Most original design- Enterprise or Serenity or Falcon? by chrisisall

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Most original design- Enterprise or Serenity or Falcon?

POSTED BY: CHRISISALL
UPDATED: Thursday, May 6, 2010 10:21
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 9357
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Tuesday, April 27, 2010 2:26 PM

CHRISISALL

Sorry, no other ships are in their class.

VOTE!!!

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, April 27, 2010 2:41 PM

PENGUIN

Serenity.

King of the Mythical Land that is Iowa

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Tuesday, April 27, 2010 2:46 PM

MACBAKER

To many younger fans here, they've never known a time when there wasn't an Enterprise, so by their standards it's not very original when almost every Trek ship since has followed the same basic design.

I think the Falcon is cool, but awkward, and I adore Serenity, inside and out, but the Enterprise was the first space ship on TV or in movies that didn't look like a rocket ship or a flying saucer.

Matt Jefferies brilliant design did incorporate familiar elements of both rockets and a saucer, but in a way that was both beautiful and balanced. It was the first space ship I ever saw that seemed REAL.

My vote for most original, hands down, is Enterprise!

I'd given some thought to movin' off the edge -- not an ideal location -- thinkin' a place in the middle.

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Tuesday, April 27, 2010 3:03 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by MacBaker:

My vote for most original, hands down, is Enterprise!

I must concur, though I love 'em all!

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, April 27, 2010 4:18 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by Penguin:
Serenity.

But Serenity is based on the harrier vertical take off & landing jet, with shortened enterprise nacelles as the propulsion...

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, April 27, 2010 4:23 PM

CYBERSNARK

Serenity: Very obviously designed after a real-life firefly.

Falcon: Famously kitbashed from parts of model kits (mostly a Sherman tank, IIRC), with the overall design based on a hamburger with an olive on the side.

Enterprise: Drawn by Jeffries as per Roddenberry's instructions to be "a ship that children could doodle in the margins of their schoolbooks" (a philosophy that was revisited when it came time to design DS9).

My vote's gotta go to Enterprise.

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Tuesday, April 27, 2010 4:27 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by Cybersnark:

My vote's gotta go to Enterprise.

I agree, by a slim margin.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Tuesday, April 27, 2010 8:23 PM

MICJWELCH

The Enterprise is definitely based on the flying saucer idea. That's why the front part is called the "saucer section."

And the Millennium Falcon is a saucer as well.

Serenity is based on an insect, obviously.

They're all spectacular designs, but it's hard to call any of them "original."

My favorite design has always been the Enterprise D from TNG. I grew up on that show, so I practically grew up on that ship. I have spent hours going over the technical manual and the blueprints.

But now, right next to those books, are the blueprints for Serenity. I may have grown up on the Enterprise, but Serenity is home now.

"Always be yourself. Unless You suck." - Joss Whedon

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Tuesday, April 27, 2010 8:32 PM

PEULSAR5

We sniff the air, we don't kiss the dirt.

Design only-no sentimentality? The Enterprise. I grew up on Star Trek, and discovered Star Wars in 1977 in the fourth grade. But if you look at it; like you said earlier, Chris, Serenity has aspects of the Enterprise with the nacelles. Joss has also stated many times he based Serenity on the Falcon, so Serenity is the best of both worlds.

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 12:29 AM

THESOMNAMBULIST

The Falcon - for me. If I could have a ship it would be that one. It's so damn cool. I've always loved the off kilter aspect of it, and I adore that the cockpit is not central to the rest of the ship. It has a hyperdrive and room for smuggling and the engines aren't as exposed as that of the Enterprise (A major weakness in design for me)
SERENITY is cool with the glowing engine, but I never liked the cockpit and the limited viewing it provides.
Just like to point out a prefecrence for the cylon fighters from the ORIGINAL Battlestar Gallactica. Those were awesome to.

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 2:02 AM

LEMMING

The Enterprise. (If I must pick one)

"No bloody A, B, C or D" to quote Montgomery Scott.

(So glad that you posted the wonderful original version or what appears to be a good version of it)

I love Serenity completely, I too have the Blueprints on the wall, but it in fact owes much to The Enterprise which was without doubt (apart from the classic "Hugo" style rocketship - which was essentially a V2) the first truly iconic and different spaceship design. (You could see that this thing *belonged* in space, never meant to land or fly aerodynamically despite the smooth lines)

Serenity has the double nacelles, the neck, the bridge section and main body in a broadly similar configuration the Enterprise. Heck the cargo bay door is even where the deflector dish would have been.

Serenity owes more that a bit to the Falcon as well with the whole "a bit beaten up but maintained with care and love" vibe going on. (The Falcon of course notable as the first asymetric iconic design afaik, but it's still a straight saucer variant and so not the most original IMO)

This is not that surprising as functionality often drives design - so most planes look similar because of how they have to operate. It's also why there are the aircraft parallels with Serenity especially because of how it operates as well. You can even apply this principle to the Enterpise as a cross between classic Flying Saucer and aircraft with obvious engines outboard.

What makes all these designs attractive, apart from any emotional attachment we have (growing up with Trek , then Star Wars, then Firefly), is the combination of features that just *works*. There's a sense of inherent "rightness" about all 3, in the same sense that an Aston Martin DB5 looks a million time better than some of the deeply generic 80's or 90's cars you see around.

I guess that's why The Enterprise is "the one" for me. Similar vintage to myself (and DB5s in fact) and it was the first spaceship I fell in love with - one that sowed the appreciation and sometimes similar feelings of affection for those that followed.

I get the warm fuzzies when I look at Serenity, or even the Falcon, same as I do for the old NCC-1701, but wouldn't have developed one without the other.

Nick

The Signal < www.serenityfirefly.com>

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 4:04 AM

BYTEMITE

Quote:
The Falcon - for me. If I could have a ship it would be that one. It's so damn cool. I've always loved the off kilter aspect of it, and I adore that the cockpit is not central to the rest of the ship. It has a hyperdrive and room for smuggling and the engines aren't as exposed as that of the Enterprise (A major weakness in design for me)

SERENITY is cool with the glowing engine, but I never liked the cockpit and the limited viewing it provides.

...The Falcon doesn't have limited viewing as well? I'd say it has a comparable transparisteel to windshield factor, including an inability to see below or to the sides, but what's more, the position of the cockpit of the Falcon, if a loveable quirk, is also impractical. Vision would be partially obstructed by the forward projection.

Anyway. You can't call any of them UNORIGINAL, not unless they ripped off another design. "Most original" is an unquantifiable designation.

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 4:56 AM

HKCAVALIER

Most original? Gotta be Enterprise, 'cause--come on!--thing makes NO SENSE! Who would ever design a ship like that? Who? I love the idea that it was designed to be drawn by small children. Those other ships? Too much adherence to principles of engineering and utility.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 5:33 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:
Most original? Gotta be Enterprise, 'cause--come on!--thing makes NO SENSE! Who would ever design a ship like that?

You flunked Warp Displacement & Magnetic Stress Engineering class, didn't you?

Yep.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 6:05 AM

BROWNCOAT1

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

Quote:
Originally posted by micjwelch:
The Enterprise is definitely based on the flying saucer idea. That's why the front part is called the "saucer section."

And the Millennium Falcon is a saucer as well.

Serenity is based on an insect, obviously.

They're all spectacular designs, but it's hard to call any of them "original."

I agree that both the Enterprise and Falcon are both basically derived from flying saucers and in my thinking that does not make them very original.

In all honesty I have to say that Serenity is the most original of the three choices. Her curved neck and cockpit, which resemble those of a horse, are far removed from the normal linear design we see in space craft. Even looking at other ships we see in the 'verse the Firefly class stands apart.

My vote is for Serenity.

__________________________________________
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Richmond, VA & surrounding area Firefly Fans:

http://www.richmondbrowncoats.org

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http://76thbattalion.homestead.com/index.html

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 6:15 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by BrownCoat1:

I agree that both the Enterprise and Falcon are both basically derived from flying saucers and in my thinking that does not make them very original.

I disagree; the "saucer" section of Enterprise looks like no saucer I've ever seen (think Forbidden Planet or Invasion Of The Saucer Men or Earth Vs. The Flying Saucers), and the Falcon is so NOT a "saucer" that I can't accept the term being used to describe it.

I *could* say that Serenity is just a copy of Voyager, with the general shape and the feet & all, but I won't. All ships will have antecedents
but I see Enterprise as being the FIRST modern era break-away design, and that's why it gets my vote, even if it is a difficult & somewhat personal choice.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 7:50 AM

STORYMARK

For originality, I'm going to go with the Falcon, because it's asymmetrical - which in spaceship design is incredibly rare, and thus more original.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 7:54 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
For originality, I'm going to go with the Falcon, because it's asymmetrical - which in spaceship design is incredibly rare, and thus more original.

I can hover with that reasoning.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 9:04 AM

WINDIE

The Falcon for me, been in awe of the ship since the seventies.

Very close tho, is Serenity due to the I want to be there feeling.

A confused younger me votes the Falcon.

An old and not wiser me votes for Serenity.

The engineer in me, likes things that need to be tinkered with, the enterprise is to sterile and clean.

Why have they taken the sky from ME

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 11:04 AM

IMNOTHERE

If those are the only choices, I'd have to go with the good old NCC 1701.

Main reason: back in 1966, it was almost totally original, at least on screen: almost everything else was a saucer or a rocket (except a certain blue police box of course, but lets give the US a sporting chance

).

Plus, although it acknowledges that a starship that never lands doesn't need to be aerodynamic, it still looks fast. NB: in the accounts I've seen of its design, it looks like the saucer section started out as a sphere - plus it was always meant to be detachable in an emergency (although that didn't make it to the screen until TNG).

But what's this about no other contenders, Chris?

What about:

Or this:

Or any of these:

(Can't find a decent Starfury...)

PS: Serenity always reminds me of this, for some reason:

EDIT and how could I forget this:

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 12:24 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Showing my noobness on things SW, was it ever explained why the Falcon's cockpit was off centered?

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 12:42 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Showing my noobness on things SW, was it ever explained why the Falcon's cockpit was off centered?

Just to be different, I conjure.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 12:52 PM

STORYMARK

I don't think there's a story-based reason, or if there is, it was conjured long after the fact.

The folk tale around it is that Lucas was trying to describe his idea for the ship (and it's asymetrical nature), and illustrated it by sticking an olive to the side of a hamburger with a toothpick.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 1:07 PM

CYBERSNARK

The only "explanation" I've ever come across was a note in the old West-End RPG that the stock YT-1300 freighter came in three variants; portside cockpit, starbord cockpit, and central cockpit. Lando just happened to end up with the starbord-side variant.

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 2:13 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Showing my noobness on things SW, was it ever explained why the Falcon's cockpit was off centered?

Just to be different, I conjure.

The laughing Chrisisall

I can't help but think of Jubal Early, as he described the cargo bay of Serenity.

I like the way the walls go out.
Gives you an open feeling. Firefly's
a good design.

Those words really stuck w/ me. Not because Jubal was describing our favorite Midbulk transport

, but because I hear Joss proudly proclaiming to the world that there was great thought put into this design. The ship has meaning. Not just in her crew, but in her very essence....

Sorry, what was the question again?

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 2:25 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Sorry, what was the question again?

Are you a lion?

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 2:43 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Sorry, what was the question again?

Are you a lion?

The laughing Chrisisall

I do have a mighty roar....

Now this is creepy. I'm actually wearing a fleece pull over with a Mac & Jack's logo on it ...

Well.... my sister is a ship...... we had a complicated childhood.

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 2:47 PM

STORYMARK

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

I can't help but think of Jubal Early, as he described the cargo bay of Serenity.

I like the way the walls go out.
Gives you an open feeling. Firefly's
a good design.

Those words really stuck w/ me. Not because Jubal was describing our favorite Midbulk transport , but because I hear Joss proudly proclaiming to the world that there was great thought put into this design. The ship has meaning. Not just in her crew, but in her very essence....

That's a solid observation, I had never looked at it that way.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 2:48 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Now this is creepy. I'm actually wearing a fleece pull over with a Mac & Jack's logo on it ...

I know, we saw it. Hence the question.

*Que eerie Twilight-Zone music*

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 2:51 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:

That's a solid observation, I had never looked at it that way.

Yeah, props for the astuteness. Bonus points for using the term "midbulk."

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 3:42 PM

OUT2THEBLACK

Most ORIGINAL design ?

Enterprise...(Duh !)

http://www.mattjefferies.com/btbtc.html

Were it not for the Enterprise and her 'originality' , we probably wouldn't have a Falcon or a Firefly...

Gotta give all credit to Matt for that...Funny that Enterprise was supposed to be a doodle , because I totally used to do that !

Saw some of his artwork in the aviation world , from time to time , back in the day...

Enterprise was an 'instant classic' . Still is ! Despite the makeovers , it remains elegant .

Among engineers , the preference runs to the Falcon , for a number of reasons !

But , I live in Serenity , 'cause she has a lot of regular Folk in her heart...So very pretty , but all jus' Folk...

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 3:45 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by out2theblack:

Were it not for the Enterprise and her 'originality' , we probably wouldn't have a Falcon or a Firefly...

Gotta give all credit to Matt for that...

Yep.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 3:45 PM

CHRISISALL

Damn Ferengi double latinum post!

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 4:51 PM

OUT2THEBLACK

Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
...The folk tale around it is that Lucas was trying to describe his idea for the ship (and it's asymetrical nature), and illustrated it by sticking an olive to the side of a hamburger with a toothpick.

That's the apocryphal version of the fable...Heretic !

The real story is that the Falcon came together over lunch at a little take-out hole-in-the-wall which featured a sandwich made with a boneless
Pork Chop , which was their specialty...It was called , what else ? , the
porkburger!

As was the Falcon , among the crew...

I always thought the Falcon looked like a trilobite moving backward , but some concept sketches took off from the notion that it was an ocean sunfish...

Odder still , the 'original' Falcon was the
Pirate Ship , which was the concept model which was eventually rehabbed into Tantive IV , Princess Leia's Rebel Blockade Runner...

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 4:53 PM

CHRISISALL

Star Wars geek-land here, my Browncoat brothers & sisters...

The laughing Chrisisall

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 5:34 PM

OUT2THEBLACK

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Star Wars geek-land here, my Browncoat brothers & sisters...

More than you know...At this very moment , I'm wearing my vintage-y
Star Wars T-shirt !

Meanwhile , here comes the rockety , saucer-y , Enterprise ! You can tell it's the rockety Enterprise because Spock is even greener than usual ! That's what happens
when you run around at Warp Nine with your tail on fire...Like a Firefly !

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Wednesday, April 28, 2010 11:46 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Most 'original' deign? I'd have to go w/ the Enterprise. I mean, the warp engines themselves don't even work like standard propellant engines.

All 3 are fine lookin' ships, to be sure.

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

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Thursday, April 29, 2010 7:54 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by out2theblack:

I have this book upstairs.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Thursday, April 29, 2010 7:55 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

All 3 are fine lookin' ships, to be sure.

Best in history, IMHO.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Monday, May 3, 2010 4:16 AM

CLJOHNSTON108

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Sorry, no other ships are in their class.

Oh, I dunno about that!

My pick is for the Enterprise, since it was the first one to be designed exclusively for travel in outer space: Not a single aerodynamic surface, and no visible exhaust (sparklers & road flares, ECCH!). In fact, it was the first one to not even use conventional rocket propulsion, but rather EM fields! Amazingly advanced concept for that era!

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Monday, May 3, 2010 8:15 AM

CHRISISALL

Starfury am cool all right.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Thursday, May 6, 2010 10:21 AM

CHRISISALL

The model I cannot afford:

http://blog.seattlepi.com/thebigblog/library/serenity.JPG