Dollhouse: Echoes - Echo engages echoes of her past. Post comments here. by Haken

OTHER SCIENCE FICTION SERIES

Dollhouse: Echoes - Echo engages echoes of her past. Post comments here.

POSTED BY: HAKEN
UPDATED: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 08:21
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VIEWED: 9662
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Friday, March 27, 2009 8:53 AM

Likes to mess with stuffs.

Echo has an engagements that sends her back to a college campus where she encounters echoes of her past as a virus outbreak rages on.

Continuing on the momentum built up from last week's episode, "Man on the Street," "Echoes," along with episode 108, "Needs," are pivotal episodes in the series where things get very dark and very intense, culminating and building up to the final season episode, "Epitaph One."

For those interested here are the remaining episode titles:

107 "Echoes"
108 "Needs"
109 "Haunted"
110 "Four Engagements"
111 "Briar Rose"
112 "Omega"
113 "Epitaph One"

Watch "Echoes" and post your reactions here.

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Friday, March 27, 2009 2:27 PM

HAKEN

Likes to mess with stuffs.

It just occurred to me, if Alan Tudyk is Alpha, who is Omega?

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Friday, March 27, 2009 4:04 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up

Continues to get better. More backstory, and the effects of the drug on both actives and Dollhouse personnel was interesting. I'll probably watch it again on-line to catch the nuances.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Friday, March 27, 2009 4:11 PM

DAVESHAYNE

Yes, I think we can now confidently say that Dollhouse is firmly headed in the direction of awesome!

Topher, a character that really annoyed me until I figured out he's actually a twelve year old, has a drawer of inappropriate starches! Dewitt makes her choices, lives with her choices, and then dies with her choices and, you must admit, she is very British. What's His Name is so very sorry for trying to burn Echo alive.

David

'Geeks can't admit that anything worthwhile was invented before 1981. Soon, "making cocoa" will be called "milk hacking."' - Lore Sjoberg

http://xkcd.com/386/

"Don't worry. Captain Hammer will save us." - Penny.

I has myspace - http://www.myspace.com/daveshayneforpresident

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Friday, March 27, 2009 4:19 PM

CYBERSNARK

Sooo many great lines.

"Dom would never deliberately have fun."

And I love how Topher was pretty much the same whether he was high or "normal."

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Friday, March 27, 2009 5:59 PM

PHOENIXROSE

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Arg! How long is the delay between airing and appearing on hulu?? Want to watch...

[/sig]

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Friday, March 27, 2009 6:12 PM

SIRI

I missed it tonight, too. It should be on Hulu tomorrow - it ususally takes a day.

Siri

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Friday, March 27, 2009 6:24 PM

PACHELBEL

solid episode with some great one-liners. It was no "Band Candy" though.

It seemed like there were a few times when they really jumped ahead, could've used more than 1 hour to tell the whole story.

Also, my local fox station inexplicably jumped to a commercial right when Topher was checking on Mellie. It came back for about 30 seconds, then went to another commerical.

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Friday, March 27, 2009 6:35 PM

ANGELDOVE

So did anyone else catch the similar line from BTVS?

Echo (as Alice) to Dom

Quote:
It's ok, really...water... bridge... under

Episode Angel BTVS

Buffy to Angel

Quote:
Hey, no big. Water...over the bridge...under the bridge

I know, not exact, but it was so weird, I heard the line and I immediately saw Buffy saying it. I'm not sure if this should concern me...way too much Joss Whedon running around in my head...like that's even possible!

Anyway, really enjoyed tonight's episode, almost as much as last week's...and next Friday's looks very promising.

"Two roads diverged in a wood, and I took the road less traveled by and they CANCELLED MY FRIKKIN' SHOW. I totally shoulda took the road that had all those people on it. Damn." --Joss

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Friday, March 27, 2009 6:41 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!

What was the bike Echo was riding? Triumph 675 Daytona?

Quote:
"It looks like a Dragon. Is that stupid?"
-Echo, Dollhouse, Echoes

No. A reference to The Dragon at Deals Gap TN, "the world's ultimate biker road", with 636 curves in 11 miles (more or less), as seen on TV every week and in 6 movies???

www.TailOfTheDragon.com
www.Killboy.com
www.DealsGap.com
www.DealsGapDragon.com

"I might throw up... That's a compliment."
-Topher, Dollhouse, Echoes

"So now we're sharing? Can you get me a juicebox?"
-Topher, Dollhouse, Echoes

"This is NOT how we used to party!"
-Snide Bitch, Dollhouse, Echoes

"You haven't seen my drawer of inappropriate starches?"
-Topher, Dollhouse, Echoes

"This is great news! Where's your happy face?"
-Echo, Dollhouse, Echoes

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Friday, March 27, 2009 9:27 PM

YINYANG

You were busy trying to get yourself lit on fire. It happens.

I think this is the best episode yet. Dominic on the drug was great; Topher and DeWitt on the drug were also great (especially with Topher taking off his pants - very funny); Eliza Dushku as Caroline was great, and so was her back story. Eliza continues to be outshone by the actors who play Sierra and Victor, though - they're more versatile and convincing in all their roles, IMO. And, it was nice that there weren't as many major story lines, even if it meant focusing less on Ballard.

I do have a few niggles, like the skirt length on Dr. Sierra and the high-heel boots another woman (an active?) was wearing while she was taking pictures of the crime scene. And, although I'm not happy with Mellie as a doll because of the ethical problem with her relationship with Ballard*, it's nice to know that not all the female dolls are skinny.

*The problem's not solely limited to their relationship, but a feature of the Dollhouse - every time the actives have "sex," it's really rape because they can't consent - but I didn't want Ballard's white hat to get dirty like this.

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 1:54 AM

DAVESHAYNE

Also, did anybody go untie This Weeks John?

David

'Geeks can't admit that anything worthwhile was invented before 1981. Soon, "making cocoa" will be called "milk hacking."' - Lore Sjoberg

http://xkcd.com/386/

"Don't worry. Captain Hammer will save us." - Penny.

I has myspace - http://www.myspace.com/daveshayneforpresident

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 4:46 AM

NCBROWNCOAT

Did anyone catch the Firefly reference, Topher apologizing for the fact that "Foxtrot" spoke Mandarin instead of Cantonese?

http://fireflyfaninnc.livejournal.com/

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 5:14 AM

KHAMBILO

I really enjoyed this episode, but it all felt a bit rushed. They could have used more time to tell the story. I liked the interplay of thje backstories the the actives started succumbing to the drug, that was good. And there was a ton of good lines in it, epecially between Adelle and Topher. But I'm not so sure about how I feel about Caroline's background...it seemed a bit cliche. But then again it did work out nicely when you compared it to the guy that Adelle was signing on as an active at the end.

Okay...yeah I really liked this episode. Can't wait for more!

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 8:40 AM

PHOENIXROSE

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Yes! At last, to know more about where the characters are coming from!
I really liked this. It was funny and sad. Striking, really.

[/sig]

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 9:18 AM

CYBERSNARK

Quote:
Originally posted by khambilo:
But I'm not so sure about how I feel about Caroline's background...it seemed a bit cliche.

true, but consider the irony of her being little more than a lab animal herself, now.

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 10:17 AM

ZEEK

I found it interesting that we found out Boyd, Topher, DeWitt and Dominic are not actives because they all got high off the drug.

And did anybody else think Sierra was going to introduce herself as Dr. Saunders? I thought it would be cool if they wanted to send Dr. Saunders but rather than put her in danger just send her in a Doll's body. It would have been kind of cool and kind of creepy at the same time.

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 12:03 PM

ASARIAN

Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:
Continues to get better. More backstory, and the effects of the drug on both actives and Dollhouse personnel was interesting.

The 'Caprica' episode (Nr. 6) is still the best, in my book. It will be one of those classics. Epic, I'm guessing. But Nr. 7 certainly shows Dollhouse is no longer spiraling down, and steadily moving upward. Perhaps, indeed, they tried to tell too much story in too little time, though I'm glad we now know how Caroline tried to make a difference.

Quote:
Originally posted by daveshayne:
Topher, a character that really annoyed me until I figured out he's actually a twelve year old...

That's a good observation. He really annoyed me too: a grown man with a callous smirk, doing questionable things without questioning those things. But if you look at him as just a big child, really, rather emotionally immature, and just happily nerding away in his fascinating world of science, he becomes a lot more palatable.

Quote:
Eliza continues to be outshone by the actors who play Sierra and Victor, though - they're more versatile and convincing in all their roles, IMO.

I'd probably have to agree. Eliza does a great job. But after having seen her in several 'different' roles now, it's also clear that maybe she can't make 'em as 'different' from one another as I'd like to see. Still, she's mad hot. :)

--
"Mei-mei, everything I have is right here." -- Simon Tam

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 2:01 PM

PACHELBEL

Quote:
Originally posted by khambilo:
I really enjoyed this episode, but it all felt a bit rushed. They could have used more time to tell the story. I liked the interplay of thje backstories the the actives started succumbing to the drug, that was good. And there was a ton of good lines in it, epecially between Adelle and Topher. But I'm not so sure about how I feel about Caroline's background...it seemed a bit cliche. But then again it did work out nicely when you compared it to the guy that Adelle was signing on as an active at the end.

Okay...yeah I really liked this episode. Can't wait for more!

I agree; the episode felt rushed, and they left a lot of loose threads. Not threads that could be neatly tied up in an "ah-ha" moment later, but sloppy threads.

Didn't Victor get shot? Whatever happened to that? Also, I'm not sure a doctor from the CDC would show up in those heels.

Topher's still annoying. He's an amalgamation of the 3 idiots who helped ruin season 7 of Buffy.

Great one-liners ("Sure, you're experts now. But 4 hours ago you were all discussing your love for apple sauce."). When I realized I was watching a cheap rip-off of "Band Candy" I became less impressed.

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 3:33 PM

CLJOHNSTON108

Yep, I caught the Buffy water/under/bridge and the Firefly Mandarin/Cantonese references.

So many great lines (I'm gonna go through the episode again and take notes), but my favorite was from Adelle...

"I find lentils completely incomprehensible!"

It was great that Olivia Williams finally got to do some comedy!
Did anybody see her in Rushmore, with Bill Murray? One of my all-time favorite movies!

Oh, and the part where Boyd's playing the piano, and Adelle puts it on speaker, and she and Topher... really enjoy it was just priceless!

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 3:50 PM

CELLARDOOR

I liked various snatches from this episode, but as a whole, I did not think very much of it (though it was better than most of the 5 pilot episodes). Poor editing didn't really help things (people elsewhere are citing the "red pipe" tunnel as being only about 8 feet long, woo...). Lots of smaller aspects were interesting or compelling, but I'm not sure I'd want to rewatch the episode like I would last week's. Adelle was wonderful though. :D

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 3:50 PM

TURQUOISEBOAT

Very interesting episode......

I just wondered why Dr. Saunders hardly appeared, if at all. How curious? Also, something besides saving the monkeys has to factor in to how Echo got roped into the Dollhouse in the first place.

Turq

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 4:52 PM

STOWEAWAY

Quote:
Originally posted by TurquoiseBoat:
Also, something besides saving the monkeys has to factor in to how Echo got roped into the Dollhouse in the first place.

She saw the computer and what they were really up to. Never mind legal trouble. Crossing a corporation like that -- they can make people "disappear". So the choice becomes getting snuffed out or doing time as a doll.

------------------------------------------------
Check out http://www.americasfunniesttshirts.com for hilarious shirts at a great price.

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Saturday, March 28, 2009 5:52 PM

KHAMBILO

Quote:
Originally posted by Cybersnark:
Quote:
Originally posted by khambilo:
But I'm not so sure about how I feel about Caroline's background...it seemed a bit cliche.
true, but consider the irony of her being little more than a lab animal herself, now.

True. I guess that's an interesting twist on it.

By the way did anyone catch what was going on with Victor and his flashbacks in that episode? I was a bit confused by that. Was that something from his past experiences as a doll (like Sierra's flashback) or was that from something prior to him becoming a doll (like Echo's flashbacks)?

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Sunday, March 29, 2009 10:13 AM

TURQUOISEBOAT

I understand the choice there. You're correct in every way.

I just found myself wondering if there is going to be any other layers of motivation woven in for breaking into the "evil corporation" in the first place.

If Caroline's great cause is the humane treatment of animals, it might have arisen a bit suddenly. It is a new and interesting character insight, but comments stating the episode felt rushed might be a result of not having any other context for that righteous cause.

Turq

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Sunday, March 29, 2009 12:46 PM

THESOMNAMBULIST

A funky episode reminiscent of the Angel episode "Spin the Bottle" and the Buffy episode "Tabula Rasa" - It's a clever devise to inject humour when the usual format of the show wouldn't usually allow it, but I'm wondering if it's a tad overused now. It was alot of fun though.
Not the best episode as the wrap up was a bit sudden and we really didn't see Topher 'deal' with his walking around in his underwear!? But DeWitt was delicious during her moment and I'm now curious as to who Mellie's friend might be who may pop in to crash at her place? In other words might a new active move in next to Ballard?

Also how horrific was the kid hitting his head against the glass! Jeez! A simple notion really well put together!

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Sunday, March 29, 2009 12:57 PM

TUJIAOZUO

Like many, I didn't like Topher at all for the first few eps but....

Juiceboxes?
Nerdy?
A drawer of inappropriate starches?
Quirky sense of humor?

Is it weird that he's pretty much beginning to encompass what I like in a guy (besides the whole working for an evil corporation and mind washing people thing)? I mean pretty much all that's left is if he's a Browncoat, has a love of animated movies, and is willing to sleep on bed sheets with cartoon characters on them (ninja turtles, spongebob, spiderman, dinosaurs, ect). But seriously, think I'm developing a crush on Topher.....

Ummm yeahhh... getting back to the show....

Great ep, loved the various states of high throughout the non-dolls ("I have a phalax of machines that go bing", "I could eat that word... or a crisp", "It's soft! Like a kitty") as well as the glitching of the Dolls as it gave us some insight into them.
I buy Carolina's past as a uber-activist wanting to save the monkeys and bring down the evil science lab as well as getting way in over her head. I also liked Victor's glitch which alludes to the guy was in the war at some time.
But Echo is on her way to a compositing event reeaaal soon. Like the season finale soon. So I'm intrigued as to how after the composite event (which will render Echo as badass as River and Buffy as she will recall some of her past programming), how Joss is going to pull off five seasons as that is how many he's planned out. I full faith in him, I'm just curious as to how this obviously wild ride is going to go down.

Your Indian Pirate Lord,
Ash

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Sunday, March 29, 2009 4:43 PM

PHOENIXROSE

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Quote:
Originally posted by pachelbel:
they left a lot of loose threads. Not threads that could be neatly tied up in an "ah-ha" moment later

We're now seven episodes into a Joss Whedon show... What on Earth would make you think there's going to come a moment where everything will suddenly be tied up into a pretty little bow? I am expecting nothing but the complete, total and utter lack of pretty little bows.
Hm... unless we see Echo in some lingerie.

[/sig]

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Sunday, March 29, 2009 4:52 PM

PACHELBEL

Quote:
Originally posted by PhoenixRose:
Quote:
Originally posted by pachelbel:
they left a lot of loose threads. Not threads that could be neatly tied up in an "ah-ha" moment later

We're now seven episodes into a Joss Whedon show... What on Earth would make you think there's going to come a moment where everything will suddenly be tied up into a pretty little bow? I am expecting nothing but the complete, total and utter lack of pretty little bows.
Hm... unless we see Echo in some lingerie.

Maybe you are right. What I really meant was that the show seems terribly sloppy so far --- that's not indicative of a Joss Whedon show.

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Monday, March 30, 2009 7:15 PM

ROCKETJOCK

Some small observations:

(1) Caroline Farrell. We now have a last name.

(2) Extreme implication that her induction into the Dollhouse was less than truly voluntary.

(3) "Rossum Corporation": Quite likely a reference to the stageplay R.U.R. -- standing for "Rossum's Universal Robots". Source point for the word "robot". For those not in the know, the play ended with the robots rebelling against their creators . . .

"You can't fight a ghost." -- Echo

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Monday, March 30, 2009 10:04 PM

SHINYGOODGUY

I really liked the episode, not as much as last week's, but still enough to recommend it to a newbie.

Although, at first, I wasn't crazy about the "cliche" animal activist back story to Echo/Caroline it occured to me that Joss usually has something up his sleeve when it comes to the main character (I'm totally relying upon my Firefly experience here), and, if anything, I must be patient.

Things are never what they seem in Joss' verse. The snippets of Caroline's past are just that - snippets. Joss is going to tell this story over 5 years (barring any of the usual behavior from our host - Fox TV). I'm going to take my clues and file them away under "curious" and not "definitive." You know that he leaves a trail of "breadcrumbs" along the way and we are to gather them up, hold them up to the light at just the right time to get his great reveal some years later.

He did it on a smaller scope in the BDM with River "seeing" the Reavers in her "visions" leading up to the secret of Miranda. Anyway loved the humor in this ep (Mr. Dominic turning into a harmless puppy-dog was priceless) as well as Topher and Adele.

Not a great ep but solid enough to keep the momentum going in the right direction.
-----------------------------------------------
Yinyang

although I'm not happy with Mellie as a doll because of the ethical problem with her relationship with Ballard*, it's nice to know that not all the female dolls are skinny.

I agree with you about having a female doll that looks like a real person instead of a Victoria's Secret model (I actually think Mellie is a cutie). But I think that ultimately the true character of of each doll comes through despite the programming. I truly believe Mellie actually has feelings for Ballard. Hear me out: Joss's theme in both Serenity and now in DH is how man should not tamper with trying to make people "better."

Remember Adele had Mellie recalled for a diagnostic. What was wrong with her? I think Mellie has gone off her programming. Another point is that she's a "sleeper" active and may have all her faculties save for when Adele uses her trigger to activate her. My point being, I think Mellie is herself when she's with Ballard.
But I do agree with you that lack of consent constitutes rape.

SGG

Tawabawho?

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Tuesday, March 31, 2009 4:45 AM

ZEEK

I agree that all we saw was a snippet of Caroline's backstory. I think that was more like the beginning of her involvement with Rossum. DeWitt said something like "we've been dancing around this for two years" to Caroline in her "interview" with her. I really doubt the flashbacks spanned two years. I think it's more likely that when DeWitt said "she won't get far" that was the start of their two years of cat and mouse.

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Tuesday, March 31, 2009 8:21 AM

WASHNWEAR

Quote:
Originally posted by PhoenixRose:
Quote:
Originally posted by pachelbel:
they left a lot of loose threads. Not threads that could be neatly tied up in an "ah-ha" moment later

We're now seven episodes into a Joss Whedon show... What on Earth would make you think there's going to come a moment where everything will suddenly be tied up into a pretty little bow? I am expecting nothing but the complete, total and utter lack of pretty little bows.
Hm... unless we see Echo in some lingerie.

Hmmm...okay, I guess I could endure that...

What color bows?

W W E L D ?
(What would Echoe's lingerie do?)

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