So!! Who's finished Deathly Hallows?? by PhoenixRose

Quote:
Originally posted by PhoenixRose:
Quote:
Originally posted by mal4prez:
she wanted to be on the winning side

No, she wanted her son. She was a mom; it wasn't about winning or losing.

Absolutely! But the way she wants to help her son is by getting on the winning side (I think I recall that being said pretty explicitely... I could be wrong.) Which is fine - but lying about Harry didn't seem the obvious choice to me. Not from her point of view. How could she be sure one small lie would lead to Voldemort's defeat? How did she know the good guys would forgive her and her family for all they'd done?

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 4:27 AM

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Actually, what's said is that she wants to get to the castle as soon as possible, and that's all that matters. Saying that Harry was dead meant marching immediately to the castle. That's what I got, anyway...

Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so.
A troll's hair is still pointy, even when it's wearing a hat.

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 4:41 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by PhoenixRose:
Actually, what's said is that she wants to get to the castle as soon as possible, and that's all that matters. Saying that Harry was dead meant marching immediately to the castle. That's what I got, anyway...

Hmmm... must read again...

But I still think there were better ways to handle it, better arguments. Seemed contrived, and was too important a moment for that.

Yes, I'm nit-picky.

But like I said, these little things didn't stop me from really enjoying the book. Overall, thumbs up from me. I just pity the folks who are going to try to make a movie out of it. So much was happening, and there's so many characters! It needs to be like 6 hours long LOL!

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 5:30 AM

SAB39

Quote:
Originally posted by mal4prez:
Quote:
Originally posted by PhoenixRose:
Actually, what's said is that she wants to get to the castle as soon as possible, and that's all that matters. Saying that Harry was dead meant marching immediately to the castle. That's what I got, anyway...
Hmmm... must read again...

The book said something like the only way she could go to the castle would be marching there victorious with Voldemort. It wasn't about actually being on the winning side, it was about letting Voldemort believe himself to be victorious now so he'd have his triumphal march to the castle. It didn't matter to her that once he got there he was doomed.

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:06 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by sab39:
The book said something like the only way she could go to the castle would be marching there victorious with Voldemort. It wasn't about actually being on the winning side, it was about letting Voldemort believe himself to be victorious now so he'd have his triumphal march to the castle. It didn't matter to her that once he got there he was doomed.

Which helps her get into the castle... how? Which protects her son... how? Wouldn't taking one more minute to kill Harry - who she hates and sees as The Enemy of herself and her son - be a lot more obvious a path for her to take?

And keep in mind - this isn't her thoughts we're being shown, so the hysterical/illogical protective mother thing doesn't work. This is Harry working out her reasoning, and he doesn't read minds. All he's seen from her is hate hate hate hate Hermione torture and hate.

(Edit: oops, did she torture Hermione, or was that Bellatrix? I'm so confused... but the point being, Harry's seen all bad of Mrs. Malfoy up to then, right?)

I'm just saying - the motivations of the character who backed up his false death should be in character and fit Harry's prior observations. To me, it was neither of those.

Obviously, I'm in the minority LOL! That's cool, I'm used to it.

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:15 AM

RIVERISMYGODDESS

It was Bellatrix who tortured Hermione.

I think the Malfoys had a change of heart partway through this book, when they might have realized that being a part of Voldemort's regime wasn't the healthiest life choice (the random killings when Harry et. al. robbed Gringott's). Lucius had already lost favor with the Dark Lord several times, and was wandless, so it might have even been a vengeful type move on her part, for him tossing their loyalty aside so casually in pursuit of nothing but his own goals. *shrug* Just some speculation, though. It seems like Draco had a similar change of heart partway through, when Harry saved his ass twice (of course, the fact that a Death Eater was threatening him leads to the belief that they had already fallen/showed signs of turning).

~jimi
We must all fear evil men, but there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men.

Do you want to see more of Magda? Of course you do. We all do. If you are interested in helping our Dear One to get a laptop with wireless connectivity, please contact PhoenixRose.

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:26 AM

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Yeah, Bellatrix was the nasty one with the hate, hate, torture, and hate. We don't actually see much of Narcissa, and what we see of her (aside from being a silent snob at the Quiditch cup) is her trying to protect and stay close to her son. She wanted to get in and find him ASAP. Harry had just survived a killing curse; why would she think another would finish him off?
Had it been Bellatrix, I'm sure she would have acted differently.

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:31 AM

Yeah and when it opens and the deatheaters are at the Malfoys Voldemort says Lucius doesn't want him there...I think they are watching him try to turn their son into a monster and realizing just how awful VOldemort is and that he can and will kill them and their son at any time just to amuse himself...think they started thinking maybe it's not such a good thing to be with Voldemort.

"I'm not all that interested in the mental health of people who want to kill me. "- Leroy Jethro Gibbs

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 6:43 AM

SAB39

Don't forget at the start of Half Blood Prince she was already ready to go against Voldemort's direct order to keep a secret, in order to try to get Snape to help protect Draco as he tried to kill Dumbledore.

Admittedly Harry didn't see that, but it's well-established in the series that Narcissa's primary concern is for Draco's well-being, and her support of Voldemort is very much secondary to that, a sort of family loyalty without any real passion behind it.

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 7:10 AM

EMBERS

I got my book at 1 am Friday night/Saturday am
(the lines were long at B&N!)
I finished reading at 11 am on Sunday....
I was completely unspoiled (thank heaven)
and I'm STILL feeling kinda depressed.

IMO the body count was too high for a children's book:
killing Harry's pet was cruel (and taking Hedwig's life while she couldn't fight back, but was stuck in a cage was really mean).

I actually loved the book, I really enjoyed having Dumbledore's dark history unfold in such an interesting way...

I cried a lot over Dobby's death... but that didn't compare to how I wept over Fred.
I really felt that killing off Fred was short sighted, because The Adventures of Fred & George was a book we were all dying to read, but no one wants to read about the boy with no future.

besides, it would have made sense for Percy to die defending his siblings, it would have been a bit cliched, but we would have all been happy about it!

But it is a brilliant book, the fitting end to a great series. I'm glad JKR was able to finish her masterpiece in her own way.

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 7:56 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by sab39:
Admittedly Harry didn't see that, but it's well-established in the series that Narcissa's primary concern is for Draco's well-being, and her support of Voldemort is very much secondary to that, a sort of family loyalty without any real passion behind it.

OK, so, I don't question that Narcissa had motivation, I just question how it was presented (Harry's POV and questionable logic). Really, it was just one small example of how the hand of the writer is more present in HP books than I like. I didn't see the character Harry reasoning this out; I saw the author explaining/justifying an important plot twist. It ruined the moment for me.

Again, that's just me, and I regret focusing on it so much. I bow to the overall entertaining-ness of the book, and I'll stop nit-picking now!

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 7:59 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Actually, I think the Malfoys kinda got the thought somewhere in there, that maybe it wasn't such a good idea to help Voldy take over everything just so they could be his bitches.

In fact, that thought right there stickin in my head, it surprises me that certain folk, including much of Slytherin, supported him - cause that would be my house in such a world, and no way in hell I woulda supported him.

Would you ?

Mrs. Malfoy was lookin for a spot in Voldy's back for a knife ever since Voldy sent her son on a blatant suicide mission as retaliation for the Malfoys lack of faith in him - so between the chance to save her son AND stick it to Voldy, you bet she was gonna do exactly what she did.

Didn't surprise me a bit.

-F

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 8:16 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
In fact, that thought right there stickin in my head, it surprises me that certain folk, including much of Slytherin, supported him - cause that would be my house in such a world, and no way in hell I woulda supported him.

Yeah, I was surprised when the Slytherin table completely emptied before the battle. I thought she'd set it up that the Slytherins weren't ALL evil, and maybe a few would stay to fight. Oh well!

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 8:29 AM

RIVERISMYGODDESS

Quote:
Originally posted by mal4prez:
OK, so, I don't question that Narcissa had motivation, I just question how it was presented (Harry's POV and questionable logic). Really, it was just one small example of how the hand of the writer is more present in HP books than I like. I didn't see the character Harry reasoning this out; I saw the author explaining/justifying an important plot twist. It ruined the moment for me.

No, my point this last time was that Harry was aware of all of this, having seen it both firsthand and in his visions.

Good point on the Slytherins, both of you, I would have thought that at least some would have stayed, though someone (Aberforth, I think) brought up a good point that they had just set free a load of potential hostages, Death Eater children).

By the way, Mary, I'll have some more beer ready in time for D*C. You want me to put a couple of bottles aside for you ? *hugs* (caffeinated candy beer and honey weisen)

~jimi
We must all fear evil men, but there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men.

Do you want to see more of Magda? Of course you do. We all do. If you are interested in helping our Dear One to get a laptop with wireless connectivity, please contact PhoenixRose.

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 8:46 AM

EMBERS

Quote:
Originally posted by mal4prez:
I didn't see the character Harry reasoning this out; I saw the author explaining/justifying an important plot twist. It ruined the moment for me.

I didn't see that Harry needed to reason anything out...
he had no reason to lie to her,
no advantage he could hope for...
he was still just surprised not to be dead.

At least that was the way I saw it.

Harry simply told the truth, and it was Narcissa's decision to lie.

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 8:49 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by RiverIsMyGoddess:
No, my point this last time was that Harry was aware of all of this, having seen it both firsthand and in his visions.

OK, I missed your point - sorry! And surely I wasn't aware of the full situation with Narcissa... I still would'a like it better if, say, she'd just helped him and the explanation came afterwards or something. Whatever!

EDIT: Embers - uh... I never said Harry was lying. I'm criticizing the writer's choice of what she put in that paragraph stating Narcissa's motivations... OK, OK let's all just agree to disagree, all right? So not a big deal. (But I'm not changing my mind LOL!

)

Quote:
By the way, Mary, I'll have some more beer ready in time for D*C. You want me to put a couple of bottles aside for you ? *hugs* (caffeinated candy beer and honey weisen)

Oh yeah baby!! Did I ever give you feedback on the others? Gorramn fine! The caffeinated stuff rocks! (I like dark beer.) You want some mead?

Um... and on with the HP discussion!

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 9:03 AM

RIVERISMYGODDESS

I would love some mead, any that you want to send me. The last stuff you sent was divine.

~jimi
We must all fear evil men, but there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men.

Do you want to see more of Magda? Of course you do. We all do. If you are interested in helping our Dear One to get a laptop with wireless connectivity, please contact PhoenixRose.

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 9:06 AM

OK so , on average, how many times do you each plan to re-read the series?? I'm going for probably 5 or 6 more times per book

"I'm not all that interested in the mental health of people who want to kill me. "- Leroy Jethro Gibbs

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 9:31 AM

http://www.myspace.com/lady_magdalena
http:/www.crazypurplewombat.blogspot.com

Quote:
Originally posted by RiverIsMyGoddess:
I would love some mead, any that you want to send me. The last stuff you sent was divine.

Gettin' right on it...

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Tuesday, July 24, 2007 11:21 AM

DONCOAT

I finished DH about 2:00 PM Sunday. I was wondering where the thread was for it. Well, now I know that.

Some of my favorite moments:

Hagrid is dead!!??!! ...Oh, wait, no he's not. Jo, you evil little...

Firefly/Serenity memes, especially in the escape-from-Privet-Drive scene and its aftermath. "Have you found the nav sat?" "Uh, Sir... we found seven." And then, Hagrid: "...Where's Hedwig?"

The Conversion of Kreacher. Wonderful to see the crazy old elf come around.

Luna's bedroom, with her pictures of Harry and Co. knitted together with a ribbon saying friends... friends... friends. Made me think of the Browncoats.

Ron leaving, then returning, and Hermione's most unexpected reception for him.

Harry's wand! I almost lost hope at that point. How could he win without that? ...although the book's cover art suddenly made more sense.

Neville, the brave hero and leader of the DA at Hogwarts. And Ginny, who will not be kept out of the battle, no matter what.

The return of Percy.

Fiendfyre. That should be a challenge for the filmmakers!

The house elves joining the fray armed with cleavers against wands.

The desanctification of Dumbledore.

The redemption of Snape.

Kickass Mama Weasley. Kickass Peeves. Kickass Trelawney.

The strange lack of consequences for the Malfoy clan. Were they all spared because of Narcissa's help for Harry at a critical moment?

Still wondering about a few things. Rowling could easily fill a book just tying up loose ends. What about Umbridge? The surviving Death Eaters? Who took over at Hogwarts? What do the trio, and Ginny, and Luna do in later life? (At least we know Neville is teaching.)

Overall, a very satisfying read. I'll probably start a slower-paced reread shortly.

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I'm pointin' right at it!

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Wednesday, July 25, 2007 4:13 AM

SAB39

Oh my... rereading... Fred at the wedding saying something like "When I get married everyone can wear what they want and I'll put a full Body-Bind curse on mum until it's over..."

"When I get married"... *sniff*

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Wednesday, July 25, 2007 4:28 AM

MAGDALENA

"No power in the 'verse can stop me!"

I know it was strange that the Malfoys became somewho impotent in the end. I had such high hopes of Draco turning out to do something to redeem himself - along the lines of Harry's lesson in 'The Chamber of Secrets', it's the choices we make... he could have turned 'good', kind of balanced Tom Riddle turning evil, but even after the trio saved his life in the room of requirement he wasn't shaken up enough to take a long hard look at himself!

I was glad we got the full story about Snape's love for Lily... it made more sense to me that he loved her for almost all his life, and that he never loved anyone else... When I reread his death the moment when he asks Harry to just look into his eyes, and he dies feeling like he's connected with Lily again... wow...

I got a lot of Christian connitations in this one. There were some really valuable life lessons, but there was also a very powerful sense of 'Christ going to the cross' when Harry was walking into the forest without saying goodbye, knowing that Voldemort had to kill him and he wouldn't defend himself. Later I understood that a little more when it became clear that the same self-sacrifice Harry had made had protected all the others from Voldemort, and the message of Christ's death on the cross is that everyone has an opportunity of new life becuase of that sacrifice. I don't mention this to push my own faith or anything - but I have heard that Joanne is a Christian herself, and rarely talks about it becuase she didn't want people to speculate about the possible ending of the books... I can see why now.

It seems so obvious that he did exactly what Lily did with much higher stakes, but despite the first hand experience of that occassion, Tom Riddle (yes, I liked Harry diminishing him to his given names) did not learn anything about love and deep, old magic...

Oh so much more to ponder - much, muich more to discuss... but I must go to bed...

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Wednesday, July 25, 2007 5:10 AM

Oh I just loved all the unexpected turns, but I really liked that Dumbbledore became human for the first time...well for us and Harry anyway.

It does finally explain why Snape can never stand to look Harry in the eye and when he does, he backs down every time.

I love the idea of Neville being a teacher at Hogwarts( I am assuming Herbology)

Yeah she could have done lengthy explainations of everyone's outcomes, but I think it's enough to know the main ones...

I am re-reading it now to find all the little details I missed:)

"I'm not all that interested in the mental health of people who want to kill me. "- Leroy Jethro Gibbs

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Sunday, July 29, 2007 5:30 AM

SPACEANJL

Sheesh, you guys read slowly. Took me just over four hours to whip through that li'l sucker.

Sorry, but the epilogue made me barf. I'm going to pretend it never happened, and finish with Harry sacking out with a sandwich.

But Snape? Woot!

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Sunday, July 29, 2007 6:08 AM

PENGUIN

MsG...I guess you get to do the "Snape is good" victory dance!!

I SOOO wanted him to be bad!

King of the Mythical Land that is Iowa

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Sunday, July 29, 2007 6:12 AM

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Reading it again this weekend, and I'm just wondering what took Harry so long realizing where the diadem was. Seems strange to me that it wouldn't have seemed familiar the instant he saw the statue. I mean, he'd touched the gorramn thing! It taking so long to sink in seemed odd.
Also, a lot of things didn't seem to tally with last books. The whole thing of his Cloak being one of a kind, but all others looking just like it? "Silvery Invisibility Cloak" was always the description; it was never indicated that his was special. Even saying there were different types could have explained it, but they all seemed the same until this book. I've wondered about other things throughout the series like that; things never talked about, even in passing, and then there they are, and are talked about for the rest of the books. Hogsmeade, never mentioned until the third book, and then a deal. Thestrals, never mentioned (except as 'invisible horses') until the fifth book, even though Harry should have been able to see them from the start (having seen death as a baby, as confirmed by Voldemorts memories of the night) stuff like that. I still adore these books, but it seems kind of lazy.
Oh, and I don't think she could fill a whole book with what ended up happening to everyone. Maybe, if she really strained it, but that would be lame. I think even a few extra pages in the epilogue could have given a lot of info on some things that weren't tied up as neatly as maybe they could have been. Maybe there will be a few missing pieces filled in by the Encyclopedia she has some tentative plans to release, though!

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Sunday, July 29, 2007 8:21 AM

BOBBIWIB

I was pretty sure Harry was going to die.. so I was surprised there!!! ^_^

*Browncoat Bobhen*

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Sunday, July 29, 2007 12:41 PM

RICKKER

WellI took my time. went to a concert that Fri so didn't do the midnight opening. Had to be at work at 6am Sat. Got the book after work but it was my birthday and I HAD to goto my sisters for a BBQ. Sun took my nephew to see Order of the Phoenix. So didnt really get started till Sun night. Finished at midnight thirty Tues/Wed, then took it to my nephew after I was done at the comic shop. The deal we have is I buy for him but I read first. Loved it. Did seem bogged down at points but still awsome. They were still kids and were trying to sort things out so they were a bit lost in the woods for a while. I new Nevel was gonna be a hero almost from the begining, his killing the snake with the griffindors sword, a true member of the house of griffindor. New Snape was good and it was because of Lilly. As for Harry seeing the invisible flying horses that was explained. He was to youg to comprehend what had happened, it wasn't untill the V man killed Cedric in front of him did Harry know death.

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Sunday, July 29, 2007 7:03 PM

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

No. Sorry. It wasn't explained. It was never even discussed within the books. And it didn't say "Those who can see thestrals are those who have seen and understood death" or "those who have known death" but simply "those who have seen death". Those who have watched someone die. The eyes that can see a thestral are eyes that have seen life snuffed out. Harry was standing and holding the bars of his crib and saw his mother die, with his very own innocent eyes, when he was a year old, and should have always seen the thestrals. Not being able to understand what he was seeing doesn't change what he saw; that's just fanon explination, unless you can point to something Rowling wrote that says otherwise.
It just feels like she wasn't always sure what was going to be introduced from book to book, and didn't put in any foundation for it. Or she just wanted something new and unexpected and mysterious every book, and didn't think about there being no foundation for it or having contradictions. And it seems a little lazy.
Saying that, I have read most of these books upwards of seven times and I love the series; I'm just at the nitpicking stage right now.

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Monday, July 30, 2007 9:44 AM

BOBBIWIB

The way JK Rowling could get out of that would probably be to say that Harry wasn't really Harry then, and launch into some vague semi-scientific diatribe about the events of your life shaping who you are :P or, her old classic: as a child Harry wasn't capable of making decisions and so wasn't Harry because, of course, 'it is our choices that make us what we are'
I doubt she'd bother though - that's just what I'd do to appease the people who'd caught me out!!! xD

*Browncoat Bobhen*

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 1:33 AM

DONCOAT

Actually, PR, Rowling herself gave the explanation about "knowing death" in an interview. (Unfortunately I don't have a reference, but I've read it on the HP Lexicon and/or Leaky Cauldron site.) So it's not fanon, but it's also true that it's a post-justification. I think Rowling just missed that point and had to come up with a semi-reasonable rationalization.

To be honest, I'm a little bemused (good word, that) by your complaint about her introducing new elements in each book. Did you really expect to have the entire complex story foreshadowed in every detail in Book One?

I have the opposite impression: that Rowling did a great job of planting subtle clues and hints about coming attractions in the early books. There are numerous examples, but I'll give two from Philosopher's (aka Sorceror's) Stone: Ollivander hinting about the importance of Harry's wand being Voldemort's wand's brother, and Ron's rat Scabbers (who turned out to be a good deal more than he seemed).

And how about a big one from Chamber of Secrets: the whole book revolved around the enchanted diary, but even so we never learned the critical importance of that object until Book Six.

I don't have any problem at all with the various inconsistencies and contradictions. In fact, I'm amazed at how few of those there are in such a long and complex story. I recently heard an interview with the guy who performs the audio books of the HP series. He mentioned that he had to do something like 140 different voices for the characters in Order of the Phoenix alone!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I'm pointin' right at it!

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 5:06 AM

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

No, of course I don't expect everything to be foreshadowed in book one (though, as you pointed out, much of it was. Gridelwald was mentioned in Stone and not again til Hallows, etc) but having everything stay consistent is different. Just, as an example, in Goblet the village of Hogsmeade is mentioned as out-of-bounds for those below third year in the start-of-school anouncements, but it was never alluded to in the first two books. Now, that wouldn't have given away any plot details or anything, it's just inconsistent. It still would have been a new thing for book three if it had been mentioned before, but never seen. We find out that the Hogwarts Express actually pulls in to Hogsmeade station in Phoenix, so the village could have been mentioned as where the train station is, if nothing else. My complaint isn't that she introduced something new each book, but that she avoided even mentioning said things in previous books so that they would be totally new, even when they should have gotten a few words. Not everything. A house-elf was totally new and probably would have been mentioned. That one's cool. See what I'm saying? My complaint is that, though it might not be the case, she just kind of made up this new thing for the story when it should have been mentioned before, and it seems slightly lazy. Rowling is an excellent writer when it comes to keeping you reading, but if you actually analyze her writing and her stories, there are little problems like that, and a lot of derivative things. It doesn't really decrease my enjoyment of them much, but when you read them as many times as I have, things start to pop out as being a little off.

And, I just finished up my re-read last night, and the thing about the Malfoys just wanting to weasel their way into the castle as soon as possible was something Harry knew from a conversation between Lucious and Voldemort that he was in Voldemort's head for, so that explans the conclusion he came to about Narcissa a bit.

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 5:11 AM

Thanks Penguin:) I know you did...but I was so pleased...( mind you this is all Alan Rickman's fault as I wouldn't have been so attached to Snape had he not been the actor playing him)

"I'm not all that interested in the mental health of people who want to kill me. "- Leroy Jethro Gibbs

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 5:22 AM

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Quote:
Originally posted by msg:
I wouldn't have been so attached to Snape had he not been the actor playing him)

I knew it!!! Snape groupies are all just Rickman groupies!

I am immune because I can't stand the movies.

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 5:48 AM

DESKTOPHIPPIE

It wasn't until I read Snape's death scene a second time that I realised he asked Harry to look at him so he could see Lily's eyes one last time before he died. That made me very sniffly.

Loved the book.

I think it was the best written of any of the books so far. It certainly moved at a furious pace.

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 6:42 AM

Yeah it's Alan elegant evil that makes Snape more attractive...I still would have concluded he was a good person because of all the hints and clues, but I would have been less passionate about it.

It also explains why , when disciplining Harry, Snape always backs down when he looks in Harry's eyes.

"I'm not all that interested in the mental health of people who want to kill me. "- Leroy Jethro Gibbs

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 7:01 AM

FREMDFIRMA

I gotta go with Alan Rickman adulation too - he's Goooood, not only does he bring Snape's nastiness right up front - he also throws in some obvious frustration at Harry's tendancy to be just plain DENSE! (c'mon, even the most adoring fan has wanted to slap him a time or two, even Minerva has at him for it!)

The occlumency scenes really highlights Snape's frustration with Harry's lackluster efforts in his own defense, Rickman totally delivers the goods in that one.

His best line tho, is the sardonically delivered one on the doorstep of Umbridges office.

"Unless you wish to poison mister potter, and if you did you'd have my ut-most sympathy, I'm afraid i cannot help you..

I LOL'ed.

-F

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 7:03 AM

DESKTOPHIPPIE

Oh, I almost forgot! JK Rowling wrote a complete ending for each of the main characters, where they ended up 19 years later and so on, but didn't get to include it in the book. This covers the stuff she left out.

Select to view spoiler:

SPOILER ALERT: Those who do not wish to know what happens to the
characters after the book ends should stop reading here.

Rowling said the world was a sunnier, happier place after the seventh
book and the death of Voldemort.

Harry Potter, who always voiced a desire to become an Auror, or
someone who fights dark wizards, was named head of the Auror
Department under the new wizarding government headed by his friend
and ally, Kingsley Shacklebolt.

His wife, Ginny Weasley, stuck with her athletic career, playing for
the Holyhead Harpies, the all-female Quidditch team. Eventually,
Ginny left the team to raise their three children -- James, Albus and
Lily -- while writing as the senior Quidditch correspondent for the
wizarding newspaper, the Daily Prophet.

Harry's best friend Ron Weasley joined his brother, George, as a
partner at their successful joke shop, Weasley's Wizard Wheezes.
Hermione Granger, Ron's wife and the third person of the series' dark
wizard fighting trio, furthered the rights of subjugated creatures,
such as house elves, in the Department for the Regulation and Control
of Magical Creatures before joining the magical law enforcement
squad. The couple had two children -- Rose and Hugo.

Luna Lovegood, Harry's airily distracted friend with a love for
imaginary animals who joins the fight against Voldemort in the Order
of the Pheonix, becomes a famous wizarding naturalist who eventually
marries the grandson of Newt Scamander, author of "Fantastic Beasts
and Where to Find Them."

And what Muggle, or non-wizard, song would have been played at the
funeral of Albus Dumbledore, the most brilliant and talented wizard
the world had ever known?

"Surely 'I Did It My Way' by Frank Sinatra," Rowling told her fans,
referring to the song "My Way," written by Paul Anka but popularized
by Sinatra, among other singers.

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 7:22 AM

LOL DTH love the " spoiler"

"I'm not all that interested in the mental health of people who want to kill me. "- Leroy Jethro Gibbs

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 7:52 AM

SPACEANJL

*snicker*

Now, I have a completely different version of the future, myself.

It involves the flying motorbike, an unexpected animagus,some nastiness with six inch roofing nails, and a really pissed off snake demon in Europe.

Just a thought - some of these folk have another year of school to go, or to make up. (Hermione miss out on examinations? I don't think so.)

Would you like to be the Auror Recruitment Officer that tells Harry Potter that he doesn't have the paper qualifications for the job?

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 8:28 AM

MALACHITE

I've got a quick question. I might have been reading too quickly, but I didn't get who "Victoire" was in the epilogue. She seemed to be a female who was perhaps going to marry Ted. Harry then states that such a marriage would make Ted truly part of the family. Does this make her Harry's daughter? Her name seems appropriate, given Harry's "victory" over Voldemort.

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 9:18 AM

DAPHNE

With the french name, I'm thinking Victoire is Bill and Fleur's daughter.

I am also a Snape fan although I thought after book 6 that it would turn out he had made an unbreakable vow with Dumbledore. I knew he had a thing for Lily. The "look at me" and "always" were heart-breaking. Snape really had no choice but to see Harry as his father, to recognize Lily in Harry would have been too hard for him knowing he was somewhat responsible for her death.

I originally thought the epilogue idea was kind of cheesy but liked that Harry honored Snape and recognized his bravery in the end. Also nice to see that Percy was still Percy and that Neville had found his place at Hogwarts (and in my version of the future as head of Gryfindor, while McGonagall was Headmaster).

I really thought Narcissa's final motivation to lie was seeing that Harry had once again survived Voldemort's killing curse. She was already angry for what Voldemort was doing to her child and now Harry appears unkillable.

Dobby was really the hardest loss (I knew Snape would have to die so it wasn't as shocking), Tonks and Lupin were done for as soon as they made Harry godfather.

I liked that JKR let Dumbledore have some weaknesses instead of making him a saint. I also don't think Dumbledore could have told Harry the full story before he chose to sacrifice himself. I think Harry had to truly think he was going to die. If he knew that he wouldn't then the old magic would not have been invoked.

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 3:33 PM

DONCOAT

JKR has confirmed that Victoire is Bill and Fleur's oldest child.

That scene can be a bit misleading, if you imagine that Teddy is there to get on the Hogwarts train. He's too old, being nineteen at that point. But JKR was clever -- James says "he came to see her off", so he's not on the way back to school. Victoire must be at least a couple years younger than Teddy.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I'm pointin' right at it!

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 5:13 PM

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Quote:
Originally posted by SpaceAnJL:
Just a thought - some of these folk have another year of school to go, or to make up. (Hermione miss out on examinations? I don't think so.)

Would you like to be the Auror Recruitment Officer that tells Harry Potter that he doesn't have the paper qualifications for the job?

I think that defeating the most evil and powerful Dark wizard to ever walk the Earth would qualify one for graduating with honors, don't you?

I <3 the future history of all the characters there! That's just what I would have chosen for most of them. Wasn't sure where Ginny would have gone, but that's a great wrapup for her.

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 6:43 PM

DAVESHAYNE

Quote:
Originally posted by SpaceAnJL:
Would you like to be the Auror Recruitment Officer that tells Harry Potter that he doesn't have the paper qualifications for the job?

Only important if Harry wants the job. He did say he'd had all the excitement from life he wanted already so the only reason for him to apply would be if he needed the money. Which from the very first book it is shown that he doesn't.

David

"Looks like we got here just in the nick of time."

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Tuesday, July 31, 2007 11:22 PM

BROWNCOAT2007

The only thing I wanna say was that the Harry as a Hurcrux dealie got me excited that my prediction that both Harry and Voldemort would die... which I wouldda frakin' loved!!! It's not that I hate Harry or anything, but be realistic folks, a 17 year old kid would probably NOT be able to kill a (centuries? ) old, POWERFUL dark wizard... also it would have broken from tradition and that in and of itself would have given Rowling a HUGE boost in my eyes as an author... the whole "19 years later" thing got way to cutesie for me after all the deaths in the book... what was with that? and the Remus and Tonks getting married, haveing a kid, and then getting axed without them ever really being in the story

Lupin/ Tonks are my two most favorite characters in the entire series next to Mad Eye... Mad Eye died the way I felt he should have though, and for that I am greatful... and, yes, the Dobby death really got my tears going, but for some reason, the Fread death didn't do much for me... I guess because it was just so sudden and all "Fread's dead... moving on" ... and this has become much longer than "the only thing I wanna say..."

But, yeah, best Potter EVER next to "Goblet of Fire"

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Wednesday, August 1, 2007 12:17 AM

SPACEANJL

Quote:
Originally posted by PhoenixRose:
Quote:
Originally posted by SpaceAnJL:
Just a thought - some of these folk have another year of school to go, or to make up. (Hermione miss out on examinations? I don't think so.)

Would you like to be the Auror Recruitment Officer that tells Harry Potter that he doesn't have the paper qualifications for the job?

I think that defeating the most evil and powerful Dark wizard to ever walk the Earth would qualify one for graduating with honors, don't you?

Work with me here. All you need is one little jobsworth having a Percy moment, and he could have himself a very bad day.

I was rather sad that the only way forward for the female characters seems to be 'wife and mother'. (Then, I feel that way about life most of the time...)

Interesting thought on another character here - Lavender Brown got bitten by Fenrir, didn't she? That's going to put a cramp in her social life. I just had a flashback to Willow - 'three days of the month, I'm a bitch to be around, too.'

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Wednesday, August 1, 2007 4:37 AM

DAVESHAYNE

Quote:
Originally posted by BrownCoat2007:
(centuries? ) old

71 years assuming my math is correct. Riddle was 16 when he first opened the chamber of secrets and made the book horcrux. That happened 50 years before the events of Chamber of Secrets. Add 5 years to get to Deathly Hallows.

David

"Looks like we got here just in the nick of time."

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Wednesday, August 1, 2007 5:28 AM