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REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS
235 Republican Congressmen Sign Mandatory Healthcare Bill!
Wednesday, May 4, 2011 3:25 PM
KWICKO
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)
Wednesday, May 4, 2011 5:08 PM
DREAMTROVE
Wednesday, May 4, 2011 6:45 PM
PIRATENEWS
John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!
Wednesday, May 4, 2011 7:32 PM
Quote:Originally posted by piratenews: Note this mandatory med insurance law only requires we buy private insurance. It does not require the insurance be affordable. It does not require the insurance to cover pre-existing, which it will never do. So after you buy the insurance, you still have no coverage!
Wednesday, May 4, 2011 9:37 PM
Quote:The only defense for this is for states to preempt it with a public option so that everyone is covered.
Thursday, May 5, 2011 2:21 AM
GEEZER
Keep the Shiny side up
Thursday, May 5, 2011 8:04 AM
NIKI2
Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...
Quote:Some governors are viewing Obamacare as the federal government specifying the *MINIMUM* healthcare levels that are acceptable, and using that as a starting point, rather than an end point. States are within their rights, they say, to offer something MORE to their residents, such as single-payer or a public option, so long as it covers at least as many people with at least as much coverage. States can vote to implement their own methods of payment - mandate, tax increase, etc. - and as the states' rights folk are so proud of pointing out, anyone who doesn't want to participate can simply move to another state.
Thursday, May 5, 2011 8:13 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Geezer: Saying that offering a refundable tax credit for those buying health insurance makes that purchase mandatory seems to be sort'a like claiming the EITC makes working mandatory or the Adoption credit makes adoption mandatory. Not saying one way or the other about anyone's health insurance plans, but the author of this article seems to have a bias, as several folks in the 'comments' note. "Keep the Shiny side up"
Thursday, May 5, 2011 8:47 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: So you agree that "Obamacare" isn't mandatory?
Thursday, May 5, 2011 8:53 AM
Quote:One of the most innovative voices in the health care debate, Senator Ron Wyden (D-Ore.), is accelerating the process of exempting his state from some of the national reforms passed under President Barack Obama. The Oregon Democrat is seeking to take advantage of a provision he helped write into the legislation that allows states to set up their own health care systems as long as they meet minimal requirements established by the Department of Health and Human Services. In a letter to the state's Health Authority office, Wyden announced that he will introduce legislation to accelerate the start date for state waivers from 2017 to 2014, if not earlier for Oregon specifically. In addition, he strongly suggested that the state should use the provision to exempt Oregon from the individual mandate, which would penalize those individuals who refuse to purchase insurance coverage. The mandate was a feature of Wyden's own health care bill but has proved to be remarkably unpopular among voters.
Quote:Colorado lawmakers have agreed on a plan that creates a health insurance marketplace they hope will help the state avoid mandates from a federal health care law. The bill creates an exchange board and an oversight committee. The board would administer the exchange, with the power to set up financial plans, apply for grants and determine the size of the small employer market. The exchange would allow small groups to pool resources to buy health insurance. It was approved Tuesday by the House Health & Environment Committee with overwhelming support from the business community and now goes to the full House for debate. Trying to quell fears that it’s a step toward federal health care mandates, the exchange would not purchase insurance or set rates, be an agency of the state and there would be no mandate to buy health insurance. Carriers would not be required to provide insurance. Bill Lindsay, who chaired a health care study group that recommended Colorado set up its own exchanges, said it’s better for Colorado to come up with its own plan than wait for the federal government to come up with a plan. “It’s a Colorado solution to the questions and issues, and it’s unique to Colorado,” he said. Supporters argue that states that don’t set up exchanges will be assigned one by the federal government in future years and say Colorado should act now to craft its own exchange.
Quote:In a speech to governors, President Obama just endorsed a plan to allow states to opt out of major provisions of the Affordable Care Act just as it’s set to kick in. Saying he recognizes that not everyone is a member of the “Affordable Care Act fan club,” Obama said, “I agree with Mitt Romney that…states should have the power to implement their own solutions.” The plan Obama endorsed, first proposed back in November by Democratic Sen. Ron Wyden and Republican Sen. Scott Brown, would give states flexibility to design their own versions of health reform. States could buck many aspects of the federal approach, including the individual mandate, employer requirements, health insurance exchanges and the federal design for insurance policies. Under this system, states would receive their share of insurance subsidies and administrative funding in blocks to implement their own reforms. In order to be granted a waiver to do this, a state would need to show its plan would: * not increase the federal deficit * provide insurance to as many people as the ACA * provide insurance as least as comprehensive as that called for in the ACA * provide insurance that’s just as affordable
Thursday, May 5, 2011 11:33 AM
RIONAEIRE
Beir bua agus beannacht
Thursday, May 5, 2011 1:14 PM
Quote:Originally posted by Geezer: Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: So you agree that "Obamacare" isn't mandatory? Nope. Neither does the article you quote. "Beginning Jan. 1, 2014, when the ACA provision takes effect, individuals who do not qualify for exemption on hardship or other specified grounds, must either carry health insurance or pay a tax penalty as part of their annual income tax filing. The ACA caps individuals' penalty liability at 2.5 percent of household income above the filing threshold, or a flat dollar amount ranging from $695 to $2,085, depending on family size." Buy health insurance or pay a penalty sounds pretty mandatory. As usual, when you got no answer, you start blowing smoke. "Keep the Shiny side up"
Thursday, May 5, 2011 1:16 PM
Quote:Originally posted by RionaEire: I think I like the German healthcare system, available for all, but with options. "A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya
Thursday, May 5, 2011 1:41 PM
Quote:One of these Ryan proposals—as yet little noticed by pundits or politicians—is almost an exact copy of a provision in the Affordable Care Act.* It would repeal the current exclusion from employees' income of employer contributions to their health insurance premiums, thus terminating the subsidized employer-sponsored group health regime that covers nearly 60 percent of all Americans. In its place, the Republican plan would substitute a refundable tax credit, to be provided to individuals who purchase health insurance (or to employers who purchase health insurance for their employees). When this new arrangement takes effect in 2022, the tax credit would be set at $2,300 per adult and $1,700 per child, not to exceed $5,700 per family.
Quote:Under both provisions, the result is the same: People who choose to carry health insurance have a lower tax bill than they would if they chose not to. In terms of their respective potential impact on individuals' bank accounts and tax liability, the manner in which they affect individuals' financial incentives, and hence the constraining effect on individuals' financial choices to either buy or forgo health insurance, the two "mandate" provisions are identical. (Indeed, in most cases, the financial difference for the individual taxpayer made by the Republican tax credit would be greater—i.e., more "coercive"—than the ACA tax penalty.)
Quote:In addition to cloning the ACA's framework for coverage of adults under 65, the Ryan plan would also apply a similar approach to Americans currently covered by Medicare.* Beginning in 2021, former Medicare-eligibles would receive a voucher they can apply to the purchase of private insurance. According to the Congressional Budget Office, the vouchers would be worth approximately $6,000 for recipients age 65, and would be greater for older recipients, averaging $11,000 across the entire Medicare population. Of course, Americans would be required to continue to pay their annual Medicare tax throughout their working lives. Hence, the Republicans' proposal to replace Medicare with partially subsidized private insurance also operates to "compel" people to pay for private health insurance policies. Moreover, this mandate is not even a pay-or-play option; Medicare taxes are mandatory, whether workers want to buy eligibility for old-age vouchers or not.
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