters, but their random immunity to the law of averages is bugging me, and a lot of them have to be spontaneously offed by nothing in particular. It can be any three, those were picked at random.

I'm going to kill them all. That oughtta distract 'em.

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Wednesday, October 12, 2005 12:22 PM

DREAMTROVE

I'm going to kill them all. That oughtta distract 'em.

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Wednesday, October 12, 2005 1:17 PM

LIMINALOSITY

Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:

I remember the first time glory through buffy through a wall my reaction was - ...Yes!

Not cause I have something against the slayer, just the unstoppable hero needed a pounding.

Dying guy doesn't get his dying wisdom out. Or better yet, dying guy gets his dying wisdom out, spills the beans, all the secrets he no longer needs to guard, and then doesn't die.

Time, time, time... is what turns kittens ...into cats.

MMmmmm, Glory, my favorite Buffy ubervillain! The clothes fettish, the minions with names like Dreg, the snotty bitchslap attitude.

Dying guy gets his wisdom out, then doesn't die is usually a bad guy or a misguided guy, else how would you mess with him for not dying as expected (except by using the Jesus scenario). When the writer plays that card, they pretty often turn it into a redemption scenario, or a duck in the bushes to avoid payback from the tattled upon, which can be plenty good fun if there's humor, non tropo.

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Wednesday, October 12, 2005 1:41 PM

ROCKETJOCK

Quote:
Originally posted by Cybersnark:
One of my ambitions is to be able to write for a Star Trek series and introduce a random security crewman, who gets shot in his first scene. And survives.

Sounds like you should check out the web comic Schlock Mercenary; the med-tech there is so advanced they can clone you a new bod if you're nothing more than a brain-in-a-bag.

Specifically, one character, LCDR Jon Der Trihs, has been reduced to a head in a jar so many times that his HMO tab has bought the Mayo Clinic a new wing.

And if you still don't get the gag, spell "Der Trihs" backwards.

"She's tore up plenty. But she'll fly true." -- Zoë Washburn

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Wednesday, October 12, 2005 1:59 PM

DREAMTROVE

Cliche #142

Good guys are never shot down by unintentional friendly fire.

In any real combat, this is a major issue. It would stand to reason that as the power of weapons goes up, it becomes more of an issue. River isn't going to lop Zoe's head off with an axe, but Mal might hit her with a stray bullet in combat.

Cheating at kitten poker, which by the way is stupid currency.

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