Movies you love, but a little new CGI could help... by chrisisall

OTHER SCIENCE FICTION SERIES

Movies you love, but a little new CGI could help...

POSTED BY: CHRISISALL
UPDATED: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 04:41
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 7505
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Monday, June 28, 2010 1:17 PM

I've been *lovin'* the Star Trek original series episodes with the new FX, and I just saw Terminator: Salvation, and I wondered how many peeps would like the original Terminator to be "augmented" with new CGI to clean up the, err, questionable stop-motion shots of the T-800 late in the flick?
I have no problem whatsoever with the practical stuff, but the animated little articulated puppet sort of gives me pause. However, in the very end, the practical stuff takes over again, and all is well IMO.

So, I'd like to see a *slight* CGI clean-up of one of my favourite movies.

Agree? Disagree? Other movies you'd like to see re-faced?

The Mr. Fix It Chrisisall

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Monday, June 28, 2010 2:02 PM

CATPIRATE

Yeh that makes sense. Babylon 5 would make a good arguement. The first dvds had widescreen and full screen but now they separate the two for cash. Hey put everthing on one dvd. New cgi added. Makes everybody happy. I don't think it helped Star Wars 1thru3, not for the young darth as a ghost.

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Monday, June 28, 2010 2:29 PM

OPPYH

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:

So, I'd like to see a *slight* CGI clean-up of one of my favourite movies.

Agree? Disagree? Other movies you'd like to see re-faced?

I'm not much for new CGI to classic movies Star trek original series(TV) may be the only exception I make .

But I would love to see a re imaging of my favorite movie shot for shot:

Planet of the Apes starring:

Taylor

Cornelius

Nova

Zaius

Zira(Hey Mira Sorvino can act, and she has great eyes).

-------------------------------------------------

70's TV FOREVER

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Monday, June 28, 2010 2:46 PM

CHRISISALL

You could be a casting director!!!!

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Monday, June 28, 2010 5:59 PM

DMI

Expired, forgotten, spoiled rotten.

How about Logan's Run? Just as long as new effects doesn't mean we have to give up this...

------------------------
I pray for one last landing,
on the globe that gave me birth.
Let me rest my eyes on the fleecy skies
and the cool, green hills of Earth.

http://www.blogiversity.org/blogs/dmi/default.aspx

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Monday, June 28, 2010 6:11 PM

IREMISST

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:

So, I'd like to see a *slight* CGI clean-up of one of my favourite movies.

No such thing as a slight CGI clean up, just over-blown in-your-face crap to cover up the lack of originality and of sufficient plot and character development and depth...

That being said... I'd like to BE a piece in a factory in a 3-d version of "How It's Made" that'd be cool

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Monday, June 28, 2010 6:41 PM

11THHOUR

One older movie that could really benefit from some updated FX would be "Labyrinth". Most of it is fine, but there are some sequences where flawed FX really takes one out of the moment. One sequence that really had surprisingly poor FX was the "Chilly Down" song. Whether they used green screen or blue screen back then, parts of the critters kept disappearing and edges were terrible. Even back then that technology could have turned out much better.

There are several instances of wires showing, and other set faux pas, which could be corrected with new CGI yet still keep the original feeling and intent of the film. I don't agree with substantive changes, like Han not firing first any more, but correcting old fx that never quite looked right, or fixing wires that show, etc., helps to keep attention on the story unfolding and not the jarring visual goofs.

All that said however, sometimes a flawed FX film has a certain charm and can be big fun when watched with friends... as any fan of MST3000 can attest.

11th

>>>}———————————————)))======<[]>======(((———————————————{<<<

"Because teenage pranks are fun when you're about to die!" - Hoban Washburne

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Monday, June 28, 2010 8:05 PM

NAVYSEILS

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
the original Terminator

When I read the thread title this was the first thing that came to mind. Good call on that one. Though the option to watch the original should always be present on any future versions... cause the stop motion can give you a chuckle.

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 2:14 AM

JONGSSTRAW

I'd like to see "Conquest Of Space" get a facelift. It's one of my favorite 50's space movies, and it features the legendary art work of Chesley Bonestell. The movie was based on the Collier's Magazine articles that ran in the mid-50's, taken from the book witten by Willy Ley. The special effects in this movie are better than the norm for that era, but CGI enhancement would make them even better.

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 7:56 AM

LWAVES

Great question but tough to think of an answer.

T1 would be a definite choice for the same reasons as you. And I'd like the option to see the original as well.

E.T. would be my second choice. I'd like them to CGI the guns in over the walkie-talkies so the men didn't look silly. Plus the other bits they changed as there was nothing wrong with the original.

Battlestar Galactica (Original) - Okay, it's not a film but I love this show but the constant use of repeated for the Viper/Raider battles gets on my nerves a bit after all these years. So I'd like to see these updated in the same style/look but with more variety of moves.

"The greatest invention ever is not the wheel. It's the second wheel." - Rich Hall

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 7:58 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by DMI:
How about Logan's Run? Just as long as new effects doesn't mean we have to give up this...

Honestly, I'd only clean up the model-lookin' city a bit, and some of the cheesy "explosions" at the end that were supposed to simulate the dome cracking. Other than that, it's garish perfection IMO.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 8:04 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by lwaves:
Great question but tough to think of an answer.

I can think of a few shots in Batman that could use a tweak (COUGHJokerfallingtohisdeath).

Quote:

Battlestar Galactica (Original) - Okay, it's not a film but I love this show but the constant use of repeated for the Viper/Raider battles gets on my nerves a bit after all these years. So I'd like to see these updated in the same style/look but with more variety of moves.

I'm with you on this.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 8:12 AM

CHRISISALL

I got one!
Robocop 3- the final fight scene! Just jazz that up a bit and *poof* instant better movie!!!
(Okay, now make fun of me for liking it...

)

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 8:32 AM

THESOMNAMBULIST

Not a fan of CGI at all. It does no better at conveying story than good old fashioned stop motion. I'd rather have Ray Harryhausen's stop motion over any CGI. In fact I'm thinking how about we 'Stop Motion' over some recent CGI heavy stuff. KING KONG for example! Or AVATAR! How about a stop motion version of that. I'd go see that... Again.

Cartoons - http://cirqusartsandmusic.blogspot.com

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 8:39 AM

THESOMNAMBULIST

Originally posted by DMI:

Quote:
How about Logan's Run? Just as long as new effects doesn't mean we have to give up this...

My god! Jenny Agutter really is a beauty. No wonder I was a wreck after seeing this when I was a kid! Frankly anbody watching Logan's Run and wanting better CGI is missing the point!
Cartoons - http://cirqusartsandmusic.blogspot.com

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 9:44 AM

MALACHITE

Hey, was Star Wars the original trilogy rereleased with new CGI effects? Does that count? If so, what did you think about that? I'm wondering if it might be an instructive/cautionary tale of what happens when you try to update something so iconic. I can remember being excited about the new cgi animals and new scenes initially. But, there were some (imo) ridiculous additions/changes such as Greedo shooting first.

It was kind of cool to have the Han talking to Jabba scene of old footage being able to incorporated into the movie (I don't know if the movie needed it, but at the time, I liked seeing the little extra addition, and I liked the trivia for why the scene hadn't been included originally -- that is, because the knew that Han couldn't walk behind Jabba without stepping on him)

ETA: I do kind of miss the original ewok celebration song at the end of Return of the Jedi, though. Yub dub!

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 1:46 PM

RAHLMACLAREN

"Damn yokels, can't even tell a transport ship ain't got no guns on it." - Jayne Cobb

Quote:
Malachite wrote:

I do kind of miss the original ewok celebration song at the end of Return of the Jedi, though. Yub dub!

Really? What the hell did they replace it with?

20th Century Fox needs to take out a restraining order against George Lucas/Lucasfilm, to keep them from being within 1000ft of the Original Trilogy master reels.

--------------------------------------------------
Find here the Serenity you seek. -Tara Maclay

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 2:07 PM

CYBERSNARK

Quote:
Originally posted by RahlMaclaren:
Quote:
Malachite wrote:

I do kind of miss the original ewok celebration song at the end of Return of the Jedi, though. Yub dub!

Really? What the hell did they replace it with?

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 2:56 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by TheSomnambulist:
Not a fan of CGI at all.

Star Trek Remastered with new CGI, as well as Firefly & Serenity have taught me that Good CGI is better than bad opticals or stop-motion.
A tool can be used for good or for evil. Do not hate the tool.

The laughing Toolisall

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 3:12 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

Perhaps the monster scenes in Forbidden Planet could use an update. Though I am very impressed with that movie's FX.

Incidentally, the worst FX in Terminator was not the stop-action terminator chassis. It was the fake Arnold head in the scene where he tends to his eye.

--Anthony

Due to the use of Naomi 3.3.2 Beta web filtering, the following people may need to private-message me if they wish to contact me: Auraptor, Kaneman, Piratenews, Wulfenstar. I apologize for the inconvenience.

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 3:15 PM

CATPIRATE

Cybersnark that's the ending I like.

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 3:16 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:

Perhaps the monster scenes in Forbidden Planet could use an update. Though I am very impressed with that movie's FX.

Naww, all was cool in that flick IMO.

Quote:

Incidentally, the worst FX in Terminator was not the stop-action terminator chassis. It was the fake Arnold head in the scene where he tends to his eye.

I bought that as it was a machine not needing to seem human in front of others.
But that may just be me.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 3:18 PM

CATPIRATE

Malachite,Greedo shooting first is an artistic change of the movie not an upgrade. Lucas went anti-gun for the kiddies like in star wars 1 thru 3. But hey that is what made Solo a bad ass. Shoot first ask questions later.

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 3:22 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by CatPirate:
Cybersnark that's the ending I like.

Me too also.
Han-shoots-last is the only CGI addition that I really hate.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 3:26 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by CatPirate:
[B Shoot first ask questions later.

No, that's crap. Han shot first BECAUSE there was no question.
Period.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 3:55 PM

THESOMNAMBULIST

It's not the tool that bothers me big 'C' it's the application of it. Just because CGI is out there doesn't mean that all special effects must be rendered in CGI.

It's a little like expecting all black and white films to be coloured. Casablanca is just fine as is. Colouring it would do nothing more for the story.

Revisiting past special effects heavy films and 'correcting' them with the present CGI standard of special effects would just contribute to a generic 'look' that would become visually tedious.

And part of cinema history is captured in those old hand crafted special effects, and to remove them would be like erasing all that hard work and altering cinematic history. Imagine if Jason and the Argonauts were to be completely re-visited with WETA tending to all the effects. Ray Harryhausen would vanish from the archives!

It would also mean that films are never really finished. With effects technology updating so frequently directors or studios would be tempted to regularly 'tweak' their products, ad infinitum.

As it is the whole 're-imagining' thing that went on in the 90's has ruined Bladerunner for me as I have no idea which version is now the definative one and I can't enjoy one without thinking about the other one and thus the story now feels - confused....

Nah... no thanks. Once your film is released that's it. Learn from it with the next endeavour and try and make that the best it can be.

Just my take on it...

Cartoons - http://cirqusartsandmusic.blogspot.com

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 3:56 PM

CATPIRATE

No this is crap, ya throw it till it's the wall.

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 4:12 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by TheSomnambulist:
It's not the tool that bothers me big 'C' it's the application of it. Just because CGI is out there doesn't mean that all special effects must be rendered in CGI.

Total agreement here, Som.

Quote:

Revisiting past special effects heavy films and 'correcting' them with the present CGI standard of special effects would just contribute to a generic 'look' that would become visually tedious.

Yeah, I was just thinkin' about flicks that suffered limitations budget-wise in PARTICULAR shots.

Quote:

Imagine if Jason and the Argonauts were to be completely re-visited

NO!!! NO!
We do not touch that kind of art.

Quote:

It would also mean that films are never really finished.

Yeah, but we are at a point where anything is possible, even turning old movies into 3D... "cleaning" up some old FX should be a one time thing for 20th Century efforts only.

Quote:

As it is the whole 're-imagining' thing that went on in the 90's has ruined Bladerunner for me as I have no idea which version is now the definative one and I can't enjoy one without thinking about the other one and thus the story now feels - confused....

The 1982 International Cut is the true one.
Does that help?

The definite Chrisisall

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 4:50 PM

CYBERSNARK

The real problem with Greedo shooting first is that it completely guts Han's character arc. Lucas' rationale in the SE was that Han was a Hero and wouldn't shoot first --yet the whole point of Han's role in ANH is that he wasn't a hero. He was a self-interested drug-runner in hock to the mob. He became a hero over the course of the trilogy.

RotJ Han might not have shot first. ANH Han most definitely would've.

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Yeah, I was just thinkin' about flicks that suffered limitations budget-wise in PARTICULAR shots.

This kinda influences my own perspective; I'm a TV/Film guy. In Canada. We have no budgets.

Yet everyone is so wrapped up in the CGI fetishization that older (and more importantly, cheaper) methods are being completely ignored. I will never be able to produce the next Avatar (not unless/until I can move to the US), but give me a good creature shop, some model-builders, and a cameraman who knows how to use forced perspective, and I can give you the next Dark Crystal or Labyrinth. . .

EDIT: Gah!

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Tuesday, June 29, 2010 5:03 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by Cybersnark:
older (and more importantly, cheaper

And more artistic, to a large degree IMO.
I mean, imagine a SF movie depending entirely on ONE venue, like stop-motion, for ALL its FX?

Oh... Laserblast. Flesh Gordon.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, June 30, 2010 3:18 AM

DMI

Expired, forgotten, spoiled rotten.

It always descends into an argument about who shot first. There is no argument in my opinion. The Han I know and love owned Greedo under the table half for the fun of it while the green bastard was still trading insults.

I liked the original Ewok celebration song better but I have to say that my favorite improvement of all in the redone Star Wars films was the pan over the different planets celebrating.

Also, no point was missed in Logan's Run and I can watch it over and over again without new CGI because of those legs. But new effects wouldn't hurt...

------------------------
I pray for one last landing,
on the globe that gave me birth.
Let me rest my eyes on the fleecy skies
and the cool, green hills of Earth.

http://www.blogiversity.org/blogs/dmi/default.aspx

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Wednesday, June 30, 2010 4:41 AM

MALACHITE

Here's a link to the original ending with the original ewok song (I think -- I don't have audio on my current work computer).

Cybersnark already posted the "new" ending. I agree, I like the way the new ending showed several different planets celebrating because it seems to be more of an epic ending to an epic series, as opposed to the original, which featured only the celebration on Endor. The new music creates a different tone to the whole thing, though. The original ewok song seems pure celebration (even if its silly), while the new ending song (pan pipes) seems a bit more contemplative for starters.

ETA: an interesting link on some of the different ROTJ versions out there: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0086190/alternateversions

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