REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Sutherland Springs Texas, Mass Murder Church Shooting

POSTED BY: JAYNEZTOWN
UPDATED: Friday, November 10, 2017 09:26
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 203
PAGE 1 of 1

Monday, November 6, 2017 2:12 PM

JAYNEZTOWN


At least 26 people were slain and dozens injured in a mass shooting at a Baptist church in Sutherland Springs, Texas when a gunman clad in combat gear walked into the small country church and gunned down parishioners, including pregnant women and children. Police confirmed Monday morning that Kelley’s mother-in-law attended the church, and there was a “domestic situation” involving his family, including unspecified text threats made by the shooter and anger directed toward his mother-in-law. Police said Kelley was not motivated by religious beliefs, although the shooter had personal ties to the church through his wife; the gunman claimed he briefly taught Bible school, but he also liked Facebook pages devoted to atheism and weirded friends out with his posts about it. Devin P. Kelley, who was court-martialed by the U.S. Air Force for assaulting his wife and child, was identified as the black-clad and military-rifle wielding gunman. Authorities revealed that a heroic citizen, a neighbor of the church named Stephen Willeford, “grabbed his rifle and confronted the suspect,” who was armed with a “Ruger AR assault type rifle.” The neighbor shot Kelley. The local citizen and another man, Johnnie Langendorff, who happened to be driving past the church, then pursued the suspect, who ran off the road and crashed and was found deceased in his vehicle. Kelley was shot by the “Texas hero” outside the church, authorities said. He called his father while being chased, and told him he wasn’t going to make it, police said. It is believed that he then shot himself and died of a self-inflicted wound. The victims ranged in age from 5 to 72, authorities said. “This will be a long suffering mourning for those in pain,” said Governor Greg Abbott, confirming that 26 people had died.

The New York Times reported that his parents’ home is worth $1 million, although The Washington Post said it was $800,000 and that the family had lived on the 28 acres for more than a decade. Because it’s a hunting area, the Post noted that it’s not unusual to hear gunfire in that region. One of Kelley’s relatives unloaded on Facebook. “Devin ‘MY NEPHEW’ is NO better than a POS suicide bomber…He acted as a Coward..I hope he burns in hell!” wrote Dave Ivey. “HE Killed 27 people ….I dont care if hes my Nephew or not….He destroyed innocent lives.” NBC News also quoted him as saying, “I never in a million years could of believed Devin could be capable of this kind of thing. I am numb. … My family will suffer because of his coward actions. … I am so sorry for the victims in Texas.”

Heavy has learned that the shooter’s wife’s Facebook page says that she is from Sutherland Springs, and her mother was pictured in previous photos at the First Baptist Church. Online records show the wife’s name is Danielle Shields Kelley, which CBS has also confirmed. One man said the gunman was known to at least one victim who died in the attack. The Shooter, Who Showed Off a Rifle on Facebook, Creeped Out Friends By Preaching About Atheism & Lived on a Wooded Property Where Gunfire Rang Out at Night. The shooter was described as a “white male in his 20s from outside San Antonio” by Mike Levine, a journalist for ABC News, who reported that law enforcement had uncovered a weapon photo on Kelley’s Facebook page. Despite rumors on social media, there is no evidence that he was a member of Antifa or carried out the attack on behalf of the far left group. There is also no evidence he converted to Islam and was a practicing Muslim, as other social media rumors have claimed. Some doctored photos have circulated on social media, and people identified the wrong people as suspects early on. However, friends told ABC News he “hated religious people.” High school classmates who stayed in touch with him wrote that they’d grown troubled by his posts. According to UK Daily Mail, “Former classmates described him as ‘creepy’, ‘crazy’ and an ‘outcast’ who had recently started preaching about atheism and picking fights on social media.” “Authorities are now scrubbing his social media; on Facebook in recent days, he showed off an AR-15 style-looking gun,” Levine wrote. Authorities said the rifle used in the massacre was similar to the one Kelley posted on Facebook, but they could not confirm it was the same weapon.

https://heavy.com/news/2017/11/sutherland-springs-active-shooter-shoot
ing-texas-church
/

Church shooting: 26 dead, including 8 members of one family. Authorities said the shooter sent threatening texts to his mother-in-law before opening fire on the church. "We know that his ex- in-laws or in-laws came to church here from time to time,"
https://www.click2houston.com/news/shooting-sutherland-springs-church-
gunfire-mass-shooting-airlife


Sutherland Springs church shooter didn't have gun license, threatened mother-in-law
https://www.dallasnews.com/news/texas/2017/11/05/reported-shooting-bap
tist-church-town-near-san-antonio


Church shooting in Sutherland Springs, Texas, leaves 26 dead
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/11/05/church-shooting-in-sutherland-springs-
tx-leaves-several-dead-more-than-a-dozen-injured.html


NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Monday, November 6, 2017 7:26 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


There is a mass murder joke very early in Thor: Ragnarok (2017) that connects to mass murder in Texas. Me being from Texas, I think the scriptwriters were aware of something very "special" about Texas. Karl Urban (aka Skurge) shows the ladies his automatic weapons: "I picked these up in Tex Ass. I call them Des and Troy. Put them together and you have Destroy." His word-play isn't clever. Neither is he.

Under centuries-old theories of liability, if you have been shot, you should be allowed to sue both the gun-manufacturer and the gun-dealer for torts like negligence and public nuisance. You could then use that money to pay your medical bills. If you are hurt by a car or a prescription drug, after all, you are typically allowed to sue for damages. But thanks to a law called the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act (PLCAA), you have no legal remedy if you are hurt by a gun. In passing that law in 2005, Congress granted gun dealers and manufacturers legal immunity in all 50 states, the District of Columbia, and every U.S. territory. No other industry receives this privilege: Firearms are the only consumer products that receive federal immunity from tort liability.

Congress passed the PLCAA in 2005 at the behest of the National Rifle Association and other industry lobbyists, which insisted that firearm-related litigation had imperiled the gun industry. That wasn’t actually true; as a court later noted, the industry faced “no crippling recoveries,” and the NRA’s anxiety about budget-busting litigation had lacked “empirical support.” Still, Republican Idaho Sen. Larry Craig, the bill’s sponsor, insisted it was necessary to stave off catastrophe, and his GOP colleague Jeff Sessions urged his colleagues to protect the industry from “huge costs” resulting from “unjust lawsuit[s].” With some bipartisan support, the bill easily passed into law.

If there was no empirical support for the NRA’s claims, what was the group so frightened of? The answer is simple: The firearm industry feared becoming the next tobacco industry. In the 1990s, a supermajority of states, frustrated that tobacco-related illnesses were draining their Medicaid funds, banded together to sue tobacco manufacturers for violating various state laws, particularly consumer protection statutes. As the attorney general of Mississippi explained: “You caused the health crisis; you pay for it.” In 1998, the states entered into a settlement with tobacco manufacturers that required them to pay out $206 billion.

Around the same time, public health advocates started to describe gun violence as a public health crisis, and firearm manufacturers and dealers began to face a variety of tort suits.

www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/jurisprudence/2017/11/a_speci
al_tax_on_the_firearm_industry_is_the_only_way_to_make_victims_of.html



The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Tuesday, November 7, 2017 11:56 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Texas attorney general on latest mass shooting: We need more guns in churches

Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton: "We’ve had shootings at churches for forever. This is going to happen again. And so, we need people in terms of professional security or in terms of arming the parishioners or the congregation so that they can respond when something like this happens again."

“All I can say is in Texas at least we have the opportunity to concealed carry [a handgun],” Paxton explained to Fox. “If it’s a place where somebody has the ability to carry, there’s always the opportunity the gunman can be taken out before he has the opportunity to kill very many people.”

www.marketwatch.com/story/texas-attorney-general-on-latest-mass-shooti
ng-we-need-more-guns-in-churches-2017-11-06





The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, November 9, 2017 2:39 AM

OONJERAH


Statistics presented in the article below ... show that other countries aren't even trying
to keep up with the USA in mass murders.

What Explains U.S. Mass Shootings? International Comparisons Suggest an Answer

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/07/world/americas/mass-shootings-us-in
ternational.html?action=click&contentCollection=Arts&module=Trending&version=Full®ion=Marginalia&pgtype=article


Is it just the power of the NRA? ...
Does our entertainment teach us to love shoot outs? ...
What makes Americans so nuts about guns?

Remember the shootout in Heat? 1995 Pacino, de Niro, Kilmer.
  Pretty awesome.
Shane, 1953, Alan Ladd, Jack Palance

  ... I grew up with movie shootouts ... and I love them.


... oooOO}{OOooo ...

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, November 9, 2017 5:10 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


“The Deep State wants to embarrass Trump with more terror attacks.” - Alex Jones of Info War on the killings. Alex said the shooter was a "wind-up toy" controlled by the Deep State. The whole text and video of the popular (in Texas) Alex Jones’s rant are at
www.mediamatters.org/video/2017/11/08/jones-texas-church-gunman-carrie
d-out-his-attack-while-under-mind-control-deep-state/218489


Alex Jones did not take the NYTimes into account when explaining the shootings: Americans make up about 4.4 percent of the global population but own 42 percent of the world’s guns. From 1966 to 2012, 31 percent of the gunmen in mass shootings worldwide were American. Adjusted for population, only Yemen has a higher rate of mass shootings among countries with more than 10 million people. Yemen has the world’s second-highest rate of gun ownership after the United States.

“In retrospect Sandy Hook marked the end of the US gun control debate,” Dan Hodges wrote, referring to the 2012 attack that killed 20 young students at an elementary school in Connecticut. “Once America decided killing children was bearable, it was over.”

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, November 10, 2017 7:07 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


The problem isn't guns, it's people. There are other cultures with widespread gun ownership who don't have our problem with gun deaths (which BTW happens to be suicide, not mass murder. But I digress....)

But this is a lot like many of our own SELF CREATED problems: the real problem lies with the media, who endlessly propagandize on behalf of the wealthy. Once the population is bamboozled to take the elite's side and to stop representing their own interests, nothing will ever be solved.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, November 10, 2017 9:26 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
The problem isn't guns, it's people. There are other cultures with widespread gun ownership who don't have our problem with gun deaths (which BTW happens to be suicide, not mass murder. But I digress....)

But this is a lot like many of our own SELF CREATED problems: the real problem lies with the media, who endlessly propagandize on behalf of the wealthy. Once the population is bamboozled to take the elite's side and to stop representing their own interests, nothing will ever be solved.

Signym, now you've gone off into bitter, vague philosophizing when cold, hard numbers explain what's happening. I believe the number of dollars explains everything about the difference between how the rich and the middle-class are treated, but I will stay with how the number of guns explains the number of mass killings, since the explanation has already been written for me:

Perhaps, some speculate, it is because American society is unusually violent. Or its racial divisions have frayed the bonds of society. Or its citizens lack proper mental care under a health care system that draws frequent derision abroad.

These explanations share one thing in common: Though seemingly sensible, all have been debunked by research on shootings elsewhere in the world. Instead, an ever-growing body of research consistently reaches the same conclusion.

The only variable that can explain the high rate of mass shootings in America is its astronomical number of guns.

Worldwide, Mr. Lankford found, a country’s rate of gun ownership correlated with the odds it would experience a mass shooting. This relationship held even when he excluded the United States, indicating that it could not be explained by some other factor particular to his home country. And it held when he controlled for homicide rates, suggesting that mass shootings were better explained by a society’s access to guns than by its baseline level of violence.

Factors That Don’t Correlate

If mental health made the difference, then data would show that Americans have more mental health problems than do people in other countries with fewer mass shootings. But the mental health care spending rate in the United States, the number of mental health professionals per capita and the rate of severe mental disorders are all in line with those of other wealthy countries.

A 2015 study estimated that only 4 percent of American gun deaths could be attributed to mental health issues. And Mr. Lankford, in an email, said countries with high suicide rates tended to have low rates of mass shootings — the opposite of what you would expect if mental health problems correlated with mass shootings.

Whether a population plays more or fewer video games also appears to have no impact. Americans are no more likely to play video games than people in any other developed country.

Racial diversity or other factors associated with social cohesion also show little correlation with gun deaths. Among European countries, there is little association between immigration or other diversity metrics and the rates of gun murders or mass shootings.

More at www.nytimes.com/2017/11/07/world/americas/mass-shootings-us-internatio
nal.html

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

YOUR OPTIONS

NEW POSTS TODAY

USERPOST DATE

OTHER TOPICS

DISCUSSIONS
The Evidens
Thu, November 23, 2017 13:32 - 722 posts
Evidence: So where are we now(II) ?
Thu, November 23, 2017 12:59 - 108 posts
Countdown Clock to Trumps impeachment " STARTS"
Thu, November 23, 2017 12:59 - 646 posts
Mueller, Trump and the case for Obstruction of Justice
Thu, November 23, 2017 12:56 - 105 posts
Shout out to Second - hope you are doing well
Thu, November 23, 2017 06:54 - 188 posts
The predictions thread
Thu, November 23, 2017 05:50 - 686 posts
The Scumbag from Alabama - 5th Accusser Surfaces
Thu, November 23, 2017 05:18 - 27 posts
In the garden, and RAIN!!!!
Thu, November 23, 2017 02:08 - 242 posts
Is Trump Nuts?
Thu, November 23, 2017 00:43 - 857 posts
Russia wants to upend Western democracy
Wed, November 22, 2017 20:40 - 50 posts
A thread for Democrats Only
Wed, November 22, 2017 20:30 - 191 posts
Another Putin Disaster
Wed, November 22, 2017 16:49 - 44 posts

FFF.NET SOCIAL