Best Villan by est120

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Best Villan

POSTED BY: EST120
UPDATED: Monday, June 7, 2004 03:14
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VIEWED: 5876
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Friday, June 4, 2004 7:46 AM

okay, to further elaborate on the other post about best guest star, who is your favorite villan or antagonist? it can be anyone, major or minor (ie you can pick Stern from Out of Gas if you want, but i am not sure why you would).

some nominees include:
saffron
niska
crow
blue hands men
early
dobson

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Friday, June 4, 2004 7:52 AM

TERRIBLETINK

I say Jubal Early. That man gave me nightmares.

My husband says Niska is the best villain. I told him, however, that his vote may not count since he doesn't frequent this site.

---------------------------------------------------
"I'll be in my bunk."

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Friday, June 4, 2004 8:21 AM

BLACKSHAMROCK5

Niska. Creepy old guy who tortures, and that little fact that he killed Mal or at least was the employer of someone who did. I think that counts.

Shamrock

You do as I say 'cause I said it!

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Friday, June 4, 2004 8:41 AM

ZOID

est120, and 'coats:

Much as I'd like to vote for Saffron, as usual, I really can't see her as a villain. I see her as more of a 'bad girl', who needs a good spankin' is all (we can take turns).

So, Niska? Nah. He talks tough and is properly psychotic; but only when the other guy is tied up. One-on-one, he's a pussy.

Crow? Too stupid to be scary. Good comic relief, though.

So, I guess I'm voting for Early. Threatened rape and cruelty to animals is pretty sick. Is it wrong that I liked his character so much?

Respectfully,

zoid
_________________________________________________

"I knew a man once. History will never recall him, or what he gave to make us free. That's the way he wanted it. But as long as I live I'll remember, and he'll never truly die."

- River, from A Child Shall Lead Them: A History of the Second War of Independence Wilkins, Richard

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Friday, June 4, 2004 8:43 AM

BROWNCOAT1

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

Got to cast my vote for Early. I know he was a villian, but his manner of speaking and coolness were a might unsettlin'. I think the character has a lot of potential if he ever surfaces again.

"May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one."

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Friday, June 4, 2004 8:53 AM

MALICIOUS

Can I just cast one big vote for Reavers??

Mal-licious

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Friday, June 4, 2004 9:32 AM

BIKISDAD

While I like all of the specific bad guys that we'd gotten to know by name, I'm going to vote for the "two-by-two, hands of blue" guys. Think about it. We don't know anything about them except that they use that little thingamabob to fry/explode (or whatever - apparently very painfully) the brain of anyone who's had even the most remote contact with River - even their own Alliance people. What do you think they'd do with our little crew when they find out that River's been with them all for months?

Apathy on the Rise. No One Cares.

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Friday, June 4, 2004 9:59 AM

SOPRANOSBROWNCOAT

I'm gonna have to agree with bikisdad on this one; the Blue Hands are the best villains, hands down (bad pun definitely not intended. . .I think). Sure, Jubal Early, Niska, and Saffron are great characters, but the Blue Hands have a certain menace about them because they're so mysterious. Watch the scene in "Ariel" again where Jayne, Simon, and River are fleeing the hospital, being pursued by something, which the audience knows are the Blue Hands. That scene, IMHO, is the creepiest portrayal of a villain ever put on film. The Blue Hands look human, but there's something just a bit off about them. Watch the look of fear on the characters' faces when they realize that something is in the next room; they're just not quite sure what.

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Friday, June 4, 2004 10:57 AM

RAISTLYNNE

Hmmm. Let's see. Here's a twist on the best villain: Jayne. The despicable act of betrayal for his own selfish gain in Ariel.

Best guest star is tough. They were all so good. Joss really lucked out in that regard. Gorram it!! Ok, the standouts were Richard Brooks as Early, Mark A. Sheppard as Badger.

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Friday, June 4, 2004 10:57 AM

PURPLEBELLY

Simon, with a big black moustache

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Friday, June 4, 2004 11:15 AM

KARENKAY99

i'll wanted to go with blue hands too, coz we know what they do. but mal and company don't know yet(i think river might though).

anyway, i think i'll vote reavers. they scare the hell out of mal, jayne, etc. so that scares me.

"They say the snow on the roof is too heavy. They say the ceiling will cave in. His brains are in terrible danger."

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Friday, June 4, 2004 11:32 AM

TEELABROWN

Jubul scared the guay outta me.

And Badger's pretty cool.

_____________
"Freedom is the Freedom to say that 2 plus 2 make 4. If that is granted, all else follows"-Winston, 1984
Teela Brown, keeper of bad typing.
"No one reads these things any way."- Bart on Blackboard

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Friday, June 4, 2004 11:38 AM

HOAGIE

i'm gonna go ahead and say Saffron. yeah, she's a bad girl but she's so damn devious.

Niska is sadistic and pays people well enough to do his messy work for him but, as was mentioned earlier, is not so much the tough guy when the chips are down and things are not going according to his plan.

Early, while cold and calculating, was not really able to think on his feet. he had a plan (get the Tams) and worked out a way to do it once he boarded. when the plan started going awry, he lost his cool and was not as threatening.

Saffron has a plan that has so many intricate twists and turns, yet can quickly adapt to any situation that comes up. plus the girl can do ANYTHING, be it seduce, hot-wire, field strip, reprogram, shoot, this girl is a threat even when she's naked! you have to constantly be on you toes around her and even then she's still dancing way ahead of you.

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Friday, June 4, 2004 12:05 PM

GREGGALLINSON

Niska. I still think that shot of him in War Stories right after he takes off Mal's blindfold is the single creepiest image in the entire series.

Runner up is Early. That seem right to you?

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Friday, June 4, 2004 12:50 PM

GEORDIESTEVE2003

Have to say Reavers for me. We ain't never even seen them, and they give me the creeps, the ghost stories are the best. The sooner we see them full on and instead of on an angle, they won't be scary no more, look at the Borg. They scared me senseless as a kid, now we know all about them and have seen them so much, they're as scary as pandas.

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Friday, June 4, 2004 2:34 PM

ANNIK

For real-life historical reasons, I think guys like Niska are definitely the creepiest. To be able to live like he does because that's just his business and his reputation is extremely scary ... Jubal seems downright crazy, which gives him an excuse for his crazy behaviour.

My runner-up is the 'daddy' (sorry, his name escapes me at the moment) in Heart of Gold: the scene where he forces the turncoat prostitute to give him head in front of the 'decent townsmen' also shows a high degree of well-thought-out contempt for his fellow humans.

Cheers,
Annik
... my sister's a ship. We had a complicated childhood.

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Friday, June 4, 2004 3:59 PM

MISSAYATAM

My vote is for the hands of blue guys. Anyone who can do to River what they did is the biggest villain in my book. That and they wear creepy blue gloves, that just gives me a creepy serial killer vibe.

I love Simon!

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Friday, June 4, 2004 5:29 PM

JESS

My favorite would be Badger. He's got style. That's very important in a villan.

But the ones that scare me the most are the blue hand group. The scene in Ariel where with the feds makes me shudder no matter how many times I watch it.

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Friday, June 4, 2004 6:42 PM

DAVCO92

Damn, no way for me to choose. It depends too much on what kind of mood I'm in at the moment. I'd probably have to say 50/50 Reavers & Blue Hands because the true depths of their evil, who/what they really are and why they do what they do, are still unknown...and the unknown can be deeply terrifying.

OK, total hypothetical tangent. Early gets hired by Niska to hunt down Mal. He runs afoul of some Blue Hands twins and since his mind is "special" he ends up being used in one of their "training programs" rather than killed. Later he faces off against the crew of Serenity and is defeated again, but escapes...only to be captured by Reavers and converted. So, you end up with Early the River Reaver...I think "ERR" could be sorta scary.

Edit: Plus, it goes so well with the Mutant Enemy credits.

Burn the land, boil the sea...

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Friday, June 4, 2004 7:28 PM

FIREFLYTHEMOVIE

When I first started reading I thought, "Jubal, hands down, how come there's so much discussion?" I changed my mind about 8 times reading the thread...

I think I'm back to Jubal, though, with Reavers poised to overtake him at any second. Jubal's brilliant but crazy. And calculating. (Whoever said he lost his cool once things went awry: it took quite awhile for him to lose his cool. It wasn't until River made him think he was even crazier than he actually was that he really lost it.) But he's also unpredictable, and entirely capable of just about any kind or degree of violence to achieve his ends.

Reavers are...well, they're even less predictable than Jubal. Also, there's the idea that each of us is capable of becoming one of them, which I think of as worse than death. But still not creepier than Early.

The Blue Hands don't make the cut for me. Too predictable. They're going to come after River, and kill anyone who gets in their way. Painfully, sure, but it's quick.

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Saturday, June 5, 2004 2:13 PM

LUPINADDAMS

Didn't mean for this to end up as a haiku, but sod it, it did...

The best Firefly villain?
Wash's T. Rex.
His is an evil laugh.

You know you're watching too much Firefly when you write haiku replies to poll questions...

"You are what you do."
Andrew Vacchs

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Saturday, June 5, 2004 2:46 PM

BIKISDAD

Quote:
Originally posted by LupinAddams:
Didn't mean for this to end up as a haiku, but sod it, it did...

The best Firefly villain?
Wash's T. Rex.
His is an evil laugh.

You know you're watching too much Firefly when you write haiku replies to poll questions...

"You are what you do."
Andrew Vacchs

I don't know how good that is as a haiku, but I like it. And Wash's T. Rex is certainly the FUNNIEST villain.

Apathy on the Rise. No One Cares.

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Sunday, June 6, 2004 4:13 AM

RUTHIE

sorry - must have clicked twice :(

*******************
Ruthie
*******************
By the data to date, there is only one animal in the Galaxy dangerous to man - man himself. So he must supply his own indispensable competition. He has no enemy to help him. (R.A.Heinlein)

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Sunday, June 6, 2004 4:13 AM

RUTHIE

My vote for the best villan would have to be the whole gorram Allience.
Whatever evil individuals do compares NOTHING to the power of an evil totallitarian state.

*******************
Ruthie
*******************
By the data to date, there is only one animal in the Galaxy dangerous to man - man himself. So he must supply his own indispensable competition. He has no enemy to help him. (R.A.Heinlein)

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Sunday, June 6, 2004 5:05 AM

CYBERSNARK

This question is multifacetted.

Early, the BlueHands, and the Reavers are all great villains IMHO, but I'm gonna have to vote for Early, 'cause he's the most unique.

I've encountered BlueHand and Reaver analogues before --plus, they're an impersonal force. As intimidating as that can be, Early is more interesting from a character point of view.

Sure, he's a terrifying villain, but Early's the kind of bad guy you can strike up a fascinating conversation with, and who, as much as you want to escape, you can't seem to want to leave. I mean, did anybody not say to themselves "I'll miss him" in the last scene of OiS? He just doesn't seem like the bad guy --he's just got his own agenda (and a sick, twisted personality). If you ran into him, say, at a bar on U-day, he'd be perfectly civil.

The only other villains who've struck me this way (villains I'd like to meet) are Demona (from Gargoyles), Sesshoumaru (from InuYasha), Shinzon (from Star Trek Nemesis), and Dukat (from DS9).

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Sunday, June 6, 2004 5:49 AM

BIKISDAD

Quote:
Originally posted by Cybersnark:
This question is multifacetted.

Early, the BlueHands, and the Reavers are all great villains IMHO, but I'm gonna have to vote for Early, 'cause he's the most unique.

The only other villains who've struck me this way (villains I'd like to meet) are Demona (from Gargoyles), Sesshoumaru (from InuYasha), Shinzon (from Star Trek Nemesis), and Dukat (from DS9).

I'd like to throw in another really likeable villain (not from Firefly): Richard Wilkins III, former Mayor of Sunnydale. In addition to being completely evil, he was the consummate, "tell all the voters what they want to hear" politician. I think he may have actually been modeled after one of our former presidents.

Apathy on the Rise. No One Cares.

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Sunday, June 6, 2004 6:18 AM

CAPNRAHN

All in all and my top choice:ADALEA NISKA - as a individual who controls a larger group. His evil is calculated and he works from the shadows. He sorta reminds me of a FireFly vesion of Scorpius from Farscape, sans the physical capibilities.

JUBAL EARLY: As the single individual. His creepifin' attitude and physical aptitude gives him the edge in the lone merc area. His weak point is his own mental weaknesses, as shown exploited by River.

BLUE SUN: (2x2) as the MASSIVE Big Bad. Huge manpower, military clout, corporate power and sheer singled mindness of purpose. But the weak point {which, ironacally, is also a strong point} - we don't know them hardly at all.

REAVERS: High potental to be my top choice! But so little info, mostly folklore. Why list them? I am sure the expriments with River and the 2x2s are an effort that will result in war aginst the Reavers - who are the only "Indpendents" left in this 'Verse. But, that is just my speculation based on my observations.

SAFFRON: She is ... more akin to an anti-hero. Likable, nice to look at, yet TOTALLY selfish. Much like Han Solo before he got "Skywalkered"

"Remember, there is only ONE absolute - There ARE NO absolutes!!!"

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Sunday, June 6, 2004 7:37 AM

ELWOODMOM

Niska, definately Niska. Jubal didn't scare me at all, in fact is was slightly humorous to see him crack. But Niska...(shudders!)

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Sunday, June 6, 2004 7:52 AM

PURPLEBELLY

Quote:
Originally posted by Elwoodmom:
Niska, definately Niska.

But don't forget At diner, I am getting earful. How scary is Mrs. Niska?

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Sunday, June 6, 2004 11:42 AM

ELWOODMOM

Probably worse! Then again, Niska most likely wouldn't be married. Too evil!

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Sunday, June 6, 2004 12:31 PM

PURPLEBELLY

Quote:
Originally posted by Elwoodmom:
Probably worse! Then again, Niska most likely wouldn't be married. Too evil!

IIRC in The Train Job the exemplary corpse is that of Niska's wife's nephew, hence the earful.

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Sunday, June 6, 2004 1:56 PM

ELWOODMOM

Hmmmm...missed that tidbit somehow.

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Monday, June 7, 2004 1:57 AM

MANTICHORUS

Quote:
Originally posted by bikisdad:
While I like all of the specific bad guys that we'd gotten to know by name, I'm going to vote for the "two-by-two, hands of blue" guys. Think about it. We don't know anything about them except that they use that little thingamabob to fry/explode (or whatever - apparently very painfully) the brain of anyone who's had even the most remote contact with River - even their own Alliance people. What do you think they'd do with our little crew when they find out that River's been with them all for months?

Apathy on the Rise. No One Cares.

I agree; the Blue Handed guys are great villains.
And I think that device is supposed to make people's brains haemorrhage (at least, that's what I've always presumed...)

-------------------------------------------
"BADGER: You think you're better than other people.
MAL: Just the ones I'm better than."
-------------------------------------
"MAL: Gotta say, doctor, your talent for alienatin' folk is near miraculous.
SIMON: Yes, I'm very proud."

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Monday, June 7, 2004 3:14 AM

STICKS

2 by 2 hands of BLUE.

Without doubt these villians are great and need to be explored more.

are there just the two of them? or do they have to work in two?
whats with the gloves?
and that device they use(freaky)?
where did they come from?
are they controled?
and if yes who by?
what did they do to river & why ?
why dont they bleed when they use the device ?

and many more.

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