RE: by gypsylife

FIREFLY EPISODE DISCUSSIONS

RE:

POSTED BY: GYPSYLIFE
UPDATED: Friday, February 10, 2006 06:28
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VIEWED: 22405
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Monday, January 16, 2006 8:50 AM

The end of Heart of Gold...(well actully the whole ep. just for all the Inara and Mal not getting it! and the whole Zoe/Wash talk about a baby....but the end, between Mal and Inara when she says shes leaveing...Mal's face. I love the subtle shift in his expression...after you pick your jaw off the floor, you yell at the TV and want them to just make out right there on the catwalk...C'mon, I know I'm not the only one...

-----------------------------------------
twas a perrty sight as jello was a slingen and the ladies were all in a heap of fun.
Twas a right shiny event for the eyes to feast on. I was fun!!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=2&t=16371

Hoplessly addicted but in that good sort of way. :)

SCAD/Savannah,GA Browncoat

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Monday, January 16, 2006 9:31 AM

STILLTHEREWAITING

I'm not the type that get teary-eyed at the sad moments. I'm most vulnerable to the moments where everything is finally right, and all of the trials and tension are gone. Like when George Bailey's friends and neighbours rally to give hime the money he needs in "It's a Wonderful Life".
I have one of those momentes towards the end of OiS with the exchange as River returns to Serenity.

MAL
You know, you ain't quite right.

RIVER
It's the popular theory.

MAL
Go on. Get in there. Give your brother
a thrashing for messing up your plan.

RIVER
He takes so much looking after.

Humour as a relief gets me everytime. Plus it's with that exchange that I think the relationship between Mal and River is solidified for good.

Laugh while you can, monkey-boy.

If I were you, I'd run!
If you were me, you'd be good-looking

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Monday, January 16, 2006 8:52 PM

SEPHRIM

hello folks, this will be my first post here so be gentle haha.
all of these moments are just great but one moment that got me and i haven't seen on here is in "trash" when Saffron breaks down in the shuttle with Mal.
even though i knew she was bad i always hoped that maybe Mal would get through to her and maybe she would change but then she reverts back into the old Saffron.

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Wednesday, January 18, 2006 10:12 AM

HAPPYBRAIN

I love that Jayne keeps vigil while Kaylee is being operated on in the pilot. That big lug actually cares about someone other than himself.

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Thursday, January 19, 2006 5:30 PM

GISKARD

Quote:
Originally posted by Stewie45:
At the end of The Message Mal gives a great Soliloquy,for some reason people don't really talk about it that much

I'm not sure what exactly you are referring to. When does Mal talk at the end of the show? IIRC, the ending consists of the recording playing again.

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Wednesday, January 25, 2006 4:25 PM

CAT1620RD

I just love the "light it" scene between Simon and River.

It's a real burden being right so often.

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Friday, January 27, 2006 4:30 PM

ELOISA

Bearing in mind that I saw the BDM before the series so wasn't nearly as emotionally involved with the characters then as I am now (and as I'm British I've not got the DVD yet; one month today, guys!), here goes:

Inara crying in Heart of Gold - I actually cried with her at that point - and the scene between her and Mal at the end, on Serenity, when she's so afraid of or unwilling to hear what he's trying to tell her.

River's speech in Objects in Space about how much easier everyone's lives would be if she wasn't around. Again, I got weepy at that one, but only on the second viewing. It's everyone else's reactions at that point that are so crucial.

Inara frantically kissing Mal in Our Mrs Reynolds (though I knew it would have taken a large twist of logic to kill him at that point).

Simon trying to sacrifice himself alongside River in Safe, and Mal and Zoe walking out of the smoke. The rescue gets me as much as the sibling devotion.

Five successive moments in War Stories - Wash trying to tell Zoe to run from Niska, Zoe instantly picking him to rescue over Mal, Mal making faces at the pair of them to let them know he thinks she's made the right choice and should just get out, Wash hiding away in tears when Mal's ear gets cut off, and Zoe comforting him in the shuttle just before his Big Damn Hero moment.

Mal throughout Out of Gas. Everything from not needing Jayne's proffered space suit to resolutely not kissing Inara. In an episode that was based on flashbacks and, the direction suggests, hallucinations produced by blood loss, I think that in the last scene Mal wasn't even sure if he was dreaming again - that he'd conjured up the memory of these people who meant as much to him as Serenity. Very touching...

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Friday, January 27, 2006 5:08 PM

GRIMJACK21502

Quote:
Originally posted by Eloisa:
Bearing in mind that I saw the BDM before the series so wasn't nearly as emotionally involved with the characters then as I am now (and as I'm British I've not got the DVD yet; one month today, guys!), here goes:

Inara crying in Heart of Gold - I actually cried with her at that point - and the scene between her and Mal at the end, on Serenity, when she's so afraid of or unwilling to hear what he's trying to tell her.

River's speech in Objects in Space about how much easier everyone's lives would be if she wasn't around. Again, I got weepy at that one, but only on the second viewing. It's everyone else's reactions at that point that are so crucial.

Inara frantically kissing Mal in Our Mrs Reynolds (though I knew it would have taken a large twist of logic to kill him at that point).

Simon trying to sacrifice himself alongside River in Safe, and Mal and Zoe walking out of the smoke. The rescue gets me as much as the sibling devotion.

Five successive moments in War Stories - Wash trying to tell Zoe to run from Niska, Zoe instantly picking him to rescue over Mal, Mal making faces at the pair of them to let them know he thinks she's made the right choice and should just get out, Wash hiding away in tears when Mal's ear gets cut off, and Zoe comforting him in the shuttle just before his Big Damn Hero moment.

Mal throughout Out of Gas. Everything from not needing Jayne's proffered space suit to resolutely not kissing Inara. In an episode that was based on flashbacks and, the direction suggests, hallucinations produced by blood loss, I think that in the last scene Mal wasn't even sure if he was dreaming again - that he'd conjured up the memory of these people who meant as much to him as Serenity. Very touching...

You just named everyone of my heart string moments...especially Inara crying in HoG.

Keep the fire alive on your side of the pond...and we'll do the same. We WILL see more heartfelt moments with the BDHs.

We will hold...we hold till Mal gets back.

"And once you're gone, you can never come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black"
-Neil Young

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Saturday, January 28, 2006 1:03 PM

ERISTOFF

Well, all of you have quite hit the top spots, so I won't be really adding anything new.

Anyway, one scene that gives me goosebumps, which I'm not sure anyone has pointed out specifically, is Jubal Early threatening Kaylee (The whole episode was fertile in pulling my heart strings, but that particular scene touched me more than the others). Geez, I just get this feeling to go and beat the s**t out of that bounty hunter. The desperate look on Kaylee's face just gives me chills, especially when the tears come down on her face.

"Sir, I think you have a problem with your brain being missing."

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Saturday, January 28, 2006 1:43 PM

GUTTERBALL

Yeah, I know I'll probably be outed as the Ice Queen I am for this, but one of the parts that really gets me is in "Ariel" when Jayne tells Mal to make something up about why he was dead.

I mean, here's this guy who showed -- through several little facial tics and awkward body language -- how guilty he felt about the whole mess throughout the episode. But up until that moment, he hadn't shown that he actually cared what the rest of the crew thought about him. Their OPINION of him.

He'd shown guilt because he knew he wasn't quite righteous, sure...but I think he hadn't really realized the consequences until then. He hadn't realized that maybe getting pinched by the Feds wasn't the worst thing that could happen as a result. Even DYING wasn't the worst case scenario.

The idea of the others thinking of him as a traitor, though...that he just couldn't live with. Or die with, if you prefer.

And that crucial forethought is the only thing that saved him, I have no doubt. Mal's face clears that right up.

THAT gets my heartstrings. That and they exchange between Mal and Jayne in the BDM when Mal goes, "Tell me you brought 'em this time" and Jayne just grins and pulls out a grenade.

*chokes, gasps* It just GETS me, man. *wipes a tear*

________________________________________

Please remember that the 9:30 show is completely different from the 7:30 show. Don't forget to tip your waitress.

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Sunday, January 29, 2006 3:25 PM

MICO

You all have touched on most of the scenes I would include. The only one I would add is where Mal pats the bloody catalyzer after he finally gets it in place in OoG. That gets me every time.

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Sunday, January 29, 2006 3:42 PM

MALNOURISHED

I'm right there with HappyBrain. When Jayne crouches next to the infirmary window during Kaylee's operation it just crushes me. It's not something that affected me on the first or even second viewing. I only understood how significant it was after really getting an idea of who Jayne is.

Another moment in Serenity that gets me is when Dobson takes River hostage, and she stares at the gun and then at Kaylee with an expression of pure fear and despair.

Of course I love when Mal wakes up in OoG, and finds himself surrounded by his crew. He is just so vulnerable (for once). It makes me want to hug him and never let go.

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Sunday, January 29, 2006 9:47 PM

ASARIAN

FireFly/Serenity has got me waxing lyrical, the last few days. So, I read this fantastic thread, on what pulls our heart strings. Unfortunately, towards the end, I realized I no longer have anything substantial to contribute, as great men and great women have already made great posts, and said even greater things. And more importantly, have pretty much said everything I had been dying to say myself.

I wanted to say that I think pretty much all scenes with River Tam are gut-wrenching. Especially those were she's really vulnerable. Because vulnerability, I say, is the one aspect of humanity which makes us realize, above all, that our Love is needed, and where we find in ourselves -- sometimes to our own surprise, even -- that we are capable of giving it, too.

The moments that tug at my heart strings are not necessarily lines, per se. Very often, especially with River, what just breaks my heart are the things she cannot say, or says with those beautiful wide eyes. When she's playing with Kaylee, that chokes me up just as much as, say, when she connects to Simon, as she stumbles out of the cryo box. Although the latter, I must confess, is probably of a higher order.

In Serenity, in the military installation, where Simon says:

"Yes. She always did love to dance."

Pay particular attention to his face, please. Controlled anguish, and not-so-controlled Love, coming together in one single expression. In that brief moment, the whole 'verse, despite itself, suddenly makes sense. Because you realize that Love is not just the driving force behind Simon, but is also, as we learn in the end, that which keeps Mal's boat afloat. And I submit to you even further: the strings that truly tug at our heart are all just invisible threads of Love, spun across the sky, which they cannot take away from us, along which we mutually reel ourselves in, towards one another, towards mutual healing.

Vulnerability calls to vulnerability. Perhaps that is why I hear the call of the FireFly so loudly; or rather, why I find that call so hard to resist.

"Mei-mei, everything I have is right here." -- Simon Tam.

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Monday, January 30, 2006 5:55 PM

RHYIANAN

After watching the movie, the scene where Wash and Zoe are arguing about having a child is especially heart-wrenching.

Other than that, I'll have to agree with what everyone else said.

Wash: Yeah, but psychic? That sounds like science fiction.
Zoe: You live on a spaceship, dear.

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Monday, January 30, 2006 6:13 PM

LUTHIEN1121

Quote:
Originally posted by asarian:

In Serenity, in the military installation, where Simon says:

"Yes. She always did love to dance."

Pay particular attention to his face, please. Controlled anguish, and not-so-controlled Love, coming together in one single expression. In that brief moment, the whole 'verse, despite itself, suddenly makes sense. Because you realize that Love is not just the driving force behind Simon, but is also, as we learn in the end, that which keeps Mal's boat afloat. And I submit to you even further: the strings that truly tug at our heart are all just invisible threads of Love, spun across the sky, which they cannot take away from us, along which we mutually reel ourselves in, towards one another, towards mutual healing.

Vulnerability calls to vulnerability. Perhaps that is why I hear the call of the FireFly so loudly; or rather, why I find that call so hard to resist.

Thank you for that beautiful thought. You're absolutely right!

The moments I love have already been said for the most part. I also love Out of Gas--the whole episode is really one big heart-string tug. Simon's face when he sees the 'cake', and Mal dragging himself off the floor determined to fix his ship no matter what. The scene with Inara crying in HoG, Mal's bitter guilt at the end of the ep, Wash's death and the funeral scene at the end of the BDM, and so many more I just can't think of them all right now.

We're gonna explode? I don't wanna explode!

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Tuesday, January 31, 2006 3:37 PM

CAPTAINSGAL

These are all great, but also one of my favorites was at the very end of Out of Gas. The way Mal looked at Serenity. True love, oh to be looked at liked that...Now that's acting!

"I'm lost, I'm angry...and I'm armed." - Mal

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Wednesday, February 1, 2006 5:56 PM

WANTSTOBEJAYNE

I have to agree with everyone who siad Jayne crouching outside the infirmary.

Also

I didn't think you'd come.

Well, you're a dummy.

And

She's tore up plenty, but she'll fly true.

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Thursday, February 2, 2006 1:46 AM

CAPERCAILLIE

Another OOG fan - I could just watch Nathan Fillion close doors all day.

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Thursday, February 2, 2006 3:26 AM

NUCLEARDAY

Quote:
Originally posted by mphillips:
What a great thread..And so many scenes..
1) The message Mal's carried the bullet speech

I hadn't caught that line until about my third time watching that episode, but it really got me choked up once I understood it.

There ain't much I can add off-hand that hasn't been said here already. However I just got around to watching the deleted scenes from the Firefly Boxed Set, and while I understand why they cut them, there are some really good quotes in there.

From the alternate opening to the pilot, with Mal saying "God? Who's color's he flying?" Loved that, shows his whole rejection of faith from that moment on, and you can see how the war has changed him.

Also, I just LOVED this quote from Zoe, from another scene deleted out of the pilot: "Once you've been in Serenity, you never leave. You just learn to live there."

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Friday, February 3, 2006 7:21 AM

LEIASKY

Well, there are a LOT of good tug at the heart moments.

In no particular order, here are mine:

The end of The Message with the music and the monologue and them cutting to each character.

Simon willing to die with his sister and the look on his face as he tells them to light the fire.

Mal being a very bad man telling Kaylee has died.

Gabriel Tam saying "I will NOT come for you" and then seeing the parallel when Simon asks Mal "Why did you come back for us?"

River talking about the crew being afraid of her in objects in space and seeing the crew (especially Simon's) reaction to her words.

Tammy

"A government is a body of people usually notably ungoverned."

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Friday, February 3, 2006 7:57 AM

CAPELLA

Ok, I will try to do a top ten list:

10)Jayne looking through the infirmary window after Kaylee has been shot
9) Mal picking River up in the BDM after Simon sent her to sleep
8)Tracey's death in The Message, when he says "Searge" and Mal answers "I am right here"
7) Inara telling Mal that she did not trip and knock her head in OMR and Mal misunderstanding.
6) The "We're still flying" scene from the pilot
5) Inara telling Mal that she is leaving in HoG
4) Mal covering himself with a blanket after the others have left in OoG
3) Kaylee asking about Wash in the BDM and Zoe's answer "He is not coming"
2) Inara crying in HoG
1) The "Will you all still be here?" scene from OoG

There are many other great emotional moments in both the series and the movie, though. I think, that is one of the reasons it is so good. You just care for the people so much after a while. I really tend to forget that they are just fictional characters. Thay go right under my skin.

Keep flying,
Capella

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Friday, February 3, 2006 8:26 AM

FOLLOWMAL

Quote:
Originally posted by GrimJack21502:
Keep the fire alive on your side of the pond...and we'll do the same. We WILL see more heartfelt moments with the BDHs.

We will hold...we hold till Mal gets back.

My top three in descending order:

3.Simon's speech ( with the loveliest music!) after River is out of cryo

2. The dining table scene at the end of "Safe"

1.Mal asking if everyone will still be there when he wakes up in OoG.

And.... off topic a little, GrimJack, but I'm having one of those days where I'm wishin' so hard for more of our crew, that I'm a little blue, and your kind words above made me cry a little. So it qualifies as heart tuggin'. Thanks.

" You hold. Hold til I get back." Mal

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Friday, February 3, 2006 1:19 PM

GRIMJACK21502

Quote:
Originally posted by FollowMal:
Quote:
Originally posted by GrimJack21502:
Keep the fire alive on your side of the pond...and we'll do the same. We WILL see more heartfelt moments with the BDHs.

We will hold...we hold till Mal gets back.

My top three in descending order:

3.Simon's speech ( with the loveliest music!) after River is out of cryo

2. The dining table scene at the end of "Safe"

1.Mal asking if everyone will still be there when he wakes up in OoG.

And.... off topic a little, GrimJack, but I'm having one of those days where I'm wishin' so hard for more of our crew, that I'm a little blue, and your kind words above made me cry a little. So it qualifies as heart tuggin'. Thanks.

" You hold. Hold til I get back." Mal

Whenever I feel the cold hand of despair reaching out from the black, I warm myself with the company of my fellow Browncoats.

FollowMal, you are one of the most active contributors to this board, and you help keep the signal alive everyday. I'm with you my friend...on the line...until Mal comes back.

And FM...he will come back. Our friends will return to us, and we will be here when they wake up.

We are all crew...and sometimes we need to carry each other.

Your comrade in arms,

GrimJack

We will hold...we hold till Mal gets back.

"And once you're gone, you can never come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black"
-Neil Young

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Friday, February 3, 2006 1:40 PM

CHRISTHECYNIC

Two scenes without words in Serenity are great, one is when Simon is patching up Kaylee and Jayne is watching through the window.

The other is used in the opening credits, Simon holding River's hand.

Kind of odd listing these here but they fit in my mind, the moment Inara looks at Mal after Nandi dies, and when Jayne says, "Make something up," at the end of Ariel.

Beyond that there are so many, with Simon and River especially, "Found me broken," "I didn't think you'd come/Well you're a dummy,"

Inara and Mal sitting above cattle got me for some reason.

When Kaylee was standing over Book, "He did this for me once."

Between Mal and Simon: "But you don't even like me./You're part of my crew, why are we still talking about this." Tone of voice wouldn't make you think it's an "aww" moment but it really is.

The moment Mal saw Serenity.

Kaylee's, "It's nobody's fault," in Serenity is so great but it isn't really between anyone, Mal isn't a part of it, he's an observer, it's just a momment where you go, "Kaylee is just so ... Kaylee."

Jayne with the kid, when he's over his body, "Didn't you hear a word?" Even before he had time to think about it you just see right there, he probably wouldn't care about it if he killed him, but there he is and you can tell that he'd rather be the one to die. This is Jayne we're talking about.

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Friday, February 3, 2006 1:43 PM

CHRISTHECYNIC

Quote:
Originally posted by Chindi:
when River is tied to the stake in Safe about to be burned as a witch.. and Simon climbs up next to her.. putting his protective arms around her and defiantly telling the cretons to light it up...

chindi

God that was great.

The guy in charge thought he was trying to stop it by saying, "You lose your doctor," but it was so much more. He'd be there for River no matter what, die for her even if it wouldn't save her.

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Friday, February 3, 2006 1:52 PM

CHRISTHECYNIC

Quote:
Originally posted by niknak:
6. Mal walks through Serenity alone and the shuttles leave (Out of Gas)

1. River: "I'll be your bounty, Jubal Early. And I'll just fade away." (Object's in Space)

Ok so what I'm learning here is that there are too many for me to think of at once but if I just read other people's posts I'll be reminded.

Those two were so powerful. And in Objects in Space when Kaylee confesses to River and River just shushes her.

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Friday, February 3, 2006 1:53 PM

CAPTAINSHINY

Rex's betrayal. That bastard.

Rest in peace, Steggy. Rest in peace.

"The people who made the show, and the people who saw the show, which is roughly the same number of people, fell in love with it, a little bit too much to let it go, too much to lay down arms when when the battle looked pretty much lost. In Hollywood, people like that are called unrealistic, quixotic, obsessive... In my world, they're called Browncoats."
-Joss Whedon

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Friday, February 3, 2006 1:57 PM

CHRISTHECYNIC

Quote:
Originally posted by charliethebloody:

can't believe no one's mentioned objects in space when river's off ship and says:

"they didn't want her here,
but she couldn't make herself leave,
so she melted. melted away..."

it chokes me up every time...

I know I shouldn't respond to so many posts, I'll probably double the length of the thread, but I just keep on seeing things where I want to say, "Same here, I almost cry reading it.

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Friday, February 3, 2006 2:03 PM

CHRISTHECYNIC

I can't believe I didn't say this, I can't believe no one in the part of the thread I've read so far said this:

Mal. Guy killed me, Mal. He killed me with a sword. How weird is that?

I got a short span here.

They destroyed my equipment... but I have a backup unit. Bottom of the complex,
right over the generator. Hard to get to. I know they missed it.

They can't stop the signal, Mal. They can never stop the signal.

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Friday, February 3, 2006 2:10 PM

CHRISTHECYNIC

My mother just said:
I don't know if it pulls at your heartstrings, but when she says they weren't cows inside.

I think that's a good one, because it just rings as so true and it's a moment when River, Mal, and the cows are all linked together in an understanding of freedom and such.

-

Quote:
Originally posted by Kaneski:
"Everybody dies alone." in OoG. A bit of an overly dramatic phrase, but damn if it's not done well.

The writer and director both said they didn't think it would work, too overly dramatic, but that's part of what's so great about the cast, on paper it looks like cheap melodrama, but when he says it ... it's just real.

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Friday, February 3, 2006 2:10 PM

GUTTERBALL

Quote:
Originally posted by CaptainShiny:
Rex's betrayal. That bastard.

Rest in peace, Steggy. Rest in peace.

*chokes, gasps*

I'm right there with ya, man. That part SO got me! OCEANS of tears! OCEANS!

And on a less facetious note, I gotta say that when Mal tells Jayne that as far as he knew, every man who ever had a statue built in his honor was "one kinda sumbitch or another", I actually got a little quiet at the look on Jayne's face.

I have no heart -- I admit that freely -- but that lost, bewildered, aching expression on Jayne's usually hard or snarky face made the vacuumous hole where my heart should be kinda hurt a little.

________________________________________

Please remember that the 9:30 show is completely different from the 7:30 show. Don't forget to tip your waitress.

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Friday, February 3, 2006 2:23 PM

CHRISTHECYNIC

Quote:
Originally posted by Fredikayllow:
Rivers monologue in War Stories: "I work... i function like I'm a girl... I hate it because i know it'll go away"

I know that feeling, "I hate it becasuse I know it'll go away." I hate that feeling, that makes me want to cry for her, usually it does bring tears.

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Friday, February 3, 2006 2:28 PM

CHRISTHECYNIC

Quote:
Originally posted by Blueishbrowncoat:
How about in the BDM when we pull back from Serenity's name on the ship and swing around as its entering atmo?...and with that music. :)

God yes.

Quote:
Even though I'm new to the 'verse that is such a triumphant sequence to me. They are still flyin, you know. It pulls at the heart strings in a good sort of way. I sort of see it as pheonix imagery...I could be digging way to deep on that one though.

Who cares? The image fits.

Quote:
Hoplessly addicted but in that good sort of way. :)

Ditto.

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Friday, February 3, 2006 2:30 PM

SHINYFLY

So many moments to choose from...I'm a big Mal/Inara hopeless romantic, so here's one that stands out in my mind: In Serenity Part I when Inara first joins the crew, and Kaylee asks her how many men fell in love with her. "Just the one," she says. I ABSOLUTELY LOVE the way Mal looks up after her when she says that. It speaks volumes about the way he kind of pines for her in secret. Also I love Train Job when he teases her about "respectable clients". She says "Don't start" when she moves up next to him. You can just see him breathe her in, and she doesn't notice. It always gets to me. I did say I was a hopeless romantic!!

"You ready to get off this heap and back to a civilized life?" "I, uh, I don't know." "Good answer."

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Friday, February 3, 2006 5:50 PM

CHRISTHECYNIC

Quote:
Originally posted by Capella:
There are many other great emotional moments in both the series and the movie, though. I think, that is one of the reasons it is so good. You just care for the people so much after a while. I really tend to forget that they are just fictional characters. Thay go right under my skin.

When I was severely depressed and slightly existential I realized something, even after I got out of that state it still rang true.

The line between real and fiction isn't important, or rather it doesn't exist in the way most people think. While believing that Mal, Zoe, River and the rest are physical people walking around would make you more than somewhat insane they are in a very real sense real. I feel like I've used the word real too much.

If people believe in something strongly enough it is real. Belief is a thing all its own, if you give someone a placebo it can cure some of the worst ills if they just believe in it. That makes it real medicine.

Similarly if you believe in a person so strongly that their hopes and dreams, their pain and joy, their very being matters to you on a deep level then they are real in the only way that matters.

It's like the old thing, "If a tree falls in a forest and there is no one to hear it does it make a noise?" And the answer is that no one gives a damn, but those same people who don't care could devote their hearts and souls to something that never happened. So which one is more real?

I think the question is answered by a question, "Which one has more of an effect on the real world?"

If the characters matter enough to move you they are real.

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Friday, February 3, 2006 11:36 PM

CAPELLA

Quote:
Originally posted by christhecynic:
The line between real and fiction isn't important, or rather it doesn't exist in the way most people think.
[...]
Similarly if you believe in a person so strongly that their hopes and dreams, their pain and joy, their very being matters to you on a deep level then they are real in the only way that matters.
[...]
If the characters matter enough to move you they are real.

Hi Chris (you don't sound very cynic to me here, BTW

),
thank you so much for those statements. Yes, I think that is true. It is just that most people (well, not Browncoats but "ordinary people") don't understand and consider you a bit on the crazy side when you sit in front of your TV set and mumble things like: "Oh no, don't leave" or "Can't you see that she is in love with you, too, you stupid bastard"

But who cares for ordinary people anyway...

I write a lot of fiction myself and I truely hope that I will someday manage to create characters which become real in that sense.

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Saturday, February 4, 2006 2:15 AM

ASARIAN

Let's talk about the Tams.

(uh-oh, there he goes again!)

Is River real? Or, to put it in another way, am I insane? No, I'm serious. Please, bear with me for a moment.

Clinically speaking, a psychiatrist would probably define "insanity" in terms of no longer being able to distinguish fantasy from reality. Am I, by that definition, insane? No. Because I do not actually believe River Tam is a real-life character (I can't believe I just said that; shudder). And yet I say: "Full well she's real!"

Wait a tick! What was that?

Now, the point I'm driving at, is not that River provides for me a reality which is so strong and fulfilling that, to me, she could be said to be "real". Rather, I mean to say, she's better than real! And that, in point of fact, she's even supposed to be better than real! And that I am very much aware of this; and that I'm very much supposed to be aware of this. :)

River Tam is a mirror; but a very special one: the kind that shows you a better you! It's a favorite theme of mine. Looking into those beautiful wide eyes, I then see what I could be, and what I so very much want to become in the moment. As Nicholson expressed this so well to Helen Hunt, in As Good As It Gets, "You make me want to be a better person!"

Spiritually speaking, is that not the greatest reality of all, the awareness of one's own potential, and ensuing drive towards betterment of the soul? Does not the clinical definition of reality fall so short of this? How barren it is, I say!

When my River's sitting there in her small bedroom aboard Serenity, on the floor, pressed against the wall, like the little mouse that she is, mumbling: "2x2, hands of blue," then there's nothing, I assure you, that's real for me at time; for I find myself elevated to levels of humanity that are, quite frankly, off the scale. At that one moment, for a moment, I become like my own soul, hundreds of years in the future, shiny to the Nth Degree, beaming with a Tenderness, Love and Care that -- if you want to talk reality -- are truly uncharacteristically human in the now.

From such heights, looking down on Earth-That-Was, I say, what gives with reality? I'll take the blue pill! I want to see how deep the rabbit hole really goes! I want RealityPlus; I want the expanse we call the 'verse!

FireFly, and River Tam in particular, of course, makes me want to be a better person. In that sense, I've relinquished my commitment to the reality of my current self. So, maybe I'm insane, after all. :)

"Mei-mei, everything I have is right here." -- Simon Tam.

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Saturday, February 4, 2006 5:03 AM

CAPTAINSHINY

Quote:

It is just that most people (well, not Browncoats but "ordinary people") don't understand and consider you a bit on the crazy side when you sit in front of your TV set and mumble things like: "Oh no, don't leave" or "Can't you see that she is in love with you, too, you stupid bastard" But who cares for ordinary people anyway...
.

I'm one of those people who goes to a horror movie and screams "NO B!TCH DON'T GO IN THERE! DON'T GO IN THERE! HE GON' GIT YOU!"

"The people who made the show, and the people who saw the show, which is roughly the same number of people, fell in love with it, a little bit too much to let it go, too much to lay down arms when when the battle looked pretty much lost. In Hollywood, people like that are called unrealistic, quixotic, obsessive... In my world, they're called Browncoats."
-Joss Whedon

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Friday, February 10, 2006 6:28 AM

LUTHIEN1121

Quote:
Originally posted by shinyfly:
So many moments to choose from...I'm a big Mal/Inara hopeless romantic,

Me too!

Quote:

Also I love Train Job when he teases her about "respectable clients". She says "Don't start" when she moves up next to him. You can just see him breathe her in, and she doesn't notice. It always gets to me. I did say I was a hopeless romantic!!

Another one that gets me is the end of HoG where Mal is about to confess his love for her (I think, anyway) and she interrupts to tell him she's leaving. OMG that is so heartbreakingly sad! It really gets me every time. The poor guy has his heart broken twice in one ep.

We're gonna explode? I don't wanna explode!

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