Frack or Rut by Sneck

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Frack or Rut

POSTED BY: SNECK
UPDATED: Saturday, July 1, 2006 17:05
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VIEWED: 3840
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Saturday, July 1, 2006 3:32 AM

Hi all

I am a relatively new Firefly fan, pulled in by the "Serenity" film - most excellent.

Does anybody else get this cringing feeling every time somebody on Galactica says "frack" ?

Aaaargh !

Yet, I feel Rut and Goram as used on Firefly is a more "fan friendly" (and network friendly) form of cursing, and you still know exactly how pissed off they are !

Thoughts anyone ?

Sneck

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 4:18 AM

PHOENIXROSE

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Oh, I don't know about that. I haven't watched the show (yet) but if you look at word meanings, "frack" actually is a little friendlier. It's an altered version of the f word we all know and love, but doesn't have any meaning except that. It's not an actual word. "Rut" or "rutting" literally means "An annually recurring condition or period of sexual excitement and reproductive activity in male deer." OR "A condition or period of mammalian sexual activity, such as estrus." So it has an actual sexual meaning, whereas "frack" much like "gorram" is just an altered swearword and can mean basically whatever you want it to.
I think "feck" would be a little easier to say, but that's alright...

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 4:27 AM

EMBERS

Personally I liked 'Farscape's "frelling"

but I agree that alternative swearing and cursing works really well, after all in another 500 years it only makes sense that these words would 'evolve'.

Now I'm curious about the word 'sly'

In 'Safe' Kaylee says Simon is so 'sly' but clearly she means handsome, charming, attractive (something good that she wants)

But in 'Heart of Gold' 'Sly' means Gay....
Of course it is probably that Joss means that saying something is Gay is a compliment in the future.

Did anyone else notice that?

**********************************************
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have you checked out this thread?:
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Saturday, July 1, 2006 4:34 AM

PHOENIXROSE

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Kaylee says Simon is "swai" in Safe, which is Chinese for "handsome" or "dashing" or, in that context, "cute".

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 4:35 AM

CAUSAL

Quote:
Originally posted by Sneck:
Does anybody else get this cringing feeling every time somebody on Galactica says "frack" ?

Yup.

________________________________________________________________________
I wish I had a magical wish-granting plank.

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 4:45 AM

DARKJESTER

I don't mind the occasional "frak". They did use it in the original series too. But when Callie called someone a "motherfraker", that was just that little step over the enjoyable line and into the cringe zone for me.

MAL "You only gotta scare him."
JAYNE "Pain is scary..."

http://www.fireflytalk.com - Big Damn Podcast

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 5:05 AM

CYBERSNARK

I'll use frack or frell by itself; rut only sounds right when as part of ruttin' (with the dropped g, "rutting" sounds dorky, like something Simon would say). 'Course, with my pronounciation, it tends to sound more like "Rudden," which is a family name around Cornwall, so it's not really a valid curse.

Also, I can't really make the "r" sound come out sharply, which is half the point of swearing.

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 6:03 AM

EMBERS

Quote:
Originally posted by PhoenixRose:
Kaylee says Simon is "swai" in Safe, which is Chinese for "handsome" or "dashing" or, in that context, "cute".

Oh (Emily Litella moment)...never mind.

really, thanks, I've been confused about that!

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 6:23 AM

CITIZEN

I think ruttin' swearing is Frackin' disgraceful. Only people with gorram small vocabularies frellin' swear...

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
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Saturday, July 1, 2006 7:17 AM

DQBABY76

Definitely Rut... I cant stand Frack!! Whenever they say it my husband shoots me a look that says "don't you dare laugh!" But you never know it might grow on me just like Starbuck. I couldn't stand her in the pilot episode of BSG but now shes decent at the least.

-------------------------------------------------
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I'm so into Firefly, my butt glows in the dark.

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 7:21 AM

MSCKAREN

I'm more comfortable with ruttin' because it is an actual word with meaning. My mother used to use the word "ruddy" in place of "f---ing". When the SF shows try to make up swear words, it just jars me out of the story.

I did like the use of Chinese as an alternative in FF because that's believable. My Dad always swore in Italian so I understand using foreign profanity to express emotions.

Frack, Frell and even gorram are so obviously variations on current English swearwords that they just sound stupid to me. I understand that the language will evolve but it won't just be the swear words...

YMMV

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 7:29 AM

HERA

There is a time honoured tradition of diluting swear words that runs across all cultures. You get the meaning without the jolt of unease that perhaps God will smite you.

Perhaps this is the next evolution of the likes of god damn becoming gosh darn. Golly, too, has some roots in the god word, if I'm not mistaken. I had friends who were linguists. We had so much fun talking about words.

I like frikkin', meself. The "a" in frak just sounds off to me. Maybe because I'm from Texas. We also have a time honoured tradition of chopping our words short and sharp. And we also mumble.

"Wanna?" – Mal to Kaylee, Out of Gas

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 7:30 AM

PHOENIXROSE

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Quote:
Originally posted by msckaren:
When the SF shows try to make up swear words, it just jars me out of the story.

I don't know, I always like "smeg" in Red Dwarf. Also "goyt" or however it's spelled. They pulled it off very well. Maybe it was because it was British, and they have their own little swears anyway.

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 7:37 AM

CHOO1701

Quote:
Originally posted by embers:
Personally I liked 'Farscape's "frelling"

THANK YOU!!! FINALLY found out where "frelling heck" has crept into my vocabulary. Thanks embers

give it time. In another couple of genrations, Frak, Frelling and Shiny mught be used in the common vocalbulary of EVERYONE!!!!

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"Remember, always be yourself. Unless you suck."-Joss Whedon

ITES RULE!!!!

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 8:39 AM

GED

Quote:
Originally posted by Sneck:
Hi all

I am a relatively new Firefly fan, pulled in by the "Serenity" film - most excellent.

Does anybody else get this cringing feeling every time somebody on Galactica says "frack" ?

Aaaargh !

Yet, I feel Rut and Goram as used on Firefly is a more "fan friendly" (and network friendly) form of cursing, and you still know exactly how pissed off they are !

Agreed.

__________________________________________________
This above all, — to thine ownself be true.
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Saturday, July 1, 2006 8:50 AM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by PhoenixRose:
I don't know, I always like "smeg" in Red Dwarf.

Like the kitchen equipment...
http://www.smeguk.com/Catalogue/NewProducts.aspx

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 10:54 AM

BSCPANTHERFAN

Quote:
Originally posted by DarkJester:
But when Callie called someone a "motherfraker", that was just that little step over the enjoyable line and into the cringe zone for me.

If my memory serves me correctly, even when they said this, the other person with them paused for a second and then burst out laughing at them like it wasn't a regular usage of the word, so I kind of thought that was funny, since they were poking fun at their own made-up swear word.

So who is he?
He's my husband.
Well who in the damn galaxy ain't!

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 11:25 AM

MONKEYTAIL

Don't forget the Star Wars swear words/phrases. (for those of you who are star wars "purists" I am refering to words used in the Expanded Universe novels)

The only ones I can think of at the moment (other than normal words like damn) are Sithspawn, Emperor's Black Bones, Sithspit, Carbon Flush!, Emperor's Black Heart, Hutt Slime, Kiss My Wookie, and of course Kriff.

- Judge for yourself its believability, and then try to tell yourself, wherever you may be, it couldn't happen here. - Carl Kolchak

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 12:02 PM

SERENITYINSCOTLAND

Quote:

Don't forget the Star Wars swear words/phrases.

What about Episode 3 when Obi-wan says (or something like that) 'He killed the younglings'
Younglings?!
I burst out laughing (really, really loud) in the cinema when Ewan McGregor delivered that line and got loads of dirty looks from hardcore Star Wars fans (it was one of the bang on release day midnight showings). I giggled to myself for the remainder of the film...

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 1:07 PM

GUYWHOWANTSAFIREFLYOFHISOWN

Quote:
Originally posted by monkeytail:
Don't forget the Star Wars swear words/phrases. (for those of you who are star wars "purists" I am refering to words used in the Expanded Universe novels)

The only ones I can think of at the moment (other than normal words like damn) are Sithspawn, Emperor's Black Bones, Sithspit, Carbon Flush!, Emperor's Black Heart, Hutt Slime, Kiss My Wookie, and of course Kriff.

you forgot "stang"

I like the EU novels

and younglings is a nice neutral word because aliens might refer to their young as cubs, crechlings, and others, so "younglings" is a term that all can agree on

http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/llama.php
-try it out, I dare you

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Saturday, July 1, 2006 5:05 PM

RMMC

Quote:
Originally posted by msckaren:

Frack, Frell and even gorram are so obviously variations on current English swearwords that they just sound stupid to me. I understand that the language will evolve but it won't just be the swear words...

YMMV

Actually, I can see how it would be more of the swear words that other words. At the rate that society is regulating things, including speach (yep, it is actually against the law to use 'profanity' in public in many places in the US. We had some guy who went to court about it a few years back in our state. ) The definition of what is profane is constantly changing, but I can see the current 'g-dd*mn it' being included. So what happens? Folks who still use it, say it under their breath and faster. Speed it up enough, the harder consonants getting softer and rolling as it gets said faster. Eventually it changes enough that it can actually be spoken a bit louder and is not readily recognized for what it was. Heck, it may even be, that the kids got it from their parents and so on that by then nobody knows what it once was

Why wouldn't this be happening to regular words? Two reasons. One is the dictionary. It tends to fix the pronunciation to a set way. The other is formal education. I'm going to assume that education in the Firefly 'verse is much like it is in the US now...there is a 'public' education, which means that everyone goes to school up to a certain age, regardless of their social status. This means that you are taught the "correct" way to pronunciate (droppin the 'g' not withstanding...that happens now as the dropping of the lead 'h' happens in certain dialects in England) the language(s)...but this would only be for acceptable words, not profanity. Hence, most of the everyday speech would be not too off from what it is now, but the non-standard words would likely not be.

And now to answer the title question...rut. I always thought frack was dumb, even as a kid with the original Galactica.

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RMMC

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