CINEMA

Joker

POSTED BY: SHINYGOODGUY
UPDATED: Thursday, November 14, 2019 06:19
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 718
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Sunday, October 20, 2019 1:42 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


NO SPOILERS

Joker is a brilliant masterpiece of film, a masterstroke in storytelling and screenwriting.
Todd Phillips and Scott Silver depicted a story of squalor and despair that was the Joker’s life.
They peel back the layers of how exactly to build a Joker and construct just how a psychopath
Gets born.

Gotham is not a very pleasant place, the streets are philthy, jobs are scarce and hope is something people just talk about. Arthur Fleck is just your average joe who lives with his mom, working to make ends meet, but he has an illness…..that is the premise of the Joker. A man who is just on this side of sanity and walks the tightrope of life, one slip, one step away from madness…...and we get to watch.

It is social commentary, a cautionary tale. Phillips/Silver slowly reveal just what it takes to push a madman close to the edge (and then over it). Their writing is superb, but they don’t tell you in so many words...they show you. It is the way a writer is supposed to write a type of mystery that we all
Know so well. Or, at least, that we think we know. They show us the way, but it’s creepy because it is very close to the real thing. We all know where the rabbit hole leads to because we are just on this side of the real-life version. If Joker were a painting, it would be a Picasso during his Cubist period. Distorted but familiar. Sad but you can’t look away; much like a car accident - we just have to see: did anyone get hurt. This is how Joker lives, on the ugly side of life. But it’s fascinating. It is so well written, not a wasted word or a wasted scene. And, above all, NO preachy dialogue.

It’s as though our writers held up a mirror and said “here ya go!” I really can’t put it in words. I cannot do it justice, because I’m making it sound melodramatic. It really is NOT that. Some may decide not to go see it. I could understand that, but if you’re an amateur movie buff, or just plain love the movies and what it could ideally be, you owe it to yourself to go see this deeply satisfying piece of art. Where would we be without Picasso, Rembrandt and Kubrick and Shakespeare.

Joaquin Phoenix is an acting genius, a savant in this film. He took Phillips words and breathed life into the Joker like no other before him. Both he and Phillips went down a completely different path than previous iterations of this character. Joaquin took the Picasso and set it in motion, each movement, each word brought new meaning to the character. We as the audience wanted to know more, and with each scene, with each movement and word we were rewarded. The writing and the performance by Joaquin waltzed together in perfect maddening harmony. The pacing in this two hour movie, it was as though they came into the theater and brought us to our seats, put our feet up and said: “No hurry, get comfortable, you’ll see, it will all pay off.” But it’s not so much the destination, as it is the journey. The music/soundtrack too, reminded me of Kubrick/Tarantino. Each piece, each entry, each selection carefully chosen and perfectly matched. Yes, I dare say that Heath Ledger would applaud Joaquin’s efforts. Both he and Phillips took Joker down a whole new path. Kubrick and Quentin would smile appreciatively.

It left me inspired and hopeful that the end 2019, at least film-wise, looks to be salvageable.


The Best Film of The Year. 5 Stars


sgg


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Sunday, October 20, 2019 5:05 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


I can't argue any of that.

I've become so jaded that I didn't believe that Hollywood was even capable of putting a film like this out anymore. Not only was it the best comic book movie that likely will ever exist, but if one was being honest with themselves they'd be hard pressed to find another movie of any genre that was better than Joker.

Maybe I'm just still "high" off of it, and it wasn't as good as it "felt"? This is a possibility. Watching it was grueling. My first words to my old man when it finally ended were "I'm exhausted". I felt like I had just come out of the gym after a great workout... and I think my entire body had been tensed up for so long that this wasn't all that far from the truth. Sitting through it was the definition of uncomfortable. Yet at the same time, it was the least violent Batman universe flick ever made. There might have been less gore in other Batman movies, but the death count was extremely low by comparison. But they were powerful... probably because of that fact.

Maybe Phoenix's performance deserves all of the credit? It is the single most amazing acting performance I've ever seen in my life, and there is no second place that is even remotely close. I said in another thread that I hope he's seeking out the psychiatric help to remove himself from the character of Arthur Fleck after what happened to Heath Ledger. I don't see how it would be possible to put on a performance like that and not have that be a part of you long afterward.


If it were a lesser film, I would say that my favorite thing about the movie was the laughing at the SJW critic idiots that hadn't even seen it freaking out about it and calling it right wing propaganda designed for incels... or laughing even harder at those who had seen it and said "the critics that give it a fresh rating will have blood on their hands".

But no... That wasn't my favorite thing at all. The movie was just so good that I didn't even give that a thought until well after a day later.



All of that being said, I am finding it quite hard to recommend it to anybody. I mean, I have and will continue to do so... but I warn them that it is not a feel good movie and they might not enjoy the experience. But if you're up for it, it's one hell of a ride.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, October 20, 2019 7:10 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

If Joker were a painting, it would be a Picasso during his Cubist period. Distorted but familiar. Sad but you can’t look away; much like a car accident - we just have to see: did anyone get hurt. This is how Joker lives, on the ugly side of life. But it’s fascinating. It is so well written, not a wasted word or a wasted scene. And, above all, NO preachy dialogue


IDK if you read this from a posted movie review, or these are your own words, but I think this perfectly describes Joker.

Bravo.

Completely agree.

( I may have to borrow this description, giving you full credit, of course )

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Monday, October 21, 2019 10:03 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


No Rappy, I did not take this from any review. I purposefully did not see a review, trailer or comment regarding this movie.

My words exclusively, period.

The only exposure I had were the hype coming from celebrities comments on TV, some radio and that's about it. I wanted to go into it, the film, totally fresh and without prejudice. So my thoughts, well the ones I could articulate,
are front and center. There is so much to this film that it would take a long
conversation to unwrap the genius and absolute brilliance. Joker was a near
perfect convergence of artistic elements - sound, writing, direction, acting
and visuals. The cinematography and the score are beautiful in so that they are part of the landscape of the film, only overshadowed by Phoenix's portrayal.

I am still digesting what I saw some 3 days after the fact. I will be going back, maybe next weekend - it was that good; did I say good, I meant great.
The best of the year, 2019, and taking a place among my all-time Top Ten.
And notice, I say film rather than movie. To me, a film is art. A movie is, well, less so. A movie entertains, a film envelops the soul, much like those
classic painters and filmmakers I mention. But thank you for the compliment,
true inspiration comes from films like this.


sgg


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

If Joker were a painting, it would be a Picasso during his Cubist period. Distorted but familiar. Sad but you can’t look away; much like a car accident - we just have to see: did anyone get hurt. This is how Joker lives, on the ugly side of life. But it’s fascinating. It is so well written, not a wasted word or a wasted scene. And, above all, NO preachy dialogue


IDK if you read this from a posted movie review, or these are your own words, but I think this perfectly describes Joker.

Bravo.

Completely agree.

( I may have to borrow this description, giving you full credit, of course )


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Monday, October 21, 2019 10:32 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


I'm glad you went to see it. There's so much to say about this film, but I think you touched upon a handful of key elements regarding this film. It is, above all else, an experience. I too had that "feeling" at the end, the one where you just can't quite leave without having someone to talk to and say...
"Wow! what did you think?" You had your dad, so I hope you were able to discuss it.

Here it is 3 days later and I'm still feeling that "high" - it is the emotion of what I identified with in the film. It was how Arthur felt. We, the audience, could identify with it because, at some point, we felt as he did.
But, there's a twist, because Arthur had brain damage and took things further
once he was "pushed" over the edge.

I agree that the commentary never got in the way and spoil the film; and there was social commentary. Much like a good sci-fi film that slips in a sort of
lesson about life on earth. The good ones slide that in, the great ones never let you see the man behind the curtain. That's why I say it was NOT preachy in any way. That's the task of a good writer, to tell a story that has meaning.

But I agree, this film is far too great to lessen it by talking about politics. To put it bluntly, this was a fucking great film. And yes, I put it in my Top Ten All Time. I will see it again, maybe next week, it's that great.


sgg


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
I can't argue any of that.

I've become so jaded that I didn't believe that Hollywood was even capable of putting a film like this out anymore. Not only was it the best comic book movie that likely will ever exist, but if one was being honest with themselves they'd be hard pressed to find another movie of any genre that was better than Joker.

Maybe I'm just still "high" off of it, and it wasn't as good as it "felt"? This is a possibility. Watching it was grueling. My first words to my old man when it finally ended were "I'm exhausted". I felt like I had just come out of the gym after a great workout... and I think my entire body had been tensed up for so long that this wasn't all that far from the truth. Sitting through it was the definition of uncomfortable. Yet at the same time, it was the least violent Batman universe flick ever made. There might have been less gore in other Batman movies, but the death count was extremely low by comparison. But they were powerful... probably because of that fact.

Maybe Phoenix's performance deserves all of the credit? It is the single most amazing acting performance I've ever seen in my life, and there is no second place that is even remotely close. I said in another thread that I hope he's seeking out the psychiatric help to remove himself from the character of Arthur Fleck after what happened to Heath Ledger. I don't see how it would be possible to put on a performance like that and not have that be a part of you long afterward.


If it were a lesser film, I would say that my favorite thing about the movie was the laughing at the SJW critic idiots that hadn't even seen it freaking out about it and calling it right wing propaganda designed for incels... or laughing even harder at those who had seen it and said "the critics that give it a fresh rating will have blood on their hands".

But no... That wasn't my favorite thing at all. The movie was just so good that I didn't even give that a thought until well after a day later.



All of that being said, I am finding it quite hard to recommend it to anybody. I mean, I have and will continue to do so... but I warn them that it is not a feel good movie and they might not enjoy the experience. But if you're up for it, it's one hell of a ride.

Do Right, Be Right. :)


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Monday, October 21, 2019 10:42 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


( I may have to borrow this description, giving you full credit, of course )


Hey Rappy,

Somehow I thought you would like this film. I have no problem with you borrowing my comments.


sgg

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Monday, October 21, 2019 10:53 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
I'm glad you went to see it. There's so much to say about this film, but I think you touched upon a handful of key elements regarding this film. It is, above all else, an experience. I too had that "feeling" at the end, the one where you just can't quite leave without having someone to talk to and say...
"Wow! what did you think?" You had your dad, so I hope you were able to discuss it.

Here it is 3 days later and I'm still feeling that "high" - it is the emotion of what I identified with in the film. It was how Arthur felt. We, the audience, could identify with it because, at some point, we felt as he did.
But, there's a twist, because Arthur had brain damage and took things further
once he was "pushed" over the edge.

I agree that the commentary never got in the way and spoil the film; and there was social commentary. Much like a good sci-fi film that slips in a sort of
lesson about life on earth. The good ones slide that in, the great ones never let you see the man behind the curtain. That's why I say it was NOT preachy in any way. That's the task of a good writer, to tell a story that has meaning.

But I agree, this film is far too great to lessen it by talking about politics. To put it bluntly, this was a fucking great film. And yes, I put it in my Top Ten All Time. I will see it again, maybe next week, it's that great.


sgg






I do like your choice to call it a "film", rather than a movie. Although I think it's even more than that.

I took a Film class in college, and the "films" they had us watch were your usual fare like Citizen Kane and 2001: A Space Odyssey. To me, those are "Films". Outdated bullshit that intellectuals pretend to love while they're smelling their own farts and talking down to people who "just don't get it".

Joker was an experience. It was an event.

I can't even say it was "emotional" for me. It wasn't exactly emotions that I was feeling. I didn't feel sadness for his character, or more accurately, I didn't feel any more than a normal person would. I didn't feel "cringe" for him during parts that would normally have made me feel the cringe, like when he was failing miserably at the stand up comedy.

I was too wrapped up in whatever guttural, instinctual "feelings" that were turning me inside out while experiencing this, this... masterpiece of a performance.



Yet, days later and I still don't know if it was a good movie or not.


It was an amazing experience. I'm so glad I saw it in a theater and did not just watch it on a small screen alone on Netflix months or years from now.


I think what made it even better was that I saw it in one of those old-timey small theaters with only two screens that still have the red curtains and the smell that old theaters have. Something about that really resonated with me during the scene where he put on the usher uniform and all of the rich people were watching some old black and white movie. (I really loved constant anachronisms in the movie... Rich people dressing up in their best to go see what I think was a Charlie Chaplin movie, along side of cars from the 60's outside of the theater and an answering machine in Arthur's apartment... very cool).

I wish the theaters weren't so expensive now that I'm back up here. If I was living down by my brother already I'm sure I would go and see it at that theater a few more times.

In the mean time, I don't think I'm going to be able to separate the feelings from the movie itself after only one viewing. It's going to take at least one if not quite a few more for me to actually wrap my head around it and get beyond Phoenix's performance.



Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Tuesday, October 22, 2019 12:00 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Spot on. Joker is a film. Not a ' movie '

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Tuesday, October 22, 2019 9:42 AM

THG


First, good to hear from you SGG. Thanks for the excellent review. I haven't seen it yet but it looks like a dazzler.

T



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Wednesday, October 23, 2019 1:16 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

Joker was an experience. It was an event.

It is also an example of Joker running amok. Amok is a Malay word for the homicidal sprees occasionally undertaken by lonely Indochinese men who have suffered a loss of love, a loss of money, or a loss of face. The syndrome has been described in a culture even more remote from the West: the stone-age foragers of Papua New Guinea.

The amok man is patently out of his mind, an automaton oblivious to his surroundings and unreachable by appeals or threats. But his rampage is preceded by lengthy brooding over failure, and is carefully planned as a means of deliverance from an unbearable situation. The amok state is chillingly cognitive. It is triggered not by a stimulus, not by a tumor, not by a random spurt of brain chemicals, but by an idea. The idea is so standard that the following summary of the amok mind-set, composed in 1968 by a psychiatrist who had interviewed seven hospitalized amoks in Papua New Guinea, is an apt description of the thoughts of mass murderers continents and decades away:

I am not an important or "big man." I possess only my personal sense of dignity. My life has been reduced to nothing by an intolerable insult. Therefore, I have nothing to lose except my life, which is nothing, so I trade my life for yours, as your life is favoured. The exchange is in my favour, so I shall not only kill you, but I shall kill many of you, and at the same time rehabilitate myself in the eyes of the group of which I am a member, even though I might be killed in the process.

The amok syndrome is an extreme instance of the puzzle of the human emotions. Exotic at first glance, upon scrutiny they turn out to be universal; quintessentially irrational, they are tightly interwoven with abstract thought and have a cold logic of their own.

More at https://bit.ly/32IqISS

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, October 23, 2019 6:23 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

Joker was an experience. It was an event.

It is also an example of Joker running amok. Amok is a Malay word for the homicidal sprees occasionally undertaken by lonely Indochinese men who have suffered a loss of love, a loss of money, or a loss of face. The syndrome has been described in a culture even more remote from the West: the stone-age foragers of Papua New Guinea.

The amok man is patently out of his mind, an automaton oblivious to his surroundings and unreachable by appeals or threats. But his rampage is preceded by lengthy brooding over failure, and is carefully planned as a means of deliverance from an unbearable situation. The amok state is chillingly cognitive. It is triggered not by a stimulus, not by a tumor, not by a random spurt of brain chemicals, but by an idea. The idea is so standard that the following summary of the amok mind-set, composed in 1968 by a psychiatrist who had interviewed seven hospitalized amoks in Papua New Guinea, is an apt description of the thoughts of mass murderers continents and decades away:

I am not an important or "big man." I possess only my personal sense of dignity. My life has been reduced to nothing by an intolerable insult. Therefore, I have nothing to lose except my life, which is nothing, so I trade my life for yours, as your life is favoured. The exchange is in my favour, so I shall not only kill you, but I shall kill many of you, and at the same time rehabilitate myself in the eyes of the group of which I am a member, even though I might be killed in the process.

The amok syndrome is an extreme instance of the puzzle of the human emotions. Exotic at first glance, upon scrutiny they turn out to be universal; quintessentially irrational, they are tightly interwoven with abstract thought and have a cold logic of their own.

More at https://bit.ly/32IqISS

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly




Which makes it all the more hilarious that the SJW weirdo brainwashed lefties went around insulting people and calling them incels before the movie was even released.

Yup. Good idea, knuckleheads. Poke the hornet nest.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, October 23, 2019 7:40 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

Which makes it all the more hilarious that the SJW weirdo brainwashed lefties went around insulting people and calling them incels before the movie was even released.

Yup. Good idea, knuckleheads. Poke the hornet nest.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

This description fits Joker running amok. Any part fit you?
Quote:

I am not an important or "big man." I possess only my personal sense of dignity. My life has been reduced to nothing by an intolerable insult. Therefore, I have nothing to lose except my life, which is nothing, so I trade my life for yours, as your life is favoured. The exchange is in my favour, so I shall not only kill you, but I shall kill many of you, and at the same time rehabilitate myself in the eyes of the group of which I am a member, even though I might be killed in the process.
"How the Mind Works" by Steven Pinker
https://books.google.com/books?id=5cXKQUh6bVQC&pg=PA364&lpg=PA
364#v=onepage&q&f=false


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, October 23, 2019 7:47 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


I was called an 'incel ' by someone on twitter because I questioned climate change.


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Wednesday, October 23, 2019 9:17 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

Which makes it all the more hilarious that the SJW weirdo brainwashed lefties went around insulting people and calling them incels before the movie was even released.

Yup. Good idea, knuckleheads. Poke the hornet nest.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

This description fits Joker running amok. Any part fit you?
Quote:

I am not an important or "big man." I possess only my personal sense of dignity. My life has been reduced to nothing by an intolerable insult. Therefore, I have nothing to lose except my life, which is nothing, so I trade my life for yours, as your life is favoured. The exchange is in my favour, so I shall not only kill you, but I shall kill many of you, and at the same time rehabilitate myself in the eyes of the group of which I am a member, even though I might be killed in the process.
"How the Mind Works" by Steven Pinker
https://books.google.com/books?id=5cXKQUh6bVQC&pg=PA364&lpg=PA
364#v=onepage&q&f=false


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly




Nope. But we all knew what you were doing there.

Nobody should be afraid of admitting that Joker was a great flick.

Go fuck yourself, ya mental midget.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Thursday, October 24, 2019 4:37 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


I'm going back to calling you Six in this section, Cinema, because we're talking on a level as men, who happen to love film (or real art).

Quote:

I do like your choice to call it a "film", rather than a movie. Although I think it's even more than that.


You are right Six. This is,as I have said above, a masterwork, a piece of art.
It is Beethoven's 9th, Kubrick's 2001, Stairway to Heaven.......

Quote:

Oh bliss! Bliss and heaven! Oh, it was gorgeousness and gorgeousity made flesh. It was like a bird of rarest-spun heaven or like silvery wine flowing in a spaceship, gravity all nonsense now.

(from A Clockwork Orange, another Kubrick film, 1971)


There's more below...


sgg


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Thursday, October 24, 2019 4:41 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Thank you THG....I don't want to over-hype it, just go see it then come back if you wish to discuss it. All are welcome!


sgg


Quote:

Originally posted by THG:
First, good to hear from you SGG. Thanks for the excellent review. I haven't seen it yet but it looks like a dazzler.

T




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Thursday, October 24, 2019 4:45 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Did you see the film?


sgg

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Thursday, October 24, 2019 4:50 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Yes, Rap. To experience a film such as this, well....it takes you places, it envelops and surrounds you. It never judges you, but enhances you as a person.
We are human and perfect creatures.

A masterpiece does that.

Fuck the critics!

Go in peace!


sgg

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Thursday, October 24, 2019 5:33 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Six, I continue here:

Quote:

...took a Film class in college, and the "films" they had us watch were your usual fare like Citizen Kane and 2001: A Space Odyssey. To me, those are "Films". Outdated bullshit that intellectuals pretend to love while they're smelling their own farts and talking down to people who "just don't get it".


Me too, film class. It got me to appreciate the difference between a movie and "film." True art does not 'look down' on anyone. Like you say below....

"Joker was an experience. It was an event."

Quote:

I can't even say it was "emotional" for me. It wasn't exactly emotions that I was feeling. I didn't feel sadness for his character, or more accurately, I didn't feel any more than a normal person would. I didn't feel "cringe" for him during parts that would normally have made me feel the cringe, like when he was failing miserably at the stand up comedy.


Me!? I felt his pain. I identified with the sadness that I felt he was going through. It was as though he wanted to cry, but instead he chose to laugh through the tears. It felt to me like he was frustrated, because all he wanted
was to be heard and understood. But I get what you're saying, this is what I mean about "true art" like this film. It reveals, it takes you along a path,
it opens the mind. It delivers the experience.

Quote:

I was too wrapped up in whatever guttural, instinctual "feelings" that were turning me inside out while experiencing this, this... masterpiece of a performance.


Yes. Joaquin, Todd Phillips brought us along the journey with their collaboration. Phoenix was phenomenal.


Quote:

Yet, days later and I still don't know if it was a good movie or not.

It was an amazing experience. I'm so glad I saw it in a theater and did not just watch it on a small screen alone on Netflix months or years from now.



Agreed.


Quote:

I think what made it even better was that I saw it in one of those old-timey small theaters with only two screens that still have the red curtains and the smell that old theaters have. Something about that really resonated with me during the scene where he put on the usher uniform and all of the rich people were watching some old black and white movie. (I really loved constant anachronisms in the movie... Rich people dressing up in their best to go see what I think was a Charlie Chaplin movie, along side of cars from the 60's outside of the theater and an answering machine in Arthur's apartment... very cool).


Yes, I'm jealous. You got to see it in an old-timey theater. I saw it in a brand new multi-plex. But I still enjoyed it. I did get a feeling of nostalgia
in that scene in the theater with all the rich folk. It reminded me of some of the films from the 70s. The Day of the Locust, Klute, Going Places, They Shoot Horses, Don't They, Days of Heaven....just to name a few. Days of Heaven, in particular, is a masterpiece. Now those were "films."


Quote:

In the mean time, I don't think I'm going to be able to separate the feelings from the movie itself after only one viewing. It's going to take at least one if not quite a few more for me to actually wrap my head around it and get beyond Phoenix's performance.


I need to see this film again. There's so much to absorb and experience. I remember seeing most people leaving the theater a little stunned. I wish I could have spoken to them to see what they were feeling. I don't know, I just think it would be interesting to see what their thoughts were. I kept saying,
as I was watching (after the first half hour)..."this is brilliantly written...this is a masterpiece...this is so fucking good."

I'm going back to see it again.


sgg

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Friday, October 25, 2019 6:59 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



Only seen it once, but the mind games the audience is subjected to is nothing short of brilliant.


Much like Fight Club, we're seeing the story unfold through the eyes of unreliable narrator . However, as the movie unfolds, we're let in on a little secret. Not everything we've seen actually happened. There's a weaving of events from his point of view and then what takes place in the real world. There's speculation as how much of the movie really happened, mostly or entirely , from inside Arkham Asylum ?

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Friday, October 25, 2019 7:56 AM

THG


Not having seen it who am I to say, still. The hype is reminding me of the shining. Certain things in scenes would be different to show when Nicholson's character was in and out of reality. Like the kids three wheeler changing color. Lights switches being on the wall in one scene and not in another.

???

T



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Friday, October 25, 2019 8:57 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

Which makes it all the more hilarious that the SJW weirdo brainwashed lefties went around insulting people and calling them incels before the movie was even released.

Yup. Good idea, knuckleheads. Poke the hornet nest.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

This description fits Joker running amok. Any part fit you?
Quote:

I am not an important or "big man." I possess only my personal sense of dignity. My life has been reduced to nothing by an intolerable insult. Therefore, I have nothing to lose except my life, which is nothing, so I trade my life for yours, as your life is favoured. The exchange is in my favour, so I shall not only kill you, but I shall kill many of you, and at the same time rehabilitate myself in the eyes of the group of which I am a member, even though I might be killed in the process.
"How the Mind Works" by Steven Pinker
https://books.google.com/books?id=5cXKQUh6bVQC&pg=PA364&lpg=PA
364#v=onepage&q&f=false


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly




Nope. But we all knew what you were doing there.

Nobody should be afraid of admitting that Joker was a great flick.

Go fuck yourself, ya mental midget.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

I downloaded Joker, the Movie, to see if 6ixStringJoker is telling the truth. Well, it must be his own personal truth about what is a great movie.

As a ten year old, my reference point for great cinema was Lawrence of Arabia. After seeing it I read Seven Pillars of Wisdom by T. E. Lawrence, borrowed from the library. That movie did not leave me in doubt about how much was real and how much was only Lawrence dreaming he goes to war, while Joker is ill, doubt filled and hallucinating his reality.

Seven Pillars of Wisdom by T.E. Lawrence
https://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/l/lawrence/te/seven/introduction1.html
"In these pages the history is not of the Arab movement, but of me in it. It is a narrative of daily life, mean happenings, little people. Here are no lessons for the world, no disclosures to shock peoples. It is filled with trivial things, partly that no one mistake for history the bones from which some day a man may make history, and partly for the pleasure it gave me to recall the fellowship of the revolt. We were fond together, because of the sweep of the open places, the taste of wide winds, the sunlight, and the hopes in which we worked. The moral freshness of the world-to-be intoxicated us. We were wrought up in ideas inexpressible and vaporous, but to be fought for. We lived many lives in those whirling campaigns, never sparing ourselves: yet when we achieved and the new world dawned, the old men came out again and took our victory to re-make in the likeness of the former world they knew. Youth could win, but had not learned to keep: and was pitiably weak against age. We stammered that we had worked for a new heaven and a new earth, and they thanked us kindly and made their peace."

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, October 25, 2019 11:33 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


No surprise you didn't like it.

You're an idiot.

Go troll back in the RWED.



Awards (Everything it's been up for it has won already):

Venice Film Festival 2019

Winner / Graffetta d'Oro for Best Film
Fanheart3 Award / Todd Phillips

Winner / Best Film
Golden Lion / Todd Phillips

Winner / Best Soundtrack
Soundtrack Stars Award / Hildur Guðnadóttir

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt7286456/awards






It's also already made $750 Million on an estimated $55 Million budget.

https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Joker-(2019)#tab=box-office

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt7286456/?ref_=nv_sr_2?ref_=nv_sr_2



It's pretty safe to say that it will make more money than any comic book movie ever made compared to how much it cost to make.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, October 25, 2019 12:18 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
I'm going back to calling you Six in this section, Cinema, because we're talking on a level as men, who happen to love film (or real art).

Quote:

I do like your choice to call it a "film", rather than a movie. Although I think it's even more than that.


Quote:

You are right Six. This is,as I have said above, a masterwork, a piece of art.
It is Beethoven's 9th, Kubrick's 2001, Stairway to Heaven.......




Thanks man. If it makes you feel any better, I'll always call you SGG.

I think one of the most impressive things to consider about this movie was it was directed by the guy that brought us The Hangover movies and Old School. (I actually remember really liking Old School, back in my 20's, but I didn't care at all for the Hangover movies).

Quote:

Six, I continue here:


Quote:

...took a Film class in college, and the "films" they had us watch were your usual fare like Citizen Kane and 2001: A Space Odyssey. To me, those are "Films". Outdated bullshit that intellectuals pretend to love while they're smelling their own farts and talking down to people who "just don't get it".


Quote:

Me too, film class. It got me to appreciate the difference between a movie and "film." True art does not 'look down' on anyone. Like you say below....

"Joker was an experience. It was an event."



I don't think that Citizen Kane or 2001: A Space Odyssey looked down on anybody, or were designed by people who looked down on the masses themselves. I think it's the educated "elite" that use their supposed love of these films as a way to look down on others that don't like them.

I've actually had discussions about both of these films on a few occasions over the years, starting with my film instructor at the time. Surprisingly, he agreed with me and asked me "how do you think I feel? Do you know how many times I've had to sit through them?"

My take is that both of them probably were pretty great for their time. There really wasn't that many movies out there back when Citizen Kane came out to compare it to. Although I am a bit perplexed why it is still heralded as the greatest movie ever made today, when Gone With the Wind and The Wizard of Oz pre-dated it by 2 years.

And for 2001, I get what Kubrick was trying to do. There is no sound in space. Things don't move quickly. It is almost like a ballet out there. But it's boring. I liked the interactions with HAL, but other than that, it was a snorefest. Although I didn't care for his torture porn A Clockwork Orange, I quite like most of the Kubrick movies I've ever seen. He was just an extremely experimental guy who had his own visions and made them come to life no matter what people were telling him to do. I can respect that.

Quote:

I can't even say it was "emotional" for me. It wasn't exactly emotions that I was feeling. I didn't feel sadness for his character, or more accurately, I didn't feel any more than a normal person would. I didn't feel "cringe" for him during parts that would normally have made me feel the cringe, like when he was failing miserably at the stand up comedy.


Quote:

Me!? I felt his pain. I identified with the sadness that I felt he was going through. It was as though he wanted to cry, but instead he chose to laugh through the tears. It felt to me like he was frustrated, because all he wanted
was to be heard and understood. But I get what you're saying, this is what I mean about "true art" like this film. It reveals, it takes you along a path,
it opens the mind. It delivers the experience.



You know. I might have felt his pain. It's hard to tell. There was just too much sensation overload from that performance. I can't even really go back and reflect on exactly what I felt a full week later. The "high" is gone, and along with it my ability to really reflect on much of it at all. It does need to be experienced again. I don't think that I could really analyze the film until I watch it in the comfort of my own home on a TV.

Quote:

I was too wrapped up in whatever guttural, instinctual "feelings" that were turning me inside out while experiencing this, this... masterpiece of a performance.


Quote:

Yes. Joaquin, Todd Phillips brought us along the journey with their collaboration. Phoenix was phenomenal.


Agreed. I don't honestly see how anybody could disagree with this.


Quote:

Yet, days later and I still don't know if it was a good movie or not.

It was an amazing experience. I'm so glad I saw it in a theater and did not just watch it on a small screen alone on Netflix months or years from now.



Quote:

Agreed.



Quote:

I think what made it even better was that I saw it in one of those old-timey small theaters with only two screens that still have the red curtains and the smell that old theaters have. Something about that really resonated with me during the scene where he put on the usher uniform and all of the rich people were watching some old black and white movie. (I really loved constant anachronisms in the movie... Rich people dressing up in their best to go see what I think was a Charlie Chaplin movie, along side of cars from the 60's outside of the theater and an answering machine in Arthur's apartment... very cool).


Quote:

Yes, I'm jealous. You got to see it in an old-timey theater. I saw it in a brand new multi-plex. But I still enjoyed it. I did get a feeling of nostalgia
in that scene in the theater with all the rich folk. It reminded me of some of the films from the 70s. The Day of the Locust, Klute, Going Places, They Shoot Horses, Don't They, Days of Heaven....just to name a few. Days of Heaven, in particular, is a masterpiece. Now those were "films."



Yeah. I'm REALLY trying to get my house fixed up so I can sell it to move down by my brother. $5 for brand new movies and the theaters aren't even packed unless it's on the weekend. Only $8 if you want popcorn and a drink. I almost feel like I'm stealing from them when I just get the ticket. Maybe I'll do the whole $8 thing when I get my teeth fixed. It's a beautiful little theater, and only one of two that I've ever seen like that in my life. Would love if it were in walking distance from my house.


Quote:

In the mean time, I don't think I'm going to be able to separate the feelings from the movie itself after only one viewing. It's going to take at least one if not quite a few more for me to actually wrap my head around it and get beyond Phoenix's performance.


Quote:

I need to see this film again. There's so much to absorb and experience. I remember seeing most people leaving the theater a little stunned. I wish I could have spoken to them to see what they were feeling. I don't know, I just think it would be interesting to see what their thoughts were. I kept saying,
as I was watching (after the first half hour)..."this is brilliantly written...this is a masterpiece...this is so fucking good."

I'm going back to see it again.


sgg



Yeah. Like I said, after 2 hours and 2 minutes of dead silence in the theater while we watched it, my first words to my old man were "I'm exhausted".

Then I made a beeline for the bathroom since I had to go for about the last half hour. The next words I spoke was when I met them outside and said "I don't know what you guys thought, but that was amazing."

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, October 25, 2019 12:29 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
No surprise you didn't like it.

You're an idiot.

Go troll back in the RWED.

No surprise you liked Joker, 6ixStringJoker.

With Joker, the sequel has been made many times, already.
www.metacritic.com/movie/joker/critic-reviews

VulturE
David Edelstein
The downside to the performance is the downside to the movie: It's one note played louder and louder

The New Yorker
Anthony Lane
Such is the strenuous effort of Phoenix’s performance that it becomes exhausting to behold

The New Yorker
Richard Brody
The result is a movie of a cynicism so vast and pervasive as to render the viewing experience even emptier than its slapdash aesthetic does.

Slate
Dana Stevens
Joker is a bad movie, yes: It's predictable, cliched, deeply derivative of other, better movies, and overwritten to the point of self-parody. (If a feature-length sendup of Joker was made, it's hard to imagine in what details it would differ from Joker itself.) The experience of sitting through it is highly unpleasant, but that unpleasantness has less to do with graphic violence — there are only one or two scenes that go hard, gore-wise — than with claustrophobia and boredom. Read full review

TIME
Stephanie Zacharek
Phoenix is acting so hard you can feel the desperation throbbing in his veins. He leaves you wanting to start him a GoFundMe. so he won't have to pour so much sweat into his job again. But the aggressive terribleness of his performance isn't completely his fault. Read full review

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, October 25, 2019 1:00 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Any one who claims Joker is a “ bad “ movie is lying. Or didn’t see it. Or absolutely thought captain Mary Sue was the bestest movie evah!

And loves woke Batwahman too.


Slate?

Too damn funny.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

I'm just a red pill guy in a room full of blue pill addicts.

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Friday, October 25, 2019 6:30 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
No surprise you didn't like it.

You're an idiot.

Go troll back in the RWED.

No surprise you liked Joker, 6ixStringJoker.

With Joker, the sequel has been made many times, already.
www.metacritic.com/movie/joker/critic-reviews

VulturE
David Edelstein
The downside to the performance is the downside to the movie: It's one note played louder and louder

The New Yorker
Anthony Lane
Such is the strenuous effort of Phoenix’s performance that it becomes exhausting to behold

The New Yorker
Richard Brody
The result is a movie of a cynicism so vast and pervasive as to render the viewing experience even emptier than its slapdash aesthetic does.

Slate
Dana Stevens
Joker is a bad movie, yes: It's predictable, cliched, deeply derivative of other, better movies, and overwritten to the point of self-parody. (If a feature-length sendup of Joker was made, it's hard to imagine in what details it would differ from Joker itself.) The experience of sitting through it is highly unpleasant, but that unpleasantness has less to do with graphic violence — there are only one or two scenes that go hard, gore-wise — than with claustrophobia and boredom. Read full review

TIME
Stephanie Zacharek
Phoenix is acting so hard you can feel the desperation throbbing in his veins. He leaves you wanting to start him a GoFundMe. so he won't have to pour so much sweat into his job again. But the aggressive terribleness of his performance isn't completely his fault. Read full review

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly




Whatever you say, bitch.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, October 25, 2019 6:31 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Any one who claims Joker is a “ bad “ movie is lying. Or didn’t see it. Or absolutely thought captain Mary Sue was the bestest movie evah!

And loves woke Batwahman too.


Slate?

Too damn funny.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

I'm just a red pill guy in a room full of blue pill addicts.

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall




He didn't see it. He's a pathological liar.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, October 25, 2019 6:33 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]




Parody of the idiot right here.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Saturday, October 26, 2019 4:30 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Rappy, you're starting to scare me (kidding, of course).

But you're spot on. What is real and what is in the mind of the Joker is exactly the point. We don't know where Arthur ends and the Joker begins, or did Arthur ever end? He tells us, then shows us what exactly? It is brilliant.
We get a glimpse into the unstable mind of a psychopath, a mentally unbalanced
person. Did he ever leave the insane asylum? Did he imagine it all? Did he really kill his mother? Did he have a mother?

Was he ever a clown? Did he get a gun from a co-worker? Everything has to be questioned because of the absolutely brilliant way the script was written.
And within the film many more questions and statements without being preachy.
Arthur getting a gun for instance. Bottom line; he shouldn't.


sgg


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

Only seen it once, but the mind games the audience is subjected to is nothing short of brilliant.


Much like Fight Club, we're seeing the story unfold through the eyes of unreliable narrator . However, as the movie unfolds, we're let in on a little secret. Not everything we've seen actually happened. There's a weaving of events from his point of view and then what takes place in the real world. There's speculation as how much of the movie really happened, mostly or entirely , from inside Arkham Asylum ?


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Saturday, October 26, 2019 4:36 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Second, you say you've seen the Joker film. Forget your feud with Six (Jack).
We're here to discuss. What did YOU think of the film?

Otherwise, you're just being obtuse.


sgg

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Saturday, October 26, 2019 4:56 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Yes, I can see that...the comparisons as to perception. But Joker has elements that are similar to other films, which critics have taken Phillips to task.

I don't agree with the critics as far as comparing it to Taxi Driver and so forth. Granted it's regarding "loners" - but that, to me, is too simplistic.
Some have said that it was Scorceses' influence, that may be so, but is that so bad? The film may be flavored with the essence of other 'loner' flicks, but Joker has it's own style and substance that those others don't. And still others say that the film was all Joaquin's performance and not much else.

Yeah, the critics picked this film apart. I'm not sure exactly why, but audiences have been going in droves to the tune of 93% score on Rotten Tomatoes; as compared to a 69% critical score. Does monetary gains for this film outdo the critical acclaim? No matter the accolades, Joker has reached
an audience that critics have had no effect on. That's why I say go see and judge for yourself. I highly recommend it.


sgg


Quote:

Originally posted by THG:
Not having seen it who am I to say, still. The hype is reminding me of the shining. Certain things in scenes would be different to show when Nicholson's character was in and out of reality. Like the kids three wheeler changing color. Lights switches being on the wall in one scene and not in another.

???

T




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Saturday, October 26, 2019 5:20 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Hey Second, I'm guessing by your post that YOU didn't like the film.
And I emphasize the word "guess" because nary a word from you of what YOU thought of the film.

The critics, for their "reasons" hated the film. But audiences love it to the tune of 93% RT score. So what does that mean? Are the critics right? Or is the audience?

No matter. Art is not always appreciated in it's time.


sgg

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Saturday, October 26, 2019 9:17 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
Hey Second, I'm guessing by your post that YOU didn't like the film.
And I emphasize the word "guess" because nary a word from you of what YOU thought of the film.

The critics, for their "reasons" hated the film. But audiences love it to the tune of 93% RT score. So what does that mean? Are the critics right? Or is the audience?

No matter. Art is not always appreciated in it's time.


sgg

You might not believe it, but when I go into a movie, everything I know about the characters influences how I view the movie. I can suspend disbelief, but I can not erase what I know about imaginary characters.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suspension_of_disbelief

There was a movie I saw this year, Alita Battle Angel, that the critics were not impressed with, but I liked it while watching. I knew nothing about the character called Alita, other than the trailer. Everything about Alita was new and thrilling. But reading what the critics said about the movie, all the shortcomings they noticed were obviously there. I didn't see those flaws until they were pointed out to me. Those flaws should have been fixed when it was only a script.
www.metacritic.com/movie/alita-battle-angel/critic-reviews

The critics were not impressed by Joker, just like they were not by Alita. The difference for me was that I knew a great deal about the character of Joker versus nothing about the character called Alita. Joker is a mass murdering monster, so I am already primed to dislike his origin story. The flaws in the Joker movie which the more self-aware critics pointed to are actual flaws that should have been fixed while the movie was still a script.

In Alita, I didn't see the flaws but I had NO prejudice against the Alita character. On the other hand, I already hated the Joker character so it was easy to see the flaws in his movie. For me the movie was nothing but flaws. As one critic said about Joker: "The downside to the performance is the downside to the movie: It’s one note played louder and louder."
www.metacritic.com/movie/joker/critic-reviews

By the way, I was not kidding when I compared Joker to someone running amok. If you have actually seen somebody go berserk in real life, it will cast a shadow on the Joker and his mental problems. Similarly, you will never again look at the gunfights in movies the same after you have actually been in a real shootout and have to deal with the dead and injured afterwards.
"How the Mind Works" -- the chapter on Hotheads: https://bit.ly/32IqISS

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, October 26, 2019 9:24 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
Rappy, you're starting to scare me (kidding, of course).

But you're spot on. What is real and what is in the mind of the Joker is exactly the point. We don't know where Arthur ends and the Joker begins, or did Arthur ever end? He tells us, then shows us what exactly? It is brilliant.
We get a glimpse into the unstable mind of a psychopath, a mentally unbalanced
person. Did he ever leave the insane asylum? Did he imagine it all? Did he really kill his mother? Did he have a mother?

Was he ever a clown? Did he get a gun from a co-worker? Everything has to be questioned because of the absolutely brilliant way the script was written.
And within the film many more questions and statements without being preachy.
Arthur getting a gun for instance. Bottom line; he shouldn't.


sgg



My biggest takeaway was something that my brother and dad didn't notice, and in fact, they argued me on until I convinced them otherwise.

There is no reason to believe it's not at least a 50/50 chance that Joker and Batman are brothers in this universe.

(Oh, sorry. Spoiler alert, Second)


I've intentionally not seen any reviews of the movie, even after the fact, so this might be something that people are talking about now.

I didn't even think about it until you triggered that memory that you can't just believe that any of that was real. Was the entire movie both in 1st and 3rd person, or just the scenes with his "girlfriend" that we "know" weren't real?

Did he actually date the girl at some point, and what we saw late in the movie that made everyone think those times were a figment of his imagination the part that wasn't real? That could be... He had certainly been off his meds for quite a while at that point.


When I brought up the idea that Arthur and Bruce were brothers to my Dad, he said they couldn't be because of the medical records and his mom was a loon.


I said, "says who? Some medical records from Arkham Asylum which has a long dubious history, about some random, not-important woman who used to work for the man who has more money than God? What if he was screwing around on his wife with the help, she turned out to be somewhat unpredictable and professed her love to him and that she wanted the baby and a family? Knowing that he had everything to lose... his reputation, his status, his marriage, his family, and knowing that he wasn't in love with her, he opened up his vault of money and just pulled some strings with the director of AA and had the problem "taken care of".

"So what that you saw the scene of her talking to the shrink in the Asylum? Yeah... it was a powerful scene, seeing her battered and bruised across that table, spouting (what appeared to be) nonsense. But... That was the visions of a crazy person slipping further into insanity reading a document that you can't give more than 50% of your belief in its credibility."

Any points that somebody could make to contradict this idea based off of how the movie played out could and would be met with just as plausible points to refute them.

I think there's a very good chance the boys are brothers. It's at least 50/50.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Saturday, October 26, 2019 9:41 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
Yes, I can see that...the comparisons as to perception. But Joker has elements that are similar to other films, which critics have taken Phillips to task.

I don't agree with the critics as far as comparing it to Taxi Driver and so forth. Granted it's regarding "loners" - but that, to me, is too simplistic.
Some have said that it was Scorceses' influence, that may be so, but is that so bad? The film may be flavored with the essence of other 'loner' flicks, but Joker has it's own style and substance that those others don't. And still others say that the film was all Joaquin's performance and not much else.

Yeah, the critics picked this film apart. I'm not sure exactly why, but audiences have been going in droves to the tune of 93% score on Rotten Tomatoes; as compared to a 69% critical score. Does monetary gains for this film outdo the critical acclaim? No matter the accolades, Joker has reached
an audience that critics have had no effect on. That's why I say go see and judge for yourself. I highly recommend it.


sgg


Quote:

Originally posted by THG:
Not having seen it who am I to say, still. The hype is reminding me of the shining. Certain things in scenes would be different to show when Nicholson's character was in and out of reality. Like the kids three wheeler changing color. Lights switches being on the wall in one scene and not in another.

???

T






Initially, the critics score on Rotten Tomatoes was in the 20's and 30's. Sanity at least stepped in at some point to give it the current 69% that it has, but if you look at only "Top Critics" that even goes down to a 45%. That's the part that's a bit surprising to me. Usually the SJW woke elitist critics are among those not considered the "Top Critics" and when you remove them the number for a flick that gets positive audience scores actually increases when removing the chaff. (I'd love for somebody to investigate why it's different this time around).

When it was shown in Venice, it was met with a standing ovation. They LOVED it. It won the award that I've learned is the bellweather for the Oscars. Not that I give a shit about the Oscars and their popularity contest here in the states, but if Joker and Phoenix and Phillips don't win for Joker, it will be politically motivated.


What you're experiencing right now is a schism from the narrative. I know you don't want to hear that or even believe that it is true, but that's what it is. I'm not saying that Joker is going to make you not a 2019 Democrat. It was a powerful film, but they still haven't come up with a film that powerful. What I'm saying is that this time you happen to be on the other side of things and see the shit the media pulls from a perspective that a lot of us encounter on a near daily basis.

Second, who I have no doubt has still not watched the flick, did not budge. At this point, he's backed himself into a corner. Even if he does see the movie he will not admit to anybody that it was good. He's going to go into it with such a closed mind that he won't even admit it to himself.

Look at what he has to say about the movie right now. Whether he saw it or not, all he's doing is parroting talking points from critics.

That video I posted by the Cinema Snob parodies perfectly Second and any critic that wrote the stuff he's repeating. Cinema Snob himself is very borderline SJW, so that surprised me. I think he's hilarious, but I have to generally stay away from any movies he reviews with political messages, and I rarely ever watch the stuff he does with his friends when he's out of character.



Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Saturday, October 26, 2019 9:51 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!




Ryan Reynolds

@VancityReynolds


R-Rated box office congratulatory posts aren’t like the ones you’re used to...



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Saturday, October 26, 2019 10:18 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

Second, who I have no doubt has still not watched the flick, did not budge. At this point, he's backed himself into a corner. Even if he does see the movie he will not admit to anybody that it was good. He's going to go into it with such a closed mind that he won't even admit it to himself.

Look at what he has to say about the movie right now. Whether he saw it or not, all he's doing is parroting talking points from critics.

6ix, do you ever stop calling people you don't like liars? That is an obnoxious habit that Republicans have. The pirated copy I watched is Joker.2019.720p.CAM.H264.AC3.ADS.CUT.BLURRED.Will1869.mp4

Maybe I would like Joker, the movie, better if the copy was better? No, I would not. Maybe I should watch it again? No. Maybe Batman should kill the Joker? Yes. The Joker's lawyer is very successful using the insanity plea. And Joker is very successful at escaping Arkham Asylum. When will Batman stop this cycle of Joker escaping, followed by Joker committing mass murder, followed by Batman capturing Joker, followed by another vacation in Arkham for Joker until the next escape?

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, October 26, 2019 10:19 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Did Joker already become the highest grossing R-Rated flick, or was that just a pre-emptive Fuck You?

I'd heard only yesterday that it was very likely to happen.



EDIT: Oh.... lol

https://ew.com/movies/2019/10/25/joker-highest-grossing-r-rated-film-e
ver
/

I can't imagine what it must be like for Second to be wrong about everything all of the time.


Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Saturday, October 26, 2019 10:24 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

Second, who I have no doubt has still not watched the flick, did not budge. At this point, he's backed himself into a corner. Even if he does see the movie he will not admit to anybody that it was good. He's going to go into it with such a closed mind that he won't even admit it to himself.

Look at what he has to say about the movie right now. Whether he saw it or not, all he's doing is parroting talking points from critics.

6ix, do you ever stop calling people you don't like liars? That is an obnoxious habit that Republicans have. The pirated copy I watched is Joker.2019.720p.CAM.H264.AC3.ADS.CUT.BLURRED.Will1869.mp4

Maybe I would like Joker, the movie, better if the copy was better? No, I would not. Maybe I should watch it again? No. Maybe Batman should kill the Joker? Yes. The Joker's lawyer is very successful using the insanity plea. And Joker is very successful at escaping Arkham Asylum. When will Batman stop this cycle of Joker escaping, followed by Joker committing mass murder, followed by Batman capturing Joker, followed by another vacation in Arkham for Joker until the next escape?

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly




No. You didn't see it.

I don't believe I've called anybody but you a liar, liar.

All you do every day is lie about how awesome you are and blow yourself. Nobody believes you're a successful business tycoon when all you seem to have time to do in your day is bitch about Trump to an audience of less than a dozen in the RWED.


Glad you finally got a copy of Joker that you didn't pay for with the millions of tax dollars that Trump saved you.

Now why don't you go watch it and prove me wrong that you're not a completely static character and come back and admit it was a good movie.




If not, then fuck right off out of this thread. I'll give you your spankings in the RWED.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Saturday, October 26, 2019 10:34 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
. . . not even worth quoting . . .

I read this comic:

The Comic That Explains Where Joker, the Movie, Went Wrong

Alan Moore’s classic 1988 story, Batman: The Killing Joke, was an inspiration for Todd Phillips’s grim new film — but not in the one way that really mattered.

I’m not the biggest fan of The Killing Joke’s place in Batman lore. Its plotting is too glib and undercooked to warrant its severity, putting Barbara through an unspeakable ordeal to make a fairly ordinary point. Still, I admire it mostly as a distillation of the relationship between the Joker and Batman. The Joker spends the entire comic insisting that they’re two of a kind, both men driven to aberrant behavior after a terrible tragedy; Moore emphasizes that the triumph of Batman’s character is that he resisted abandoning hope and embracing anarchy, as the Joker did.

Phillips’s film keeps much of Moore’s characterization, tracking the life of Arthur Fleck (Phoenix) as he struggles with mental illness, is attacked and harassed in the street multiple times, and becomes a figure of public ridicule when one of his strange stand-up sets is mocked by a legendary talk-show host (Robert De Niro). But the thing that Joker, the movie, lacks is Batman. The film does include a young Bruce Wayne (Dante Pereira-Olson), but flips the order in which the characters’ alter egos are created, having Joker’s transformation into a public menace spur a riot that ends with Bruce’s parents getting murdered.

Without Batman to play off, the reason for Joker’s existence as a protagonist in Phillips’s film is vague at best. The narrative tracks his evolution into an evil creature, providing a revamped and simplistic origin story for a figure who has only ever existed as a distorted mirror image of the Caped Crusader. Even when compared with Moore and Bolland’s comic, Joker is a bitter and humorless work, an attempt to add gravitas to a character who typically hasn’t stood for anything broadly metaphorical. In the movie, Joker commits an act of murder on live television and somehow becomes an icon of rebellion and class upheaval as a result. It’s an arc that tries to justify his leap from supporting player to star — and fails spectacularly.

More at www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2019/10/killing-joke-and-jok
er/599512
/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, October 26, 2019 10:40 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
I read this comic:



No you didn't.

A critic who's opinion nobody else but you cares for read the comic, then wrote a bunch of opinions nobody else but you cares about.

Then you posted it here, where nobody else but you will read it.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Saturday, October 26, 2019 3:48 PM

THG


'Joker' Takes R-Rated Box Office Record…and Possibly Another No. 1 Weekend

T



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Saturday, October 26, 2019 4:55 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:


Ryan Reynolds

@VancityReynolds


R-Rated box office congratulatory posts aren’t like the ones you’re used to...





Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, October 27, 2019 4:13 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Interesting...

Joker, like Deadpool, was not released in China.


Kind of unfair, when you're trying to compare it to other Comic Book blockbusters. I wasn't aware until just now that Deadpool had the same fate.


Only 4 weeks in, not including Friday or Saturday's numbers for this past weekend, the top international release country for Joker is the UK at $49.9 Million.

Compare that to Captain Marvel, which was in UK theaters for nearly 4 months and only reached $51.8 Million in that time.

In the same 4 months, Captain Marvel earned $153.8 Million in China.


In Mexico, Joker has already earned $3.1 million dollars in 1/4 of the time that it took Captain Marvel to make $33.3 million in it's entire near 4 month run. In Russia, it's already made more than $5 million above what Captain Marvel did.


https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Joker-(2019)#tab=international

https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Captain-Marvel-(2019)#tab=internatio
nal




If Joker were released in China, and the same ratio were to be applied that we're seeing in the UK right now, it wouldn't be surprising if China added $175 to $225 Million to Joker's total even if it only spent half the time in the theaters that Captain Marvel did.



Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, October 27, 2019 4:22 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Also interesting to note...

https://www.the-numbers.com/movies/custom-comparisons/Joker-(2019)/Cap
tain-Marvel-(2019)#tab=day_by_day_comparison


If you don't count the first two weekends of Captain Marvel's domestic take, you'll find that the rest of the days so far are fairly even at the box office between the two movies, with quite a few days already showing Joker taking more than Captain Marvel did in the same window.

The 2nd Monday, for instance, Joker pulled in more than $3 Million more domestically than Captain Marvel did on its second Monday.


To be fair though, this could likely be attributed to the millennials still recovering from St. Patrick's day on the 17th of March.



But the vast majority of the Captain Marvel win over Joker in the Domestic Box office will be the $57 million more it made opening weekend. Even on the second weekend, Captain Marvel only made $11 Million more than Joker did. The third weekend we're talking less than $5 Million.

CM is only roughly $74.5 Million ahead of Joker for the first 22 days. $72 to $73 Million of that was on the weekends with the weekdays themselves being about dead even.


Could repeat viewings and a significant upturn this weekend back at number one possibly keep Joker going long and strong enough to actually make more money domestically over time before it's dropped from theaters?



Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, October 27, 2019 5:50 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Reynolds posted this!?

Brilliant, I love it!


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:


Ryan Reynolds

@VancityReynolds


R-Rated box office congratulatory posts aren’t like the ones you’re used to...





Do Right, Be Right. :)


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Sunday, October 27, 2019 6:13 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Quote:

In the movie, Joker commits an act of murder on live television and somehow becomes an icon of rebellion and class upheaval as a result. It’s an arc that tries to justify his leap from supporting player to star — and fails spectacularly.


Is that what you got from the film, really? Nothing else comes to mind? Second, this was NOT a superhero film. This is leaps and bounds above that genre, although it did take from it.

Sorry, but I couldn't help but submit my two cents. I'll retreat to my corner and comment no further.


sgg

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Sunday, October 27, 2019 7:42 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Here's a video of a You Tube critic that I respect, he breaks down the Joker in a straight-forward manner that I admire,his name is Chris Stuckmann:



I'm posting this not so much to convince you of anything, but rather to show you a different point of view.


sgg


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
Hey Second, I'm guessing by your post that YOU didn't like the film.
And I emphasize the word "guess" because nary a word from you of what YOU thought of the film.

The critics, for their "reasons" hated the film. But audiences love it to the tune of 93% RT score. So what does that mean? Are the critics right? Or is the audience?

No matter. Art is not always appreciated in it's time.


sgg

You might not believe it, but when I go into a movie, everything I know about the characters influences how I view the movie. I can suspend disbelief, but I can not erase what I know about imaginary characters.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suspension_of_disbelief

There was a movie I saw this year, Alita Battle Angel, that the critics were not impressed with, but I liked it while watching. I knew nothing about the character called Alita, other than the trailer. Everything about Alita was new and thrilling. But reading what the critics said about the movie, all the shortcomings they noticed were obviously there. I didn't see those flaws until they were pointed out to me. Those flaws should have been fixed when it was only a script.
www.metacritic.com/movie/alita-battle-angel/critic-reviews

The critics were not impressed by Joker, just like they were not by Alita. The difference for me was that I knew a great deal about the character of Joker versus nothing about the character called Alita. Joker is a mass murdering monster, so I am already primed to dislike his origin story. The flaws in the Joker movie which the more self-aware critics pointed to are actual flaws that should have been fixed while the movie was still a script.

In Alita, I didn't see the flaws but I had NO prejudice against the Alita character. On the other hand, I already hated the Joker character so it was easy to see the flaws in his movie. For me the movie was nothing but flaws. As one critic said about Joker: "The downside to the performance is the downside to the movie: It’s one note played louder and louder."
www.metacritic.com/movie/joker/critic-reviews

By the way, I was not kidding when I compared Joker to someone running amok. If you have actually seen somebody go berserk in real life, it will cast a shadow on the Joker and his mental problems. Similarly, you will never again look at the gunfights in movies the same after you have actually been in a real shootout and have to deal with the dead and injured afterwards.
"How the Mind Works" -- the chapter on Hotheads: https://bit.ly/32IqISS

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


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Sunday, October 27, 2019 8:05 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


I love how Ryan Reynolds put ' Hugh Jackman ' instead of Logan.

What a bromance going on there.

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