Male and Female Imponderables--Post-Resurrection by Tristan

Continue, my fine friends!

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 10:38 AM

Big question. I know what I like about women, But I can't understand what women like about men. My main thing is the physical aspect. With women, no matter if I am attracted to them or not, I always have loved the many curves and the softness a woman is graced with. Just curious. Side note. I could never be gay, just for that fact. That and I cannot even brush my teeth withot gagging. What attracts women to the male form?

Seryn: I have no problem with that.

Jayne: I was gonna get me an ear too.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 10:46 AM

SAMEERTIA

Oh... that's tough.
It's ummmm.
Men are just so ummm masculine! They have a manly smell, and are all muscley. I love it when a guy sweeps me into a hug and his arms are all strong around me.

I guess it's hard to explain. It's like trying to explain an attraction to women to a straight woman.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 10:49 AM

It's kinda hard to put into words but ... there's just something about the shape of a guy. Something ... solid. And I mean all of him, not just the occasionally solid bit. Maybe it's because I tend to go for the bulkier type rather than the slender ones (In Buffy terms I'm a Xander-lover, not a Spike-lover), but there's something about a nice chest and good, strong arms that's all kinds of pleasin'.

Could I ever be gay? Meh. Maybe. I really enjoyed Willow and Tara's relationship on Buffy, where lots of women I know couldn't bear to watch them kiss. But beautiful as Amber and Aly are, I'd definately be chasing Nicky!

Desktop Hippie: at one with the 'verse

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 10:50 AM

Whoa.
Good explaiation.

Jayne: I was gonna get me an ear too.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 10:55 AM

MAL4PREZ

Quote:
Originally posted by nvghostrider:
That and I cannot even brush my teeth withot gagging.

bwah!! good one!

I tell you, I looove the check/jaw/neck/throat of a man. It's pretty lines to look at on a woman, but on a man... well...

Let's just say Mal making out with Nandi, and the lighting on his neck (right before they cut to the sex scene) makes my mouth water. I requested mphillips to draw that, but never heard back.

Maybe it's an appreciation for something different? Woman are wonderful to hug, and I've kissed a woman and it was nice and soft, but men are just harder - and I'm not just talking about the obvious thing. There's a solidness in a man that's nice to hold. Or be held by.

Going home now to jog in the cold rain, followed by a cold shower.

Then maybe I'll watch HoG and have another cold shower. Didn't I order that toy yet? Damn.

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I'm the president. I don't need to listen.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 10:56 AM

MAL4PREZ

Quote:
Originally posted by DesktopHippie:
It's kinda hard to put into words but ... there's just something about the shape of a guy. Something ... solid. And I mean all of him, not just the occasionally solid bit.

Ha! I wrote the same thing before I saw your post!! It's so the truth!

But I do like a slimmer solid rather than bulky.

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I'm the president. I don't need to listen.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:03 AM

Yup, it's the truth! We like our men solid

And yes, I know most people go for the slim instead of bulky. Sometimes I do too, and the bodybuilder look does nothing for me. But ... I like a guy with a bit of shape to him. It makes him all the more solid.

And a cheeky smile gets me every single time. I just can't resist it!

Desktop Hippie: at one with the 'verse

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:09 AM

How about man ass. That is another reason for my hetero status. I was recently commended on my backside from someone i'd known for years. Though I enjoy my own rear, I can't understand understand how anyone else could. Who enjoys man ass?

Jayne: I was gonna get me an ear too.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:11 AM

Solid...alright, I can accept that. How about slightly "fluffy"? Do you all have a problem with a bit of extra weight? I have about an average height/weight for my age, body type, etc, but I still feel like I have a softness about my middle that I wish would go away. Is that a turn-off for females? I am not a bodybuilder by any means, but I am an armorer and fighter, so I have solid arms and defined legs, but I am not cut. Do you prefer a male's strength to be overt, or are you satisfied that he can literally sweep you off your feet without looking like it?

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:20 AM

I have to concur with TRISATAN's request for information. I still have the remnants of my former life, (Big arms and shoulders, Defined calves and thighs, but the same nagging middle). Though, having the softer middle sure helps absorb a bit of shock to armor (kevlar),or otherwise. Just curious as is TRISTAN.

Jayne: I was gonna get me an ear too.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:24 AM

LITTLEALBATROSS29

I'm new to the conversation, but please allow me to jump in.
My husband is very similar to your description. He's tall & looks thin but he's actually quite strong & it's really nice to be held in strong arms .Theres a safety & comfort in that,at least for me.

That being said I usually prefer a tall man ,whatever the build ,because for me there's something about men that says they must be 6 feet or over.

Bryce
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I swallowed a bug.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:26 AM

LIGHTMEDARK

Two out of the three girlfriends I've had (also the only people I've ever slept with) have said there is nothing attractive about a man's body whatsoever, haha...both of them did say the strength/dominance was where the attraction lay.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:30 AM

Welcome, LittleAlbatross29! Always good luck to have one...until some idiot kills them!

Thanks for the comment. Please feel free to hang around...these threads can get quite interestin'!

LMD, I may have to agree with you on that one...although I have been called pretty on ocassion

...I do spend some time looking in the mirror (not vain, I promise) thinking "what the hell does she see in this?!?"

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:43 AM

LITTLEALBATROSS29

Tristan,
thanks for the welcome. I'll look out for any shots.Wouldn't want to hang around anyones neck & bring zombies or anything.Not yet anyway.

LMD-
I think there are some very beautiful men.
Johnny Depp for instance. I could stare at him for hours.
Oh, and there's Nathan , him I could stare at for a lifetime.
But the naked male form can be very fuuny.

Bryce
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I swallowed a bug.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:46 AM

MSG

OK I have to agree with the power/aggression thing. It's why so many women are attracted to Jayne even though he's definitely not husband material... It's the swept away combined with the ability to overwhelm. Controlled agression for the purpose of pleasure is quite the turn on ( well for most women) and a guy with strong arms and broad chest ok I am now distracting myself ...as for butt I refer you to Mal's ass

You're only young once, but you can be immature any time!

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:52 AM

About that whole dominace thing... I see it now. (having a Total Recall moment). Especially in alot of the training situations I'd been in, (Instructor and student) where the women I work with react strangely to touch. I may experiment with that this weekend.
TRISTAN: I have a date with Ms. Incredible and her son. Don't know if I told you or not. I MAY SAY IT A FEW MORE TIMES TODAY JUST FOR GOOD MEASURE.

Jayne: I was gonna get me an ear too.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:55 AM

Yeah, but that doesn't explain the man crush I have on our captain either. (kidding)

Jayne: I was gonna get me an ear too.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:56 AM

NVGhostrider, shiny!
Let me (or us) know how it goes! How old is the son, and what are the plans, if you don't mind me asking? (Can I hijack my own thread to temporarily change the subject? Am I truly hijacking if I am the architect of the thread? Am I a lion? Sorry...way off on tangents...only have about ten minutes left of work and my mind left early).

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:56 AM

LIGHTMEDARK

Oh, I agree, and being in no way bi-interested, I find several men to be lookers. It's just that, aside from the face, around half the chicks I talk to say there is no visual attraction.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 12:04 PM

He's nine. A great kid who was able to tell me in detail the particulars of Venom/Eddie Brock (He likes Spiderman, but Venom is much cooler. In basically his own words.) We are headed to the Stillwater Mtns, (see photo on myspace), for the day. I have a few points of interest to visit and some medicine to look for. She was very excited when I asked them to go with me. Another one of those folk who loves the outdoors. Not to make future plans and the like, but I see a Firefly viewing for them in the future.

Jayne: I was gonna get me an ear too.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 12:17 PM

LITTLEALBATROSS29

I'd like to wish you good luck on your date.I think it's shiny that you included her son.

Bryce
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I swallowed a bug.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 12:24 PM

I'd known them for a while, him shorter obviously. They are going through some crap now, (she finally left his dad), and iI think it will take off that edge from when its just her and I. Besides, he's a cool kid and it ain't hard to hang out with him. Someone at home mentioned scoring points and the like. I don't care about that stuff. Anyone who thinks like that should be forced to forfeit their nuts. Like I said before: Benchmade. Don't leave home without it.

Jayne: I was gonna get me an ear too.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 12:28 PM

MSG

Yeah NV Must say strong guy in a pin down situation when you trust him will definitely get the juices going big time...just remember to wear protective gear Grin

You're only young once, but you can be immature any time!

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 12:36 PM

Gosh, never looked at it like that. You know you're good when you can make a dark man blush!

Jayne: I was gonna get me an ear too.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 1:15 PM

SAMEERTIA

Quote:
Originally posted by msg:
Yeah NV Must say strong guy in a pin down situation when you trust him will definitely get the juices going big time...just remember to wear protective gear Grin

YUP! What msg said!

But to allay the fears of those gents who no longer look like they did at 22, GUESS WHAT?
We aren't 22 anymore, either. And honestly, while we may drool over Brad Pitt and Johnny Depp, it's the PERSON who we love, not what they look like!

What attracts me physically, (tall dark and handsome) and who I've dated, aren't the same thing. Manitou is pretty fit, getting that tummy y'all are talking about, but he could put on thirty pounds and I would still be attracted to him.

I think what really makes a difference is when my partner is happy with their own body. If they are don't like their body, or how they look, they tend to move with less confidence- and in the bedroom, confidence means ALOT.

Okay, now, the BUTT QUESTION-
Call me a bad girl and spank me with a spoon, but I LOVE a good firm butt! When I was doing rodeo, I loved loved loved the Wrangler butt. (Still do, just not the wrangler attitude). I love to reach around and grab a handful of butt when we're making love.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 1:42 PM

Dang, makes me want to go get some spurs for... yet again, you know the rest. I would just like to say that I am very happy right now. One of my co-workers just confirmed the shinyness of Ms. Incredible. Can't stop smiling. Must stop, everyone looking at me funny. Can't stop smiling.
Welp, end of the day. Goodnight BROWNCOATS.

Jayne: I was gonna get me an ear too.

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 2:47 PM

COPILOT

annnoyance #156,000 why am I supposed to feel bad because I like sex? Sometimes I wish I were born male just because of this little factoid.

An I carried such a torch.......For the Dark Lord

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 2:47 PM

COPILOT

annnoyance #156,000 why am I supposed to feel bad because I like sex? Sometimes I wish I were born male just because of this little factoid.

An I carried such a torch.......For the Dark Lord

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 10:14 PM

SERYN

outmoded social mores - tradition is always the hardest thing to get rid of. I could go on but it would get boring.

Lets instead talk about what makes men attractive.

I'm all giddy just thinkin' about it

Frst of all yes, arms, definetly, the way the muscles sit firm under the softer skin, then elegant lines to the wrist and out to the angles of the hands, and the ncek, the hollow under the chin before the adams apple, and the muscles either side of that little dip of the collar bones, the jaw line and just behind the ears where the hair falls away, the shoulders. then the way the back tapers in to slim hips. And the pronounced curves and angles of the thighs and legs. I personally love big (crooked) noses and hands and feet (i'm a strange one though)

I can never NEVER understand women who say they think men are ugly naked.
Bah, they wouldn't know a good thing if it walked up and flashed them.

I love goofyness and the way their thinking is so refreshingly simple compared to women who just tie themselves in knots constantly. I also love how passionate and stubborn they can be.

Ok, so the little guy may have been sculpted with more enthusiasm than style, but everything else is just perfect - even with a bit of a paunch or a saggy butt. (still grabbable!

)

Bodybuilder types I just find look mutated. Christian Bale in American Psycho is probably my limit, Nathan is fantsy perfection. But IRL I like real men, I've dated tall, short, solid, skinny, whatever.

Basically, i'm agreeing with everything thats been said before. Big thumbs up from me.

But one thing guys - SOCKS OFF!!!!!

nothing is less sexy than a naked guy still wearing his socks (to look at, when there are other things going on it's pretty much irrelevent) but just for us? Take them off first.

And Ghostrider! You are fabulous, my sister has a young kid, and to find someone who would take the time to get to know the two of them together is her absolute dream (I don't even think she'd mind if they were point scoring) but kudos to you.

Plus, if you ever want to sweet talk her, let her know how you refer to her here.

(EDITED - to try and slim down the waffle)
(RE-EDITED - to put all the poetical descriptions back in for Mal4prez)

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Hodgins: Your robot reminds me of you. You tell it to turn it stops. You tell it to stop it turns. You ask it to take out the garbage it watches reruns of Firefly.
FozzieWash, You know what I always say: sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug!
KermieMal, I never Know what the heck you're talking about.
FozzieWash, Hey, look! They're sending us free lumber!
http://www.myspace.com/seryndippyt

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 10:35 PM

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Quote:
Originally posted by SameErtia:

while we may drool over Brad Pitt and Johnny Depp, it's the PERSON who we love, not what they look like!

What attracts me physically, (tall dark and handsome) and who I've dated, aren't the same thing. Manitou is pretty fit, getting that tummy y'all are talking about, but he could put on thirty pounds and I would still be attracted to him.

I think what really makes a difference is when my partner is happy with their own body. If they are don't like their body, or how they look, they tend to move with less confidence- and in the bedroom, confidence means ALOT.

I'm gonna agree here, 100%
It's always the person I'm really attracted to, which might be part of why I don't care what gender they are. Obviously I have the natural "swing" but in terms of attraction... Well actually I might just be talking rubbish because nothing is more beautiful to me than a naked woman. But still, I like the person more than the body. I guess that's my point.
In terms of what is attractive about a man; I like the way a man feels. Much as I love woman as well, they're harder to hold with all the boobage in the way. I can just press against a man, it's nice. And yes, I like a bit of softness; makes a good pillow. In terms of looks and attraction, I'm a face girl, and a bearing girl. Someone who bears themself well is very attractive. I like a man's arms, too. Something about the way they're shaped. And butts... oh definitely. That's another one with carry-over. Love all butts. I refer you to both Mal and Zoe. Whew, no one has a butt quite like Gina! As Wash says "Right where her legs meet her back"... That and above it, of course. She is gorgeous.
Sorry, got off the topic.
But really, is there that much of a difference in butts between the genders? I mean, women have wider hips for obvious reasons, but it's still the same muscle. And it's sexy. It says "I can move around effectively. I'm a functioning person. And I have strength for thrusting!" In the case of women it can also say "I can bear children well."

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 10:52 PM

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

So I got all caught up on the last thread, and I wanna know where to find this "support group" of men who appreciate, respect, and love women!
Preferably unattached men in my part of the 'verse...

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:06 PM

Me too on the but! I love a nice bum on a guy. Something to look at, something to nibble and something to grab on to all in one

As for the dominance thing ... it is weird because I'm very much a feminist and can't stand the whole macho alpha male I'll protect you little lady thing, but I'm still physically attracted to strong guys with good arms for cuddling. Again, can't stand the bodybuilder look, but someone with a bit of muscle is very, very nice. Like Nicholas Brendan, who I've adored since I first started watching Buffy all those years ago.

So the liking a strong feel to a guy confuses me a bit, but I don't analyse it much. It pushes my buttons, so I just go with the flow.

Do we like normal looking guys? I think part of the reason I like Nicky so much is because he does look normal. There's something about the pretty boy look that annoys me. You know, the unbelievably good looking fellas they seem to have on every TV show. It seems so fake. It's why I like Sean and Nathan too. They've very good looking, don't get me wrong, but it's not the manufactured looking good looks so many actors seem to have.

I have to hold my hand up and admit to being one of the women here who is not attracted to Jayne. Adam's cute n' all, but his character actually puts me off him completely. I've read all the posts from the Jayne lovers. I know all about him being sweet and sensitive on the inside and braiding women's hair and all that stuff. But no. Just no. He's crude, he's obnoxious and he doesn't have a whole pile going on between the ears. He would drive me absolutely demented. If I were on Serenity I'd avoid him like the plague! Which I guess means that I'd be hanging out with Simon a lot.

Desktop Hippie: at one with the 'verse

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Thursday, June 8, 2006 11:13 PM

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

I agree with you about Jayne. The actor is way more attractive than the character.
Dominance, I think I have discussed before; I like a trade-off. Sometimes I'm not in the mood to take charge or make decisions, and then I want whoever I'm with to do it (various situations apply here; get your minds out of the gutter!) But if someone is going to get snarky when I am in the mood to take charge, that's not cool. Sure, I would want someone to defend me if they were involved with me, and I would reciprocate. That kind of thing can't be a one-way street.

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Friday, June 9, 2006 12:05 AM

AERIN

I finally caught up! I should have gone to bed hours ago...

PR: I dunno, I guess maybe it's bizarre, but I like Jayne. I prefer Jayne over Adam Baldwin, but I don't really know the actor (see, personality is important). I like Jayne's tough, gruff exterior and softy inside. He may be crude, which I find more amusing that bad, but he's also straightforward and much less conflicted than Mal or Simon. You wouldn't see Jayne sending a gal mixed signals. I suppose it's not surprising that I also really dig Wolverine.

Tristan: Personally, I final wide shoulders and a broad back very attractive - especially when a guy wears an old comfy t-shirst that allows you to actually see the definition in his back muscles! And forams are good. I woud have said I don't get the whole butt thing, but every now and then there's a scene in a movie that about makes me drool (Wolverine in those leather pants). Usually it involves jeans and cowboy boots (aside: do cowboy boots do for men's butts what high-heels do for women?). There is something really attractive about a guy being bigger and more solid than I am. Don't worry about a little beer gut! I think the "bigger and more solid" part is actually in the chest, shoulders, and arms.

Copilot: I hope things are are getting better.

NV: I wish you well, but I suspect there are some lady browncoats on this site that are secretly hoping Ms. Incredible doesn't work out so they can have a shot!

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Friday, June 9, 2006 1:59 AM

NUCLEARDAY

Quote:
Originally posted by DesktopHippie:
As for the dominance thing ... it is weird because I'm very much a feminist and can't stand the whole macho alpha male I'll protect you little lady thing, but I'm still physically attracted to strong guys with good arms for cuddling.

So the liking a strong feel to a guy confuses me a bit, but I don't analyse it much. It pushes my buttons, so I just go with the flow.

Just some stray thoughts here re: dominance in relationships. I think there's a difference between being a strong, capable person and being someone who needs to exert (is that the word I'm looking for?) their strength on others. ie, the strong silent type vs. say... Jayne :P Not sure where I'm going with that but perhaps I got the point across nonetheless.

I see that alot as a guy myself, actually. Some people just have that sort of overbearing personality, and it doesn't always have to do with physical strength. I've found people in general, though, are attracted to confident, healthy people. For obvious reasons, I'd imagine. And I've also found that someone who needs to "act" macho is usually just hiding some insecurities. A really confident person doesn't need to be constantly proving it.

Now, myself, I'm still a bit old-fashioned. I like opening doors for women, all that cliched stuff. Maybe that means I'm not a feminist, but I haven't met too many ladies who don't get a little bit of a kick out of it. I don't lay it on thick, or anything, or make a big production. (And it only goes so far. I can be easily persuaded to let a date pay for a meal. :)It's just the way I was raised, I guess. (And likely too many movies as a kid.)

I could be wrong, though. Anyone out there actually get offended if a guy tries to be a little chivalrous?

________________________________________________
You can take my Browncoat when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers. (Or if Kaylee asks me nicely...)

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Friday, June 9, 2006 2:07 AM

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

It would either be "Impose their strength on others" or "Exert their strength over others" or possibly "Inflict their strength on others." Any of those would work, I suppose. And yeah, I get what you're saying.
I never got offended if a guy opened a door for me, but sometimes I would totally miss it; like, he'd start to open the door and I'd grab it and open it the rest of the way and let him go first. I only got offended when my ex got mad at me for doing that. Usually I wouldn't mind going first. I do like a little pampering, too; just see no reason not to reciprocate. Assuming I have any idea how to pamper the guy, of course. Sometimes it would just involve buying a video game or getting him some juice. Whatever works.

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Friday, June 9, 2006 2:47 AM

Morning, all!

NVGhostrider, he sounds like a cool kid. I have seen the photo of Stillwater Mountains...wish I was going with you! Have a great time!

I will be back after coffee to respond to the rest of the shiny posts!

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Friday, June 9, 2006 2:50 AM

DEEPGIRL187

Quote:
Originally posted by Aerin:
I finally caught up! I should have gone to bed hours ago...

PR: I dunno, I guess maybe it's bizarre, but I like Jayne. I prefer Jayne over Adam Baldwin, but I don't really know the actor (see, personality is important). I like Jayne's tough, gruff exterior and softy inside. He may be crude, which I find more amusing that bad, but he's also straightforward and much less conflicted than Mal or Simon. You wouldn't see Jayne sending a gal mixed signals. I suppose it's not surprising that I also really dig Wolverine.

I agree with you on Jayne. I'll add though that I think there's more to Jayne's character than most people think. There are a few episodes where you get the idea that maybe Jayne only lets the crew see a certain part of himself. It's what makes his character attractive, I think. As for Wolverine, however, I don't know. If you're familiar with some of the comics, you might see some of the extremely deep-seated problems this guy has. I don't think he's as straight-forward as the movies might have you believe.

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"I'm going to sing the doom song! Doom, doom, doom, doom, doom, doom, doom, doom, dooooooom...."

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Friday, June 9, 2006 3:02 AM

MAL4PREZ

The male form is definitely beautiful!! And thanks for the descriptions Seryn, always fun to drool in my coffee first thing in the morning...

I'm with the personality thing. I didn't get the hots for Nathan until I started hanging out on this site and got all the reports on what a great guy he is. (Well, and I heard he's 6'3". That didn't hurt.

)

As much as Brad Pitt is a hotty, I have NO attraction to him because I don't think I'd like him much.

A little squishy in the middle? Hey, I'm getting it too (although I'm fighting it!) But it's no big deal. The most important thing, as someone said, is the comfort with your body thing. Know what's beautiful about your body, and what isn't should be good for a laugh, not icky trauma. And posture/bearing is HUGELY important. There's nothing as sexy as confidence (not cockiness!)

I'm not such a fan of being held down/dominated. Actually, I prefer a tall strong man who will let me believe I'm pinning him down, so I can take my time exploring those nice pretty places. *sigh*

Ooops, more drool in the coffee.

Chivalry: I find it annoying if it's not efficient. If you're closer to the door, open it. If I am, I'll open it. Sometimes a man's effort to be chivalrous interrupts the flow of the conversation/walk/whatever, as he scurries about doing his duties. It doesn't work for me. Not at all. Kills the chemistry.

I do, however, love flowers. And sparkly things, usually of the $2 plastic ring variety.

-----------------------------------------------
I'm the president. I don't need to listen.

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Friday, June 9, 2006 3:05 AM

Quote:

Now, myself, I'm still a bit old-fashioned. I like opening doors for women, all that cliched stuff. Maybe that means I'm not a feminist, but I haven't met too many ladies who don't get a little bit of a kick out of it. I don't lay it on thick, or anything, or make a big production. (And it only goes so far. I can be easily persuaded to let a date pay for a meal. :)It's just the way I was raised, I guess. (And likely too many movies as a kid.)

I could be wrong, though. Anyone out there actually get offended if a guy tries to be a little chivalrous?

Absolutely not. Yes, I'm a feminist, but that doesn't mean I go nuts over silly things like someone opening a door for me or something. In fact, I get really annoyed when people get bogged down in those arguments. It's like making a huge fuss about being politically correct instead of dealing with underlying issues of racism.

I see feminism as more, well, common sense actually. It's the underlying differences women face in everyday life I'm concerned about. Take this example - I know two women who work for a consultancy firm. They're both bright, smart professionals - way smarter than me. Both of them put in long hours. Both of them have families.

Woman A had to fight tooth and nail to get promoted in the company. Her bosses were unhappy about the fact that she was a mother and therefore "had responsibilities outside the job." She can never take a day off to spend with her kids. If she has to take care of one of them when they're sick then the M.D starts making snyde comments about how a demanding role such as her's needs 100% dedication.

Woman B has two daughters, and the firm doesn't know they exist. Whenever she needs to spend time with them she schedules a ficticious meeting or "works from home." She feels horribly guilty about hiding her kids, but won't take a chance on getting labelled as disloyal by the M.D. Woman A thinks she's absolutely right and wishes she'd thought of it.

The M.D and several of the male consultants, occasionally take time off to spend with their kids. Whenever they do, everyone goes on about what great fathers they are.

That's the kind of stuff that burns me up. That's the kind of thing I hate with a passion and get all ranty about. Opening a door for me is really not a problem.

Apart from all the issues, I'm also simply interested in the differences between men and women, especially in literature. So that's why I describe myself as a feminist. Make sense?

Desktop Hippie: at one with the 'verse

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Friday, June 9, 2006 3:32 AM

SameErita, good to hear! I am generally happy with the way I am...but guys sometimes want to lose weight, too.

Copilot, you should not feel bad because you love sex. I know, "society dictates..." well, I don't listen to society on that issue. It is nice to know that females have the same urges men do. Doesn't make us feel we are the only ones with drives!

Seryn, not all of us males are simple (I know you meant it in a nice way...that's how I took it). Some of us wrap ourselves in problems we have no control over, obsess over minor details, etc. And it's not just the sensitive-type guys, either. I would not consider myself overtly sensitive nor a brute, but I do have a high level of aggression and combativeness. Having said that, I can also state that I worry constantly about many things in my life; keeping my wife happy, wondering about bills, thinking about starting a family and all the issues that brings up, where we'll be in ten years, why is my garden not doing so well, did I get everything done at work...things like that. To counter all this, I build things with my hands; armor, costumes, and whatever else I can think of. So, yes, we obsess, too...it just may not be as obvious all the time

.
Oh, to maybe bring a smile to your face...socks are the first thing that come off.

PR, as far as butts go, I think there is a bit of a difference. I have never paid too much attention to another male's, but I have seen my own too often. I realize the anatomy of the butt is very similar between the sexes, but males generally have less "padding" than do the females. I have a butt...it's mostly muscle and all angular, and I can flex and create some really funny dimples (I have reduced my wife to tears of laughter while joke-posing for her and doing that). Women's butts have a softness to their lines that blur into gentle curves. Yes, there is muscle, and that also determines tone, but it's the softness that gets me.
Having said all that, I am more of a back man myself...the upper back between the shoulders down to right above the butt region...that's why my Kryptonite is a backless dress

.

DeskTopHippie, I have also never liked the Alpha male mentality. I like to be protective, yes, but not "lock her away so the bad people can't get to her" protective. If you have seen my posts before, or seen her pictures, you know that my wife could have my back any day! It's sort of wired into the male mind to be the protector, but sometimes the wiring is really screwed up.

Aerin, I think heeled boots do help a man's posterior. I have a pair of engineer's boots that my wife loves for me to wear...and I think it may be for that reason.

NuclearDay, amen, brother! I was trying to figure out in my head the dominance thing...you nailed it! You and I were raised the same way; respectful to women (chivalric ideals), but not condescending.
Now, with my wife, I like to practice what I call "guerilla chivalry" as a joke...before she gets to a door, I'll say "Don't touch that!" really loudly, which pauses her long enough to allow me to get the door opened for her. I used to open her car door everywhere we went, but she politely informed me that was not necessary. We have fun with it, and we enjoy the reactions of the public.

I think I am caught up...sorry about the length!

____________

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Friday, June 9, 2006 3:44 AM

MSG

Well NV, I'd be you've sent more than a few sparring partners home to a cold shower. As for the Jayne/Adam debate for me it's that Jayne is completely up front about what he wants. He's going to just lay it out and leave it for you to pick up or not and I find that attractive. I'd consider myself both a feminist and easily able to handle myself, but I also feel like I am secure enough to accept a gesture of help or protection from a guy without compromising my sense of strength. I figure you can't fight millions of years of instinct and I als think as long as a guy respects you and your ability to take care of yourself, there's no real reason to worry if he wants to open doors or be the first one out of the hatch to bash a reaver..whatever.. it's just a sign of his caring and desire to see you happy and safe and in no way ( as far as I can tell from all my guy friends) a statement of how competent or incompetent he thinks you are to protect yourself. We all want to take care of those we love. I think guys are just more physical in their taking care...wow this is way longer than I meant

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Friday, June 9, 2006 4:53 AM

RUGBUG

Hi all! I'm new to the thread, but have read various parts of the others...until they got unweildy.... I thought I'd throw in my $0.02

Dominance: Hrmmm, as much as I am an independent woman, I like the feeling of "ease" that comes from having a strong, confident man around. The pressure for all the decisions is lessened. One of my biggest turn-offs is a doormat. Have an opinion. Don't be afraid to debate it with me. Have an idea of where YOU would like to go for dinner. Etc.

Men's bodies: Yum. I agree with the solidness...even if some of the solid parts are covered with a little soft. It's not like I've got a supermodel's body, I don't expect men to either.

Chivalry: Good stuff if it's not over the top. I personally think holding a door is polite, whether it's for a man OR woman. I hold doors for other women all the time. Just seems like the thing to do. Holding a car door, or a chair can be unexpected and cute once in awhile, but it can get old real quick. Having to wait for a guy to get out of a car, come around to open my door so I can get out? No thanks. It's not efficient and makes no sense to me. That's when it becomes annoying.

I've got a question for the guys: What is your feeling on independent women? I am a strong (physically...and emotionally, I suppose) woman who doesn't expect anyone to take care of me or to do things for me. I appreciate help, but won't ask for it. I find this intimidates a lot of men. I have a hard time making someone feel needed. If I am with someone, it's because I WANT to be with them, not because I NEED to be with them. Any opinions on the matter?

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Friday, June 9, 2006 4:53 AM

NUCLEARDAY

Quote:
Originally posted by PheonixRose:
But really, is there that much of a difference in butts between the genders? I mean, women have wider hips for obvious reasons, but it's still the same muscle. And it's sexy. It says "I can move around effectively. I'm a functioning person. And I have strength for thrusting!" In the case of women it can also say "I can bear children well."

I think I have to agree with Tristan on this one. It's not a huge difference between the sexes there, but it's certainly there. All the mucles are the same, sure. Females are going to generally have wider hips (one of the few key differences in our skeletal structure, IIRC.) Which makes a slight change in how the mucles lays over the bone. The biggest difference, though, is that women have a few more places to store fat than men do (butt, hips, and thighs are the ones that come to mind.)

Which is really a very long-winded way of saying what Tristan summed up as "softness." :P Also, it is of course a broad generalization (or a generalization about broads :) Women bodybuilders come to mind since they have such low body fat.

Sorry for the long-windedness. Got caught up again in the typing :) (All that money put into art school: anatomy, and years drawing naked people. And all I got out of it was an opinion about butts :)

________________________________________________
You can take my Browncoat when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers. (Or if Kaylee asks me nicely...)

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Friday, June 9, 2006 5:00 AM

NUCLEARDAY

To RugBug's question about strong women: Maybe it's 'cause I'm generally a bit more passive, but I dig an independant woman. I don't do well with the high-maintenance thing, myself. Not a good sign if the whole relationship is going to be about her.

________________________________________________
You can take my Browncoat when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers. (Or if Kaylee asks me nicely...)

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Friday, June 9, 2006 6:16 AM

RugBug, independent is wonderful! Except the Alliance usually stomps on them...what? Oh, sorry, wrong type of independent...

I am in sort of a quandry about independent women...I respect them, and am all for independence. But, see, as a male, I still have that wiring I spoke of earlier. I have a "protector" flaw that runs in my veins that doesn't just apply to women-folk. Best way I can explain it is from the movie Hook...look out for anyone smaller than you. This does not mean I am this huge, hulking example of manhood, but I have a tendency to categorize people into threat levels. If I am out with my wife or a group of friends, I am always doing a threat assessment...if I see what may be a threat, I automatically become a protector. Doesn't matter if the person/people I am with are more than capable of taking care of themselves, that is the way I am. How this applies to the independent woman is that I consider my wife to be an independent woman, and she knows how I am in this regard. She goes with it, probably to humor me

. When she needs help, she asks, but I try to stay out of her way otherwise.
I am all for independence, but please don't get pissed off at us males if we try to be all protective at times.

I also agree with your assessment of doormats, RugBug...but there are way too many men out there like that...and women who prefer them. Does that seem right to you?

____________

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Friday, June 9, 2006 6:29 AM

Oh little COPILOT, don't fret. I think the stigma is attached to women so much because they have more to worry about, (Disease, infections, PREGNANCY). Stop the guilt. It is great that you enjoy sex. It is designed to be enjoyable. ENJOY IT. ENJOY IT OFTEN!. Women are the bearers of life. They should enjoy all that the world has to offer.

Jayne: I was gonna get me an ear too.

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Friday, June 9, 2006 7:35 AM

RUGBUG

Quote:
Originally posted by Tristan:

I am all for independence, but please don't get pissed off at us males if we try to be all protective at times.

I don't mind protective AT ALL. I love "belonging" to someone. Walking into a party with his hand on the small of your back declaring that your "his." Yep...that's all good. Protective is kind of nice...until it involves fists and blood. I think more of a man if he can diffuse a situation or even walk away instead of fight his way out.

Quote:
Originally posted by Tristan:

I also agree with your assessment of doormats, RugBug...but there are way too many men out there like that...and women who prefer them. Does that seem right to you?

I don't understand why women prefer them. I don't want to be anyone's mother, telling them what to do, think, wear, etc. Where's the fun in that? But I suppose it takes all kinds...I'll just leave the doormats to someone else.

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Friday, June 9, 2006 7:41 AM