if the show didnt get cancelled, who do you think wouldve been the first to die? by standing8

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

if the show didnt get cancelled, who do you think wouldve been the first to die?

POSTED BY: STANDING8
UPDATED: Thursday, July 8, 2004 19:10
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 11505
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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 12:40 PM

i think book wouldve died first. he had the most mysterious past and i figure his past wouldve eventually caught up to him and he'd get killed or something. and it would happen right after he reveals who he truly is to the other crew members. but his death wouldnt have been in vain cause he would have died sacraficing himself for the crew cause hes the oldest and thats just the kind of person he is.

all this would have happened in the season finale for the third season. yeah, the third season would be my guess for a HUGE "shake up the show" event.

ahhhhh, what couldve been...

-Soul Rebel-

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 12:49 PM

SOUTHERNMERC

Yikes! Can't (or don't want to) imagine ANY of our BDH dying. However, I wouldn't put it past Joss to do such a thing. Book dying first tho? Hard to say WHO would go first.

Jayne: "You got yourself lookin' mighty hideous!"

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 1:10 PM

KARENKAY99

yeah, i could see it happening that way. but third season is wishful thinking. i bet someone was set to die first season. and i think book is a good guess.

"They say the snow on the roof is too heavy. They say the ceiling will cave in. His brains are in terrible danger."

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 1:27 PM

EMBERS

My money is on Inara dying...
first she and Mal will declare their undying love
and they will have the perfect night together
and then Joss will ruthlessly cut her down like a dog
it is his way....

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 2:50 PM

ECGORDON

There's no place I can be since I found Serenity.

I think it would have been either Wash or Zoe.

Mal is the center of the show, and the death of either of those two would have produced the most stress and tension for him.

wo men ren ran zai fei xing.

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 3:08 PM

TERRIBLETINK

I think Jayne would have been the first to go.

There are two things that could happen with his character - he was destined to either betray them or become good ol' reliable Jayne who has learned his lesson. That tension can only build so long. So my guess is that he would have gone first.

If he never betrayed them again, the character loses his edge that makes him intriguing. If he did betray them, Mal would have never let him live.

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 3:12 PM

HKCAVALIER

I think losing any of the cast would be like amputating a limb: it would cripple the show. Beyond that, no one on the crew would die, 'cause you'd just have to get a new regular to take their place and who could fill those shoes? Same for Simon, 'cause they'd just have to get a new medic. So Book, Inara, or River. I don't think it would be Inara 'cause she and Mal have too much going on between them for that. It'd be like killing off Rachel at the end of the third season of Friends (o' course, plenty of you might like the sound of that

). I thought I heard Joss somewhere say he wasn't planning to kill anybody 'cause he had so many stories to tell about them. Was it in a commentary? I seem to remember him doing that shudder/giggle that he does. Did I dream it?

I like the idea of everyone surviving to at least the fifth season. Maybe some favorite guest stars could die. Some villain or other. But let's just leave Mal, Zoe, Wash, Jayne, Kaylee, Simon, Book, Inara & River be for now.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 3:26 PM

CHRISTHECYNIC

I have trouble seeing any of them die, not just because I don't want it to happen but also because I find it unlikely. Those who go into dangerous situations are highly skilled at dealing with them, and the doctor is one of the best.

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 3:54 PM

STANDING8

if the show went on, i think no one would have died until more than a few seasons into the series. since the show is so focused on the characters and character development. i would think joss would want more than a few seasons to accomplish that first. then do something like this to shake things up.

inara wouldnt go anywhere because of the sexual tension with the captain so she would stay(if they hadnt messed around by that point). ummm, river wouldnt go anywhere cause from the start she seemed to be the focal point of the series and pushed the main story of firefly along. and i think that would leave the doctor safe.

i dont know, i see book as the guy to go first.

and i changed my mind, maybe not until the fourth season until joss shocks us with something like this.(wow, imagine of we actually had 4 wonderful seasons of firefly. man, it hurts and depresses me just thinking of that)

-Soul Rebel-

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 4:10 PM

JELLO

Definitely Inara. It wouldn't be a Joss Whedon show without the death of a beloved character, i.e. Buffy, Angel, Joyce, Tara, Doyle, Darla, Cordelia, Fred, Wesley. Need I say more? That's what makes his shows so great. Some would be scared to even attempt something like that because of what the fan reaction might be, but not him. He seems to get off on pulling a 180 and go in a totally different direction than the fans thought the story might go. That's storytelling! Keeping your readers/viewers on the edge of their seats, craving more. Not a lot of people have that gift. Being a third generation writer, I guess somethings just rub off.

------------------------------
I'll be in my bunk.
------------------------------

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 4:19 PM

RIVERGIRL

Noooooooooooooooooo

no one dies

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 4:25 PM

PROFESSOR

Zoe, I could see her coming between a bullet meant for anyone else, especially the captain. Besides the only real relationship on the show is Zoe and Wash and that certainly can't last too long, it's a Whedon show. And just think of the tension between Mal and Wash if Zoe died on Mal's mission protecting Mal.

-Professor's fiance

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 4:40 PM

NIGHTTRAIN

I think River would be the first to go. That would allow a lot of interesting storyline with what would happen with Simon after losing the sister that he gave up everything to save. I'd like to see a dark, brooding simon would be very interesting to see.

Actually just about any character dying would make for some very interesting character interactions. Except maybe jayne. Probably only the viewers would care if he died.

"You gone got yourself lookin' mighty hideous" ~Jayne

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 5:07 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

Every new post had me convinced, until I read the next one.

It could be the 'least important' character - the one with only a first name who's supposed to die, as explained in Galaxy Quest. I think that makes Book the first.

On the other hand, in FF some situations do seem dead-end, thematically. They have to go one way or the other, b/c it just isn't believable they'd go on and on, and on ... and on, on the razor's edge, forever ....

... or, a character dies.

So unless there's a way to resolve Mal and Inara, Jayne and Mal, Kaylee and Simon ...

I guess I'd have to say Inara. But that could merely be a function of my inability to come up with a satisfactory evolution of that story. And that's why I'm not a writer. That, and well, it's painful and it take a lot of creativity and so on.

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 5:43 PM

BLACKSHAMROCK5

I would also have to say Inara, but with Joss you never know...

Shamrock

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 5:58 PM

GWALLY

I would like to think that Mr. Joss had planned to keep the whole cast around for quite a while, if not forever, but he also had probably made contingency plans just in case.... I'm just jaded enough about television production to understand that sometimes contracting issues, actor's sensibilities, or audience dissapproval can force cast changes, and death of the character is one very effective way to cover for the absence of an actor.

Still, if Joss had had his way, I think Zoe would have been the first to go, but I don't know why...

Geez! This is a morbid thread!

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 8:01 PM

PURPLEBELLY

Quote:
Originally posted by Gwally:
Still, if Joss had had his way, I think Zoe would have been the first to go, but I don't know why...

Select to view spoiler:

Purplebelly's Denouement

I agree Zoe's death is the one that is essential for series development; she is the Ma Joad foundation of the Firefly family.
After her death, Mal and Wash surrender to opium and alcohol. Kaylee and Serenity are grounded though continuing to care for the former captain and pilot.
The fates of Book and Inara are not pivotal; they can die or return to their former careers after completion of their roles in the demise of Blue Sun.
River needs to be alive to enter the witness programme against Blue Sun, so a subsequent death would be quixotic; you could argue that the re-programming she undergoes is a form of death as it leaves her a happy cabbage.
Simon, as Whedon's alter-ego, survives to return to his career and to oversee the care of his invalid sister. Jayne is the one character who can live happily-ever-after as the majordomo of Simon's loft apartment which he has tastefully decorated in the fashionable Serenity mode; it is his threat to kill Mal that keeps Kaylee from appealing to Simon for help.

Serenity is recrewed in the following season. With a new cast each season, Whedon has found a way to free himself from the prima donna; for a writer, that's a real happy ending

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 9:26 PM

TALONPEST

Definitely River. She was just there as a plot device to add the X-Files element to the show, so once they followed that plot to its logical conclusion she would become far too powerful to remain on the ship. Joss has always said that Firefly was supposed to be about the little people that history forgets about, and that doesn't describe what River would have become when she got her act together.

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 9:36 PM

JCOBB

Joss would do the entirely unexpected and kill Mal.

I don't care, I'm still free.

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 10:22 PM

SLOWSMURF

That is the benefit of not having a title character :)

I agree, were anyone to die, it wouldn't have been for a while.

Oh, and he did kill Mal. Go technicalities :)

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 11:24 PM

DRAKON

Mal already died. He got better.
Death is not the disadvantage that it used to be. Especially on a Joss Whedon show.

"Wash, where is my damn spaceship?"

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 11:25 PM

SOLON

The smart money is definitely on Inara, Jayne, or Book going first. In that order of probability I’m inclined to believe.

My personal opinion however, based on nothing more than my gut feeling, and ME’s proud, Doylesque tradition, is that Wash may in fact have been the first to go. Wash is a sweet, funny, easily likeable guy, which just makes it all the more tragic. His untimely and/or unnatural death however opens up all kinds of very interesting dramatic territory most obviously between the captain and Zoë, whose widowing would take her in a very interesting, and probably scary direction. Wash’s death would catch everyone off guard, and create a very real problem for continued smuggling and for everyone on board generally with the sudden dramatic decline in piloting talent on board. He’s also the person on the crew, perhaps excluding Kaylee, who seems to least have it coming. Wash’s death would be a shocking, unexpected, brutal blow, both to his shipmates, and to the show’s audience. Because of this, I wouldn’t be surprised if it was Wash who was on the most borrowed of time.

If it were up to me though, I’d’ve put Inara on the chopping block first. The prostitute-as-philosopher thing had some merit, and there was certainly some unexplored territory with the character herself, but she seemed by far the least interesting, the least compelling, the least likable of all the travelers, and the most easily replaceable. Her high status as a companion was used as a plot device many times; too many times for my personal taste. Her own decisions and development seemed to be leading her away from the rest of the crew fairly rapidly anyway. Instead of incorporating herself into the Serenity crew, and making the Serenity her home, as Simon, River, and Book, who been aboard for far less time were doing, she was increasingly isolating herself as the series went on. There was definitely more ground to explore with her, but I’m unsure as to how much more of it was going to be interesting, fresh ground.

The role that Inara fills on the ship could be partially or completely filled by a number of interesting possibilities. In fact, there had been some introduction of some potentially edgier replacements. The return of Yo-Saff-Bridge is a possible example. She obviously could fulfill the role of unrequited romantic foil for Mal, in addition to the distrustworthy dynamic that she brings to the shipboard situation. Quite frankly, I’d like to have been able to see her interact with Jayne on a more continuous basis. Those two together could’ve led to some very serious, and entertaining trouble. Whether you like, hate or are indifferent to the concept of Our Mrs. Reynolds being around on a more long-term basis, you do have to admit that she has the uncanny ability to complicate a scenario. She has the added benefit of being quite handy, and unopposed to helping out, in a heist situation. The indiscriminate brain-melter happiness of the Blue-hands could’ve lead to the defection of some sort of a former Alliance agent who’d been in prolonged contact with River Tam, and thus fears having been put into the queue for having his cerebrum extracted through his nose if he turns them in, but who is able to retain some pull with local Alliance, either through simple, elaborate, or double-crossingly nonexistent deception. New temporary or “Temporary” passengers or long-term shuttle tenants are also a ready possibility.

I think it’s fairly clear that had the show gone on long enough for the producers to start offing beloved characters in classic ME style, that the show had fairly limitless and interesting potential for growth for better or worse beyond what it was when we all loved it(or at least liked it enough to be speculating or lurking on these boards over "what could've been"). I can’t bring myself to think that it’s a good thing that Firefly died before it produced a single horribly bad episode.

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 11:43 PM

RICHARDWORTHINGTON

It would be Zoe, probably some big firefight, the crew taking on overwhelming odds and winning, Zoe turning to walk back and check they are alright and gettign shot by one enemy who is not yet dead. After this both Mal and Wash would be seriously affested, Mal has always had a dark side but showing Wash going for revenge and not caring about what happens to him in the process is a classic, if cliched story. An evolution of Wash as he tries to come to terms with Zoe's death would be good, plus there has to be his and Zoe's baby thrown in somewhere, either born just before the event that sparks this firefight or managed to be saved while Zoe dies.

"Well my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle."

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 11:55 PM

SOLON

Quote:
Originally posted by Talonpest:
Definitely River. She was just there as a plot device to add the X-Files element to the show, so once they followed that plot to its logical conclusion she would become far too powerful to remain on the ship. Joss has always said that Firefly was supposed to be about the little people that history forgets about, and that doesn't describe what River would have become when she got her act together.

I don't know about that. Even if River was just a plot device to disappear when her arc is over, which I doubt, I don't think that she'd be the first to die anyway. Do not count on that story being bloodless on either side. The Blue Hands don't seen shy about leaving bodies in their wake looking for her. The alliance is coming after her with more than just those nifty little stun guns, and River lives with several people ready, willing, and able to kill to defend her(including herself apparently), as well as at least one who is willing to put his life on the line for her in a more direct, unquestioning way.

Even if you see River as nothing more than the means to an interesting story, and again, I question the depth of your perception on that particular issue, I would be quite surprised if she were the first to die or disappear from the ship permanently. More than anyone else on the ship, her story is intimately linked with Mal and Zoë’s story. Her loss mirrors their loss. Her brother may have lost his home, his job, his property, and his preconceived perceptions of the order of the galaxy to the Alliance in order to get her back, but he is still fundamentally the same person. River is deeply and irrevocably changed by her involvement with them. River’s life, her freedom, her rights, her very person were valueless to these people who conquered the known galaxy, and who altered this girl. What was done to her, and what is happening to her as a result may be an interesting story, but they are not all that River is. She is more than what they’ve done to her. She is more than that to her brother, She is becoming more than that to her shipmates, and most importantly, she is more than that to herself. That’s why I think that she is more than just a plot device. She’s a girl who has a potentially very interesting existence beyond the chase that she is currently embroiled in. She may or may not survive it. She is in fact obviously in more than a bit of peril, but she’s a legitimate character, albeit an unusual one, and I’d be very surprised if she was destined to be the first of the nine to be shuffled off.

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 1:43 AM

BROWNCOAT1

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

As much as I hate to think of a beloved BDH being killed off on the show, we all know how Joss is only too comfortable w/ killing off characters.

We already saw Mal die, although only briefly. I think we would have seen several more near death or brief death instances w/ several of the characters, then at the end of season two we would have seen either Book or Simon die.

Book has the whole mysterious past thing going. At some point he would have revealed to, or had revealed by another character, who & what he was in the past. I think that tension and mistrust would have followed being resolved when Book sacrificed himself to save a crew memeber or the entire crew.

It could also be Simon. As we discover more about what was done to River, the Blue Hands get more deadly in their attempts to recover River. Near the end of season 2 River would become more coherent, finally coming to grips w/ what was done to her and why. The Blue Hands, or their agents, would be about to bring her in when Simon sacrifices himself to save her. This would result in some serious drama for both River and Kaylee.

"May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one."

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 4:09 AM

SHINYSEVEN

Whosever agent asks for the largest salary increase!

But in plot terms, Zoe would be the LAST to go, not the first, because she's the best able to take care of herself, even if her body armor has a few dings.

The Jossverse is a hospitable place for Ophelia-esque crazy girls, so River has job security. I agree that killing Simon to save River would be the high-angst option, and that always appeals to a segment of the viewership.

As a Blakes7 fan, I find the idea of a show about Mal that doesn't have Mal in it half the time strangely appealing, but I agree that for ordinary series purposes Mal *has* to stay alive, and Inara is the most expendable because she has the most tenuous connection to the crew. On the other hand, she also has places she can go (and probably so does Book, depending on what HIS damage is) and therefore can be out of the show without being killed off.

Sadistic crap legitimized by florid prose

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 5:25 AM

SOLON

Quote:
Originally posted by BrownCoat1:
It could also be Simon. As we discover more about what was done to River, the Blue Hands get more deadly in their attempts to recover River. Near the end of season 2 River would become more coherent, finally coming to grips w/ what was done to her and why. The Blue Hands, or their agents, would be about to bring her in when Simon sacrifices himself to save her. This would result in some serious drama for both River and Kaylee.

I'd agree that Simon is definitely next in the order of most likely to die first, maybe even beating out Book for the dubious honor; what with his devotion to his sister and propensity for getting into violent situations that he hasn't the physical prowess to extricate himself from. I tend to think however, that he has great potential for growth in many different directions; many of which are interesting. The same is not necessarily true of Jayne and Inara. I think keeping Simon around has a better payoff than speeding him to the grave, or the post-office box as the case may be.

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 6:07 AM

LIZ

I don't want to think about any of them dying... but i find it terribly interesting that there is a theory for everyone in the cast except Kaylee.

what, we like her too much to consider it? she's the heart of the ship, the optimistic one, the one death that would be the hardest for everyone (audience and crew member alike) so it would have the most impact. (oh wait, are we not saying Kaylee because Jewel sometimes stops by?

)

I don't think anyone would want Kaylee to go, but all the more reason to wonder if she'd be first (after all we nearly lost her in the pilot).

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 6:42 AM

STANDING8

inara wouldnt die cause shes the eye candy. as hot as kaylee is and fly zoe is, inara is the obvious eye candy imo. but even storywise inara is a very important cause she provides access to alot of places(upperclass places perhaps) where the crew might not have access to. and with that comes more opportunities for different stories to tell, shes the key for that. you could argue the doctor but he cant cause hes a fugitive. i think she would have stuck around for awhile.

after book i would think either river dies, or goes missing. but down the line i saw river getting better mentally and being more powerful. and turned evil for a period like willow in buffy.

-Soul Rebel-

http://www.livejournal.com/users/standing8/

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 6:49 AM

CAPTAINTIGHTPANTS

I think it will be whichever actor gets offered the best pilot option first. Something they can't say "no" to.

How's that for cynical?

You're gonna come with us...

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 6:49 AM

CAPTAINTIGHTPANTS

I think it will be whichever actor gets offered the best pilot option first. Something they can't say "no" to.

How's that for cynical?

You're gonna come with us...

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 7:31 AM

POPEBOB

I think that none of the cast would die untill the Final episode.. then everone would get axed in one fell swoop. Whne that Final season would have been who knows.. but i guarantee you that if that was indeed going to be the case.. it would have been a 2 hour finale, all guns a blazin'

I think we would have found out about Book being Ex-Alliance Black Ops, and that he acctualy is a Preacher seeking redemtion for his past. I think the Hands-o-Blue, twins would have caught up to River about the end of season 2 and she would "Kill them with her Brain" and then later in say Season 5 she would actualy have her chance to show her true potential and strike up a Telepathic raport with the Reavers and give Mall the Army he needs to strike back at the alliance in a Second Browncoat Rebelion.

Perhaps a little fanciful but not completley absurd.

Simon and Kaylee would get Married about Season 4. Zoe would suffer a grevious wound some wehere along the way and be unable to have children like her and Wash had wanted. Inara would leave the ship but not the Show. She would probaly end up being an anchor for safe haven for the crew of Serenity on whatever world she left for. Jayne would get a letter from his sister telling of his mom's death. I figure this would probably happen in the Same episode that Inara leaves and they would swap Inara for Jayne's sister. Oh the fun that could be had with that idea. The tension between Mal and Inara would be swaped for good ol fasioned sibling Rivalry. I think we would see at least one more episode with Yo/Saph/Brige an quite a few with Niska and Badger.

Thats my thoughts. maybe you agree.. but Only Joss knows the answers.

Ahhhh.. Curse you sudden but inevitable betrayal!!

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 7:54 AM

DUKE

Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:
I think losing any of the cast would be like amputating a limb: it would cripple the show.

That's true to an extent. However, I beleive that Firefly benefited from a genuine sence of immediacy and danger.

Unlike the various Treks, where we always know that the bridge crew is safe and only the red shirts die, Firely came, for me at least, with no built in safety nets.

I mean, I really beieved that Jayne was going to get dumped out that airlock....

"I'll be in my bunk..."

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 8:04 AM

PURPLEBELLY

Quote:
Originally posted by liz:
but i find it terribly interesting that there is a theory for everyone in the cast except Kaylee.

Select to view spoiler:

Purplebelly's Denouement

There's a sense in which Kaylee as we love her dies; she stops being cheerful, she can no longer maintain her good girl, Serenity. Hers is the cruelest end, because she is fully aware of it.

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 8:33 AM

RELFEXIVE

All great ideas there.

But Jayne... Imagine: the crew gets betrayed, it's so obviously, clearly Jayne, and Mal gets a mite tetchy and kills him.

Only it wasn't Jayne, of course.

So... who was it? duh duh DUUHH!!

All a bit obvious, of course.

Mal: "We're not gonna die. We can't die, Bendis. You know why? Because we are so... very... pretty. We are just too pretty for God to let us die."

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 9:48 AM

HATEHATEHATEFOX

I think it would have been Wash too.

The "NoooooooOOOOOOOOooooooo" factor is very high when you think about him getting iced and we all know how that tickles JW. Plus, it allows you to keep the remainder of the characters in place.

If Zoe were to die, it seems unlikely that Wash would stick around. He was highly sought after as a pilot (as we hear in OoG) and has demonstrated that he chafes under Mal's rule. So by killing Zoe, you'd be losing 2 characters in effect, imho.

And, as another poster mentioned it adds all kinds of new and exciting emotions all around the ship.

Mal has to be all practical and stuff and get himself a new pilot. The new pilot will have to face the inevitable and probably waspish comparisons to Wash's piloting skills. Plus watching him/her just trying to fit into the dynamic would be very interesting as well.

~~~~~~~~
Nothing is ever so profoundly regretted as a kind act.
Robertson Davies

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 1:42 PM

MANWITHPEZ

Important people don't do field work.

Personally, I'm for the Jayne side of dying first. But, it being Joss, he would've done something horrible, and then something fantastic to redeem himself, and everyone would've been torn up by it. Especially if he fell to Reavers, since he's the most fear he's shown on the show was about them. I mean just a really, horrible, messy death the the crwe had no other option but to leave him to it. Yeah, that sounds about right to me.

Kaylee: "What's so damn important about being proper? It don't mean nothing out here in the black."
Simon: "It means more out here. It's all I have..."

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 3:14 PM

Quote:
Death is not the disadvantage that it used to be.

It doesn't screw your career up like it used to ;)

Wash is probably a good bet, although I am now in love with this image of Zoe dying. Her getting shot during some wacky fun. Her being not long pregnant. Her demanding that Simon keep her alive until they can steal the mechanical womb needed to keep their child alive, because there's just no hope for her. It taking quite a few episodes for her to finally snuff it. Wash staying because, hey, Serenity is what's keeping his child alive (you can't unplug these big unwieldy mechanical wombs, you know). Also, Zoe telling Wash that he has to stay, for some reason as yet unknown to me. The tension between Mal and Wash racking up to unimagined heights. Kaylee grieving for Zoe but loving the baby.

I doubt that would have happened. But if it were my show, it would have happened.

Kaylee can't be the one to die, though, because she's the heart of the story. As Joss has said so many times, if Kaylee says someone is good or bad or whatever, the audience believes that someone is good or bad or whatever. You can't lose that. Nor could you lose Mal; it is, at the end of the day, his story. He's why everyone is there, after all.

Jayne's a tricky one. It's true that there's a use-by date on his story; either he betrays them or he 'joins' them, thus killing his ambiguity. Something would have to be done with him, but I think death is just the easy way out.

It won't kill the crew enough if Simon or River die. So it wouldn't be them.

Could be Book. Would be better if he died before he told all. Perhaps all could be gradually found out after his death, as a direct result of some wacky fun that comes about because of Book's death.

Could be Inara. But it wouldn't have a big enough effect, I think.

No, I would kill Zoe. Definitely. She's the best candidate for maximum pain all around. Ooh, also, because her death would kill Wash, too, in a sense. He'd be a bit more subdued. Excellent stuff.

JK

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 4:37 PM

CARDIE

Joss has killed off a lot of recurring characters, but his original ensembles have a pretty good survival rate, at least until the show's final seasons. Look at Buffy--the core regular cast was originally Buffy, Willow, Xander, Giles and Angel. None of them died permanently in either Buffy or Angel. Doyle dying is the really big exception. The carnage on Angel didn't otherwise kick in for those in the opening credits until the second half of the final season.

So I don't think anyone in the cast would have died any time soon.

Cardie

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 5:20 PM

NOSADSEVEN

I'm not going to speculate much on who'd go first, but ever since HoG I've always envisioned the Zoe-with-child scenario RichardWorthington brought up.

My vision of it involves a seemingly pointless death, a kind of after the danger has passed some stupid thing ultimately caused by some guest character's weenieness. When it becomes apparent that Zoe is down for the count, Mal just goes to that dark place, finds aforementioned weenie guest character, and without even noticing anyone else is there, kills the sad SOB with his bare hands, then, again not noticing the rest of the crew (sans Wash who is still lost in his own grief with Zoe) witnessing this, he just kind of walks off to his bunk or something. Meanwhile, the crew is not only devastated by Zoe's demise, but equally unsettled by Mal's reaction - though no one even attempts to intervene. So, Mal's out of the picture for a while, and Simon determines either that they can deliver the baby (depending how far along Zoe was) or that she can be kept alive on life support in order to carry the baby to term.

I find the baby angle intriguing because it forces the survivors to keep it together. It contrasts the devastating loss and grief with the gift and responsibility of parenthood. It keeps Mal and Wash connected, because you know Mal would be devoted to Zoe's child. And, with Zoe being Mal's only connection to who he once was, that part of Zoe would seem to be the only thing keeping him tethered to the person he was. And of course, you have the whole magic of parenthood (via Joss's idea of "made" family) as giving Mal more to live for than just to keep flying, and at the same time, so much more to lose.

Zoe never seemed to have lost her self in the war quite the way Mal had, and it seems like in Wash she had found the joy that she had lost. Mal had never allowed himself that kind of healing, and the wounds just kind of scabbed over without healing. Zoe's death would serve as a catalyst to kind of tear open those wounds again, but in the context of their "made" family on Serenity, and the responsibility and wonder of a child, his wounds would finally have a chance to get cleaned out properly and begin to truly heal. Sure, they would still be tender, and there would always be scars, but that's a far cry from the festering we currently see.

~~~~~~~~~
Ain't. We. Just.

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 7:02 PM

THEZOOMZOOMKID

I think Book would have been the first to go. Mabye Joss was gonna pull a Doyle on us and kill him off very early.

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Wednesday, July 7, 2004 8:38 PM

CATNAMEDDUDE

Ok, since we are all speculating, here's my two cents on
a possible story-line. Zoe and Walsh have been having trouble having a baby. Zoe wants a baby badly , so without
Walsh's knowledge she visits some quack doctor/scientist
that says he can make it happen. (Simon having already
told her it would be impossible). Some time later Zoe
becomes pregnant, by Walsh, and everything seems
hunky dory. All except for River, who has become
annoyingly interested in the new baby. Turns out the
quack was an ex-employee of the Blue Sun corporation, on
the run from the Blue Hands himself, who gets his income
from helping couples with enough cash to conceive. Zoe
dies in childbirth (Simon valiantly tries to save her) . A
grief stricken Walsh decides to leave Serenity with his new
daughter after a period of mourning, until River drops the
bombshell. Zoe's little girl is just like her, and that
father and daughter would be safer within the friendly
walls of Serenity. Could happen.

My food is problematic.

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Thursday, July 8, 2004 1:07 PM

BLACKSHAMROCK5

Quote:
Originally posted by Cardie:
Joss has killed off a lot of recurring characters, but his original ensembles have a pretty good survival rate, at least until the show's final seasons. Look at Buffy--the core regular cast was originally Buffy, Willow, Xander, Giles and Angel.

I don't want to be especially picky but Cordelia was among the original members of Buffy and Angel and she ended up dying.

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Thursday, July 8, 2004 4:34 PM

CARDIE

But Cordy only died during the last season of Angel (and that was because of budget cuts and Charisma's inconvenient pregnancy). My point was that original cast members usually didn't die until it was known the shows were in their last seasons. Also, Charisma wasn't in the original title credits on Buffy, was she?

Cardie

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Thursday, July 8, 2004 5:39 PM

BLACKSHAMROCK5

I get ya. I'm not for sure, but I think she was on the first credits.

Shamrock

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Thursday, July 8, 2004 7:10 PM

JIMGOINGS

I agree... Book is a likely choice. He would die, leaving the crew with a moral message that would make Mal rethink his lost faith perhaps.

Jim
Web: http://www.3rdedition.org
Blog: http://www.goingsfamily.com/jim

Join: http://browncoats.serenitymovie.com/serenity/index.html?fuseaction=too
ls.invlink&u=jimgoings&linkID=36

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