Mixed Martial Arts by m52nickerson

I personally find it fascinating to watch, but kind of against my better Buddhist judgement. No one is forced to do it though...
As a martial artist there is a high degree of technical interest for me, but I wouldn't want my Son to do it.
BUT, I don't seek it out, rather if it's on and I pass it, I'll look in.

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Friday, December 28, 2012 8:49 AM

BYTEMITE

I like martial arts! But I think instead of knockouts it should be sparring rules, first hit or first blood decides the match.

If you knock someone out, that can be serious business, that's how all these football types are getting all these concussions. I am uncertain how comfortable I am with aspects of sports that encourage actually injuring an opponent, it seems to go against rules of sportsmanship I personally ascribe to.

But in training or in a real fight I can understand how important it is to go all out, same with competitions. The martial arts shouldn't be intended as window dressing either, they do have to be functional enough to turn aside an aggressor. Very tricky.

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Friday, December 28, 2012 9:21 AM

DALEK!

Right now most of the knockouts are really technical knockouts. One fighter gets hit hard enough to be dazed and unable to defend himself and the referee steps in.

That being said I understand your view BYTE. The point is still to try and hurt your opponent.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

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Friday, December 28, 2012 9:24 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

"Hookie religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid." -Han Solo.

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

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Friday, December 28, 2012 9:36 AM

I've never been a fan of martial arts for fun outside of art (movies and exhibitions). Beating on people until they pass out FOR REAL is a very weird way to put a smile on your face. The kung fu I learned was about causing maximum pain quickly so you could get away from a violent situation, it was about disarming your assailant and in extreme cases it was about breaking bones and causing nerve damage. This getting into a fight and staying there until one or the other of you can't get up is unethical and the human form of cruelty to animals. Count me as again'it!

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Friday, December 28, 2012 10:06 AM

DALEK!

How do you know that what you have been taught really works? MMA competitions have shown that pure disciplines such a Kung Fu don't work very well in real fights.

I do understand your objections, but the human form of cruelty to animals? Last time I checked a human to give consent, an animal could not.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

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Friday, December 28, 2012 10:20 AM

Do you need to be mauled by a cat to know it can mess you up? My school was eclectic, drawing from many traditions. "Sport martial arts" don't "work" anyway, 'cause if they did, the contetants would all have broken bones and lacerated tendons and such. One of the easiest and most effective moves you can learn is the knee break, but nobody does that move in competition because it could end someone's career. Sport martial arts are designed to look damaging but not to be damaging in any perminent way. The motto of my school was "One hit, one destruction." Open sparring was something we didn't get into until our first degree.

Consent is overrated. People "consent" to all manner of heinous crap. Women "consent" to being abused by their husbands but it's still abuse and I still don't think it's good for people. Sorry.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Friday, December 28, 2012 10:22 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

The only MMA that works is wrestling, mixed with strikes to the most vulnerable parts.

And strength, always strength.

Just ask yourself this...

If "martial arts" were so great... like, some magical thing...

How did the Marines beat the Japanese in WW2? A LOT of it was hand to hand combat.

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

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Friday, December 28, 2012 10:30 AM

DALEK!

Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:
Do you need to be mauled by a cat to know it can mess you up? My school was eclectic, drawing from many traditions. "Sport martial arts" don't "work" anyway, 'cause if they did, the contetants would all have broken bones and lacerated tendons and such. One of the easiest and most effective moves you can learn is the knee break, but nobody does that move in competition because it could end someone's career. Sport martial arts are designed to look damaging but not to be damaging in any perminent way. The motto of my school was "One hit, one destruction." Open sparring was something we didn't get into until our first degree.

I'm talking about Mixed Martial Arts competition. People have tried to knee break in matches, never really works.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

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Friday, December 28, 2012 10:41 AM

Sorry Nick, I'm having a little difficulty taking this conversation seriously because the subject kinda disgusts me. Yeah, a knee break is not going to be very effective against an opponent who is anticipating it, so you're right. And at that level, a knee break would have to be perfectly executed and, yeah, only if your opponent gave you the opening by putting all his weight on his forward leg.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Friday, December 28, 2012 10:41 AM

DALEK!

Quote:
Originally posted by WULFENSTAR:
The only MMA that works is wrestling, mixed with strikes to the most vulnerable parts.

And strength, always strength.

Just ask yourself this...

If "martial arts" were so great... like, some magical thing...

How did the Marines beat the Japanese in WW2? A LOT of it was hand to hand combat.

Wrestling is a martial art. You are right wrestling is very effective in MMA. However it is not the end all be all. Just like strenght, important but not the ultimate factor.

There is a reason this man is the most dangerous fighter in the world...

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

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Friday, December 28, 2012 10:50 AM

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Quote:
Originally posted by WULFENSTAR:
The only MMA that works is wrestling, mixed with strikes to the most vulnerable parts.

And strength, always strength.

Just ask yourself this...

If "martial arts" were so great... like, some magical thing...

How did the Marines beat the Japanese in WW2? A LOT of it was hand to hand combat.

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

Hello,

I find this statement ignorant on many levels.

It presupposes that hand to hand combat was the decisive factor in warfare.

It presupposes that all Japanese combatants were martial artists and all marine combatants were untrained.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

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Friday, December 28, 2012 10:53 AM

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Quote:
Originally posted by m52nickerson:
Since a certain someone wants something other than what is the current norm around here let us talk about Mixed Martial Arts.

I'm a MMA fan and have been one for quite some time. For those of you not familiar with the sport, MMA is full contact fighting in which most types of striking (punches, kicks, knees…est.) are allowed as well as grappling.

Fights are won by knocking your opponent out, by submitting your opponent or by judges decision.

This Saturday night is the next UFC event. The UFC (Ultimate Fighting Championships) is the premier MMA organization in the world. Saturday's main event has the current Heavyweight Champion Junior Dos Santos defending his title against the man he took it from Cain Velasquez.

So...anyone here a fan or watched MMA before? Anyone against it?

Hello,

I enjoy martial arts and martial arts competitions.

I do wish there was a way to practice the art without damaging an opponent. Perhaps motion capture, force feedback, and virtual reality interfaces will someday allow two combatants to have no-holds-barred fights without anyone getting hurt. This would allow technique to be perfected without causing injury or death.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

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Friday, December 28, 2012 10:59 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

Ill give you the man who has trained his entire life in MMA. Wrestling, striking, a great ground game. Jet-Li fast, with power to match.

VS.

My mother-in-law.

Shes in her 60s. Has diabetes. Can't get down the stairs on her own.

Except.

I just gave her my Glock. With its pretty hi-cap mag.

Who wins?

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:00 AM

DALEK!

Injuries happen, most of the time during training. There have been broken bones in MMA and unfortunaly a few deaths. Far less than other sports, like football.

Anthonyt have you watched any UFC events?

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:03 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

Grow up.

G*d made folks. Sam Colt made them equal.

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:04 AM

DALEK!

Quote:
Originally posted by WULFENSTAR:
Ill give you the man who has trained his entire life in MMA. Wrestling, striking, a great ground game. Jet-Li fast, with power to match.

VS.

My mother-in-law.

Shes in her 60s. Has diabetes. Can't get down the stairs on her own.

Except.

I just gave her my Glock. With its pretty hi-cap mag.

Who wins?

What's wrong Wolf to much of a coward to get punched in the face. Have to hide behind a gun?

Also the fighter wins. He covers the distance of the cage before your mother-in-law can even cock the gun.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:14 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
I do wish there was a way to practice the art without damaging an opponent.

In two of my schools we'd dress up in protective gear so that you could go all out 100% & hit anywhere- that was very informative. Aside from an obvious loss of some speed & manoeuvrability, it let us know what moves worked & what was fancy show crap. Still, eye & throat stuff could not be tested, except on the heavy bag & wooden dummy. The wrestling stuff was essential IMO, and that could be practised pretty much full on, but without strikes involved.
I actually got knocked out once though, from of all stupid things, a spinning back kick- but that was my very first Tae Kwon Do class at 13 years old, and I walked right into it. The dork yellow belt that did it just wanted a practice dummy, I guess. White belt fodder.

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:17 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:
Yeah, a knee break is not going to be very effective against an opponent who is anticipating it

We were taught to create a bridge for that, unless you're going Muay Thai on the guy.

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:19 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

"Also the fighter wins. He covers the distance of the cage before your mother-in-law can even cock the gun."

Would anyone like to explain to this fool that a Glock is a striker-fired pistol? And what that means?

No?

Ok, clown. No.

What happens is your great fighter starts charging, and my humble mother-in-law starts squeezing the trigger.

Many grains of lead fly into him.

And before he even get within 2 feet of my mother-in-law, the drop in blood pressure makes him fall to his knees.

2 to the head finishes it.

If you fight fair in a fight... you are fighting wrong.

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:27 AM

DALEK!

Quote:
Originally posted by WULFENSTAR:
"Also the fighter wins. He covers the distance of the cage before your mother-in-law can even cock the gun."

Would anyone like to explain to this fool that a Glock is a striker-fired pistol? And what that means?

No?

Ok, clown. No.

What happens is your great fighter starts charging, and my humble mother-in-law starts squeezing the trigger.

Many grains of lead fly into him.

And before he even get within 2 feet of my mother-in-law, the drop in blood pressure makes him fall to his knees.

2 to the head finishes it.

If you fight fair in a fight... you are fighting wrong.

I know what a glock is. You still have to pull back the slide after inserting the mag. You never said she gets to start with a round already chambered.

If you bring a gun to a fist fight, you are a coward.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:31 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

If you bring a gun to a fist fight... you are better prepared.

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:34 AM

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Quote:
Originally posted by WULFENSTAR:
If you bring a gun to a fist fight... you are better prepared.

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

Hello Wulf,

Police are trained that they can not un-holster and fire a weapon at an opponent within 21 feet with a reliable chance of success.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:41 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

"Hello Wulf,

Police are trained that they can not un-holster and fire a weapon at an opponent within 21 feet with a reliable chance of success."

So... give up if they cross into the 7 yard kill zone?

Just drop the weapon, bend over, and say hello to Buddah?

Or, empty your mag into them?

Sometimes, you being a lawyer is annoying. :)

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:45 AM

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Quote:
Originally posted by WULFENSTAR:
"Hello Wulf,

Police are trained that they can not un-holster and fire a weapon at an opponent within 21 feet with a reliable chance of success."

So... give up if they cross into the 7 yard kill zone?

Just drop the weapon, bend over, and say hello to Buddah?

Or, empty your mag into them?

Sometimes, you being a lawyer is annoying. :)

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

Hello,

You are confused.

If an opponent is so close to you, and your weapon is not already in hand, you will need to rely on other means to defeat or evade the opponent.

This is where some training in self-defense that does not rely on gunpowder can come in handy.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:45 AM

DALEK!

You are really a fucking idiot Wulf.

Can we all just ignore him in this thread? I want to talk about MMA.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

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Friday, December 28, 2012 11:49 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

"Can we all just ignore him in this thread? I want to talk about MMA"

Oh, sorry.

Here. For you.

I squint better than you, bitch.

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

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Friday, December 28, 2012 12:11 PM

BYTEMITE

Quote:
MMA competitions have shown that pure disciplines such a Kung Fu don't work very well in real fights.

*Compelled to try to defend Shaolin Chuan Fa temple boxing school, but has to nod in chagrined acknowledgement*

The old traditional forms do still have worth though. The discipline and traditions are very valuable - though less so much for the beat down aspects.

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Friday, December 28, 2012 12:26 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:

The old traditional forms do still have worth though. The discipline and traditions are very valuable - though less so much for the beat down aspects.

That also depends on the individual & their level of training. I know one guy who trains in traditional Hung Ga (a style I find does not work well for me for the most part) RELIGIOUSLY who can kick my ass in a hot second. He's the closest thing to Bruce Lee I've seen in person, and truth be told, he could whip me using regular ol' boxing. One handed.

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Friday, December 28, 2012 1:50 PM

BYTEMITE

I think they often provide a good foundation, at least.

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Friday, December 28, 2012 2:12 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
I think they often provide a good foundation, at least.

Oh definitely!

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Friday, December 28, 2012 2:13 PM

This one was actually pretty funny:

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Friday, December 28, 2012 2:56 PM

DALEK!

Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
The old traditional forms do still have worth though. The discipline and traditions are very valuable - though less so much for the beat down aspects.

Very true. For many disciplines there is a very spiritual aspect.

Bruce Lee advocating studying and understanding all forms and taking from each to have no form. Today Anderson Silva, widely regarded as the greatest MMA artist ever, studies a wide variety of forms. He even traveled to the Amazon to learn some traditional tribal wrestling.

http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/Anderson-Silva-Visits-Wrestles-with-A
mazonian-Tribe-40113

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

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Friday, December 28, 2012 6:26 PM

That's dedication.

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Friday, December 28, 2012 7:59 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:
Do you need to be mauled by a cat to know it can mess you up? My school was eclectic, drawing from many traditions. "Sport martial arts" don't "work" anyway, 'cause if they did, the contetants would all have broken bones and lacerated tendons and such. One of the easiest and most effective moves you can learn is the knee break, but nobody does that move in competition because it could end someone's career. Sport martial arts are designed to look damaging but not to be damaging in any perminent way.

Yanno, I like to joke about only knowing "Too-Bye-Forr" and "Krow-Barr", but I kinda do know how to deliver nasty unto people, and as HKCav points out, it's something you *COULDN'T* "spar" with because it all centers on hauling someone in close and BREAKING BITS OF THEM, permanently.
The closest it comes to anything official would be Kali/Escrima, being that found objects, spring baton or length of chain are stuff I know how to use, although these days being all old and rickety someone with real skill who knew it was coming would very likely hand my ass to me unless they're out of commission BEFORE they have any chance to react.

I have the same distaste for the subject that Cav does, in fact that distaste has encouraged me to look for less damaging defense options overall - I wish I still had my zapgloves though, those were.. interesting, basically a stungun emitter attached to the palm of each glove with the battery and components on a wrist mount.

-Frem

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Saturday, December 29, 2012 5:53 AM

DALEK!

For anyone interested, the prelim fights start tonight a 8pm EST on FX.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

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Tuesday, January 1, 2013 7:01 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht

Hi Nick, You want to know a not-so-secret secret? I enjoy ... watching men fight. I like movies where men box or fight in other ways, martial arts etc., I like it when there are rules of some sort. Because I don't like watching anyone get hurt for reals (I'm kind of a sissy) I prefer movies about these things because I know that those are actors and its mostly pretend. The only actual fighting I really watch is Olympic boxing, that way I can satisfy my interest in watching men fight, but I know there are rules in place so people don't get too hurt usually.

As for MMA I think it can be really positive, a lot of the guys at my church are into it, but I'm not close enough with them to ask if I can come watch, :(

As for watching the official MMA events though I think they're a little much for me from what I've heard, people get pretty hurt doing it so I think that, for me, it might be a bit much. But I support the right of others to do it if they choose.

I have told Byte several times that I think getting into her local MMA club or something similar would be a good idea for her, because she likes to fight and its a great way to channel that into something enjoyable that people have fun at.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Tuesday, January 1, 2013 7:08 PM