Jayne's Betrayal by Fastmover

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Jayne's Betrayal

POSTED BY: FASTMOVER
UPDATED: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 16:53
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 2255
PAGE 1 of 1

Tuesday, November 21, 2006 12:46 PM

Just wanted to know what everyone here think's about Jayne's betrayal of the Tams on Ariel. I for one was very troubled when I first watched the episode, especially because I really liked Jayne as a character. He is always really funny coming up withose great lines. It's just that maybe, at least initially, the line was crossed for me concerning Jayne's selfish nature because I didn't think he would ever do that. At the same time, however I can't really say I blame him, because the Tams do pose a big risk for the crew, and the crazy nutcase sister slashed him across the chest with a butcher knife. I would be pretty upset too, and probably want to do something about it.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, November 21, 2006 12:59 PM

MSG

My take is Jayne just doesn't know any better. All his life he's had to take care of himself and ( it can be argued) his mom and sib so he's sort of raised himself. I work with kids like this and it's not that they don't have morals, it's just they don't know what they are. After it's been explain ( as Mal did) they can get better at being selfless.

"A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort."- Albright

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, November 21, 2006 4:01 PM

PIRATECAT

The crew of Serenity took on an honest fair. Dr Simon Tam didn't think or care about the trouble he would bring on others. They smuggle true but its nescessities because of alliance red tape and lack of service to worlds on the rim. Jayne looks at it take a prophet it ain't worth the trouble. The day they open the lid on the box it wouldn't matter what they did because they have been exposed to a vial secret. Mal's problem is he thinks in military terms and honor but the cavalry isn't over the hill. The war is lost their are no more battles to fight. Jayne, Badger, Niska, and Patience are survivalists also know this is Mal's weakness and think he is a fool. Zoe is more stubborn than Mal; Wash, Inara,and Kaylee are followers but they are not sure either. Shepherd Book is the only one that knows Mal is not just on the right side but doing the right thing.

Battle of Serenity, Mal: besides Zoe here, how many-I'm talkin' at you-how many men in your platoon came out of there alive?

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, November 21, 2006 7:35 PM

FASTMOVER

Something I've also been wondering is whether Mal would have really dumped Jayne out of the ship in Ariel. He looks pretty serious, especially when he starts climbing the stairs to leave Jayne before Jayne apologizes and shows remorse. Is this what made Mal change his mind, or was he just trying to scare some sense into Jayne to make a point? This scene did kind of remind me of an angry parent trying to scare a child into discipline.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, November 21, 2006 8:38 PM

PIRATECAT

No,No,No Mal is a harden war vetran. Mal lost fear in the beginning of the war he made combat rank as a volunteer to sargent then brevetted to the rank of captain at the end of the war. He is not scared of Jayne. He brought Jayne on board because it got him out of jam and was impressed with Jayne tracking him down. Jayne's extra muscle that's all. Zoe's is the soldiers soldier would be a ranger or delta force for the US Army. She is Browncoat regular probably join Malcom later. Mal was afraid of her slightly definitly knew the war would ended sooner if she was alliance. Mal waxed Dobson the Fed without hesitation. Mal kills with purpose when nescessary. Ole Jayne was going to be atmo fodder if he didn't come straight with Mal. Mal had enough of Jayne it was over.

No, alliance starts the war then you volunteer.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, November 21, 2006 9:09 PM

REDLAVA

I don't believe that Jayne looks at Serenity the same way as the rest of the crew. I think he looks at it more as a job not a home. Jayne, I think, was doing what he need to do to survive more than out of the kindness of his heart by getting rid of a problem that Mal didn't have the guts to take care of. I think he felt that having the Tams on board would jepordize his mealticket. If the Tams were caught the rest of Serenity's crew would be arrested for aiding and abetting criminals. Jayne would not be too happy about going to prison especially for something that he didn't directly do.

That and the reward money was just too good to pass up, as evidence in OIS when River reads his mind and he says along the lines of "I got stupid, the money was too good."

Would Mal have killed him? Yes, if he hadn't of apologized he would have. I don't think Mal, at that time, trusted Jayne as much as somebody should in that position. He had no reason too. Mal probably still doesn't know for sure if Jayne had anything to do with Dobson getting loose. Jayne has been hounding him every chance he could about crawling away from Badger the way he did. And Jayne openly disagrees with a lot of Mal's orders especially those concerning the Tams.

Jayne needed to show Mal that he was more than just a caged dog ready to bite his master. Needed to show him that he at least had some sort of moral compass.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, November 22, 2006 12:02 AM

EVILBUNGLE

For me the Ariel moment was Jaynes low Point, he clearly started to doubt his decision before they went outside but was already committed.

Don't blame Jayne for who he is, he never claims to be trustworthy and they all should know that. he will always look out for himself but at least at the end he showed that he wanted to be part of the team, when he asks Mal not to tell the others why he was killed it makes me like him as a crew member not just a funny guy. and in OIS when his mind admits he was wrong it shows that he is finally seeing himself as part of the crew.

Vote Day 1st December 2006 http://richlabonte.net/tvvote/index.html
Together we will triumph.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, November 22, 2006 12:15 AM

DESKTOPHIPPIE

Yep, I'm with Redlava. Jayne knew exactly what he was doing, and did it more for himself than Serenity. And Mal would have killed him if he hadn't realised (and shown Mal) that what he did was wrong.

As for Simon putting the crew in danger... it's a good point, but you have to remember that Simon was desperate. If you had just smuggled someone you loved out of a place like that, would you avoid getting others involved at all costs, or would you do whatever it took to see them safe? I know what my answer would be.

Also remember that Simon never intended to stay on Serenity. He just needed to get away. Mal asked him to stay.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, November 22, 2006 1:21 AM

MRBEN

If my recollection of the episode is correct, it wasn't Jayne's apology that changed Mal's mind. It was the fact that Jayne didn't want the crew to know what he had done, even when he was dead. Mal realised then that Jayne did actually care about the crew.

mrben

"Carpe Aptenodytes"
http://www.jedimoose.org

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, November 28, 2006 4:53 PM

FASTMOVER

It's kind of wierd that even though Jayne is probably there to be the "funny goof" I think I can relate to him more than any other character. In fact, I think many people are in his position of doing or having to go along with things they don't like for the sake of their own greed. It's also hard to find things you can have an allegiance to, and often times it is just easier to go with what is loyal to your wallet. I can also relate a lot with Mal, because he is bitter over what has been done to him and the world "universe".

What I really wonder sometimes is why they kept putting up with Jayne when they knew all along that he was a mercenary and couldn't be trusted? Surely if he was that much of a threat Mal and Zoe could have done something about it.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

YOUR OPTIONS

SHARE THREAD

NEW POSTS TODAY

USER	POST DATE

USER

POST DATE