REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Trump's Trade Wars - another disaster

POSTED BY: CAPTAINCRUNCH
UPDATED: Tuesday, November 13, 2018 18:36
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 676
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Wednesday, July 25, 2018 2:35 PM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2018/07/12/tariffs-senato
rs-say-trade-policies-hurting-farmers-businesses/776771002
/
Senators blast Trump's 'reckless' tariffs, warn of impact on farmers, businesses

WASHINGTON – Republican and Democratic senators expressed rising concern Thursday about the economic impact of President Donald Trump's tariffs, saying they are hearing complaints from dock workers, soybean farmers and manufacturers whose livelihoods depend on trade.

The lawmakers also said they want to see the Trump administration explain the strategy behind the tariffs and what the expectations are for success.

“To my knowledge, not a single person is able to articulate where this is headed, nor what the plans are, nor what the strategy is,” said Sen. Bob Corker, R-Tenn., chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. “It seems to be a wake up, ready, fire, aim strategy.”

Sen. Robert Menendez, D-N.J., blasted the tariffs as “a reckless campaign” against U.S. allies and warned that it would drive them “into the arms of our adversaries.”

Even Fux Newz Knows
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2018/07/24/trumps-trade-war-is-economic
-suicide.html


Trump's trade war is economic suicide

When President Trump imposed a 25 percent tariff on steel imports last month, America's largest nail manufacturer had little choice but to raise its prices. Mid Continent Nail Corporation quickly lost 50 percent of its orders as customers opted for cheaper suppliers. Within weeks, the firm had to lay off 60 workers. Up to 200 more might lose their jobs by the end of this month.

If the tariff isn't lifted, the company could fold by September.

Mid Continent and its employees are early victims in Trump's trade war. There will be many more if the president continues to raise import costs and anger our trading partners.

https://qz.com/1336295/carmakers-are-counting-the-cost-of-trumps-great
est-tariffs-to-the-tune-of-10-billion
/
Carmakers are counting the cost of Trump’s “greatest” tariffs—in billions of dollars

Donald Trump’s “America First” policies on trade have spooked investors in some of America’s most prominent manufacturers: the “Big Three” carmakers of GM, Ford, and Chrysler.

GM, the US’s largest carmaker, said today that higher commodity costs (primarily steel and aluminum) would cut deeply into its margins, and so the company lowered its earnings outlook for the rest of the year. Earlier this year, Trump imposed tariffs on imports of steel and aluminum from China, the European Union, Mexico, and Canada to protect the US steel industry from competition on “national security” grounds. Companies that rely on these metals—imported or not—are feeling the pain. For example, GM gets most of its metal from domestic producers, but US steel prices have risen amid the tariffs.

*************************************************

Opinion in plain English:

First, he started a trade war.

He had no idea what he was doing, but he started a trade war anyway, all while declaring that it wasn't a trade war.

Guess what? It's a trade war.

1/ 
@realDonaldTrump
"China is targeting our farmers, who they know I love & respect, as a way of getting me to continue allowing them to take advantage of the U.S. They are being vicious in what will be their failed attempt. We were being nice - until now! China made $517 Billion on us last year."

?And given where things are made nowadays, the ONLY country that CAN'T win a trade war is the United States.
It's not the 1950s, folks. We don't make stuff, we buy stuff.
And American business has no one to blame but themselves.

2/
They've been sending manufacturing overseas for 40 years.
They didn't want to pay American workers a living wage. They didn't want to give benefits to American workers. They didn't want to pay American taxes. They didn't want to do their duty to the American Republic.

3/
They didn't want to make things in the United States, but they sure loved calling themselves Americans, benefiting from all the things America provides, and trading on America's name.

4/
This is result. Right here.
When you don't make anything, you got nothing to win a trade war WITH.

5/
What's that?
We make money?
Yeah. About that. For a while our wealth could prop up this imbalance. But here's the problem, all that money, decades worth, OUR money, spun up the economies in the rest of the world.

6/
An so, manufacturing economies like China are NO LONGER dependent on our money -- and when we drive them away from the US, they easily shift elsewhere, and then THEIR brands become household names in those economies and not ours.

7/
Hell, we don't even make ideas anymore. We outsourced that too.
We hired people overseas to come up with new ideas, to flesh out the concepts, to write the code, to do the tech support.
It didn't happen all at once, but little by little, we empowered those nations.

8/
And within a few decades, we become a backwater, left behind.
This has happened before, you know. There are plenty of historical examples.
We now find ourselves at the mercy of the very Third World countries we hold in contempt.

9/?The really ironic part? Conservatives are terrified of "communism," where government controls the means of production, meanwhile, the result of 4 decades of offshoring in the pursuit of ever higher profits has effectively moved production completely outside of US control.

10/?It's a trade war. And we're losing. Because we've got nothing to trade that our adversaries can't get elsewhere for less or make for themselves.
We did that.

11/
Trump is a product of the very modern business mindset that created this situation, that values profit above all and ONLY profit.
So long as he gets rich, so long as the rich get richer, the rest of the country can burn.
It's not like they've made a secret of this.

12/?Trump's bluster and clumsy ill-conceived trade war blew up in his face, so he then blamed Americans like Harley-Davidson for not toughing out HIS blunder. He literally expected that others would bear the cost, to the tune of billions, for his mistakes.

Why wouldn't he?

13/?If you've been paying attention, this should be no surprise.
This IS the mindset of American business. Pollute the rivers, somebody else will clean it up. Poison the population, somebody else will clean it up.

14/?Destroy the economy via bad investments, junk bonds, mortgage scams, Ponzi schemes? Somebody else will clean it up.
And that somebody else is ALWAYS you and me.

And that's EXACTLY what Trump expects here.

15/?You lose your job, your home, your retirement, your savings, your healthcare, that's the price you pay so Ivanka Trump can make her shitty handbags for cheap. You lost your life savings because you got scammed by Trump University? Caveat Emptor, sucker.

16/?Then he blamed everybody else.
Because that too is the modern American businessman, never, ever, ever, take responsibility for your own mistakes. Somebody else will clean it up.
So, NOW, Trump's taking $12 BILLION of YOUR money to bribe his victims.

17/?He's going to pay off American farmers with YOUR money for his mistake just like he paid off those porn stars.
Trump is running America EXACTLY as he said he would.
Yes he is.
That's the ONE thing he told the truth about.

18/?He's running America exactly as he runs his business. He never has to pay for his mistakes.
HE profits. YOU get screwed.
He makes the mess, you get to clean it up.

19/?And I don't know why this would be a surprise to anybody.
I warned you son of bitches. I did. A lot of us warned you this would happen.
If you elect a businessman, you are going to get the business. And you're gonna get it good and hard.

Every. Single. Time.

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Wednesday, July 25, 2018 7:21 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


wow

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, July 25, 2018 9:14 PM

REAVERFAN


American banks won't go near him. That's why Russia owns him.

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Thursday, July 26, 2018 6:15 AM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2018/07/12/tariffs-senato
rs-say-trade-policies-hurting-farmers-businesses/776771002
/
Senators blast Trump's 'reckless' tariffs, warn of impact on farmers, businesses

WASHINGTON – Republican and Democratic senators expressed rising concern Thursday about the economic impact of President Donald Trump's tariffs, saying they are hearing complaints from dock workers, soybean farmers and manufacturers whose livelihoods depend on trade.

The lawmakers also said they want to see the Trump administration explain the strategy behind the tariffs and what the expectations are for success.

“To my knowledge, not a single person is able to articulate where this is headed, nor what the plans are, nor what the strategy is,” said Sen. Bob Corker, R-Tenn., chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. “It seems to be a wake up, ready, fire, aim strategy.”

Sen. Robert Menendez, D-N.J., blasted the tariffs as “a reckless campaign” against U.S. allies and warned that it would drive them “into the arms of our adversaries.”

Even Fux Newz Knows
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2018/07/24/trumps-trade-war-is-economic
-suicide.html


Trump's trade war is economic suicide

When President Trump imposed a 25 percent tariff on steel imports last month, America's largest nail manufacturer had little choice but to raise its prices. Mid Continent Nail Corporation quickly lost 50 percent of its orders as customers opted for cheaper suppliers. Within weeks, the firm had to lay off 60 workers. Up to 200 more might lose their jobs by the end of this month.

If the tariff isn't lifted, the company could fold by September.

Mid Continent and its employees are early victims in Trump's trade war. There will be many more if the president continues to raise import costs and anger our trading partners.

https://qz.com/1336295/carmakers-are-counting-the-cost-of-trumps-great
est-tariffs-to-the-tune-of-10-billion
/
Carmakers are counting the cost of Trump’s “greatest” tariffs—in billions of dollars

Donald Trump’s “America First” policies on trade have spooked investors in some of America’s most prominent manufacturers: the “Big Three” carmakers of GM, Ford, and Chrysler.

GM, the US’s largest carmaker, said today that higher commodity costs (primarily steel and aluminum) would cut deeply into its margins, and so the company lowered its earnings outlook for the rest of the year. Earlier this year, Trump imposed tariffs on imports of steel and aluminum from China, the European Union, Mexico, and Canada to protect the US steel industry from competition on “national security” grounds. Companies that rely on these metals—imported or not—are feeling the pain. For example, GM gets most of its metal from domestic producers, but US steel prices have risen amid the tariffs.

*************************************************

Opinion in plain English:

First, he started a trade war.

He had no idea what he was doing, but he started a trade war anyway, all while declaring that it wasn't a trade war.

Guess what? It's a trade war.

1/ 
@realDonaldTrump
"China is targeting our farmers, who they know I love & respect, as a way of getting me to continue allowing them to take advantage of the U.S. They are being vicious in what will be their failed attempt. We were being nice - until now! China made $517 Billion on us last year."

?And given where things are made nowadays, the ONLY country that CAN'T win a trade war is the United States.
It's not the 1950s, folks. We don't make stuff, we buy stuff.
And American business has no one to blame but themselves.

2/
They've been sending manufacturing overseas for 40 years.
They didn't want to pay American workers a living wage. They didn't want to give benefits to American workers. They didn't want to pay American taxes. They didn't want to do their duty to the American Republic.

3/
They didn't want to make things in the United States, but they sure loved calling themselves Americans, benefiting from all the things America provides, and trading on America's name.

4/
This is result. Right here.
When you don't make anything, you got nothing to win a trade war WITH.

5/
What's that?
We make money?
Yeah. About that. For a while our wealth could prop up this imbalance. But here's the problem, all that money, decades worth, OUR money, spun up the economies in the rest of the world.

6/
An so, manufacturing economies like China are NO LONGER dependent on our money -- and when we drive them away from the US, they easily shift elsewhere, and then THEIR brands become household names in those economies and not ours.

7/
Hell, we don't even make ideas anymore. We outsourced that too.
We hired people overseas to come up with new ideas, to flesh out the concepts, to write the code, to do the tech support.
It didn't happen all at once, but little by little, we empowered those nations.

8/
And within a few decades, we become a backwater, left behind.
This has happened before, you know. There are plenty of historical examples.
We now find ourselves at the mercy of the very Third World countries we hold in contempt.

9/?The really ironic part? Conservatives are terrified of "communism," where government controls the means of production, meanwhile, the result of 4 decades of offshoring in the pursuit of ever higher profits has effectively moved production completely outside of US control.

10/?It's a trade war. And we're losing. Because we've got nothing to trade that our adversaries can't get elsewhere for less or make for themselves.
We did that.

11/
Trump is a product of the very modern business mindset that created this situation, that values profit above all and ONLY profit.
So long as he gets rich, so long as the rich get richer, the rest of the country can burn.
It's not like they've made a secret of this.

12/?Trump's bluster and clumsy ill-conceived trade war blew up in his face, so he then blamed Americans like Harley-Davidson for not toughing out HIS blunder. He literally expected that others would bear the cost, to the tune of billions, for his mistakes.

Why wouldn't he?

13/?If you've been paying attention, this should be no surprise.
This IS the mindset of American business. Pollute the rivers, somebody else will clean it up. Poison the population, somebody else will clean it up.

14/?Destroy the economy via bad investments, junk bonds, mortgage scams, Ponzi schemes? Somebody else will clean it up.
And that somebody else is ALWAYS you and me.

And that's EXACTLY what Trump expects here.

15/?You lose your job, your home, your retirement, your savings, your healthcare, that's the price you pay so Ivanka Trump can make her shitty handbags for cheap. You lost your life savings because you got scammed by Trump University? Caveat Emptor, sucker.

16/?Then he blamed everybody else.
Because that too is the modern American businessman, never, ever, ever, take responsibility for your own mistakes. Somebody else will clean it up.
So, NOW, Trump's taking $12 BILLION of YOUR money to bribe his victims.

17/?He's going to pay off American farmers with YOUR money for his mistake just like he paid off those porn stars.
Trump is running America EXACTLY as he said he would.
Yes he is.
That's the ONE thing he told the truth about.

18/?He's running America exactly as he runs his business. He never has to pay for his mistakes.
HE profits. YOU get screwed.
He makes the mess, you get to clean it up.

19/?And I don't know why this would be a surprise to anybody.
I warned you son of bitches. I did. A lot of us warned you this would happen.
If you elect a businessman, you are going to get the business. And you're gonna get it good and hard.

Every. Single. Time.

How timely.

Posting a 2 week old Fake News Story. Today. The day Trump wins the Tariff/Trade war as EU capitulates to his calls for fairness and balance.

Trolls are really funny sometimes.

And the Fake Story says "Senators" and only cites Uranium One usher Corker and pants-on-fire idjit Menendez. Lol.

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Thursday, July 26, 2018 11:31 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Even NPR has to acknowledge, when doing "background" on the tariffs, that the trade rules are tremendously unbalanced. In their recent piece on Trump's tariffs on EU automobiles, even THEY had to acknowledge that the USA has to pay VAT tax when exporting to the EU while at the same time facing a 25% tariff, while EU autos coming into the USA don't pay any VAT tax and have only a 10% tariff. Similar data on trade with the Chinese.

CLEARLY, THIS IS NOT FAIR TRADE. Whoever negotiated those deals on "our behalf" sure didn't negotiate with AMERICAN INTERESTS at heart! A trade war has been going on for a long time, and "our" negotiators just hoisted the white flag and let everyone else walk all over us.

Because that's how it was supposed to be: In the globalist scheme of things (just ask Bill Clinton, he can describe it for you) each nation had its assigned role. Haitian farmers, for example, were to be displaced by subsidized Arkansas rice. That way they would be moved off their land and Haiti could become food-dependent source of "cheap labor". And Mexican farmers were to be displaced off THEIR land with subsidized American corn, and Mexico could ALSO become a source of "cheap labor". In the meantime, the role of America was to be the world's "No 1 consumer". Every other economy - including China and the EU - were to hitch their "production" wagon to our "consumption" donkey, resulting in a huge hemorrhage of our jobs to overseas locations.

Of course, that required OUR BANKS to issue giant gobs of credit to everyone ... businesses, consumers, the government, foreign investors ... fortunately for us, we held the world's reserve currency/ petrodollar, which gave us a giant U$D-denominated credit card for our worldwide appetite for goods and services. UNFORTUNATELY, the forbearance of the global currency, credit, and banking system for virtually unlimited trade, private, business and government debt would eventually run out.

So here we are ...

45 years after Nixon visited China, took us off the gold standard, and crafted the "petrodollar" deal ...

25 years after Bill Clinton signed Executive Order 12850 freeing up Most Favored Nation terms so that China could continue to operate under a 6% tariff regimen (1), and concluding NAFTA negotiations ...

18 years after George W Bush supported China's accession into the WTO, negotiated approximately a dozen NAFTA-style trade agreements and extending NAFTA to Central America nations (CAFTA) (giving away more USA jobs) (2) and 10 years after he negotiated trade deals with the EU thru the Transatlantic Economic Council ...

Well, here we are: the worlds biggest debtor nation, facing the prospect of an increasingly unwelcome currency. (It's a good thing that We didn't get into the TTP and TTIP, like Obama was pushing for.)

One thing that our fearless leaders chose to ignore is that, in a world of nations, each nation must at some point earn its way if it wants to maintain a viable economy. That means is must be able to independently produce all of the goods and services required to keep its citizens happy, or it must be able to trade - on a balanced basis- for those goods and service that it can't produce. Spending money around the world like a drunken sailor with an unlimited credit card for decades on-end and playing financial games ... as much as it helps out OTHER economies and feels great in the moment for that sailor... is NOT the way to sustainable prosperity.

Trade wars are an ongoing fact of life. If you are trading internationally, you ARE in a trade war. That is the nature of international trade. As far as I can tell, the only difference now is that Trump is willing to put up a fight for the American economy.


(1) https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2016/09/how_bill_clinton_sent
_manufacturing_jobs_to_china.html


(2) http://www.epipolicycenter.org/blm-trade_and_jobs.pdf

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Thursday, July 26, 2018 12:51 PM

THG


T



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Thursday, July 26, 2018 2:08 PM

THG


T



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Thursday, July 26, 2018 2:56 PM

THG


T



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Friday, July 27, 2018 6:39 AM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2018/07/12/tariffs-senato
rs-say-trade-policies-hurting-farmers-businesses/776771002
/
Senators blast Trump's 'reckless' tariffs, warn of impact on farmers, businesses

WASHINGTON – Republican and Democratic senators expressed rising concern Thursday about the economic impact of President Donald Trump's tariffs, saying they are hearing complaints from dock workers, soybean farmers and manufacturers whose livelihoods depend on trade.

The lawmakers also said they want to see the Trump administration explain the strategy behind the tariffs and what the expectations are for success.

“To my knowledge, not a single person is able to articulate where this is headed, nor what the plans are, nor what the strategy is,” said Sen. Bob Corker, R-Tenn., chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. “It seems to be a wake up, ready, fire, aim strategy.”

Sen. Robert Menendez, D-N.J., blasted the tariffs as “a reckless campaign” against U.S. allies and warned that it would drive them “into the arms of our adversaries.”

Even Fux Newz Knows
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2018/07/24/trumps-trade-war-is-economic
-suicide.html


Trump's trade war is economic suicide

When President Trump imposed a 25 percent tariff on steel imports last month, America's largest nail manufacturer had little choice but to raise its prices. Mid Continent Nail Corporation quickly lost 50 percent of its orders as customers opted for cheaper suppliers. Within weeks, the firm had to lay off 60 workers. Up to 200 more might lose their jobs by the end of this month.

If the tariff isn't lifted, the company could fold by September.

Mid Continent and its employees are early victims in Trump's trade war. There will be many more if the president continues to raise import costs and anger our trading partners.

https://qz.com/1336295/carmakers-are-counting-the-cost-of-trumps-great
est-tariffs-to-the-tune-of-10-billion
/
Carmakers are counting the cost of Trump’s “greatest” tariffs—in billions of dollars

Donald Trump’s “America First” policies on trade have spooked investors in some of America’s most prominent manufacturers: the “Big Three” carmakers of GM, Ford, and Chrysler.

GM, the US’s largest carmaker, said today that higher commodity costs (primarily steel and aluminum) would cut deeply into its margins, and so the company lowered its earnings outlook for the rest of the year. Earlier this year, Trump imposed tariffs on imports of steel and aluminum from China, the European Union, Mexico, and Canada to protect the US steel industry from competition on “national security” grounds. Companies that rely on these metals—imported or not—are feeling the pain. For example, GM gets most of its metal from domestic producers, but US steel prices have risen amid the tariffs.

*************************************************

Opinion in plain English:

First, he started a trade war.

He had no idea what he was doing, but he started a trade war anyway, all while declaring that it wasn't a trade war.

Guess what? It's a trade war.

1/ 
@realDonaldTrump
"China is targeting our farmers, who they know I love & respect, as a way of getting me to continue allowing them to take advantage of the U.S. They are being vicious in what will be their failed attempt. We were being nice - until now! China made $517 Billion on us last year."

?And given where things are made nowadays, the ONLY country that CAN'T win a trade war is the United States.
It's not the 1950s, folks. We don't make stuff, we buy stuff.
And American business has no one to blame but themselves.

2/
They've been sending manufacturing overseas for 40 years.
They didn't want to pay American workers a living wage. They didn't want to give benefits to American workers. They didn't want to pay American taxes. They didn't want to do their duty to the American Republic.

3/
They didn't want to make things in the United States, but they sure loved calling themselves Americans, benefiting from all the things America provides, and trading on America's name.

4/
This is result. Right here.
When you don't make anything, you got nothing to win a trade war WITH.

5/
What's that?
We make money?
Yeah. About that. For a while our wealth could prop up this imbalance. But here's the problem, all that money, decades worth, OUR money, spun up the economies in the rest of the world.

6/
An so, manufacturing economies like China are NO LONGER dependent on our money -- and when we drive them away from the US, they easily shift elsewhere, and then THEIR brands become household names in those economies and not ours.

7/
Hell, we don't even make ideas anymore. We outsourced that too.
We hired people overseas to come up with new ideas, to flesh out the concepts, to write the code, to do the tech support.
It didn't happen all at once, but little by little, we empowered those nations.

8/
And within a few decades, we become a backwater, left behind.
This has happened before, you know. There are plenty of historical examples.
We now find ourselves at the mercy of the very Third World countries we hold in contempt.

9/?The really ironic part? Conservatives are terrified of "communism," where government controls the means of production, meanwhile, the result of 4 decades of offshoring in the pursuit of ever higher profits has effectively moved production completely outside of US control.

10/?It's a trade war. And we're losing. Because we've got nothing to trade that our adversaries can't get elsewhere for less or make for themselves.
We did that.

11/
Trump is a product of the very modern business mindset that created this situation, that values profit above all and ONLY profit.
So long as he gets rich, so long as the rich get richer, the rest of the country can burn.
It's not like they've made a secret of this.

12/?Trump's bluster and clumsy ill-conceived trade war blew up in his face, so he then blamed Americans like Harley-Davidson for not toughing out HIS blunder. He literally expected that others would bear the cost, to the tune of billions, for his mistakes.

Why wouldn't he?

13/?If you've been paying attention, this should be no surprise.
This IS the mindset of American business. Pollute the rivers, somebody else will clean it up. Poison the population, somebody else will clean it up.

14/?Destroy the economy via bad investments, junk bonds, mortgage scams, Ponzi schemes? Somebody else will clean it up.
And that somebody else is ALWAYS you and me.

And that's EXACTLY what Trump expects here.

15/?You lose your job, your home, your retirement, your savings, your healthcare, that's the price you pay so Ivanka Trump can make her shitty handbags for cheap. You lost your life savings because you got scammed by Trump University? Caveat Emptor, sucker.

16/?Then he blamed everybody else.
Because that too is the modern American businessman, never, ever, ever, take responsibility for your own mistakes. Somebody else will clean it up.
So, NOW, Trump's taking $12 BILLION of YOUR money to bribe his victims.

17/?He's going to pay off American farmers with YOUR money for his mistake just like he paid off those porn stars.
Trump is running America EXACTLY as he said he would.
Yes he is.
That's the ONE thing he told the truth about.

18/?He's running America exactly as he runs his business. He never has to pay for his mistakes.
HE profits. YOU get screwed.
He makes the mess, you get to clean it up.

19/?And I don't know why this would be a surprise to anybody.
I warned you son of bitches. I did. A lot of us warned you this would happen.
If you elect a businessman, you are going to get the business. And you're gonna get it good and hard.

Every. Single. Time.

How timely.

Posting a 2 week old Fake News Story. Today. The day Trump wins the Tariff/Trade war as EU capitulates to his calls for fairness and balance.

Trolls are really funny sometimes.

And the Fake Story says "Senators" and only cites Uranium One usher Corker and pants-on-fire idjit Menendez. Lol.

And for a 2nd day in a row, Trolls double down on stupid while the Stock Market climbs. Even with SIG's helping to explain, their FACTS Vaccine protects them from letting knowledge and information infiltrate.

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Friday, July 27, 2018 9:42 AM

REAVERFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
And for a 2nd day in a row, Trolls double down on stupid while the Stock Market climbs. Even with SIG's helping to explain, their FACTS Vaccine protects them from letting knowledge and information infiltrate.

Seems he's stealing a page from Bush. How did that turn out?

Budget office projects growing deficits and massive debt during Trump administration
http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-trump-deficits-20180409-stor
y.html


The CBO also confirmed earlier estimates that despite Republican promises that the tax cuts would pay for themselves through economic growth, the plan would actually increase the deficit about $1.9 trillion over 11 years.

Democrats said the report rebuked Republicans' claims to be fiscal conservatives.

"In their craven haste to give corporations and the wealthiest 1% massive tax breaks, Republicans saddled our children and grandchildren with trillions of dollars of debt," House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-San Francisco) said in a statement.

More of the same from the tinkle-down crew.




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Friday, July 27, 2018 10:08 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


The Dow is only up because of the massive inflation that has occurred in the last decade because of quantitative easing. We're in the second longest period of "growth" of GDP in America. If it were to "grow" until the 2020 election, it would be the longest period of "growth" the US has ever seen.

One of the bubbles will burst eventually. When it does, the FED can't lower the rates to below Zero to combat it this time.

I wonder what Stagflation is going to be like.



The only thing I really find funny is people here who put all of this blame on Trump. From what I can see, the only thing Trump is guilty of here is keeping up with the status quo instead of making good on any of his pre-election promises regarding the economy. As soon as he got in all of the sudden the Unemployment numbers were great and the Dow is doing better than ever. He hasn't done a thing to shrink big government. Regarding the economy specifically, we might as well still have Obama in or have voted in a Clinton. The picture wouldn't look any different than it does today.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, July 27, 2018 10:14 AM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by reaverfan:
Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
And for a 2nd day in a row, Trolls double down on stupid while the Stock Market climbs. Even with SIG's helping to explain, their FACTS Vaccine protects them from letting knowledge and information infiltrate.

Seems he's stealing a page from Bush. How did that turn out?

Budget office projects growing deficits and massive debt during Trump administration
http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-trump-deficits-20180409-stor
y.html


The CBO also confirmed earlier estimates that despite Republican promises that the tax cuts would pay for themselves through economic growth, the plan would actually increase the deficit about $1.9 trillion over 11 years.

Democrats said the report rebuked Republicans' claims to be fiscal conservatives.

"In their craven haste to give corporations and the wealthiest 1% massive tax breaks, Republicans saddled our children and grandchildren with trillions of dollars of debt," House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-San Francisco) said in a statement.

More of the same from the tinkle-down crew.

You should try reading some news sometime, instead of 3-month old outdated gibberish, which every reasonable person knew it was when it was propagated.
A few weeks later, the CBO announced that they were off by $2.95 Trillion, and the Trump Tax Reform would actually reduce the debt by $1.45 Trillion, after several years of first paying back the $1.5 Trillion.

Try keeping up with the adults, m'kay?

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Friday, July 27, 2018 11:31 AM

REAVERFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
You should try reading some news sometime, instead of 3-month old outdated gibberish, which every reasonable person knew it was when it was propagated.
A few weeks later, the CBO announced that they were off by $2.95 Trillion, and the Trump Tax Reform would actually reduce the debt by $1.45 Trillion, after several years of first paying back the $1.5 Trillion.

Try keeping up with the adults, m'kay?

Unlike you, I read news. You read what your Russian bosses tell you to parrot. You say the same things all the other trolls say, all over the internet.

Here's a novel idea. Why don't you post the source of what you said? That would be refreshing.

Here's mine. https://www.cbo.gov/publication/53727

Prove it wrong, Ruskie.

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Friday, July 27, 2018 12:51 PM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
A few weeks later, the CBO announced that they were off by $2.95 Trillion, and the Trump Tax Reform would actually reduce the debt by $1.45 Trillion, after several years of first paying back the $1.5 Trillion.



Huh? "the CBO announced that they were off by $2.95 Trillion" that's almost 3 times the TOTAL projected deficit for 2020, JSF. I too am anxious to see your links for that one. (f*cksake).

"The U.S. budget deficit will surpass $1 trillion by 2020, two years sooner than previously estimated, as tax cuts and spending increases signed by President Donald Trump do little to boost long-term economic growth, according to the Congressional Budget Office.

Spending will exceed revenue by $804 billion in the fiscal year through September, jumping from a projected $563 billion shortfall forecast in June, the non-partisan arm of Congress said in a report Monday. In fiscal 2019, the deficit will reach $981 billion, compared with an earlier projection of $689 billion.

The nation’s budget gap was only set to surpass the trillion-dollar level in fiscal 2022 under CBO’s report last June."

https://mises.org/power-market/cbo-projection-us-deficit-tops-1-trilli
on-two-years-ahead-schedule


Stop huffin' your mom's hair spray, m'kay?

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Friday, July 27, 2018 2:14 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


I don't think that cutting taxes in THIS situation will reduce the deficit. The taxes have to be SO high that they are strangling economic growth, and in THIS case what's strangling economic growth is not taxes it's "free trade", internal corruption and wealth inequality. So, I do NOT agree with Trump's tax cut, unless there's something about "repatriation of capital" that I don't understand. When I have more time I'll research it.

Also, the stock market is NOT the economy! The stock market is up because THE FED has held interest rates at near-zero for almost ten years now, and large businesses which issue stock have been busy borrowing money at near-zero interest rates to engage in "stock buybacks" which reduce the number of outstanding shares, artificially increasing the price per share (PE ratio).

A stock market crash CAN bonk the economy (It has done so in the past) due to capital flow (money velocity) grinding to a halt. But the REAL economy consists of production of goods and provision of services; not stock, real estate, or commodity prices or derivatives and hedge funds.

So I wouldn't be crowing about stock prices, if I were a Trump supporter, because (1) it's irrelevant to the real economy and (2) it's not under control of the WH, but under control of The Fed. A rise in interest rates will crash a lot of debt-based speculation, including hedge funds, stocks, and real estate.


-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Friday, July 27, 2018 4:21 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I don't think that cutting taxes in THIS situation will reduce the deficit. The taxes have to be SO high that they are strangling economic growth, and in THIS case what's strangling economic growth is not taxes it's "free trade", internal corruption and wealth inequality. So, I do NOT agree with Trump's tax cut, unless there's something about "repatriation of capital" that I don't understand. When I have more time I'll research it.

Also, the stock market is NOT the economy! The stock market is up because THE FED has held interest rates at near-zero for almost ten years now, and large businesses which issue stock have been busy borrowing money at near-zero interest rates to engage in "stock buybacks" which reduce the number of outstanding shares, artificially increasing the price per share (PE ratio).

A stock market crash CAN bonk the economy (It has done so in the past) due to capital flow (money velocity) grinding to a halt. But the REAL economy consists of production of goods and provision of services; not stock, real estate, or commodity prices or derivatives and hedge funds.

So I wouldn't be crowing about stock prices, if I were a Trump supporter, because (1) it's irrelevant to the real economy and (2) it's not under control of the WH, but under control of The Fed. A rise in interest rates will crash a lot of debt-based speculation, including hedge funds, stocks, and real estate.


-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876



This.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, July 27, 2018 4:40 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I don't think that cutting taxes in THIS situation will reduce the deficit.

You can argue with CBO about that. Lettuce know how well that works for ya.
To be technically accurate, I don't believe any reasonable projection has indicated the Obamanomics bloat will be halted soon enough to actually reduce the Debt in that timeframe, but the CBO was comparing the projections from before the Tax Reform, and then comparing again a few weeks later.
Quote:

So, I do NOT agree with Trump's tax cut, unless there's something about "repatriation of capital" that I don't understand. When I have more time I'll research it.

Why don't you like Repatriation of Capital?

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Friday, July 27, 2018 6:14 PM

WHOZIT


GDP is at 4.1%...shut up

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Friday, July 27, 2018 6:38 PM

THG


Quote:

Originally posted by whozit:

GDP is at 4.1%...shut up



T





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Friday, July 27, 2018 10:16 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

I don't think that cutting taxes in THIS situation will reduce the deficit. - SIGNY

You can argue with CBO about that. Lettuce know how well that works for ya. - JSF

JSF, you posted ...

Quote:

You should try reading some news sometime, instead of 3-month old outdated gibberish, which every reasonable person knew it was when it was propagated.
A few weeks later, the CBO announced that they were off by $2.95 Trillion, and the Trump Tax Reform would actually reduce the debt by $1.45 Trillion, after several years of first paying back the $1.5 Trillion.

I went to the CBO website and there was NOTHING there like this. So if you have information that none of us have ... LINKS, PLEASE?

Quote:

To be technically accurate, I don't believe any reasonable projection has indicated the Obamanomics bloat will be halted soon enough to actually reduce the Debt in that timeframe, but the CBO was comparing the projections from before the Tax Reform, and then comparing again a few weeks later.
As I requested: LINKS, PLEASE?

Quote:

So, I do NOT agree with Trump's tax cut, unless there's something about "repatriation of capital" that I don't understand. When I have more time I'll research it.- SIGNY

Why don't you like Repatriation of Capital?- JSF

It's not that I don't like it, it's that I don't know exactly what it is or how its supposed to work. Here are two threads of thought that I have on the topic ....

1) It's possible to reduce imports into the USA by charging tariffs, and if the tariffs are high enough you can essentially block certain imports. BUT, just because there is a deficit of (say) automobiles in the USA and (because of reduced supply and steady demand) the price goes up from $25,000 to $50,000, altho that represents an investment opportunity, that doesn't necessarily mean that any company will actually step in and invest. Perhaps the total investment is too high, or interest rates are too high, so altho the "environment" might be good, actual investment might not happen.

2) At the same time, if taxes allow profit to remain in the USA, PERHAPS that money would be used for investment.

So possibly between a "push" (availability of money) and a "pull" (demand for product) the right investment would happen to re-industrialize America, but it seems a bit indirect/ uncertain.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Friday, July 27, 2018 11:09 PM

REAVERFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by THG:
Quote:

Originally posted by whozit:

GDP is at 4.1%...shut up



T






Funny how Trump blatantly lied, again.

Not that we didn't expect him to.

A lying president is the norm in Trump's America.

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Friday, July 27, 2018 11:27 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:


A lying president is the norm in America.



Fixed it for ya.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Saturday, July 28, 2018 3:19 AM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

I don't think that cutting taxes in THIS situation will reduce the deficit. - SIGNY

You can argue with CBO about that. Lettuce know how well that works for ya. - JSF

JSF, you posted ...

Quote:

You should try reading some news sometime, instead of 3-month old outdated gibberish, which every reasonable person knew it was when it was propagated.
A few weeks later, the CBO announced that they were off by $2.95 Trillion, and the Trump Tax Reform would actually reduce the debt by $1.45 Trillion, after several years of first paying back the $1.5 Trillion.

I went to the CBO website and there was NOTHING there like this. So if you have information that none of us have ... LINKS, PLEASE?

Quote:

To be technically accurate, I don't believe any reasonable projection has indicated the Obamanomics bloat will be halted soon enough to actually reduce the Debt in that timeframe, but the CBO was comparing the projections from before the Tax Reform, and then comparing again a few weeks later.
As I requested: LINKS, PLEASE?

Quote:

So, I do NOT agree with Trump's tax cut, unless there's something about "repatriation of capital" that I don't understand. When I have more time I'll research it.- SIGNY

Why don't you like Repatriation of Capital?- JSF

It's not that I don't like it, it's that I don't know exactly what it is or how its supposed to work. Here are two threads of thought that I have on the topic ....

1) It's possible to reduce imports into the USA by charging tariffs, and if the tariffs are high enough you can essentially block certain imports. BUT, just because there is a deficit of (say) automobiles in the USA and (because of reduced supply and steady demand) the price goes up from $25,000 to $50,000, altho that represents an investment opportunity, that doesn't necessarily mean that any company will actually step in and invest. Perhaps the total investment is too high, or interest rates are too high, so altho the "environment" might be good, actual investment might not happen.

2) At the same time, if taxes allow profit to remain in the USA, PERHAPS that money would be used for investment.

So possibly between a "push" (availability of money) and a "pull" (demand for product) the right investment would happen to re-industrialize America, but it seems a bit indirect/ uncertain.

??
Did you miss the news of Apple's Repatriation of Capital, about $380 Billion worth? They contributed something like $38 Billion to Federal Revenue coffers.
Yes, they decided to contribute that much Taxes.



For the CBO stuff, I can't easily do linkies right now.
You can try this: go to this post fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61505&mid=1056025
If that explanation is not enough for you, check the source data at CBO. They don't make it easy, and their written reports are garbage, hoping you won't notice how badly they lied the last month, every month. Use one of the links in that thread for CBO publications, and change the number to 53651 for the April report, and then 53884 for the May report.
IIRC, you want to look at the numbers at the end of the next decade, and compare. They tried very hard to obfuscate, but the numbers really are there.

Hopefully that gets you what you want.

The figures I posted above and you quoted are from recall and are slightly off, but the figures at the linked post are correct.

The April report is the Fake one, published so they could generate some Fake News headlines. That's the one where they say Tax Reform will add $1.9 Trillion to the Debt, compared to what they had projected previously.
The May report is where they backtracked to the vicinity of reality.
I posted the figures side by side in this post from that thread: 1053414.

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Saturday, July 28, 2018 8:22 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Quote:

So, I do NOT agree with Trump's tax cut, unless there's something about "repatriation of capital" that I don't understand. When I have more time I'll research it.- SIGNY

Why don't you like Repatriation of Capital?- JSF

It's not that I don't like it, it's that I don't know exactly what it is or how its supposed to work. Here are two threads of thought that I have on the topic ....

1) It's possible to reduce imports into the USA by charging tariffs, and if the tariffs are high enough you can essentially block certain imports. BUT, just because there is a deficit of (say) automobiles in the USA and (because of reduced supply and steady demand) the price goes up from $25,000 to $50,000, altho that represents an investment opportunity, that doesn't necessarily mean that any company will actually step in and invest. Perhaps the total investment is too high, or interest rates are too high, so altho the "environment" might be good, actual investment might not happen.

2) At the same time, if taxes allow profit to remain in the USA, PERHAPS that money would be used for investment.

So possibly between a "push" (availability of money) and a "pull" (demand for product) the right investment would happen to re-industrialize America, but it seems a bit indirect/ uncertain.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

We’re still waiting for both the investment surge and the wage gains the tax cutters promised; as far as we can tell, they’re never coming.

www.nytimes.com/2018/07/28/opinion/why-one-quarters-growth-tells-us-no
thing.html


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, July 28, 2018 11:29 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

We’re still waiting for both the investment surge and the wage gains the tax cutters promised- SECOND
Oh, you are? That must mean that you believed the hype to begin win. I'm not waiting; but that's because I didn't think the approach would work in the first place*.


Quote:

as far as we can tell, they’re never coming. - SECOND
Well, "never" is a long time. I encourage all writers to never use "never" and always avoid "always".

BEFORE TRUMP WAS EVEN ELECTED I opined that he would NOT be able to reverse America's economic fortunes, not even in two terms*. The BEST that we could hope for was to pull out of current "free trade" agreements, and avoid future ones, which would dis-empower the USA from being able to make sovereign economic and trade decisions to benefit AMERICA's economy ... a power that we may desperately need in response to the de-dollarization that was already being planned by China, Russia, and (some say) the IMF.

*I did go into my reasons at the time; I'll be happy to repeat the train of thought later when I have more time.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Saturday, July 28, 2018 12:26 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

*I did go into my reasons at the time; I'll be happy to repeat the train of thought later when I have more time.

Please don't. You are a know-it-all that doesn't know what you don't know.
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

BEFORE TRUMP WAS EVEN ELECTED I opined that he would NOT be able to reverse America's economic fortunes, not even in two terms.
"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

Trump can reverse America’s fortune. He can make it worse: the junk loans that tanked the economy in 2008? They are back!

“We have now re-created the condition that led to the last crisis by making it easier to aggregate loans that are not good for investors.”

It is no coincidence that the decline in loan quality has occurred as there’s been a shift in who is doing the lending. Back in 2013, 70 percent of the loans were made by major banks whose lending is closely scrutinized by government bank regulators. That figure is now down to 54 percent, according to Bloomberg, as hedge funds, private-equity firms, insurance companies and non-regulated lenders have entered the market in a big way. This shift in market share away from banks mirrors what happened to mortgage lending in the run-up to the 2008 crash, when competition from unregulated lenders led banks to lower lending standards in an effort to maintain their market share.

There’s also been a shift in how the loans are being used. Some of the debt is being used, as it always has been, to finance expansion or refinance old debt. But more recently, a growing portion of leveraged lending has been used to buy back stock, pay special dividends to private-equity firms cashing out of their investments or to finance richly priced mergers and acquisitions, which are now running at a pace that exceeds the bubbles of 2000 and 2007. In other words, it has been used to reward investors rather than grow the business.

The mergers and acquisitions are particularly troublesome. According to Covenant Review, a debt analyst, the amount of debt used to finance these takeover deals has grown significantly, from 6.4 times cash flow in 2015 to 7.7 times cash flow in the first quarter of this year. Moreover, analysts warn that as much as 30 percent of that expected cash flow might never materialize because of overly rosy assumptions about cost savings and revenue growth. A slowdown in the economy or a rise in interest rates could very well put those companies in a cash squeeze, e.g. bankruptcy.

Although financial regulators have taken notice of the increased volume and declining quality of corporate credit, they haven’t done much to discourage it — just the opposite, in fact.
Earlier this year, after complaints from banks and dealmakers reached sympathetic ears in the Trump administration, the newly installed chairman of the Federal Reserve and the Comptroller of the Currency Office declared that previous “guidance” against lending to companies whose debt exceeded six times their annual cash flow should not be taken as a hard and fast rule.

More at www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/the-junk-debt-that-tanked-the-economy-
its-back-in-a-big-way/ar-BBL9ef2?ocid=spartandhp


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, July 28, 2018 1:06 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Trump can reverse America’s fortune. He can make it worse: the junk loans that tanked the economy in 2008? They are back!

“We have now re-created the condition that led to the last crisis by making it easier to aggregate loans that are not good for investors.” - SECONDHAND

Speaking of being a know-it-all about things that you know thing about ...

"Junk loans" have been with us for over five years. The conditions weren't "suddenly" created in the past year, they were re-created under OBAMA's reign. The student loan crisis. The auto loan disaster. The real estate loan crisis-to-be. The stock plunge and the hedge fund crisis ... people have been warning about these for (literally) years. Where have you been living lately? Certainly not in the USA!

To be fair, this is because of The Fed keeping interest rates at near-zero for years and years, which encouraged speculative bubbles and improvident borrowing. Sarbanes-Oxley encouraged the avoidance of traditional lending and promoted SHADOW BANKS. (BTW: NOT TRUMP'S FAULT). Blaming Trump for the upcoming disaster (which people including myself have been predicting for a while) is like blaming Obama for the Great Recession. This upcoming crisis? Not Obama's fault (directly, altho he CAN be blamed for the Fed Char appointment) and not Trump's either; look to The Fed and its monetary policy.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Saturday, July 28, 2018 2:11 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

Trump can reverse America’s fortune. He can make it worse: the junk loans that tanked the economy in 2008? They are back!

“We have now re-created the condition that led to the last crisis by making it easier to aggregate loans that are not good for investors.” - SECONDHAND

Speaking of being a know-it-all about things that you know thing about ...

"Junk loans" have been with us for over five years. The conditions weren't "suddenly" created in the past year, they were re-created under OBAMA's reign. The student loan crisis. The auto loan disaster. The real estate loan crisis-to-be. The stock plunge and the hedge fund crisis ... people have been warning about these for (literally) years. Where have you been living lately? Certainly not in the USA!

To be fair, this is because of The Fed keeping interest rates at near-zero for years and years, which encouraged speculative bubbles and improvident borrowing. Sarbanes-Oxley encouraged the avoidance of traditional lending and promoted SHADOW BANKS. (BTW: NOT TRUMP'S FAULT). Blaming Trump for the upcoming disaster (which people including myself have been predicting for a while) is like blaming Obama for the Great Recession. This upcoming crisis? Not Obama's fault (directly, altho he CAN be blamed for the Fed Char appointment) and not Trump's either; look to The Fed and its monetary policy.



Somebody might want to remind Second with his own numerous quotes on the matter that the President doesn't have this power, unless it's convenient to his argument apparently...

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Saturday, July 28, 2018 11:21 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


I figure if SECOND can post random second-hand shit so can I, so here goes ...

Quote:

"There's No Way To Make This Work" Martenson Warns "A Big Reset Is Locked In"

Futurist and economic researcher Chris Martenson says we are not at the end of a business cycle but “. . . at the end of a credit cycle.”

Martenson warns,

“Here’s why people need to be concerned. Credit cycles, when they blow up, are really, really destructive..."

"2008 to 2009 was very destructive. Instead of realizing the error of their ways, they went for a third. This is the most comprehensive credit cycle that we have seen. Remember, bubbles have two things that they need. Number one, a good story that people can believe in and, of course, it’s a false story. Number two, ample credit. That’s what the Fed and central banks of Japan and Europe have done. They just flooded the world with credit. Now, we have bubbles everywhere. When these burst, it will be the worst bursting in anybody’s lifetime because we have never seen anything like this.”


Martenson says a debt reset is locked in, and somebody is going to pay.

“When you have as much debt that the United States has... the overall debt level in the United States, including auto loans, mortgages, consumer debt, student loans and corporate debt and whatever, we’re sitting at about $60 trillion right now. It’s a huge number, and when you get to this level of indebtedness, plus those unfunded or underfunded liabilities

which some have estimated to be in the realm of $240 trillion total

Quote:

... when you get to this level of indebtedness, there is really only one question left to be resolved, and that is who is going to eat the losses. That’s it.

So, when you start asking that question, the banks and people writing the laws are pretty sure they are not going to take the losses. The person relying on the pension is the person that is going to eat the losses. . . . There is no way to make this work. Here’s where the social tension comes in. Even as ordinary middle class people are being destroyed in this process, the rich are taking more and more out of the system. That is courtesy of the policies of the Federal Reserve...

But the big risk is when these printing sprees, these credit cycles finally burst. They are wildly destructive. They are fast. They are hard. They are sharp and they hurt.”


Martenson says people can protect themselves with real assets as opposed to paper assets. Martenson says,

“Real assets are the place you need to be if and when a paper tower comes crumbling down. I am diversified myself. I believe in land. I believe in real estate. I believe in gold. I believe in silver. I believe in other metals. I believe in these hard assets because this is where we are going to have to hide out because if you held hard assets in Turkey, in Venezuela, in Argentina and in places where the currency collapsed and declined, these would have been great places to be hiding out...

When this worm turns, it’s going to be a lot faster than it has in the past. There is no free lunch, and if you can see that, there is a wealth transfer coming. The wealth transfer is going to have a bright red line, and people are going to get trapped on the side where they hold paper claims, and the people that are going to preserve their wealth are going to be on the other side of the line with their wealth tied up in real things. That’s the period of history that is about to unfold.”


Chris Martenson added this ominous statement: “We are one sinking of an aircraft carrier away from the U.S. dollar being revealed as a fraud.”



INTERVIEW HERE





-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Wednesday, August 1, 2018 6:56 AM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

I don't think that cutting taxes in THIS situation will reduce the deficit. - SIGNY

You can argue with CBO about that. Lettuce know how well that works for ya. - JSF

JSF, you posted ...

Quote:

You should try reading some news sometime, instead of 3-month old outdated gibberish, which every reasonable person knew it was when it was propagated.
A few weeks later, the CBO announced that they were off by $2.95 Trillion, and the Trump Tax Reform would actually reduce the debt by $1.45 Trillion, after several years of first paying back the $1.5 Trillion.

I went to the CBO website and there was NOTHING there like this. So if you have information that none of us have ... LINKS, PLEASE?

Quote:

To be technically accurate, I don't believe any reasonable projection has indicated the Obamanomics bloat will be halted soon enough to actually reduce the Debt in that timeframe, but the CBO was comparing the projections from before the Tax Reform, and then comparing again a few weeks later.
As I requested: LINKS, PLEASE?

Quote:

So, I do NOT agree with Trump's tax cut, unless there's something about "repatriation of capital" that I don't understand. When I have more time I'll research it.- SIGNY

Why don't you like Repatriation of Capital?- JSF

It's not that I don't like it, it's that I don't know exactly what it is or how its supposed to work. Here are two threads of thought that I have on the topic ....

1) It's possible to reduce imports into the USA by charging tariffs, and if the tariffs are high enough you can essentially block certain imports. BUT, just because there is a deficit of (say) automobiles in the USA and (because of reduced supply and steady demand) the price goes up from $25,000 to $50,000, altho that represents an investment opportunity, that doesn't necessarily mean that any company will actually step in and invest. Perhaps the total investment is too high, or interest rates are too high, so altho the "environment" might be good, actual investment might not happen.

2) At the same time, if taxes allow profit to remain in the USA, PERHAPS that money would be used for investment.

So possibly between a "push" (availability of money) and a "pull" (demand for product) the right investment would happen to re-industrialize America, but it seems a bit indirect/ uncertain.

??
Did you miss the news of Apple's Repatriation of Capital, about $380 Billion worth? They contributed something like $38 Billion to Federal Revenue coffers.
Yes, they decided to contribute that much Taxes.



For the CBO stuff, I can't easily do linkies right now.
You can try this: go to this post fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61505&mid=1056025
If that explanation is not enough for you, check the source data at CBO. They don't make it easy, and their written reports are garbage, hoping you won't notice how badly they lied the last month, every month. Use one of the links in that thread for CBO publications, and change the number to 53651 for the April report, and then 53884 for the May report.
IIRC, you want to look at the numbers at the end of the next decade, and compare. They tried very hard to obfuscate, but the numbers really are there.

Hopefully that gets you what you want.

The figures I posted above and you quoted are from recall and are slightly off, but the figures at the linked post are correct.

The April report is the Fake one, published so they could generate some Fake News headlines. That's the one where they say Tax Reform will add $1.9 Trillion to the Debt, compared to what they had projected previously.
The May report is where they backtracked to the vicinity of reality.
I posted the figures side by side in this post from that thread: 1053414.

Did that work for ya?

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Saturday, August 4, 2018 11:43 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

I don't think that cutting taxes in THIS situation will reduce the deficit. - SIGNY

You can argue with CBO about that. Lettuce know how well that works for ya. - JSF

JSF, you posted ...

Quote:

You should try reading some news sometime, instead of 3-month old outdated gibberish, which every reasonable person knew it was when it was propagated.
A few weeks later, the CBO announced that they were off by $2.95 Trillion, and the Trump Tax Reform would actually reduce the debt by $1.45 Trillion, after several years of first paying back the $1.5 Trillion.

I went to the CBO website and there was NOTHING there like this. So if you have information that none of us have ... LINKS, PLEASE?

Quote:

To be technically accurate, I don't believe any reasonable projection has indicated the Obamanomics bloat will be halted soon enough to actually reduce the Debt in that timeframe, but the CBO was comparing the projections from before the Tax Reform, and then comparing again a few weeks later.
As I requested: LINKS, PLEASE?

Quote:

So, I do NOT agree with Trump's tax cut, unless there's something about "repatriation of capital" that I don't understand. When I have more time I'll research it.- SIGNY

Why don't you like Repatriation of Capital?- JSF

It's not that I don't like it, it's that I don't know exactly what it is or how its supposed to work. Here are two threads of thought that I have on the topic ....

1) It's possible to reduce imports into the USA by charging tariffs, and if the tariffs are high enough you can essentially block certain imports. BUT, just because there is a deficit of (say) automobiles in the USA and (because of reduced supply and steady demand) the price goes up from $25,000 to $50,000, altho that represents an investment opportunity, that doesn't necessarily mean that any company will actually step in and invest. Perhaps the total investment is too high, or interest rates are too high, so altho the "environment" might be good, actual investment might not happen.

2) At the same time, if taxes allow profit to remain in the USA, PERHAPS that money would be used for investment.

So possibly between a "push" (availability of money) and a "pull" (demand for product) the right investment would happen to re-industrialize America, but it seems a bit indirect/ uncertain.

??
Did you miss the news of Apple's Repatriation of Capital, about $380 Billion worth? They contributed something like $38 Billion to Federal Revenue coffers.
Yes, they decided to contribute that much Taxes.



For the CBO stuff, I can't easily do linkies right now.
You can try this: go to this post fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61505&mid=1056025
If that explanation is not enough for you, check the source data at CBO. They don't make it easy, and their written reports are garbage, hoping you won't notice how badly they lied the last month, every month. Use one of the links in that thread for CBO publications, and change the number to 53651 for the April report, and then 53884 for the May report.
IIRC, you want to look at the numbers at the end of the next decade, and compare. They tried very hard to obfuscate, but the numbers really are there.

Hopefully that gets you what you want.

The figures I posted above and you quoted are from recall and are slightly off, but the figures at the linked post are correct.

The April report is the Fake one, published so they could generate some Fake News headlines. That's the one where they say Tax Reform will add $1.9 Trillion to the Debt, compared to what they had projected previously.
The May report is where they backtracked to the vicinity of reality.
I posted the figures side by side in this post from that thread: 1053414.

Did that work for ya?

??

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Monday, August 6, 2018 7:37 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

I don't think that cutting taxes in THIS situation will reduce the deficit. - SIGNY

You can argue with CBO about that. Lettuce know how well that works for ya. - JSF

JSF, you posted ...

Quote:

You should try reading some news sometime, instead of 3-month old outdated gibberish, which every reasonable person knew it was when it was propagated.
A few weeks later, the CBO announced that they were off by $2.95 Trillion, and the Trump Tax Reform would actually reduce the debt by $1.45 Trillion, after several years of first paying back the $1.5 Trillion.

I went to the CBO website and there was NOTHING there like this. So if you have information that none of us have ... LINKS, PLEASE?
Quote:

To be technically accurate, I don't believe any reasonable projection has indicated the Obamanomics bloat will be halted soon enough to actually reduce the Debt in that timeframe, but the CBO was comparing the projections from before the Tax Reform, and then comparing again a few weeks later.
As I requested: LINKS, PLEASE?
Quote:

So, I do NOT agree with Trump's tax cut, unless there's something about "repatriation of capital" that I don't understand. When I have more time I'll research it.- SIGNY

Why don't you like Repatriation of Capital?- JSF

It's not that I don't like it, it's that I don't know exactly what it is or how its supposed to work. Here are two threads of thought that I have on the topic ....

1) It's possible to reduce imports into the USA by charging tariffs, and if the tariffs are high enough you can essentially block certain imports. BUT, just because there is a deficit of (say) automobiles in the USA and (because of reduced supply and steady demand) the price goes up from $25,000 to $50,000, altho that represents an investment opportunity, that doesn't necessarily mean that any company will actually step in and invest. Perhaps the total investment is too high, or interest rates are too high, so altho the "environment" might be good, actual investment might not happen.

2) At the same time, if taxes allow profit to remain in the USA, PERHAPS that money would be used for investment.

So possibly between a "push" (availability of money) and a "pull" (demand for product) the right investment would happen to re-industrialize America, but it seems a bit indirect/ uncertain.

??
Did you miss the news of Apple's Repatriation of Capital, about $380 Billion worth? They contributed something like $38 Billion to Federal Revenue coffers.
Yes, they decided to contribute that much Taxes.



For the CBO stuff, I can't easily do linkies right now.
You can try this: go to this post fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61505&mid=1056025
If that explanation is not enough for you, check the source data at CBO. They don't make it easy, and their written reports are garbage, hoping you won't notice how badly they lied the last month, every month. Use one of the links in that thread for CBO publications, and change the number to 53651 for the April report, and then 53884 for the May report.
IIRC, you want to look at the numbers at the end of the next decade, and compare. They tried very hard to obfuscate, but the numbers really are there.

Hopefully that gets you what you want.

The figures I posted above and you quoted are from recall and are slightly off, but the figures at the linked post are correct.

The April report is the Fake one, published so they could generate some Fake News headlines. That's the one where they say Tax Reform will add $1.9 Trillion to the Debt, compared to what they had projected previously.
The May report is where they backtracked to the vicinity of reality.
I posted the figures side by side in this post from that thread: 1053414.


Hopefully this linky will work for ya:
http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61505&mid=10560
25#1056025



And this is a copy of the post:
Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Copied from a delusional thread:

Quote:

Originally posted by second:
The Republicans’ $1.5 trillion tax cut will increase the federal debt by $1.9 trillion.

This comes from Table B-3 in the Congressional Budget Office report, page 129, so far in the back that no one reads it. The exact figure is $1.854 trillion from 2018 to 2028. That number was promised by Trump to be zero dollars or even a negative number.
www.cbo.gov/publication/53651

In other words, the tax cut doesn’t pay for itself. It doesn’t even partially pay for itself.

www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2018/04/cbo-projects-1-5-trillion-tax-c
ut-will-cost-1-6-trillion
/


Another ridiculous post quoted for posterity.

This was from 12 April.
I guess I may have not spelled out how ridiculous it was.

Using CBO Deficit figures:
FY April18 May18 difference (savings)
28 $1526B 1087B $439B / $2957B
27 $1316B $965B $351B / $2518B
26 $1320B $893B $427B / $2167B
25 $1352B $895B $457B / $1740B
24 $1244B $859B $385B / $1283B
23 $1273B $971B $302B / $897B
22 $1276B 1039B $237B / $595B
21 $1123B $945B $178B / $358B
20 $1008B $866B $142B / $180B
19 $0981B $955B $026B / $38B
18 $0804B $792B $012B

So, even by using the pessimistic projections of Deep State Libtards at CBO, one month after proclaiming their vaunted $1.854 Trillion Debt increase, they admitted that they were a tad off, by $2.957 Trillion. Meaning that $1.5 Trillion Tax Cut Now reaps $1.1 Trillion Debt savings over the next 10 years. That's fully reaping $1.5 Trillion within 7 years, before the added windfall.

second might want to look at his hair being On Fire.
As hard as he had to look, Hunt, search for that page 129, funny how he has managed to avoid Real World Facts intruding upon his delusions.



Golly, I should probably copy this info over to the thread on Lower Tax RATES Produce Higher Tax Revenue.
Although CBO will never use those words, their data proves the premise.



And the follow-up post:

Today CBO released its Analysis of Trump's FY2019 Federal Budget.
To reconcile it's prior projections with Reality it had to begrudgingly increase the Revenues, decrease the Outlays, Deficit, and Debt, and increase the GDP - at least for FY2018. And these revisions are compared to the delusions they persisted with as of LAST MONTH, or 7 weeks ago.
https://www.cbo.gov/publication/53884

The CBO report is from April 2018, which was delayed from January due to the legislation passed in November 2017, February, March 2018. It only includes non-legislative factors up to mid-February. It is https://www.cbo.gov/publication/53651
For comparison, I'll post on the same Table as Trump's projections.


The left has President's Federal Budget, FY2019, and then the CBO estimates from April 2018, and then the CBO Analysis from May 2018:

Year Rvnu Outl Defct NtGDP || CBRv CBOt CBD CBGDP || CBR CBOt CDOD CBGDP
2028 5818 6181 363 32602 || 5520 7046 1526 29803 || 5264 6351 1087 29803
2027 5506 5955 450 31089 || 5299 6615 1316 28677 || 5063 6029 $965 28677
2026 5231 5748 517 29647 || 5002 6322 1320 27608 || 4886 5778 $893 27608
2025 4946 5526 579 28253 || 4663 6015 1352 26595 || 4659 5553 $895 26595
2024 4675 5348 672 26900 || 4444 5688 1244 25583 || 4446 5305 $859 25583
2023 4386 5160 774 25605 || 4228 5500 1273 24621 || 4232 5202 $971 24621
2022 4089 4941 852 24369 || 4012 5288 1276 23716 || 4016 5055 1039 23716
2021 3838 4754 916 23194 || 3827 4949 1123 22872 || 3830 4775 $945 22872
2020 3609 4596 987 22067 || 3678 4685 1008 22034 || 3682 4548 $866 22034
2019 3422 4407 984 21003 || 3490 4470 $981 21136 || 3493 4448 $955 21136
2018 3340 4214 873 20029 || 3338 4142 $804 20103 || 3339 4131 $792 20103
2017 3316 3982 665 19177 || 3316 3982 $665 19178 || 3316 3982 $665 19178

In the left section, Trump's Budget, compared to Obama projections:
The Revenue projections are reduced from the exaggerated amounts Obama assumed. Deficits upcoming are increased due to more realistic projections. For 2017 the figures were updated from Obama's base projections and last year corrections. Trump's GDP is revised up, and Expenditures are revised down.
Trump's Budget accumulates $8.632 Trillion in Deficits by 2028.
Indicating the Federal Debt would add about $13 Trillion in that period.

Which holds true to historical practice. Democrats always exaggerate or overestimate Revenues and downplay or underestimate Expenditures, and Conservative Republicans always underestimate Revenue projections and overestimate Expenditure projections (but Democrats then find some pork to fill in the difference).

In the middle section, the CBO projections:
The Liberal biased practices of the CBO bloat the Expenditures, and undervalue the Revenues and long-term GDP, thus exaggerate the Deficits. The GDP in the short term is more because even the Liberal bias was unable to deny the reality of Trump's Fiscal Policies and subsequent GDP growth.
The CBO projections bloat the accumulative Deficits to $13.888 Trillion by 2028.
Indicating the Federal Debt would add about $20 Trillion in that period - practically doubling from it's current level. Which would exaggerate by $7 Trillion what Trump's Budget projected, or about 150%

The section to the right is the CBO Analysis of Trump's Budget.
The CBO Analysis projects $11.033 Trillion accumulated Deficits by 2028.
Indicating the Federal Debt would add about $16 Trillion in that period. Which trims off about $4 Trillion of their own exaggeration from only 7 weeks before - more than half of their bloated figures.


Does that help?

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Monday, August 6, 2018 8:30 PM

THG


T


Trump the moron starts trade wars with the rest of the world including our best allies. Millions of Americans well being are in jeopardy. Whats Trumps next move? If he's not on the campaign trail he's on vacation golfing.


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Tuesday, August 7, 2018 12:31 AM

WISHIMAY

There will be fire and brimstone and Earth will be destroyed!... in several billion years!----------------------------------------- "Well, so long Earth. Thanks for the air... and what-not." -Philip J. Fry


You know what's HILARIOUS?

Hubby worked for the coal mines until Obama, and now he works for a company that is going to be affected by the tariffs. In fact, they have already pared his department down to skeleton crew and he's doing the job of 3 people so this company, which made 7 BILLION dollars last year, could squeeze a few more nickels out.

Fucked by a black Prez, fucked by a white Prez...

Doesn't matter the color... we get fucked by the almighty dollah.

Dear Buddha...please, give all the politicians necrotizing fasciitis. They have it coming, really.


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Tuesday, August 7, 2018 6:37 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by Wishimay:
You know what's HILARIOUS?

Hubby worked for the coal mines until Obama, and now he works for a company that is going to be affected by the tariffs. In fact, they have already pared his department down to skeleton crew and he's doing the job of 3 people so this company, which made 7 BILLION dollars last year, could squeeze a few more nickels out.

Fucked by a black Prez, fucked by a white Prez...

Doesn't matter the color... we get fucked by the almighty dollah.

Dear Buddha...please, give all the politicians necrotizing fasciitis. They have it coming, really.




Hey....

Look who's finally starting to get it.

I'd only add "Fucked by a Republican Prez, Fucked by a Democrat Prez"

And as soon as we have our first female president, we can add that the people being fucked by our government isn't gender exclusive either.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Tuesday, August 7, 2018 11:49 AM

WISHIMAY

There will be fire and brimstone and Earth will be destroyed!... in several billion years!----------------------------------------- "Well, so long Earth. Thanks for the air... and what-not." -Philip J. Fry


I was apolitical before you could spell it, boy-o.

You are really looking forward to having a female prez so you can blame women even harder, aren't you?

Sorry, one woman could NEVER outdo the screw ups of the last 45.

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Wednesday, September 12, 2018 7:22 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


The city calls itself the “RV Capital of the World” — more than 80 percent of the vehicles sold in the United States are made in the area of Elkhart, Indiana, according to the RV Industry Association — and Mr. Trump’s tariffs on imported steel and aluminum are increasing costs, diminishing demand and causing concern that a 10-year boom cycle could be waning.

Shipments of motor homes were down 18.7 percent in June compared with a year ago, and shipments of smaller trailers and campers were down 10.5 percent, according to the RV Industry Association.

Some companies have cut back to four-day workweeks. Amid strong job gains nationally, hints of rising wages and solid overall economic growth, Elkhart’s health is decidedly ambiguous.

“I think it’s a yellow light,” said Richard Curtin, a University of Michigan economist who is a consultant to the R.V. industry. “Depending on how things evolve in six months, it could be a red light, getting to the end of the expansion.”

Dan Holtz, the county Republican chairman, says blaming the drop-off of sales on higher tariffs was “myopically political.” Mr. Trump is using the tariffs as a negotiating tactic.

Mike Yoder, a Republican and an Elkhart County commissioner, said that was far too charitable. “My perspective is our folks in Washington are not being honest. There is no plan. This is a very dangerous way to negotiate a trade deal. Folks like people in Elkhart are going to suffer.”

More at www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/as-elkhart-ind-goes-so-goes-the-nation
-and-elkhart-is-nervous/ar-BBNcgLH?ocid=spartanntp


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, November 2, 2018 8:53 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Trump is failing to keep his promises:

U.S. imports hit all-time high, trade deficit with China sets new record despite tariffs

The trade deficit with China set a new record despite U.S. tariffs meant to punish the country for what the U.S. considers unfair trade practices.

The U.S. trade deficit added up to almost $447 billion in the first nine months of 2018. That compared to about $404.5 billion in the same span in 2017.

The U.S. is on track to post its biggest deficit in a decade.

www.marketwatch.com/story/us-imports-hit-all-time-high-trade-deficit-w
ith-china-sets-new-record-despite-tariffs-2018-11-02


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, November 2, 2018 3:31 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by Wishimay:
I was apolitical before you could spell it, boy-o.

You are really looking forward to having a female prez so you can blame women even harder, aren't you?

Sorry, one woman could NEVER outdo the screw ups of the last 45.



Why not?

I have faith that a woman can be just as corrupt as any man who's done the job before her.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Tuesday, November 13, 2018 2:36 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


The U.S. is on track to post its biggest deficit in a decade.

Trump’s America First economic policies are designed to shrink the US trade deficit. But according to Janet Yellen, the former chair of the Federal Reserve, the deficit is on track to get bigger by the end of 2018.

Speaking at a conference in Beijing, Janet Yellen said that the steady rise in US interest rates is pushing up the value of the dollar, which will likely cause the US trade gap to widen further.
www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-11-13/yellen-says-fed-more-to-bla
me-for-wider-trade-deficit-than-china


Trump has so far focused on confronting what his administration deems unfair trade practices, erecting trade barriers against countries like China — ostensibly to offset the benefits of these tactics, or possibly to compel the countries to abandon the practices (the administration has never made its rationale all that clear). In her remarks in Beijing today, Yellen offered an implicit rebuke of this logic.

“I do not see unfair trade practices in China, or anywhere else in the world, as what is responsible for the US trade deficit,” said Yellen. “The US trade deficit reflects the fact that Americans spend more than we produce, and we import excess goods and services from the rest of the world to satisfy that demand.”

In other words, other factors influence America’s trade balance more than Chinese protectionism or China’s "unfair" trade practices. Ironically enough, the president’s fiscal stimulus is widening the deficit. The combination of tax cuts and increased spending has juiced demand. And since it takes time for domestic businesses to expand to meet said demand, imports have surged at a faster pace than exports. Beyond that, though, the trade balance reflects the fundamentals of an economy. To shrink the trade gap, Trump’s policies need to encourage a higher rate of savings. But his tax cuts and budgets policies are doing just the opposite. Instead of investing in America, Americans are buying things that don’t sustain long-term growth — consumer goods made in China, for instance.

More at https://qz.com/1461846/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Tuesday, November 13, 2018 6:36 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
The U.S. is on track to post its biggest deficit in a decade.

Trump’s America First economic policies are designed to shrink the US trade deficit. But according to Janet Yellen, the former chair of the Federal Reserve, the deficit is on track to get bigger by the end of 2018.

Speaking at a conference in Beijing, Janet Yellen said that the steady rise in US interest rates is pushing up the value of the dollar, which will likely cause the US trade gap to widen further.
www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-11-13/yellen-says-fed-more-to-bla
me-for-wider-trade-deficit-than-china


Trump has so far focused on confronting what his administration deems unfair trade practices, erecting trade barriers against countries like China — ostensibly to offset the benefits of these tactics, or possibly to compel the countries to abandon the practices (the administration has never made its rationale all that clear). In her remarks in Beijing today, Yellen offered an implicit rebuke of this logic.

“I do not see unfair trade practices in China, or anywhere else in the world, as what is responsible for the US trade deficit,” said Yellen. “The US trade deficit reflects the fact that Americans spend more than we produce, and we import excess goods and services from the rest of the world to satisfy that demand.”

In other words, other factors influence America’s trade balance more than Chinese protectionism or China’s "unfair" trade practices. Ironically enough, the president’s fiscal stimulus is widening the deficit. The combination of tax cuts and increased spending has juiced demand. And since it takes time for domestic businesses to expand to meet said demand, imports have surged at a faster pace than exports. Beyond that, though, the trade balance reflects the fundamentals of an economy. To shrink the trade gap, Trump’s policies need to encourage a higher rate of savings. But his tax cuts and budgets policies are doing just the opposite. Instead of investing in America, Americans are buying things that don’t sustain long-term growth — consumer goods made in China, for instance.

More at https://qz.com/1461846/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly



Can anybody dig up the post where Second says that there will be no recovery during the next crash because the FED hasn't raised interest rates and they can't be lowered anymore this time?

I'm not saying that either that idea or this one right here is wrong even. Just figured we should have both sides of the interest rate story here so we could have a good laugh about how it's all Trump's fault.

Cause, yanno... everything is Trump's fault.


Do Right, Be Right. :)

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