REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

FBI Raids Manafort's Home

POSTED BY: SHINYGOODGUY
UPDATED: Saturday, August 19, 2017 03:28
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Friday, August 11, 2017 5:03 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


You know, I find this rather curious. It's been two days since the news broke regarding the raid of Manafort's home by the FBI. Yet here we are, and no mention of it by anyone, not even our resident Russia-phobes.

It's been all over the MSM Libtard news. You guys are slipping!
What, Fox forgot their headline busters? Later, I'm going to go watch Fox to see what they have to say about the latest development.

Trump, of course, praised Manafort as a good man. Meanwhile, he continues to bash McConnell. Good, the rats are slowly abandoning ship.


SGG

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Friday, August 11, 2017 6:52 AM

KPO


I'm watching with interest. Have known about the shady Manafort since his time in Ukraine working for the pro-Russian, corrupt former president Yanukovich, who stole billions from the country and was overthrown, but not before ordering his security forces to fire on protesters, killing nearly 100. Manafort went from working for him, to working for Trump (another corrupt, pro-Russian authoritarian). That should tell you something.

Glad to see that the FBI is getting its teeth deep into this guy, hopefully just the first rotten domino to fall.

-------------------------------------------------------

"Objective truths are established by evidence. Personal truths by faith. Political truths by incessant repetition."

Russia's and Assad's War Crimes in Syria - http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=60278
Syrian regime collusion with ISIS - http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=60521


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Friday, August 11, 2017 6:57 AM

KPO


Also note that Trump tweeted for acting FBI director McCabe to be fired just a few hours after the FBI raid on Manafort...

Yeah, Trump is worried.

-------------------------------------------------------

"Objective truths are established by evidence. Personal truths by faith. Political truths by incessant repetition."

Russia's and Assad's War Crimes in Syria - http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=60278
Syrian regime collusion with ISIS - http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=60521


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Friday, August 11, 2017 7:45 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Nothing for Trump to be worried about, save for the fact that the Deep State and D.C. establishment are out to get him, no matter what.

Manafort fully cooperates and then is greeted early the next morning with an FBI raid on his home ?

Sorry, but that's straight up banana republic b.s. right there. Put simply, the FBI doesn't DO pre-dawn raids for cooperating individuals. IT's really fucking bad for business.

Also, this took place weeks ago, and gee... no leaks ! Gee, imagine that !

Add to the fact that there was no word on the raid, but also... nothing has been leaked out as to what was found.


This has all the earmarks of a set up.

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Friday, August 11, 2017 8:56 AM

RIVERLOVE


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Nothing for Trump to be worried about, save for the fact that the Deep State and D.C. establishment are out to get him, no matter what.

Manafort fully cooperates and then is greeted early the next morning with an FBI raid on his home ?

Sorry, but that's straight up banana republic b.s. right there. Put simply, the FBI doesn't DO pre-dawn raids for cooperating individuals. IT's really fucking bad for business.

Also, this took place weeks ago, and gee... no leaks ! Gee, imagine that !

Add to the fact that there was no word on the raid, but also... nothing has been leaked out as to what was found.


This has all the earmarks of a set up.


Ah, some sobering truth! Very refreshing, very refreshing. Slimy's gonna be devastated .. again.

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Friday, August 11, 2017 10:16 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. Pity would be no more, If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


Quote:

but not before ordering his security forces to fire on protesters,
More bullshit and lies from the aptly-renamed KRAPO.

Quote:

When the shooting started early on the morning of the 20th, Sergei [A PROTESTER] says, he was escorted to the Conservatory, and spent some 20 minutes before 07:00 firing on police, alongside a second gunman.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-31359021

-----------
By the way, GSTRING, I predicted your response PERFECTLY
* ... and then you'll say I'm "too wordy". And then you will - as always- refuse to address the pertinent points, and respond with even more lies and even more bullshit personal attacks.*

And voila! Here it is http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61835&mid=1
035581#1035581

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Friday, August 11, 2017 11:53 AM

G

... fully loaded, safety off...


Quote:

Originally posted by kpo:
I'm watching with interest. Have known about the shady Manafort since his time in Ukraine working for the pro-Russian, corrupt former president Yanukovich, who stole billions from the country and was overthrown, but not before ordering his security forces to fire on protesters, killing nearly 100. Manafort went from working for him, to working for Trump (another corrupt, pro-Russian authoritarian). That should tell you something.



His Ukrainian haircut was such a standout - it always made me laugh. This too - possibly the funniest, worst 18 second denial from this entire Fellini-esque nightmare:



Sounds honest, right?

Watching Trump distance himself from "Paul who?" Has been equally amusing. If Trump ever says, "I always thought of him as a good guy," you know you're nothing more than dirt to Trump. Hear that Trump Jr?

==============================

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Friday, August 11, 2017 4:45 PM

THGRRI

May the Good Lord take a liking to you... but not too soon!


He lived in Trump towers. Trump has known him for thirty years.






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Friday, August 11, 2017 6:21 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

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Friday, August 11, 2017 11:03 PM

KPO


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

but not before ordering his security forces to fire on protesters,
More bullshit and lies from the aptly-renamed KRAPO.

Quote:

When the shooting started early on the morning of the 20th, Sergei [A PROTESTER] says, he was escorted to the Conservatory, and spent some 20 minutes before 07:00 firing on police, alongside a second gunman.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-31359021


That doesn't even contradict what I said... Get to the point in your conspiracy theory where you say the protesters shot themselves. Or was it the CIA?

-------------------------------------------------------

"Objective truths are established by evidence. Personal truths by faith. Political truths by incessant repetition."

Russia's and Assad's War Crimes in Syria - http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=60278
Syrian regime collusion with ISIS - http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=60521


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Friday, August 11, 2017 11:52 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. Pity would be no more, If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


I'm not trying to drag this thread way off-topic, so this is my last response on the Maidan sniper shooting.
Quote:

There is a related type of false flag operation commonly used to create chaos and discredit regimes or protesters: snipers.

For example:
Unknown snipers reportedly killed both Venezuelan government and opposition protesters in the attempted 2002 coup https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_Venezuelan_coup_d'%C3%A9tat_att
empt#Miraflores_confrontation


Unknown snipers fired during Thailand’s 2010 protests https://www.csmonitor.com/World/Asia-Pacific/2010/0412/Thailand-s-red-
shirt-protests-darken-with-unknown-snipers-parade-of-coffins


Unknown snipers allegedly have created bedlam in Syria

A Russian general alleges that – during Yeltsin’s protest in front of the Russian parliament – sniper fire came from the roof of the American Embassy

And the Estonian foreign minister claims that the new Ukranian coalition deployed snipers to discredit the former government of Ukraine http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/03/estonian-foreign-minister-accus
es-new-ukranian-government-behind-sniper-attacks-led-ouster-old-ukranian-government.html


Brutal … but effective and cheap.

Because it doesn’t cost much to hire one or a handful of snipers to access rooftops or bridge overpasses, create chaos, and then quietly disappear.


http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/03/snipers-commonly-used-false-fla
g-terrorists.html


-----------
By the way, GSTRING, I predicted your response PERFECTLY
* ... and then you'll say I'm "too wordy". And then you will - as always- refuse to address the pertinent points, and respond with even more lies and even more bullshit personal attacks.*

And voila! Here it is http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61835&mid=1
035581#1035581

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Saturday, August 12, 2017 9:34 AM

REAVERFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Nothing for Trump to be worried about, save for the fact that the Deep State and D.C. establishment are out to get him, no matter what.

Manafort fully cooperates and then is greeted early the next morning with an FBI raid on his home ?

Sorry, but that's straight up banana republic b.s. right there. Put simply, the FBI doesn't DO pre-dawn raids for cooperating individuals. IT's really fucking bad for business.

Also, this took place weeks ago, and gee... no leaks ! Gee, imagine that !

Add to the fact that there was no word on the raid, but also... nothing has been leaked out as to what was found.


This has all the earmarks of a set up.

You're hilarious!

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Saturday, August 12, 2017 10:24 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


Yes, it's about time the FBI became aggressive in their pursuit of this guy Manafort, whom you could tell is a bad liar who's joined another bad liar. They're looking to squeeze Manafort to see if he's willing to sing for the authorities. Only time will tell, but yes I knew about his dirty dealings with the bogus Ukraine
oligarch/Putin puppet.

Hopefully the first of many to fall.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by kpo:
I'm watching with interest. Have known about the shady Manafort since his time in Ukraine working for the pro-Russian, corrupt former president Yanukovich, who stole billions from the country and was overthrown, but not before ordering his security forces to fire on protesters, killing nearly 100. Manafort went from working for him, to working for Trump (another corrupt, pro-Russian authoritarian). That should tell you something.

Glad to see that the FBI is getting its teeth deep into this guy, hopefully just the first rotten domino to fall.

-------------------------------------------------------

"Objective truths are established by evidence. Personal truths by faith. Political truths by incessant repetition."

Russia's and Assad's War Crimes in Syria - http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=60278
Syrian regime collusion with ISIS - http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=60521



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Saturday, August 12, 2017 10:28 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


Yeah, he's feeling the heat. Trump can't fire everybody, but I'm curious as to how long McConnell and Ryan will continue to back him. The shit is about to hit the fan.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by kpo:
Also note that Trump tweeted for acting FBI director McCabe to be fired just a few hours after the FBI raid on Manafort...

Yeah, Trump is worried.

-------------------------------------------------------

"Objective truths are established by evidence. Personal truths by faith. Political truths by incessant repetition."

Russia's and Assad's War Crimes in Syria - http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=60278
Syrian regime collusion with ISIS - http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=60521



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Saturday, August 12, 2017 10:41 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


Sure Rappy, nothing for Trump to worry about...nothing to see here. Then why is he so eager to fire another FBI director? The Deep State is gonna rip Trump a new one, then we'll see some heavy duty backpedaling.

And the truth shall set you free!

Manafort cooperated and still Mueller felt the need to raid his home, but really Manafort and Trump should feel at home with the Gestapo Tactics...All Heil Hitler!
Straight up bullshit alright, banana republic rules for a banana republic regime.
And no leaks! That goes to show you how it's done. Mueller to this day is quietly going about his business - no tweets, no leaks and no fake news. That's how you conduct an investigation.

Yep, this IS a set up. Gangnam Style!

Next stop Kushner.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Nothing for Trump to be worried about, save for the fact that the Deep State and D.C. establishment are out to get him, no matter what.

Manafort fully cooperates and then is greeted early the next morning with an FBI raid on his home ?

Sorry, but that's straight up banana republic b.s. right there. Put simply, the FBI doesn't DO pre-dawn raids for cooperating individuals. IT's really fucking bad for business.

Also, this took place weeks ago, and gee... no leaks ! Gee, imagine that !

Add to the fact that there was no word on the raid, but also... nothing has been leaked out as to what was found.


This has all the earmarks of a set up.


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Saturday, August 12, 2017 10:43 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


Kazing! Deflect! And this without the famed Wonder woman bracelets! Ha!


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

but not before ordering his security forces to fire on protesters,
More bullshit and lies from the aptly-renamed KRAPO.

Quote:

When the shooting started early on the morning of the 20th, Sergei [A PROTESTER] says, he was escorted to the Conservatory, and spent some 20 minutes before 07:00 firing on police, alongside a second gunman.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-31359021

-----------
By the way, GSTRING, I predicted your response PERFECTLY
* ... and then you'll say I'm "too wordy". And then you will - as always- refuse to address the pertinent points, and respond with even more lies and even more bullshit personal attacks.*

And voila! Here it is http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61835&mid=1
035581#1035581


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Saturday, August 12, 2017 10:48 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


Ah, refreshing like the land of the sky blue waters. Step right up folks, the leg pulling is about to begin.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by Riverlove:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Nothing for Trump to be worried about, save for the fact that the Deep State and D.C. establishment are out to get him, no matter what.

Manafort fully cooperates and then is greeted early the next morning with an FBI raid on his home ?

Sorry, but that's straight up banana republic b.s. right there. Put simply, the FBI doesn't DO pre-dawn raids for cooperating individuals. IT's really fucking bad for business.

Also, this took place weeks ago, and gee... no leaks ! Gee, imagine that !

Add to the fact that there was no word on the raid, but also... nothing has been leaked out as to what was found.


This has all the earmarks of a set up.


Ah, some sobering truth! Very refreshing, very refreshing. Slimy's gonna be devastated .. again.


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Saturday, August 12, 2017 10:53 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Are you drunk again?




Trump is not the problem. He set himself against the Deep State's agenda. And the Deep State's been heading for WWIII for years.
As for you, you're just a Deep State useful idiot, furthering its agenda. So I hope you enjoy cesium in your coffee. You've earned it.

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Saturday, August 12, 2017 11:06 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


Quote:

Watching Trump distance himself from "Paul who?" Has been equally amusing. If Trump ever says, "I always thought of him as a good guy," you know you're nothing more than dirt to Trump. Hear that Trump Jr?


I agree, watching Trump wriggle on the line gives me a deep down chuckle that is so juicy. The only thing that would give me greater pleasure is to see him sweat while being cross-examined on the witness stand (I know this because he would be stupid enough to ignore advice of counsel and insist on testifying). This aught to be good.

Trump does not give a shit about anybody. Did you see the statement he read about the White Supremacist BBQ today in Charlottesville? It was beyond unfeeling, it was zombie-like. It reminded me of a girlfriend I once had for about 5 minutes.


SGG

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Saturday, August 12, 2017 11:08 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


You're funny!


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Are you drunk again?




Trump is not the problem. He set himself against the Deep State's agenda. And the Deep State's been heading for WWIII for years.
As for you, you're just a Deep State useful idiot, furthering its agenda. So I hope you enjoy cesium in your coffee. You've earned it.


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Saturday, August 12, 2017 11:09 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


Now, why isn't this Fake News?


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
When is a Russian 'hack' not a hack? Evidence suggests DNC email hack was an inside job

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/when-is-a-russian-hack-not-a-hack-ev
idence-suggests-dnc-email-hack-was-an-inside-job/article/2631267


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Saturday, August 12, 2017 11:12 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Are you drunk again?

Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
You're funny!

You're a sloppy drunk!




Trump is not the problem. He set himself against the Deep State's agenda. And the Deep State's been heading for WWIII for years.
As for you, you're just a Deep State useful idiot, furthering its agenda. So I hope you enjoy cesium in your coffee. You've earned it.

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Saturday, August 12, 2017 11:16 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
When is a Russian 'hack' not a hack? Evidence suggests DNC email hack was an inside job

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/when-is-a-russian-hack-not-a-hack-ev
idence-suggests-dnc-email-hack-was-an-inside-job/article/2631267

Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
Now, why isn't this Fake News?

Because it's not ...


http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=61853
Evidence: The DNC server was not "hacked"
POSTED BY: SIGNYM

Quote:

A New Report Raises Big Questions About Last Year’s DNC Hack

Written by Patrick Lawrence of The Nation,

It is now a year since the Democratic National Committee’s mail system was compromised—a year since events in the spring and early summer of 2016 were identified as remote hacks and, in short order, attributed to Russians acting in behalf of Donald Trump. A great edifice has been erected during this time. President Trump, members of his family, and numerous people around him stand accused of various corruptions and extensive collusion with Russians. Half a dozen simultaneous investigations proceed into these matters. Last week news broke that Special Counsel Robert Mueller had convened a grand jury, which issued its first subpoenas on August 3. Allegations of treason are common; prominent political figures and many media cultivate a case for impeachment.

The president’s ability to conduct foreign policy, notably but not only with regard to Russia, is now crippled. Forced into a corner and having no choice, Trump just signed legislation imposing severe new sanctions on Russia and European companies working with it on pipeline projects vital to Russia’s energy sector. Striking this close to the core of another nation’s economy is customarily considered an act of war, we must not forget. In retaliation, Moscow has announced that the United States must cut its embassy staff by roughly two-thirds. All sides agree that relations between the United States and Russia are now as fragile as they were during some of the Cold War’s worst moments. To suggest that military conflict between two nuclear powers inches ever closer can no longer be dismissed as hyperbole.

All this was set in motion when the DNC’s mail server was first violated in the spring of 2016 and by subsequent assertions that Russians were behind that “hack” and another such operation, also described as a Russian hack, on July 5. These are the foundation stones of the edifice just outlined. The evolution of public discourse in the year since is worthy of scholarly study: Possibilities became allegations, and these became probabilities. Then the probabilities turned into certainties, and these evolved into what are now taken to be established truths. By my reckoning, it required a few days to a few weeks to advance from each of these stages to the next. This was accomplished via the indefensibly corrupt manipulations of language repeated incessantly in our leading media.

Lost in a year that often appeared to veer into our peculiarly American kind of hysteria is the absence of any credible evidence

HINT HINT!

Quote:

of what happened last year and who was responsible for it. It is tiresome to note, but none has been made available. Instead, we are urged to accept the word of institutions and senior officials with long records of deception. These officials profess “high confidence” in their “assessment” as to what happened in the spring and summer of last year—this standing as their authoritative judgment. Few have noticed since these evasive terms first appeared that an assessment is an opinion, nothing more, and to express high confidence is an upside-down way of admitting the absence of certain knowledge. This is how officials avoid putting their names on the assertions we are so strongly urged to accept—as the record shows many of them have done.

We come now to a moment of great gravity.

There has been a long effort to counter the official narrative we now call “Russiagate.” This effort has so far focused on the key events noted above, leaving numerous others still to be addressed. Until recently, researchers undertaking this work faced critical shortcomings, and these are to be explained. But they have achieved significant new momentum in the past several weeks, and what they have done now yields very consequential fruit. Forensic investigators, intelligence analysts, system designers, program architects, and computer scientists of long experience and strongly credentialed are now producing evidence disproving the official version of key events last year. Their work is intricate and continues at a kinetic pace as we speak. But its certain results so far are two, simply stated, and freighted with implications:

There was no hack of the Democratic National Committee’s system on July 5 last year—not by the Russians, not by anyone else. Hard science now demonstrates it was a leak—a download executed locally with a memory key or a similarly portable data-storage device. In short, it was an inside job by someone with access to the DNC’s system. This casts serious doubt on the initial “hack,” as alleged, that led to the very consequential publication of a large store of documents on WikiLeaks last summer.

Forensic investigations of documents made public two weeks prior to the July 5 leak by the person or entity known as Guccifer 2.0 show that they were fraudulent: Before Guccifer posted them they were adulterated by cutting and pasting them into a blank template that had Russian as its default language. Guccifer took responsibility on June 15 for an intrusion the DNC reported on June 14 and professed to be a WikiLeaks source—claims essential to the official narrative implicating Russia in what was soon cast as an extensive hacking operation. To put the point simply, forensic science now devastates this narrative.

This article is based on an examination of the documents these forensic experts and intelligence analysts have produced, notably the key papers written over the past several weeks, as well as detailed interviews with many of those conducting investigations and now drawing conclusions from them. Before proceeding into this material, several points bear noting.

One, there are many other allegations implicating Russians in the 2016 political process. The work I will now report upon does not purport to prove or disprove any of them. Who delivered documents to WikiLeaks? Who was responsible for the “phishing” operation penetrating John Podesta’s e-mail in March 2016? We do not know the answers to such questions. It is entirely possible, indeed, that the answers we deserve and must demand could turn out to be multiple: One thing happened in one case, another thing in another. The new work done on the mid-June and July 5 events bears upon all else in only one respect. We are now on notice: Given that we now stand face to face with very considerable cases of duplicity, it is imperative that all official accounts of these many events be subject to rigorously skeptical questioning. Do we even know that John Podesta’s e-mail was in fact “phished”? What evidence of this has been produced? Such rock-bottom questions as these must now be posed in all other cases.

Two, houses built on sand and made of cards are bound to collapse, and there can be no surprise that the one resting atop the “hack theory,” as we can call the prevailing wisdom on the DNC events, appears to be in the process of doing so. Neither is there anything far-fetched in a reversal of the truth of this magnitude.

American history is replete with similar cases. The Spanish sank the Maine in Havana harbor in February 1898. Iran’s Mossadegh was a Communist. Guatemala’s Árbenz represented a Communist threat to the United States. Vietnam’s Ho Chi Minh was a Soviet puppet. The Sandinistas were Communists. The truth of the Maine, a war and a revolution in between, took a century to find the light of day, whereupon the official story disintegrated. We can do better now. It is an odd sensation to live through one of these episodes, especially one as big as Russiagate. But its place atop a long line of precedents can no longer be disputed.

Three, regardless of what one may think about the investigations and conclusions I will now outline—and, as noted, these investigations continue—there is a bottom line attaching to them. We can even call it a red line.

Under no circumstance can it be acceptable that the relevant authorities—the National Security Agency, the Justice Department (via the Federal Bureau of Investigation), and the Central Intelligence Agency—leave these new findings without reply. Not credibly, in any case. Forensic investigators, prominent among them people with decades’ experience at high levels in these very institutions, have put a body of evidence on a table previously left empty. Silence now, should it ensue, cannot be written down as an admission of duplicity, but it will come very close to one.

It requires no elaboration to apply the above point to the corporate media, which have been flaccidly satisfied with official explanations of the DNC matter from the start.

Qualified experts working independently of one another began to examine the DNC case immediately after the July 2016 events. Prominent among these is a group comprising former intelligence officers, almost all of whom previously occupied senior positions. Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity (VIPS), founded in 2003, now has 30 members, including a few associates with backgrounds in national-security fields other than intelligence. The chief researchers active on the DNC case are four: William Binney, formerly the NSA’s technical director for world geopolitical and military analysis and designer of many agency programs now in use; Kirk Wiebe, formerly a senior analyst at the NSA’s SIGINT Automation Research Center; Edward Loomis, formerly technical director in the NSA’s Office of Signal Processing; and Ray McGovern, an intelligence analyst for nearly three decades and formerly chief of the CIA’s Soviet Foreign Policy Branch. Most of these men have decades of experience in matters concerning Russian intelligence and the related technologies. This article reflects numerous interviews with all of them conducted in person, via Skype, or by telephone.

The customary VIPS format is an open letter, typically addressed to the president. The group has written three such letters on the DNC incident, all of which were first published by Robert Parry at www.consortiumnews.com. Here is the latest, dated July 24; it blueprints the forensic work this article explores in detail. They have all argued that the hack theory is wrong and that a locally executed leak is the far more likely explanation. In a letter to Barack Obama dated January 17, three days before he left office, the group explained that the NSA’s known programs are fully capable of capturing all electronic transfers of data. “We strongly suggest that you ask NSA for any evidence it may have indicating that the results of Russian hacking were given to WikiLeaks,” the letter said. “If NSA cannot produce such evidence—and quickly—this would probably mean it does not have any.”

The day after Parry published this letter, Obama gave his last press conference as president, at which he delivered one of the great gems among the official statements on the DNC e-mail question. “The conclusions of the intelligence community with respect to the Russian hacking,” the legacy-minded Obama said, “were not conclusive.” There is little to suggest the VIPS letter prompted this remark, but it is typical of the linguistic tap-dancing many officials connected to the case have indulged so as to avoid putting their names on the hack theory and all that derives from it.

Until recently there was a serious hindrance to the VIPS’s work, and I have just suggested it. The group lacked access to positive data. It had no lump of cyber-material to place on its lab table and analyze, because no official agency had provided any.

Donald Rumsfeld famously argued with regard to the WMD question in Iraq, “The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.” In essence, Binney and others at VIPS say this logic turns upside down in the DNC case: Based on the knowledge of former officials such as Binney, the group knew that (1) if there was a hack and (2) if Russia was responsible for it, the NSA would have to have evidence of both. Binney and others surmised that the agency and associated institutions were hiding the absence of evidence behind the claim that they had to maintain secrecy to protect NSA programs. “Everything that they say must remain classified is already well-known,” Binney said in an interview. “They’re playing the Wizard of Oz game.”

New findings indicate this is perfectly true, but until recently the VIPS experts could produce only “negative evidence,” as they put it: The absence of evidence supporting the hack theory demonstrates that it cannot be so. That is all VIPS had. They could allege and assert, but they could not conclude: They were stuck demanding evidence they did not have—if only to prove there was none.

Research into the DNC case took a fateful turn in early July, when forensic investigators who had been working independently began to share findings and form loose collaborations wherein each could build on the work of others. In this a small, new website called www.disobedientmedia.com proved an important catalyst. Two independent researchers selected it, Snowden-like, as the medium through which to disclose their findings. One of these is known as Forensicator and the other as Adam Carter. On July 9, Adam Carter sent Elizabeth Vos, a co-founder of Disobedient Media, a paper by the Forensicator that split the DNC case open like a coconut.

By this time Binney and the other technical-side people at VIPS had begun working with a man named Skip Folden. Folden was an IT executive at IBM for 33 years, serving 25 years as the IT program manager in the United States. He has also consulted for Pentagon officials, the FBI, and the Justice Department. Folden is effectively the VIPS group’s liaison to Forensicator, Adam Carter, and other investigators, but neither Folden nor anyone else knows the identity of either Forensicator or Adam Carter. This bears brief explanation.

The Forensicator’s July 9 document indicates he lives in the Pacific Time Zone, which puts him on the West Coast. His notes describing his investigative procedures support this. But little else is known of him. Adam Carter, in turn, is located in England, but the name is a coy pseudonym: It derives from a character in a BBC espionage series called Spooks. It is protocol in this community, Elizabeth Vos told me in a telephone conversation this week, to respect this degree of anonymity. Kirk Wiebe, the former SIGINT analyst at the NSA, thinks Forensicator could be “someone very good with the FBI,” but there is no certainty. Unanimously, however, all the analysts and forensics investigators interviewed for this column say Forensicator’s advanced expertise, evident in the work he has done, is unassailable. They hold a similarly high opinion of Adam Carter’s work.

Forensicator is working with the documents published by Guccifer 2.0, focusing for now on the July 5 intrusion into the DNC server. The contents of Guccifer’s files are known—they were published last September—and are not Forensicator’s concern. His work is with the metadata on those files. These data did not come to him via any clandestine means. Forensicator simply has access to them that others did not have. It is this access that prompts Kirk Wiebe and others to suggest that Forensicator may be someone with exceptional talent and training inside an agency such as the FBI.

“Forensicator unlocked and then analyzed what had been the locked files Guccifer supposedly took from the DNC server,” Skip Folden explained in an interview. “To do this he would have to have ‘access privilege,’ meaning a key.”


What has Forensicator proven since he turned his key? How? What has work done atop Forensicator’s findings proven? How?

Forensicator’s first decisive findings, made public in the paper dated July 9, concerned the volume of the supposedly hacked material and what is called the transfer rate—the time a remote hack would require. The metadata established several facts in this regard with granular precision: On the evening of July 5, 2016, 1,976 megabytes of data were downloaded from the DNC’s server. The operation took 87 seconds. This yields a transfer rate of 22.7 megabytes per second.

These statistics are matters of record and essential to disproving the hack theory. No Internet service provider, such as a hacker would have had to use in mid-2016, was capable of downloading data at this speed.


Compounding this contradiction, Guccifer claimed to have run his hack from Romania, which, for numerous reasons technically called delivery overheads, would slow down the speed of a hack even further from maximum achievable speeds.

What is the maximum achievable speed? Forensicator recently ran a test download of a comparable data volume (and using a server speed not available in 2016) 40 miles from his computer via a server 20 miles away and came up with a speed of 11.8 megabytes per second—half what the DNC operation would need were it a hack. Other investigators have built on this finding. Folden and Edward Loomis say a survey published August 3, 2016, by www.speedtest.net/reports is highly reliable and use it as their thumbnail index.

We use speedtest.net to check our xfer rates from home. Just go to that website, it's very useful.

Quote:

It indicated that the highest average ISP speeds of first-half 2016 were achieved by Xfinity and Cox Communications. These speeds averaged 15.6 megabytes per second and 14.7 megabytes per second, respectively. Peak speeds at higher rates were recorded intermittently but still did not reach the required 22.7 megabytes per second.

“A speed of 22.7 megabytes is simply unobtainable, especially if we are talking about a transoceanic data transfer,” Folden said. “Based on the data we now have, what we’ve been calling a hack is impossible.” Last week Forensicator reported on a speed test he conducted more recently. It tightens the case considerably. “Transfer rates of 23 MB/s (Mega Bytes per second) are not just highly unlikely, but effectively impossible to accomplish when communicating over the Internet at any significant distance,” he wrote. “Further, local copy speeds are measured, demonstrating that 23 MB/s is a typical transfer rate when using a USB–2 flash device (thumb drive).”

Time stamps in the metadata provide further evidence of what happened on July 5. The stamps recording the download indicate that it occurred in the Eastern Daylight Time Zone at approximately 6:45 pm. This confirms that the person entering the DNC system was working somewhere on the East Coast of the United States. In theory the operation could have been conducted from Bangor or Miami or anywhere in between—but not Russia, Romania, or anywhere else outside the EDT zone. Combined with Forensicator’s findings on the transfer rate, the time stamps constitute more evidence that the download was conducted locally, since delivery overheads—conversion of data into packets, addressing, sequencing times, error checks, and the like—degrade all data transfers conducted via the Internet, more or less according to the distance involved.

In addition, there is the adulteration of the documents Guccifer 2.0 posted on June 15, when he made his first appearance. This came to light when researchers penetrated what Folden calls Guccifer’s top layer of metadata and analyzed what was in the layers beneath. They found that the first five files Guccifer made public had each been run, via ordinary cut-and-paste, through a single template that effectively immersed them in what could plausibly be cast as Russian fingerprints. They were not: The Russian markings were artificially inserted prior to posting. “It’s clear,” another forensics investigator self-identified as HET, wrote in a report on this question, “that metadata was deliberately altered and documents were deliberately pasted into a Russianified [W]ord document with Russian language settings and style headings.”

To be noted in this connection: The list of the CIA’s cyber-tools WikiLeaks began to release in March and labeled Vault 7 includes one called Marble that is capable of obfuscating the origin of documents in false-flag operations and leaving markings that point to whatever the CIA wants to point to. (The tool can also “de-obfuscate” what it has obfuscated.) It is not known whether this tool was deployed in the Guccifer case, but it is there for such a use.

It is not yet clear whether documents now shown to have been leaked locally on July 5 were tainted to suggest Russian hacking in the same way the June 15 Guccifer release was. This is among several outstanding questions awaiting answers, and the forensic scientists active on the DNC case are now investigating it. In a note Adam Carter sent to Folden and McGovern last week and copied to me, he reconfirmed the corruption of the June 15 documents, while indicating that his initial work on the July 5 documents—of which much more is to be done—had not yet turned up evidence of doctoring.

In the meantime, VIPS has assembled a chronology that imposes a persuasive logic on the complex succession of events just reviewed. It is this:

On June 12 last year, Julian Assange announced that WikiLeaks had and would publish documents pertinent to Hillary Clinton’s presidential campaign.

On June 14, CrowdStrike, a cyber-security firm hired by the DNC, announced, without providing evidence, that it had found malware on DNC servers and had evidence that Russians were responsible for planting it.

On June 15, Guccifer 2.0 first appeared, took responsibility for the “hack” reported on June 14 and claimed to be a WikiLeaks source.It then posted the adulterated documents just described.

On July 5, Guccifer again claimed he had remotely hacked DNC servers, and the operation was instantly described as another intrusion attributable to Russia. Virtually no media questioned this account.



It does not require too much thought to read into this sequence. With his June 12 announcement, Assange effectively put the DNC on notice that it had a little time, probably not much, to act preemptively against the imminent publication of damaging documents. Did the DNC quickly conjure Guccifer from thin air to create a cyber-saboteur whose fingers point to Russia? There is no evidence of this one way or the other, but emphatically it is legitimate to pose the question in the context of the VIPS chronology. WikiLeaks began publishing on July 22. By that time, the case alleging Russian interference in the 2016 elections process was taking firm root. In short order Assange would be written down as a “Russian agent.”

I will note AGAIN that Julian Assange unequivocally states that the files did not come from a "Russia"; Craig Murray - a close associate of Julian Assange - says that he received the information personally in package form. I have been repeating this over and over, but the usual unwitting deep state trolls here refuse to even remember it.

Quote:

By any balanced reckoning, the official case purporting to assign a systematic hacking effort to Russia, the events of mid-June and July 5 last year being the foundation of this case, is shabby to the point taxpayers should ask for their money back. The Intelligence Community Assessment, the supposedly definitive report featuring the “high confidence” dodge, was greeted as farcically flimsy when issued January 6. Ray McGovern calls it a disgrace to the intelligence profession. It is spotlessly free of evidence, front to back, pertaining to any events in which Russia is implicated. James Clapper, the former director of national intelligence
... and a known liar, who once said that “No, sir" and "not wittingly” to a question about whether the National Security Agency was collecting “any type of data at all” on millions of Americans, only to be revealed as a vigorous bulk collector of domestic call records and internet data three months later by Ed Snowden

Quote:

admitted in May that “hand-picked” analysts from three agencies (not the 17 previously reported) drafted the ICA. There is a way to understand “hand-picked” that is less obvious than meets the eye: The report was sequestered from rigorous agency-wide reviews. This is the way these people have spoken to us for the past year.

Behind the ICA lie other indefensible realities. The FBI has never examined the DNC’s computer servers—an omission that is beyond preposterous. It has instead relied on the reports produced by Crowdstrike, a firm that drips with conflicting interests well beyond the fact that it is in the DNC’s employ. Dmitri Alperovitch, its co-founder and chief technology officer, is on the record as vigorously anti-Russian. He is a senior fellow at the Atlantic Council, which suffers the same prejudice. Problems such as this are many.

“We continue to stand by our report,” CrowdStrike said, upon seeing the VIPS blueprint of the investigation. CrowdStrike argues that by July 5 all malware had been removed from the DNC’s computers. But the presence or absence of malware by that time is entirely immaterial, because the event of July 5 is proven to have been a leak and not a hack. Given that malware has nothing to do with leaks, CrowdStrike’s logic appears to be circular.

In effect, the new forensic evidence considered here lands in a vacuum. We now enter a period when an official reply should be forthcoming. What the forensic people are now producing constitutes evidence, however one may view it, and it is the first scientifically derived evidence we have into any of the events in which Russia has been implicated. The investigators deserve a response, the betrayed professionals who formed VIPS as the WMD scandal unfolded in 2003 deserve it, and so do the rest of us. The cost of duplicity has rarely been so high.

I concluded each of the interviews conducted for this column by asking for a degree of confidence in the new findings. These are careful, exacting people as a matter of professional training and standards, and I got careful, exacting replies.

All those interviewed came in between 90 percent and 100 percent certain that the forensics prove out. I have already quoted Skip Folden’s answer: impossible based on the data. “The laws of physics don’t lie,” Ray McGovern volunteered at one point. “It’s QED, theorem demonstrated,” William Binney said in response to my question. “There’s no evidence out there to get me to change my mind.” When I asked Edward Loomis, a 90 percent man, about the 10 percent he held out, he replied, “I’ve looked at the work and it shows there was no Russian hack. But I didn’t do the work. That’s the 10 percent. I’m a scientist.”


https://www.thenation.com/article/a-new-report-raises-big-questions-ab
out-last-years-dnc-hack/






Trump is not the problem. He set himself against the Deep State's agenda. And the Deep State's been heading for WWIII for years.
As for you, you're just a Deep State useful idiot, furthering its agenda. So I hope you enjoy cesium in your coffee. You've earned it.

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Monday, August 14, 2017 5:17 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Too late!


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I'm not trying to drag this thread way off-topic, so this is my last response on the Maidan sniper shooting.
Quote:

There is a related type of false flag operation commonly used to create chaos and discredit regimes or protesters: snipers.

For example:
Unknown snipers reportedly killed both Venezuelan government and opposition protesters in the attempted 2002 coup https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_Venezuelan_coup_d'%C3%A9tat_att
empt#Miraflores_confrontation


Unknown snipers fired during Thailand’s 2010 protests https://www.csmonitor.com/World/Asia-Pacific/2010/0412/Thailand-s-red-
shirt-protests-darken-with-unknown-snipers-parade-of-coffins


Unknown snipers allegedly have created bedlam in Syria

A Russian general alleges that – during Yeltsin’s protest in front of the Russian parliament – sniper fire came from the roof of the American Embassy

And the Estonian foreign minister claims that the new Ukranian coalition deployed snipers to discredit the former government of Ukraine http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/03/estonian-foreign-minister-accus
es-new-ukranian-government-behind-sniper-attacks-led-ouster-old-ukranian-government.html


Brutal … but effective and cheap.

Because it doesn’t cost much to hire one or a handful of snipers to access rooftops or bridge overpasses, create chaos, and then quietly disappear.


http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/03/snipers-commonly-used-false-fla
g-terrorists.html


-----------
By the way, GSTRING, I predicted your response PERFECTLY
* ... and then you'll say I'm "too wordy". And then you will - as always- refuse to address the pertinent points, and respond with even more lies and even more bullshit personal attacks.*

And voila! Here it is http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61835&mid=1
035581#1035581


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Monday, August 14, 2017 5:21 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Is that all you got? Come now, you could do better than that!
There must be something else in the Repuke Playbook, or are you following the Alt-Right Playbook? I could never tell them apart.

Russian!?


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Are you drunk again?




Trump is not the problem. He set himself against the Deep State's agenda. And the Deep State's been heading for WWIII for years.
As for you, you're just a Deep State useful idiot, furthering its agenda. So I hope you enjoy cesium in your coffee. You've earned it.


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Monday, August 14, 2017 5:23 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Quote:

Because it's not ...



Brilliant reply...so informative!


SGG

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Monday, August 14, 2017 11:16 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Did you read the linked article?

OF COURSE NOT!






Trump is not the problem. He set himself against the Deep State's agenda. And the Deep State's been heading for WWIII for years.
As for you, you're just a Deep State useful idiot, furthering its agenda. So I hope you enjoy cesium in your coffee. You've earned it.

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Tuesday, August 15, 2017 4:50 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Read the article. Wow! So obvious from the start that it was written by a right-wing GOP hack. Brilliantly written, yeah, and so informative, like I said. Who the fuck is Jennifer Kerns? Nice hatchet job!

Many experts in the field with nary a name of the "so-called" experts.
So I went back to the Nation article to try and finish reading it (I got through about 75% of it and gave up trying to follow it). So I went to the internet to try and find an article that I could follow and see if what I got from it was somewhat within the field of my comprehension. And what I found was this:

http://nymag.com/selectall/2017/08/the-nation-article-about-the-dnc-ha
ck-is-incoherent.html


Basically a review of The Nation article, stating that it made little sense.
Fuck! I wish I would have done this before I tried to decipher the technocratic verbiage in the Nation article. Now, I'm no expert in computers, not by a long shot, but I've written enough bullshit essays and term papers in college to know it when I see it.

Anyway, dueling articles. I "see" your BS article and I "raise" you another BS article. It's a draw, we both have a "FULL HOUSE" the hand is a wash.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Did you read the linked article?

OF COURSE NOT!






Trump is not the problem. He set himself against the Deep State's agenda. And the Deep State's been heading for WWIII for years.
As for you, you're just a Deep State useful idiot, furthering its agenda. So I hope you enjoy cesium in your coffee. You've earned it.


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Tuesday, August 15, 2017 5:45 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


You, you're good, you!

Face it keeks, you can't touch this!


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:

Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Are you drunk again?

Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
You're funny!

You're a sloppy drunk!




Trump is not the problem. He set himself against the Deep State's agenda. And the Deep State's been heading for WWIII for years.
As for you, you're just a Deep State useful idiot, furthering its agenda. So I hope you enjoy cesium in your coffee. You've earned it.


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Tuesday, August 15, 2017 8:45 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. Pity would be no more, If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


Awwww... SHINY .... and I even underlined the salient points!

Okay, here's the article, stripped down to its essentials, and with additional background.
Quote:

A New Report Raises Big Questions About Last Year’s DNC Hack

Written by Patrick Lawrence of The Nation,


.... All this was set in motion when the DNC’s mail server was first violated in the spring of 2016 and by subsequent assertions that Russians were behind that “hack” and another such operation, also described as a Russian hack, on July 5. ...
Lost in a year that often appeared to veer into our peculiarly American kind of hysteria is the absence of any credible evidence of what happened last year and who was responsible for it. It is tiresome to note, but none has been made available. Instead, we are urged to accept the word of institutions and senior officials with long records of deception.

In other words, as in the Wizard of Oz, pay no attention to that man (CIA, NSA, FBI) behind the curtain.

Quote:

.... Forensic investigators, intelligence analysts, system designers, program architects, and computer scientists of long experience and strongly credentialed are now producing evidence proving the official version of key events last year ... There was no hack of the Democratic National Committee’s system on July 5 last year—not by the Russians, not by anyone else. Hard science now demonstrates it was a leak—a download executed locally with a memory key or a similarly portable data-storage device. In short, it was an inside job by someone with access to the DNC’s system.


The NSA and CIA created a picture of some evil genius at a distant location .... transatlantic .... possibly Romania ... or Russian pretending to be a Russian-hating Romanian .... typing into his keyboard and accessing the DNC server with a magic few tricks known only to hackers, getting the server to spit out who-know-how-many gigabytes of files across the internet and then collecting them on his on hard drive at "home". You know - the typical movie-scenario when someone just finishes typing furiously on a keyboard and announces, with satisfaction I'm in and starts accessing the main servers at Langley.

Now, there are two places where you can get information as to what happened. The first is the "hacked" server. ALL computers keep a very VERY detailed "events log" of what/when software was initiated and closed, and what/when ports were attempted to be accessed by external sources. I know this for a fact because hubby has shown me the number of attempted intrusions on our simple system at home ... it's in the realm of many times a minute. I could even see where some external software was systematically testing our WIFI frequencies (which we have disabled for security reasons).

This EVENTS LOG information resides ON THE COMPROMISED SERVER. THAT was the one the FBI was never allowed to examine, by the DNC. All I can say is .... too much crime to wipe clean, Debbie?

The hacker can even erase those events log moments where s/he DID manage to crack the server, if they can control the events log, but s/he also manages to leave a gaping hole in the events log stream, which is fairly continuous. So even deletions are detectable, if you know where to look.

******

The SECOND place where corresponding information van be found is in the FILE SYSTEM OF THE COPIED INFORMATION. Even Microsoft file system, as crappy as it is, manages to time-stamp the information on the way in. That gives the file system the ability to tell which version is older and which is newer; so that when you're working on a file it knows which version to save and which to discard. If you open up your "folders" (assuming that you have MS) and click on the "details" icon, it will show you the file name, file extension (.doc. .xls etc), file size, and last revised time (date and time).

This information is attached to EVERY file in the form of "metadata" ... data about the data. (Size, format type, time created, source program etc.)

If you add up all of the gigabytes of data from the DNC server, and you look at the earliest time stamp and the latest, you can calculate, on the average, how many seconds per GB. But here's where knowing something about hardware comes into play ... even tho speeds have improved lately, you still can't transmit files via the internet with the speed that they were downloaded to the destination hard drive. The internet is notoriously slow ... is has a communications protocol that requires it to establish who its talking to, and to re-assemble all "packets" of data into a contiguous whole, and all of that takes time. The DNC files could not have been transmitted over the internet in the speeds demonstrated by the metadata.

However, hard drive to thumb-drive or hard drive to hard drive via a wire plugged into a USB port at either end, is VERY fast. About as fast as what was demonstrated.

That is the most robust evidence available that this was not a "hack" via the internet.,

There is more evidence, of ancillary nature, which I won't go in to.

-----------
By the way, GSTRING, I predicted your response PERFECTLY
* ... and then you'll say I'm "too wordy". And then you will - as always- refuse to address the pertinent points, and respond with even more lies and even more bullshit personal attacks.*

And voila! Here it is http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61835&mid=1
035581#1035581

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Tuesday, August 15, 2017 2:07 PM

G

... fully loaded, safety off...


You premise is flawed in many ways - it assumes:

1) we can trust Assange and his friend

2) we can trust the metadata

3) even IF it was taken by thumb drive that means it wasn't a hack.
People can gain access to the DNC besides DNC staffers. To assume server event logs are tamper proof is silly.

Plus the fact that you are working this nothing story so hard suggests it's all a deflection anyway.

D -

==============================

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Wednesday, August 16, 2017 12:05 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

You (sic) premise is flawed in many ways - it assumes:
1) we can trust Assange and his friend

Assange isn't part of the quoted story, so that statement is irrelevant to the story.
Quote:

2) we can trust the metadata
It's FAR more reliable than the 'Russian keyboard' evidence, which you seem to believe.
Quote:

3) even IF it was taken by thumb drive that means it wasn't a hack.
That's exactly the point of the article. It wasn't a hack.
Quote:

People can gain access to the DNC besides DNC staffers. To assume server event logs are tamper proof is silly.
So RUSSIANS got direct DNC server access? Is that what you're trying to say?




Trump is not the problem. He set himself against the Deep State's agenda. And the Deep State's been heading for WWIII for years.
As for you, you're just a Deep State useful idiot, furthering its agenda. So I hope you enjoy cesium in your coffee. You've earned it.

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Wednesday, August 16, 2017 4:42 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Here's the thing. You believe this article because YOU feel comfortable with the material and the "person" who wrote it. I don't. Short and simple, and to the point.

I did a little digging of my own. I am skeptical of the "journalist" who contributed the article you post, you believe him and you post what you believe. No problem. Me, I'm not as smart as you obviously are, so I tend to go a different route. Yes, I admit it and I bow down to your superior intellect. There you have it, in writing.

And now, I will take my puny brain and scamper off into a dark corner and cower in shame and humiliation over my defeat to a far more intelligent human than myself. I will forever live in darkness because you have thoroughly defeated me. Oh woe is me!

And now I await your superior gloating and insults.


SGG
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Awwww... SHINY .... and I even underlined the salient points!

Okay, here's the article, stripped down to its essentials, and with additional background.
Quote:

A New Report Raises Big Questions About Last Year’s DNC Hack

Written by Patrick Lawrence of The Nation,


.... All this was set in motion when the DNC’s mail server was first violated in the spring of 2016 and by subsequent assertions that Russians were behind that “hack” and another such operation, also described as a Russian hack, on July 5. ...
Lost in a year that often appeared to veer into our peculiarly American kind of hysteria is the absence of any credible evidence of what happened last year and who was responsible for it. It is tiresome to note, but none has been made available. Instead, we are urged to accept the word of institutions and senior officials with long records of deception.

In other words, as in the Wizard of Oz, pay no attention to that man (CIA, NSA, FBI) behind the curtain.

Quote:

.... Forensic investigators, intelligence analysts, system designers, program architects, and computer scientists of long experience and strongly credentialed are now producing evidence proving the official version of key events last year ... There was no hack of the Democratic National Committee’s system on July 5 last year—not by the Russians, not by anyone else. Hard science now demonstrates it was a leak—a download executed locally with a memory key or a similarly portable data-storage device. In short, it was an inside job by someone with access to the DNC’s system.


The NSA and CIA created a picture of some evil genius at a distant location .... transatlantic .... possibly Romania ... or Russian pretending to be a Russian-hating Romanian .... typing into his keyboard and accessing the DNC server with a magic few tricks known only to hackers, getting the server to spit out who-know-how-many gigabytes of files across the internet and then collecting them on his on hard drive at "home". You know - the typical movie-scenario when someone just finishes typing furiously on a keyboard and announces, with satisfaction I'm in and starts accessing the main servers at Langley.

Now, there are two places where you can get information as to what happened. The first is the "hacked" server. ALL computers keep a very VERY detailed "events log" of what/when software was initiated and closed, and what/when ports were attempted to be accessed by external sources. I know this for a fact because hubby has shown me the number of attempted intrusions on our simple system at home ... it's in the realm of many times a minute. I could even see where some external software was systematically testing our WIFI frequencies (which we have disabled for security reasons).

This EVENTS LOG information resides ON THE COMPROMISED SERVER. THAT was the one the FBI was never allowed to examine, by the DNC. All I can say is .... too much crime to wipe clean, Debbie?

The hacker can even erase those events log moments where s/he DID manage to crack the server, if they can control the events log, but s/he also manages to leave a gaping hole in the events log stream, which is fairly continuous. So even deletions are detectable, if you know where to look.

******

The SECOND place where corresponding information van be found is in the FILE SYSTEM OF THE COPIED INFORMATION. Even Microsoft file system, as crappy as it is, manages to time-stamp the information on the way in. That gives the file system the ability to tell which version is older and which is newer; so that when you're working on a file it knows which version to save and which to discard. If you open up your "folders" (assuming that you have MS) and click on the "details" icon, it will show you the file name, file extension (.doc. .xls etc), file size, and last revised time (date and time).

This information is attached to EVERY file in the form of "metadata" ... data about the data. (Size, format type, time created, source program etc.)

If you add up all of the gigabytes of data from the DNC server, and you look at the earliest time stamp and the latest, you can calculate, on the average, how many seconds per GB. But here's where knowing something about hardware comes into play ... even tho speeds have improved lately, you still can't transmit files via the internet with the speed that they were downloaded to the destination hard drive. The internet is notoriously slow ... is has a communications protocol that requires it to establish who its talking to, and to re-assemble all "packets" of data into a contiguous whole, and all of that takes time. The DNC files could not have been transmitted over the internet in the speeds demonstrated by the metadata.

However, hard drive to thumb-drive or hard drive to hard drive via a wire plugged into a USB port at either end, is VERY fast. About as fast as what was demonstrated.

That is the most robust evidence available that this was not a "hack" via the internet.,

There is more evidence, of ancillary nature, which I won't go in to.

-----------
By the way, GSTRING, I predicted your response PERFECTLY
* ... and then you'll say I'm "too wordy". And then you will - as always- refuse to address the pertinent points, and respond with even more lies and even more bullshit personal attacks.*

And voila! Here it is http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61835&mid=1
035581#1035581


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Wednesday, August 16, 2017 8:16 AM

G

... fully loaded, safety off...


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Quote:

You (sic) premise is flawed in many ways - it assumes:
1) we can trust Assange and his friend

Assange isn't part of the quoted story, so that statement is irrelevant to the story.
Quote:

2) we can trust the metadata
It's FAR more reliable than the 'Russian keyboard' evidence, which you seem to believe.
Quote:

3) even IF it was taken by thumb drive that means it wasn't a hack.
That's exactly the point of the article. It wasn't a hack.
Quote:

People can gain access to the DNC besides DNC staffers. To assume server event logs are tamper proof is silly.
So RUSSIANS got direct DNC server access? Is that what you're trying to say?



Kiki: lying, just another dumb @ss, or just acting stupid? That's a tough one.

1. Did I say Assange was part of some quoted story? Signym has been quoting Assange and some Assange intermediary as part of this story, proof it wasn't Russia.

2. Did I say 'Russian keyboard' evidence?

3. Right - You and Signym are assuming (i.e.; trying to make bullish*t float) if it WAS taken by thumb drive it WASN'T a hack. Keep turning those old, rusty wheels. Perhaps more box wine will help?

4. What I am saying is: "To assume server event logs are tamper proof is silly." Should I re-type that? Here: "To assume server event logs are tamper proof is silly."

==============================

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Wednesday, August 16, 2017 10:55 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. Pity would be no more, If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


Quote:

You (sic) premise is flawed in many ways - it assumes:
1) we can trust Assange and his friend- GSTRING

Assange isn't part of the quoted story, so that statement is irrelevant to the story.- KIKI

Did I say Assange was part of some quoted story? Signym has been quoting Assange and some Assange intermediary as part of this story, proof it wasn't Russia.- GSTRING.

Ok, we all agree, Assange is not part of THIS story.

Quote:

2) we can trust the metadata- GSTRING

It's FAR more reliable than the 'Russian keyboard' evidence, which you seem to believe. - KIKI

Did I say 'Russian keyboard' evidence?- GSTRING

Well, as usual, you never say much of anything. But if you "believe" that this was a hack, by (a) Russian(s), then you're choosing to believe the supposition that the charactcers were originally Cyrillic.

Quote:

3) even IF it was taken by thumb drive that means it wasn't a hack. - GSTRING

That's exactly the point of the article. It wasn't a hack.- KIKI

Right - You and Signym are assuming (i.e.; trying to make bullish*t float) if it WAS taken by thumb drive it WASN'T a hack. Keep turning those old, rusty wheels. Perhaps more box wine will help?- GSTRING

So RUSSIANS got direct DNC server access? Is that what you're trying to say? - KIKI

Yes, GSTRING, is that what you're trying to say? A Russian snuck into the DNC server room, logged in using .... who knows what .... and copied files to a thumb drive?


Quote:

4)People can gain access to the DNC besides DNC staffers. To assume server event logs are tamper proof is silly.- Should I re-type that? Here: "To assume server event logs are tamper proof is silly." GSTRING


I already addressed that in my post. Learn to read, willya???

Hubby has seen only one instance where the event logs were modified, and that was a high-level academic espionage case. In that case, the hacker went back and erased the part of the log where the hack entered. Which, as I said, left a small gap in the event log.

Now, if someone can modify the event log to erase something, they can probably modify the event log to fill in that gap with probable-looking events. However, what YOU'RE saying is that the Rooskies were SO SMART that they modified the event log, but left Cyrillic fingerprints all over the files? EPIC LOGIC FAIL.

But you're confusing the event log for the file metadata. Same deal for the metadata attached to each file. Yeah, sure, you might go in and diddle each file (and that's a lot of files!) but then why leave your fingerprints all over them? ANOTHER epic logic fail.

You're grasping at straws. The conclusion rests on only one weak point: The source of the report is anonymous, and if we're to accept the conclusion we have to trust that the author of the report is honest.



----------
By the way, GSTRING, I predicted your response PERFECTLY
* ... and then you'll say I'm "too wordy". And then you will - as always- refuse to address the pertinent points, and respond with even more lies and even more bullshit personal attacks.*

And voila! Here it is http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61835&mid=1
035581#1035581

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Wednesday, August 16, 2017 1:01 PM

G

... fully loaded, safety off...


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

You (sic) premise is flawed in many ways - it assumes:
1) we can trust Assange and his friend- GSTRING

Assange isn't part of the quoted story, so that statement is irrelevant to the story.- KIKI

Did I say Assange was part of some quoted story? Signym has been quoting Assange and some Assange intermediary as part of this story, proof it wasn't Russia.- GSTRING.

Ok, we all agree, Assange is not part of THIS story.

Quote:

2) we can trust the metadata- GSTRING

It's FAR more reliable than the 'Russian keyboard' evidence, which you seem to believe. - KIKI

Did I say 'Russian keyboard' evidence?- GSTRING

Well, as usual, you never say much of anything. But if you "believe" that this was a hack, by (a) Russian(s), then you're choosing to believe the supposition that the charactcers were originally Cyrillic.

Quote:

3) even IF it was taken by thumb drive that means it wasn't a hack. - GSTRING

That's exactly the point of the article. It wasn't a hack.- KIKI

Right - You and Signym are assuming (i.e.; trying to make bullish*t float) if it WAS taken by thumb drive it WASN'T a hack. Keep turning those old, rusty wheels. Perhaps more box wine will help?- GSTRING

So RUSSIANS got direct DNC server access? Is that what you're trying to say? - KIKI

Yes, GSTRING, is that what you're trying to say? A Russian snuck into the DNC server room, logged in using .... who knows what .... and copied files to a thumb drive?


Quote:

4)People can gain access to the DNC besides DNC staffers. To assume server event logs are tamper proof is silly.- Should I re-type that? Here: "To assume server event logs are tamper proof is silly." GSTRING


I already addressed that in my post. Learn to read, willya???

Hubby has seen only one instance where the event logs were modified, and that was a high-level academic espionage case. In that case, the hacker went back and erased the part of the log where the hack entered. Which, as I said, left a small gap in the event log.

Now, if someone can modify the event log to erase something, they can probably modify the event log to fill in that gap with probable-looking events. However, what YOU'RE saying is that the Rooskies were SO SMART that they modified the event log, but left Cyrillic fingerprints all over the files? EPIC LOGIC FAIL.

But you're confusing the event log for the file metadata. Same deal for the metadata attached to each file. Yeah, sure, you might go in and diddle each file (and that's a lot of files!) but then why leave your fingerprints all over them? ANOTHER epic logic fail.

You're grasping at straws. The conclusion rests on only one weak point: The source of the report is anonymous, and if we're to accept the conclusion we have to trust that the author of the report is honest.



----------
By the way, GSTRING, I predicted your response PERFECTLY
* ... and then you'll say I'm "too wordy". And then you will - as always- refuse to address the pertinent points, and respond with even more lies and even more bullshit personal attacks.*

And voila! Here it is http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61835&mid=1
035581#1035581



Well, if your hubby has only seen one instance where the event logs were modified then I guess that proves it. OMG

Your article - there is so much room for bullsh*t and lying and detours and misinformation and bogey men in the shadows (Deep State!) on and on... it is a pretty bag of nothing - just enough smoke and mystery to be a DISTRACTION.

You're doing Trump and Fox's work now.

==============================

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Wednesday, August 16, 2017 2:26 PM

6STRINGJOKER


Quote:

Originally posted by G:
it is a pretty bag of nothing - just enough smoke and mystery to be a DISTRACTION.



Like the whole Russia narrative, huh?

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Wednesday, August 16, 2017 3:57 PM

REAVERFAN


Manafort lied. That's why he got raided. Simple. They're all in deep doo doo.

"All of this is to say that if Manafort’s contract did indeed “greatly benefit the Putin Government,” it was nothing out of the ordinary. The problem isn’t that he might have done the work for Putin. The problem is that the ordinary when it comes to Westerners doing business with the Russians—as well as other non-democratic governments—is a murky universe, where American actors are not always on the right side of the law and Western ideas of morality. The problem is that Manafort was running a campaign that hammered Clinton and her family foundation for doing much of what Manafort himself had done for decades, and that he was arguably as corrupt as his candidate said Clinton was. The problem is that the government in question had, according to 17 U.S. intelligence agencies, been actively hacking the Clinton campaign and aiding the Trump one. The problem is that Manafort and the Trump administration have repeatedly lied about Manafort’s work. There would’ve been a problem had they come clean early on—it’s not a good look for a populist, drain-the-swamp, America First candidate—but the problem is so much bigger now that the lies are now compounded, magnified by the truth. And this is classic Trump: dissemble and deny as long as you can, and even after you can. And it’s classic Manafort: It’s not clear how much he did to “greatly benefit the Putin Government,” but he certainly did no favors for the Trump Government."

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2017/03/much-ado-abo
ut-manafort/520743
/



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Thursday, August 17, 2017 4:19 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Say, did you guys hear about one of Mueller's investigative attorneys, actually a director of one of the sections (I forget which) was demoted by Mueller for some reason - from Director to Human Resources.

Come on guys, this is juicy. And none of you picked up on this? You guys are slipping. What Fox asleep at the wheel? Breitbart can't keep up?
What gives? What's the deal?


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
You know, I find this rather curious. It's been two days since the news broke regarding the raid of Manafort's home by the FBI. Yet here we are, and no mention of it by anyone, not even our resident Russia-phobes.

It's been all over the MSM Libtard news. You guys are slipping!
What, Fox forgot their headline busters? Later, I'm going to go watch Fox to see what they have to say about the latest development.

Trump, of course, praised Manafort as a good man. Meanwhile, he continues to bash McConnell. Good, the rats are slowly abandoning ship.


SGG


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Thursday, August 17, 2017 9:31 AM

G

... fully loaded, safety off...


Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
Say, did you guys hear about one of Mueller's investigative attorneys, actually a director of one of the sections (I forget which) was demoted by Mueller for some reason - from Director to Human Resources.

Come on guys, this is juicy. And none of you picked up on this? You guys are slipping. What Fox asleep at the wheel? Breitbart can't keep up?
What gives? What's the deal?



They're too busy chasing the jorts burglar who they know is Hillary Clinton wearing Ukrainian flag jorts.

==============================

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Friday, August 18, 2017 4:38 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


You get it G, you know who I'm talking about. They think they know everything and yet here we are. I mention this to try and be thorough, and complete in my coverage of this story.

The Russian Investigation. It ain't over!


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by G:
Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
Say, did you guys hear about one of Mueller's investigative attorneys, actually a director of one of the sections (I forget which) was demoted by Mueller for some reason - from Director to Human Resources.

Come on guys, this is juicy. And none of you picked up on this? You guys are slipping. What Fox asleep at the wheel? Breitbart can't keep up?
What gives? What's the deal?



They're too busy chasing the jorts burglar who they know is Hillary Clinton wearing Ukrainian flag jorts.

==============================


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Saturday, August 19, 2017 3:28 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Hey there Comrades,

Finally got some more info regarding the Special Counsel demotion of an FBI Counter-intelligence director. His name is Peter Strzok, who is now working in Human Resources in the FBI.

Now, why is the trickier part. Two rumors as to why.

1- Something to do with the DOJ's investigation into the Clinton e-mails;
2- Could be in response to the leak about Paul Manafort's FBI raid July 26.

If it's number two, it will be the first time there's a chink in the armor of the SC's office. Anyway, seems like Mueller is running a tight ship.


SGG

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