Return of the King (dvd box set ) by AURaptor

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Return of the King (dvd box set )

POSTED BY: AURAPTOR
UPDATED: Monday, January 3, 2005 14:09
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VIEWED: 4288
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Tuesday, December 28, 2004 4:45 PM

America loves a winner!

Just got done watching both the extended version and the cast commentary of ROTK. I only saw ROTK twice in the theatre, and that was way back when it came out. Amazing. The extended version had so many key parts, imo, that should have made the theatrical cut. This is beyond all others, my favorite of its kind. ( Sorry, Star Wars )

While I consider myself a purest, I appreciate how Peter Jackson was able to tweak the story here and there to get as much of it onto film. Understanding that this is HIS adaptation of Tolkiens work, I had only a few issues with how it all came out.

Minor things I didn't care so much for-
... was when Eowen rides as a soldier, and does little to hide herself from the others, yet no one notices her.

...Denethor and his 1/2 mile dash of flaming death off the top of Minas Tirith. Please.

What I thought was way cool-
... The Mouth of Sauron. That first line he gives " The great Lord Sauron bids thee welcome.." and that goulish,gortesque smile he gives.... wicked!

... The Witch King

... Mumakil!

... Grond!

I'll stop here, or I might not be able to stop later.

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Tuesday, December 28, 2004 11:18 PM

JRC

I totally agree with your Eowyn observation. Was that some kind of continuity boo-boo?
As for Denethor's flaming run, I just remembered how far he had to run just to take his long walk off a short pier. Must have been a half-mile run (on fire!) to take a half-mile no-cord bungee jump.
Also thought the Houses of Healing was too short. Oh well...

I really liked the extra little snippets PJ added in the movie that went unmentioned.
Still, the Battle of Pellenor Fields has got to be one of the best battle sequences EVER. When the Rhohirrim sound out with their horns "announcing" their presence gives me goose bumps every time. And when Gandalf and Frodo say their goodbyes to the other Hobbits, well, still get misty-eyed over that.

Everyone dies alone.

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Wednesday, December 29, 2004 4:06 AM

COSMICFUGITIVE

I have to agree that Denethor's death was pretty unrealistic.

The Witch King sequence was brilliant! Great twist!

There were a lot of other great moments in the movie. The first one that comes to mind is when Aragorn is confronted by the pirates. The "You and who's army?" comment and Aragorn's reply was great!

Seeing Peter Jackson hit by the arrow and Gimli's response was hilarious!

The mouth of Sauron was cool too. It reminded me of Judge Death from 2000AD! Funny and creepy!

The battle of Pellenor Fields was stunning! The level of detail was scary!

I loved seeing the friendly rivalry between Legolas and Gimli continue in part 3.

The only niggle I had was that the scene when Aragorn is reunited with Arwen was too short. It could have been longer.

Frodo's departure was sad. I'll admit I had a lump in my throat watching that.

(Although, I'm not sure if I'll be able to ever watch it in the same light knowing they had to do that scene over and over and over again due to Sean Astin's continuity error. :))

I never saw the movie in the cinema (because I wanted to wait until the Extended DvD release) and I'm not disappointed!

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Wednesday, December 29, 2004 11:33 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
I loved seeing the friendly rivalry between Legolas and Gimli continue in part 3.

And speaking of those two, how about that line from Gimli after Legolas climbs up the mumakil, shoots a couple of bad guys, swings along the side, cuts the ropes supporting the tower and the rest of the bad guys, kills the mumakil , slides down its trunk, and lands w/ nary a scratch....

That STILL only counts as one! - Gimli.

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Wednesday, December 29, 2004 1:12 PM

CHANNAIN

i DO aim to misbehave

Quote:
Originally posted by The Cos
The only niggle I had was that the scene when Aragorn is reunited with Arwen was too short. It could have been longer.

And yet, the singularly best reunion kiss IMO. I mean the man knows how to get it done, doesn't he... hmmm

Oh, and you, my lad, are the singularly most patient being in this 'verse. I mean NOT see it in the theatre AND wait this long to see the extended? Weren't you tempted? Not even once?

Quote:
Auraptor said
That STILL only counts as one! - Gimli.

Well... it WAS only one. The fact that it was the equivalent of a couple thousand is entirely irrevelent.

Fans come and fans go...but zealots are with you until the bitter black end.
I draw...therefore I am. http://www.mnartists.org/artistHome.do?rid=7922
Minnesota Meetup - join us! http://firefly.meetup.com/45/

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Sunday, January 2, 2005 8:27 AM

COSMICFUGITIVE

Quote:
Originally posted by Channain

Oh, and you, my lad, are the singularly most patient being in this 'verse. I mean NOT see it in the theatre AND wait this long to see the extended? Weren't you tempted? Not even once?

It was hard. :)

Although,I originally saw Two Towers in the cinema then bought the extended DvD. It was distracting 'cause I had two different versions in my head and couldn't watch it properly.

(I didn't want to go through it again with ROTK...)

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Sunday, January 2, 2005 10:37 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Quote:
Auraptor said
That STILL only counts as one! - Gimli.

Well... it WAS only one. The fact that it was the equivalent of a couple thousand is entirely irrevelent.

CHANNAIN..... Legolas took out 1 mumakil AND like 8 -12 bad guys! Not to pick nits here, but exactly how does that count for only one ?? He single handily took out 2-3 bad guys before cutting the support rope that made the tower fall off the mumakils back. Unless you adhere to some sort of whacky Dwarf math....

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Sunday, January 2, 2005 2:02 PM

CHANNAIN

i DO aim to misbehave

I meant to say the MUMAKIL counts as one. Obviously the baddies Leggie got before he took the beastie down count as individual hits. I heard him counting them. Gimli didn't want Leggie doing any kind of strange elvish math, trying to count the Mumakil as like, 80, by sheer virtue of its size. One Mumakil = one kill.

Here's the thing. My sister and I play this counting game whenever we drive up together to see the folks. There's a messenger service called "Speedy Delivery" that has a home base well out of the cities. So when we go west in the morning on a weekday, we count vans that are coming east - the numbers usually end up somewhere in the upper 20s. However, they do have semi-tractor trucks, which we count as the equivalent of three regular-size delivery vans. dong ma?

Don't tell me you haven't played slug-bug - the regular person's version of the kill game - or some other counting game on road trips? The fun part is when you start making up rules, then can't remember which ones you made up, or how they apply.

Did I just watch the disc again and pay attention to Gimli's inference when he was talking about the Mumakil? Well, It was a holiday yesterday, wasn't it?

Fans come and fans go...but zealots are with you until the bitter black end.
I draw...therefore I am. http://www.mnartists.org/artistHome.do?rid=7922
Minnesota Meetup - join us! http://firefly.meetup.com/45/

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Sunday, January 2, 2005 3:00 PM

FIREFLYWILDCARD1

Quote:
Originally posted by CosmicFugitive:
The only niggle I had was that the scene when Aragorn is reunited with Arwen was too short. It could have been longer.

I am not disappointed in the shortness of the Aragorn/Arwen reunion scene. It would have been different if we didn't see all the other scenes that PJ added throughout the trilogy to show the romance. I can't stand the added Arwen material so that ruined the character for me.

I love the ROTK:EE though.

As has been mentioned before, the Houses of Healing scenes were too short. I would have loved to see Aragorn healing both Eowyn and Faramir. We know they shot the scene of Aragorn healing Faramir because we have production stills of it.

Otherwise, all added scenes were great!

And as most others, Denethor's death scene is unrealistic. I wonder why they didn't just leave him lying on the pyre?

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Sunday, January 2, 2005 5:34 PM

CORNCOBB

Loved the Mouth of Sauron and the demise of Saruman. And I think ROTK:EE was brilliant BUT I was really disappointed that we never got to see the scouring of the shire. The Hobbits uprising was one of the highlights of the book IMHO, and I really wanted to see it on film.
Maybe there should be a third version of the film. What do you think?

"Gorramit Mal... I've forgotten my line."

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Sunday, January 2, 2005 7:17 PM

MOHRSTOUTBEARD

I don't think they ever planned to have the scouring of the Shire in any version of the film. I believe it's one of the first things they cut when they were writing the scripts. PJ confirmed on the commentary of The Fellowship Of The Ring that the closest you'd get to seeing it would be the vision that Frodo has in the Mirror of Galadriel. That was their little nod to the scouring.

I really loved the additional stuff in The Return Of The King, as I have with the previous extended editions, but I was a bit disappointed that they left out my favorite part of the Mouth of Sauron confrontation.

Quote:
'Do not bandy words in your insolence with the Mouth of Sauron!' he cried. 'Surety you crave! Sauron gives none. If you sue for his clemency you must first do his bidding. These are his terms. Take them or leave them!'

'These we will take!' said Gandalf suddenly. He cast aside his cloak and a white light shone forth like a sword in that black place. Before his upraised hand the foul Messenger recoiled, and Gandalf coming seized and took from him the tokens: coat, cloak, and sword. 'These we will take in memory of our friend,' he cried. 'But as for your terms, we reject them utterly. Get you gone, for your embassy is over and death is near to you. We did not come here to waste words in treating with Sauron, faithless and accursed; still less with one of his slaves. Begone!'

I would love to hear Ian McKellen say that line. Or even give it to Viggo Mortensen if they were worried about not building up his kingly presence enough.

Oh well. Still three of the best movies ever.

"You've just gotta go ahead and change the captain of your brainship, because he's drunk at the wheel."

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Monday, January 3, 2005 5:25 AM

STILLSHINY

After watching the Special Features my wife & I came to this conclusion.

"I want to work for WETA!"

or at least go back in time & do so.

Check out my shop!
http://www.zazzle.com/contributors/products/gallery/browse_results.asp
?cid=238187680745956238

"Two roads diverged in a wood, and I took the road less traveled by and they CANCELLED MY FRIKKIN' SHOW. I totally shoulda took the road that had all those people on it. Damn." --Joss

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Monday, January 3, 2005 7:10 AM

MANIACNUMBERONE

I agree with Corncobb. I really wanted to see the scouring of the shire... Instead, it was kind of a half-assed way to show what happens with Saruman and Grima. I wanted a little more accuracy with the novels in that respect. And lots of people seem to think the aragorn/arwen scenes were too few. I think they were far too many. Arwen took on the roles of four other people in the fellowship, and the visions of her child were completely fabricated. Where was Glorfindel. Shouldn't he have rode with Frodo after the battle on weathertop instead of arwen? Wasn't it the magic of Elronds ring that made the river wash away the wraiths, and wasn't it Gandalf who made the white horse effect in the rushing waves? Arwen got way more than her just due in this film.

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Monday, January 3, 2005 7:31 AM

CORNCOBB

Does anyone here happen to know why the scouring of the shire was deliberately left out? Did PJ not like that chapter for some reason?

"Gorramit Mal... I've forgotten my line."

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Monday, January 3, 2005 8:35 AM

DIEGO

I believe the scouring of the shire was left out for a couple of reasons.
1) The movies were going to be long enough. There are great parts from the book, like Tom Bombadil etc., that aren't necessary for the story-telling and if included as a homage would require a lot of time to put in. You'll notice that whenever possible he puts in little extraneous details from the book, but he tends to select shorter elements (like the gift giving by Galadriel). Introducing Bombadil or dealing with the Sharky and his boys in the Shire would take more story-telling time.

2) It's anticlimatic. It runs like this --> the ring is destroyed--> end of journey everyone goes home--> uh-oh the villain from the first two books is still around and there is a new situation to deal with--> kick butt-->denouement and final farewell. Jackson says he felt that the story was that of Frodo's journey. He felt that the farewells and the glimpse of how Frodo has changed and can't deal with "normal" life anymroe were important parts leading up to the final departure at the grey havens. But he thought the scouring was superfluous. I always thought that this part of the book felt a little long, but that it was important in showing how much the hobbits have grown (literally in two cases!). But I think Jackson was able to show their changes effectively in a more abbreviated form with the Green Dragon scene.

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Monday, January 3, 2005 10:29 AM

MANIACNUMBERONE

Of course, we know that Sharkey is/was Saruman. I don't think it would have been anti-climactic to show his true end. His power lay in his voice the whole time, so I thought it was important to show his real end... not the somewhat silly ending he had falling off his tower. I thought it was a very neccessary part of the books too. It shows that the hobbits had changed in extraordinary ways. Their leadership, their strength, their abilities are all tested in their homeland at the end. I personally think it was needed. Even though Merry and Pippin did great deeds during their fellowship, they still needed to prove their changed state once they returned back to the Shire.
Also, the scouring of the Shire is very much a part of the story. It shows that evil penetrated everywhere, due to people's desire for power. There really was no escaping the Ring's power and influence. By not showing the scouring, they left out the rest of the Hobbits finally gaining their courage. As it stands, when Frodo and company rolled back into town, they were looked at the same way as they were when they left. That's just plain wrong. All the Hobbits took courage from the fellowship hobbits, chased down and killed Orcs and became a united people. Merry and Pippin finally got some real fighting action, and at the end they were all recognized as the heroes which they were. Sam became mayor! I don't think the Green Dragon scene showed much of a change in the other hobbits attitudes toward the heroic hobbits. That is just plain wrong too.

-------------------------------------------
Inara: Who's winning?
Simon: I can't really tell, they don't seem to be playing by any civilized rules that I know.
-------------------------------------------

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Monday, January 3, 2005 11:16 AM

MONTANAGIRL

Quote:
Originally posted by Corncobb:
Does anyone here happen to know why the scouring of the shire was deliberately left out? Did PJ not like that chapter for some reason?

I can't remember where I heard (or read) it, but in some interview Peter Jackson said that he had never liked the scouring of the Shire and it was never going to be included in the movie. He threw in the bit in Galadriel's mirror for the people who wanted to see the scouring (even though what was shown wasn't the scouring???) sort of as appeasement.

Packer fans welcome.
All others tolerated.

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Monday, January 3, 2005 11:43 AM

MISGUIDED BY VOICES

Quote:
Originally posted by ManiacNumberOne:
Of course, we know that Sharkey is/was Saruman. I don't think it would have been anti-climactic to show his true end. His power lay in his voice the whole time, so I thought it was important to show his real end... not the somewhat silly ending he had falling off his tower. I thought it was a very neccessary part of the books too. It shows that the hobbits had changed in extraordinary ways.

The real problem was one of time - PJ originally was trying to finance the film as two parts for the trilogy, so had to cut as much as he could; even when he got a film for each of the books (or one film per two books in reality), there was no way to have everything. The Scouring of the Shire could be cut and it would not effect the story of the movie as written. Same with Tom Bombadil and many of the parts cut.

If it were a mini-series, you could have had the Scouring, but as it stood, there was no way to end the film (which had something like 10 "endings" anyway) and re-start it for another twenty minutes.

"I threw up on your bed"

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Monday, January 3, 2005 1:28 PM

MOHRSTOUTBEARD

Quote:
Originally posted by ManiacNumberOne:
As it stands, when Frodo and company rolled back into town, they were looked at the same way as they were when they left. That's just plain wrong. [...] Sam became mayor! I don't think the Green Dragon scene showed much of a change in the other hobbits attitudes toward the heroic hobbits. That is just plain wrong too.

Well, in the book, Frodo was never given much renown in the Shire, either. Few if any of the hobbits knew or cared how much he had sacrificed for them.

Quote:
From The Return Of The King, Chapter IX: The Grey Havens:
Frodo dropped quietly out of all doings of the Shire, and Sam was pained to notice how little honour he had in his own country. Few people knew or wanted to know about his deeds and adventures; their admiration and respect were given mostly to Mr. Meriadoc and Mr. Peregrin and (if Sam had known it) to himself.

And, in the film, Sam does become mayor (I gather you're upset because you think he was short-changed in this regard?). The information is not offered up through exposition, but you can see, partially obscured by his head, that Frodo has written "Samwise Gamgee was elected may- [...] Hobbiton." You can also tell by the cut of Sam's clothes that he's moven up a bit in society.

As for the scene in the Green Dragon, I think it's a perfect, shared moment. These friends have gone there and back again; they've seen war, and things the other hobbits wouldn't understand. It makes sense to me that they feel slightly apart from them when they return. War changes people.

"You've just gotta go ahead and change the captain of your brainship, because he's drunk at the wheel."

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Monday, January 3, 2005 2:09 PM

MANIACNUMBERONE

I guess what I meant was that the other three hobbits got very good attention after the scouring... true enough frodo faded away a bit... he still helped with the scouring though. We know that merry and pippin were instrumental in rising the hobbits of the shire to do anything. I just picture the grumpy old man who gave them a crusty look in the "fellowship" when they were first riding into town, (granted gandalf was with him), who gives the returnng hobbits the same look when they return. It bugs me. Sorry if I am coming off like I didn't love the movie to death, because it was my wet dream come true. I've talked about this movie being made from the books for twenty years. So when I say things like I do, know that's comes from a place of love for the books and not anything else.

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