Possible that Joss has 'dumbed down' Dollhouse to please the network by OPPYH

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Possible that Joss has 'dumbed down' Dollhouse to please the network

POSTED BY: OPPYH
UPDATED: Thursday, January 1, 2009 09:26
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 3161
PAGE 1 of 1

Sunday, December 21, 2008 2:48 PM

Here's the review of the pilot episode from IGN.com:

"So… I’ve seen the first episode of Joss Whedon’s Dollhouse. Yes, the much anticipated, much discussed, much stressed over — by Whedon fans nervous about network tampering — series arrived on my desk yesterday.

As you may have read by now, Dollhouse tells the tale of Echo (Eliza Dushku), a young woman working (though some would use more damning words) for a mysterious company as an "Active." Her memories have essentially been wiped clean, leaving her in a simplistic, childlike state... until she gets an assignment, at which point she has a completely new identity and skill set imprinted upon her, as she temporarily becomes whomever the client wants or needs her to be for a given situation.

The show doesn’t feel like anything Joss Whedon has done before, in ways both positive and negative. On one hand, it’s great that the man who brought us such amazing television as Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Angel and Firefly (all among my very favorite TV shows) is creating another new world and a series that isn’t directly evoking his earlier work or feeling like a simple copy of something he’s done before. And there’s no doubt he’s come up with an idea that is noteworthy and raises lots of intriguing questions.

On the other hand, some small moments aside, the first episode – and note, this is the new first episode, replacing the earlier one which has been discarded – is surprisingly lacking when it comes to the trademark wit Whedon is known for. Even the most outwardly geeky character, Topher (Fran Kranz), has only some mildly amusing lines rather than anything all that funny or memorable, and he’s the type of clever audience proxy and/or sarcasm supplier Whedon usually excels at.

There is definitely a strong concept at work here – In a nutshell, you have a show that feels like Alias meets The Matrix, which is a pretty cool combination. The idea that Echo and her fellow "actives" can have any identity and skill imprinted upon them means the show has tremendous opportunities as far as exploring very different scenarios and even delving into multiple genres, depending on what Echo is sent to do each week. Without getting specific, the two scenarios in the first episode do a good job showing how very different these situations can be, as one is basically about romance and excitement, while the other is truly about life or death.

Simply by virtue of the way he is investigating the rumors of "the Dollhouse" – the nickname given to the place where the actives live and are programmed – Tahmoh Penikett’s FBI agent Paul Ballard feels a bit disconnected from the main story in the first episode, but that will no doubt change as time goes on. The always dependable Olivia Williams and Harry Lennix meanwhile quickly resonate as two of Echo’s bosses, who have very different sensibilities regarding Echo and the other actives – and the morality of what they are doing.

There have been questions regarding Dushku, and if the actress – so often cast as the tough girl – is the right person to pull off a role that will presumably need to show a tremendous amount of range. The first episode leaves the answer to that question unclear. Certainly, Dushku seems a bit more at home in one of the personas (hint: it’s the more lighthearted one) we see her playing than the other, but she also doesn’t embarrass herself in the least in the other. Whedon is clearly going to ask a lot of her in the episodes to come, and as a longtime fan of Dushku (Faith ruled!), I’m definitely pulling for her.

The first episode lacked a certain energy Whedon’s work usually has, and I felt myself thinking "this is interesting", without actually getting caught up in the story on a visceral level. It should be noted that Whedon has said that FOX has asked for the show to be more action-oriented, but that’s not exactly the case in the pilot, which has thriller elements, but not much in the way of kicking ass – at least not from Echo as yet. That’s not to say this (or any) show needs gun play and martial arts to be exciting, but there was a certain overly mellow tone to the entire episode that was surprising – one only need look at an episode like Buffy’s "The Body" to see how much Whedon can do with dialogue and emotion alone.

FOX infamously demanded a new pilot for Firefly — though Whedon is quick to point out that shooting a new first episode for Dollhouse was his suggestion this time — and the result, "The Train Job" was one of the weaker episodes of that wonderful series and far from the best example of all Firefly could be. Still, it did have that pivotal moment where Malcolm Reynolds kicked a tough talking prisoner into an engine that made you sit up and go, "Oh yes, this is a Joss Whedon show alright!" Unfortunately, the Dollhouse pilot has no such moment, either in dialogue or action. It’s certainly laying the foundation for something that can be quite compelling, but in and of itself, the first episode doesn’t exactly grab hold in the manner I hoped for.

However, the circumstances under which this episode was made, as part of a decision to re-tool the series, have to be taken into account and I’m definitely curious where the series will go in future episodes. Whedon has proven his talent time and again his involvement is reason enough to make Dollhouse a show worth keeping on your radar… and your DVR settings."

Dollhouse premieres Friday, February 13th on FOX.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, December 21, 2008 3:12 PM

ZEEK

It's possible that he made it more complex as well. Possibilities are endless. At this point it's not too far out. Let's just wait and see for ourselves. I'm sure someone will get their hands on the unaired pilot as well.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, December 21, 2008 4:17 PM

OPPYH

Quote:
Originally posted by Zeek:
It's possible that he made it more complex as well. Possibilities are endless. At this point it's not too far out. Let's just wait and see for ourselves. I'm sure someone will get their hands on the unaired pilot as well.

Yes.
We'll just have to wait and see.
It would be a tragedy if Joss streamlined a series just to gain mass acceptance to "normal" people with little imagination.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, December 21, 2008 6:19 PM

ECGORDON

There's no place I can be since I found Serenity.

I refuse to worry about Dollhouse, and I have also stopped reading any and all reports about it, positive or negative. It'll either work or it won't, and even if it's the greatest thing since Firefly (or even better

) doesn't mean it will be embraced by enough viewers to keep it on the air. We just need to wait 54 more days to satisfy our curiosity.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, December 21, 2008 7:00 PM

ZEEK

Quote:
Originally posted by OPPYH:
It would be a tragedy if Joss streamlined a series just to gain mass acceptance to "normal" people with little imagination.

See I don't think it would be. I'm ready for Joss to give in to society for once and just make something that appeals to the masses. I mean look at J.J. Abrams. He started Lost and got it through one good season before he left and the whole thing went to hell. Still he can probably pitch about any idea and get a green light now. Plus his name pulls in a bunch of Lost viewers no problem.

If Joss just got one huge mainstream success under his belt then he could go back to doing deeper shows that don't get canceled.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, December 21, 2008 10:56 PM

HAKEN

Likes to mess with stuffs.

EW.COM has posted a clip of Echo's memories being erased.

http://ausiellofiles.ew.com/2008/12/exclusive-dollh.html

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Monday, December 22, 2008 2:00 AM

FILLYGIRL

Operative: "Its worse than you know..." Mal: "It usually is."

Thanks Haken!
I will wait and see(the show) for myself and hope that F*x stays 'out of it'.

Chaplain of the 76th Independant Battalion

Do not bother dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup!

...it's worse than you know...Operative
...it usually is.....Mal

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 3:24 PM

OPPYH

A new review of the pilot from Thestar.com:

_________________________________________________

This year my Christmas came a few days early.

I came into work late last week to find my desk buried beneath a mountain of envelopes and packages.

Excavation uncovered some delightful unexpected surprises: DVD screeners previewing new and returning Fox (and one FX) series I was particularly looking forward to.

It amounted to seven hours’ viewing time, which I happily crammed into a single Sunday, prompting my spouse to comment in passing, "You have the best job in the world."

I could not disagree.

Hour One: Dollhouse

This one was of particular interest, given a) the long absence of fan-favourite fantasist Joss (Buffy) Whedon from our TV screens, and b) the characteristic abuse heaped upon him by a meddling and trigger-happy Fox network (one word: Firefly).

The resulting pilot shows aspects of both: a nifty concept, sporadically witty dialogue, a way-cool set (Whedon is as masterfully visual as he is verbal) ... and several glaringly dumbed-down story issues he clearly had to compromise on to even get the thing on the air.

I will not spoil it for you, except to warn you of one particular, ludicrously coincidental plot point that will cause you to spout whatever beverage you are drinking out through your nose (in my case hot coffee – it wasn’t pretty).

I also worry about lead actor Eliza Dushku, who is supposed to be playing a radically different character every week, for which I seriously doubt she has the range.

Apparently, one of these will be a 60-year-old woman and it’s a pretty safe bet it ain’t gonna be another Brad Pitt in Benjamin Button.

There is also the show’s unfortunate resemblance to the quickly cancelled My Own Worst Enemy.

Of all my Sunday screeners, this is the one we’ll have the longest wait for, debuting in its Friday-night "death slot," with a relocated Terminator as its lead-in, on Feb. 13.

That’s Friday the 13th.

I’m just saying.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Thursday, December 25, 2008 6:41 PM

GWENEVERE

Is it just me or does the set look like Wolfram & Hart on Angel?

I hope, even if it means waiting for the dvd, we get to see both the original pilot and the new first episode.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, December 26, 2008 3:42 AM

DARKFLY

After watching the first trailer (ages ago), then the newer shinier trailer for Dollhouse my conclusion both times was very similar to this review. I'm gonna watch it obviously if only cause I love Whedon but I don't think its gonna be anywhere as good as Whedon's previous work's but I'll keep my fingers crossed.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.myspace.com/darkfly7
Knightfly on Xfire, www.xfire.com/profile/knightfly/

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Tuesday, December 30, 2008 9:44 PM

SHINYGOODGUY

First of all, you should not decide whether a show is good or not by a trailer/teaser.

Having said that, this is Joss we're talking about. Of course it's gonna be good!

OK, seriously.....the concept is an off-shoot of the River story taken to the next level. Gov't types meddling with our brain, except that we get to see what the "Alliance" ends up with.

But remember folks, this is Fox, the folks who invented meddling to the point of distraction, and nothing gets by them thats any good. Let the record show that a re-write was called for long before the pilot was in the can. So Good Luck Joss! We knew ye well.

To answer the question: Yes, there is no doubt that Joss has had to "dumb-down" the series to appease the Fox braintrust (now there's an oxymoron).

SGG

Tawabawho?

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, December 31, 2008 6:59 AM

LEEDAVIDT

yup...i'll be watchin' too...
not gonna be expecting miracles here
but whedon has -done the impossible-
so i look forward to seein' it ...

http://www.myspace.com/leedavidt

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Wednesday, December 31, 2008 4:44 PM

LEXIBLOCK

Next time include a link.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Thursday, January 1, 2009 7:44 AM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!

Looks good. Set's like the evil office on Angel.
www.scifi.com/scifiwire/index.php?category=0&id=63214

Typical CIA MKULTRA Project Monarch mind-kontrol slave operation, with sexslavery, but without all that pesky kidnapping and kiddie porn. Aka River, aka Cathy O'Brien and Kelly O'Brien. Is Joss CIA???
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=cathy+obrien&hl=en&emb=0&aq=f#q=
the%20most%20dangerous%20game&hl=en&emb=0
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=cathy+obrien&hl=en&emb=0&aq=f#

Looks like Joss is skipping the funny BTVS seasons, and diving straight into the darkeness of the HellMouth TM, aka bombing Sunnyvale High School Hell.

Good timing for predictive programming, what with the US Civil War scheduled for 2009-2012. FOR REAL.

www.infowars.com/?p=5938

That's why I liked To Live and Die in LA this week. Another slayer was born, with Joss-style humor sans latex headgear.
http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=2&t=36214

Similar to the pre-BTVS Ladykiller Revolution, Total Recall 2070 TV series, where Matrix meets Blade Runner with brain chips, memory erasure and corporate death squads. Except women were sexy sex-crazed married hotties. With brain chips.

But it is DISTURBING to me that all these little girls are being brainwashed and recruited by TeeVee to be KILLERS. Not good news for guys playing the dating game, or hiring crazy hos.

CPB cop: "Your customers are spontaneously combusting."
REKALL rep: "We offer regular upgrades."
CPB cop: "Planned obsolescence."
REKALL rep: "We call it marketing."
-Total Recall 2070, Episode 13, Burning Desire
www.veoh.com/tv-shows/NBC-Total-Recall-2070

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Thursday, January 1, 2009 9:26 AM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!

Quote:
Originally posted by OPPYH:

Of all my Sunday screeners, this is the one we’ll have the longest wait for, debuting in its Friday-night "death slot," with a relocated Terminator as its lead-in, on Feb. 13.

That’s Friday the 13th.

I’m just saying.

So what is that saying about my TV show time slot of 1am EST on Friday nights (sat mornings)?

That's so late I can barely stay up to check quality control.

But it is streamed live worldwide, so it's primetime on the West Coast.
www.piratenews.org/pntv-live-video-stream.html

Looks like I'll run an MKULTRA show on Friday 13th.

"Sarah Conner Chronicles is my favorite Fox show. I had a hard time saying that for a long time."
-Joss Whedon, Access Hollywood: Dollhouse
http://ausiellofiles.ew.com/2008/12/exclusive-dollh.html

"Government control of communications and transportation."
-Communist Manifesto, 6th Plank

"As far as Chinese goes, I resented it."
-Adam Tudyk, The Making of Firefly
(video censored by youtube)

www.piratenews.org/fox-news-owned-by-communist-china.html

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

YOUR OPTIONS

SHARE THREAD

NEW POSTS TODAY

USER	POST DATE

USER

POST DATE