George Lucas loses his mind by OPPYH

Im about 10 years past getting upset over this kind of thing. I have several versions of the films now. Hell, the best version of ANH Ive seen is a fan-edit (Adywan's excellent ANH Revisited).

So, Im just not going to get bent out of shape. I think all those sad people who claimed Lucas "raped their childhood" shocked me into a sense of perspective where it just doesn't matter.

Im curious to see what's changed. I'll probably like some changes, and dislike others, and then move on.

So far - I don't mind the "Nooo!" I think it works here better than in ROTS, where it is really bad. I don't like the altered Kryatt ragon. The revised Han/Greedo shootout still has Greedo shoot first, but just barely, and it works for me. The blinking Ewok eyes are cool.

I do enjoy seeing some of the meltdowns people have, though.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Wednesday, August 31, 2011 3:40 PM

OPTIMUS1998

ok... watched that clip twice now..., maybe it's just been too long since i've watched ROTJ, but, what changes exactly??

I was a Lima loser for 29 years before "glee" introduced us to the term. -ME

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Wednesday, August 31, 2011 4:01 PM

BUP

No more running. I aim to misbehave.

The real problem is someone needs to smack George Lucas' hand and say, "No!" This was finished decades ago. Move on.
My mother calls it shooting the artist when the painting is finished so they will leave the thing alone.

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Wednesday, August 31, 2011 4:48 PM

OPPYH

Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
I think all those sad people who claimed Lucas "raped their childhood" shocked me into a sense of perspective where it just doesn't matter.

I have always hated the militant fans. They are the ones that put the biggest barrier between Lucas, and his loyalists.

To be honest, I expected changes. I know he is just trying to bridge the gap between prequels, and the OT. But tweaking a film four times? That just seems like Obsessive compulsive disorder. If Jaws, or Raiders of the Lost Ark were tampered with I'd feel the exact same way.

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70's TV FOREVER

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Wednesday, August 31, 2011 4:50 PM

ECGORDON

There's no place I can be since I found Serenity.

I'm sure I'm in the minority, but I was fed up with Star Wars in 1983 with the appearance of the Ewoks in RotJ. If he issued the first two films of the original trilogy on blu-ray, without the added scenes and FX, just remastering of the original prints, I'd buy them. Otherwise, I'm done with it.

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Wednesday, August 31, 2011 4:56 PM

OPPYH

Speaking of Angry fanboys, check out what Simon Pegg Tweeted:

"Always loved Vader's wordless self sacrifice. Another Shitty, clueless revision like Greedo, and young Anakin's ghost. What a fucking shame."

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70's TV FOREVER

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Wednesday, August 31, 2011 5:28 PM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by OPPYH:

"Always loved Vader's wordless self sacrifice."

Absolutely.
Blinking Ewoks are fine.
But more yelling... not so much.

I guess I'm done too.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 1:48 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by OPPYH:
Speaking of Angry fanboys, check out what Simon Pegg Tweeted:

"Always loved Vader's wordless self sacrifice..."

I'm no director, but I know what I like. The scene and Vader's actions screamed his thoughts, with out him having uttered 1 word. It was exactly as Luke had described, of the conflict with in him. The INTERNAL struggle Vader was dealing with, up until that pivotal point.

This ? It's comic book material, and patently lame comic book material at best.

Lucas should have just let the whole thing be, after the originals, and started off on an an entirely new saga. He has a universe of characters to pull from , and he easily could have taken up the story of any number of different heroes or villains, across the Empire, or the Republic, at almost any time period.

What a colossal waste.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 1:54 AM

SIMONWHO

I have no problem with Lucas re-editing the original trilogy into a musical, with a new character called Lorge Gucas delivering a 10 minute pitch for toys, while turning Darth Vader into a compulsive bed-wetter. Just as long as we get the original films made available in the best possible format.

As for me buying this? Noooooooooooo. I'll watch the deleted scenes on YouTube and that'll be that.

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 2:17 AM

I really don't understand the flack that Lucas gets over this kind of thing. Nobody should be taking these things that seriously.

I'm a fan of Simon Pegg, but I'm really tired of his ranting and raving about what Lucas has done to Star Wars. Lets see what Pegg does for cinema 40 years hence? Dude needs to chill.

And of course Lucas should learn not to over tweak these things but it's his endeavour. Fella can do what the hell he likes with it.

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 3:53 AM

LWAVES

Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
Im about 10 years past getting upset over this kind of thing. I have several versions of the films now. Hell, the best version of ANH Ive seen is a fan-edit (Adywan's excellent ANH Revisited).

So, Im just not going to get bent out of shape. I think all those sad people who claimed Lucas "raped their childhood" shocked me into a sense of perspective where it just doesn't matter.

Im curious to see what's changed. I'll probably like some changes, and dislike others, and then move on.

So far - I don't mind the "Nooo!" I think it works here better than in ROTS, where it is really bad. I don't like the altered Kryatt ragon. The revised Han/Greedo shootout still has Greedo shoot first, but just barely, and it works for me. The blinking Ewok eyes are cool.

I do enjoy seeing some of the meltdowns people have, though.

I've seen the Adywan fanedit and it is good although I personally prefer ADigitalMans edits of all six films. He makes Phantom Menace pretty watchable (although there are better versions). There's a hell of a lot of fanedits out there of the six films and people should go looking for them as I'm sure they'll find one they like. And I'm sure HD versions will appear at some point as well.

I have to agree with you on the caring part as well. I'm past caring as I accepted long ago that he would keep releasing these films and keep making changes. I do think he should just leave them alone and be done with it but they're his movies so fair enough, he can do what he wants. He doesn't owe anybody anything. None of the changes drastically alter the story so it really doesn't bother me, most of them are cosmetic or not necessary. Some of the changes definitely don't work well for me (if at all) and I can understand folks not liking them but getting as worked up about it as they do isn't going to change anything in the bigger picture.

The 'raped my childhood' line always makes me laugh at the folks who say it, they need to get a grip with reality and realise what they are actually dealing with - a series of movies. However bad people think the PT is it's still just a series of movies and there are far worse/inferior movies out there, even allowing for individual taste.

At the end of the day different fans want different versions, like the purists who only want the 'true' original versions. I can see some merit to that argument but what if you saw the '78 version of Star Wars and not the '77 version. Should that also be released too?

As for Vader's new 'dialogue' in Jedi it falls into the category of 'not necessary' for me. I'll save judgement on the other changes until I've seen them.

"The greatest invention ever is not the wheel. It's the second wheel." - Rich Hall

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 4:31 AM

LWAVES

Quote:
Originally posted by THESOMNAMBULIST:
I really don't understand the flack that Lucas gets over this kind of thing. Nobody should be taking these things that seriously.

Agreed again.
Unfortunately so many fanboys feel that they have some kind of ownership to the SW universe because it was 'a life-changing event' for them or just because they have spent so much time, effort and money on it. So when Lucas makes these changes or doesn't release the exact version of the film that the fanboy wants they feel outraged, like it's a personal attack on them or something of theirs.
Personally I do think enough is enough and that he's mucked around with them too much but it's up to him. I'll still be getting the Blu-rays. It'll be worth it to see them in HD.

"The greatest invention ever is not the wheel. It's the second wheel." - Rich Hall

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 4:57 AM

Quote:
Agreed again.
Unfortunately so many fanboys feel that they have some kind of ownership to the SW universe because it was 'a life-changing event' for them or just because they have spent so much time, effort and money on it. So when Lucas makes these changes or doesn't release the exact version of the film that the fanboy wants they feel outraged, like it's a personal attack on them or something of theirs.
Personally I do think enough is enough and that he's mucked around with them too much but it's up to him. I'll still be getting the Blu-rays. It'll be worth it to see them in HD.

Indeed Lwaves. My own slant on it is that he should leave it alone too, but I know how difficult that can be. I do creative things every day as part of my job and because I'm often under a deadline I have to let it go sooner than I'd like. Often with some of the better ideas left out. Which really eats at you. So if I get a bit of spare time I'll give it another crack and present it again... But it's kinda done it's thing by then and it falls flat. Even if it's better than what was originally done. Fact is it did the job the first time.
I imagine it's similar for Lucas but of course on a grander and more profound scale. He must have so many little things that bug the hell out of him in terms of his own stuff that he can't help but try and implement the odd change here and there. It's probably the same preoccupation that drove him to such standards with the first set of films.
But I think the people who rally up and attack him with comments about how he raped their childhood need to take a moment and try undertake a project themselves. If they feel that strongly and angry about it they should use that to make their own creative endeavours. Much of art is born out of a reaction to what came before it.
Anyway. Chances are Lucas will have Star Wars reimagined in whatever new technology is out there waiting in the wings. It's his schtick. I'm actually surprised he hasn't done the retro 3D thing with them yet.

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 5:01 AM

YELLOWJACKET

Nope. Something's just not right with her smile. Best repaint the Mona Lisa again.

And again and again and again and again and again ad infinitum...

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 5:21 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by OPPYH:
Speaking of Angry fanboys, check out what Simon Pegg Tweeted:

"Always loved Vader's wordless self sacrifice. Another Shitty, clueless revision like Greedo, and young Anakin's ghost. What a fucking shame."

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70's TV FOREVER

Well, if a celebrity said it....

Really, I thought the young Anakin ghost makes total sense in the context of the story (though the shot looks odd since Hayden wasn't told what they were doing, so has an off expression and is looking the wrong way). But conceptually, it works.

And the added "No" does fit with Lucas' stated structural goals, to have certain elements, particularly audio cues, repeat and parallel between the two trilogies. Granted, my prefered method to address this would be to remove the "No" from ROTS, but Im okay with this way, too.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 5:24 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by TheSomnambulist:
I'm actually surprised he hasn't done the retro 3D thing with them yet.

They're currently working on those. They will be released one per year, starting with Episode 1 in February.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 5:35 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by lwaves:
Quote:
Originally posted by THESOMNAMBULIST:
I really don't understand the flack that Lucas gets over this kind of thing. Nobody should be taking these things that seriously.

Agreed again.
Unfortunately so many fanboys feel that they have some kind of ownership to the SW universe because it was 'a life-changing event' for them or just because they have spent so much time, effort and money on it. So when Lucas makes these changes or doesn't release the exact version of the film that the fanboy wants they feel outraged, like it's a personal attack on them or something of theirs.
Personally I do think enough is enough and that he's mucked around with them too much but it's up to him. I'll still be getting the Blu-rays. It'll be worth it to see them in HD.

"The greatest invention ever is not the wheel. It's the second wheel." - Rich Hall

I think this hits the nail on the head.

And those guys can be so damned annoying. I have a friend who was the biggest Star Wars fan I knew for years. He had EVERYTHING. Then, about a year ago, he just suddenly decided he hated Lucas and everything Star Wars. But he didn't just limit it - suddenly, if you didn't hate it as much as him, you are some kind of sheet for Lucas - even though he was a bigger "sheep" than anyone. So damned annoying.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 7:49 AM

CHRISISALL

If Lucas isn't going to erase Jar-Jar from the new version of Phantom Menace, at LEAST I hope it's true that he's gonna CG Yoda- that crappy puppet was really the worst thing in the movie IMO.

The laughing Chrisisall

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 8:42 AM

DREAMTROVE

Do not want

That's what a ship is, you know - it's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs.

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 10:08 AM

DJD

The continual tinkering speaks more of his lack of original ideas than anything else. It's odd for a creative person not to move on.... if they are actually creative that is. I'm not annoyed because I don't intend to buy it, but I am bemused as to why he'd want to do this. And I also agree that RoJ was pants in the first place

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 10:27 AM

BYTEMITE

Quote:
Really, I thought the young Anakin ghost makes total sense in the context of the story (though the shot looks odd since Hayden wasn't told what they were doing, so has an off expression and is looking the wrong way). But conceptually, it works.

And the added "No" does fit with Lucas' stated structural goals, to have certain elements, particularly audio cues, repeat and parallel between the two trilogies. Granted, my prefered method to address this would be to remove the "No" from ROTS, but Im okay with this way, too.

I actually feel the same way. By having Hayden Anakin it's symbolic of Darth Vader being redeemed and his ghost representing the best aspect of him - a young jedi, before he fell to the dark side.

...Even though I don't like Hayden Christensen... Anyway, I get why he did it, and I also get the structural NO element. I think people react the way they do to that because the no in ROTS was delivered so woodenly, so they expect something similarly bad here.

None of the changes seem particularly bad to me... Though I wouldn't mind the Han vs. Greedo scene going back to the original, but the redone version where Han jerks away from the blaster shot is just awful, and anything would be better.

But then, maybe I don't mind that much because I'd already moved on from the Star Wars fandom. Happened a while ago with the books and the EU. Plus I've gotten into a little something called Firefly. :)

I still enjoy the Bioware games and I think they're true to the Star Wars verse, but the EU books have gotten to the point where we seriously need a major reboot or something, they're so convoluted, and all the writers are bickering.

We can keep the Thrawn trilogy. Maybe make those a movie. I'd also like to see the X-wing books get some film time, though then we might have the fans fighting over Stackpole versus Aaron.

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 12:41 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:
Originally posted by TheSomnambulist:
I'm actually surprised he hasn't done the retro 3D thing with them yet.

They're currently working on those. They will be released one per year, starting with Episode 1 in February.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

Thanks Storymark. I didn't know that. Figures though.

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 12:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by djd:
The continual tinkering speaks more of his lack of original ideas than anything else. It's odd for a creative person not to move on.... if they are actually creative that is. I'm not annoyed because I don't intend to buy it, but I am bemused as to why he'd want to do this. And I also agree that RoJ was pants in the first place

Well there's a good number of classic paintings that have been x-rayed and shown that beneath the masterpiece there is indeed a 'different' image. One that the artist began but didn't like the direction it was going in. Making corrections and altering your work makes you no less creative. In fact many great artists obsess over the same thing for many years. John Coltrane being one of them and his obsession with 'My favourite things'. Or Picasso with his 'Cubism' phase.

But I share your point of view and wish he wouldn't tamper with it either, but I can also appreciate how difficult it must be for Lucas. From an artistic point of view.

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 12:53 PM

Originally posted by chrisisall:

Quote:
If Lucas isn't going to erase Jar-Jar from the new version of Phantom Menace, at LEAST I hope it's true that he's gonna CG Yoda- that crappy puppet was really the worst thing in the movie IMO.

Nice one Chris!

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 1:36 PM

YELLOWJACKET

Lucas needs us to hear Vader say 'No' so that we know that Vader has reached the 'enough is enough' stage, because throwing the Emperor down a thirty story shaft isn't enough to sell this point on it's own.

Thank you, Lucas. Thank you.

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 4:26 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by yellowjacket:
Lucas needs us to hear Vader say 'No' so that we know that Vader has reached the 'enough is enough' stage, because throwing the Emperor down a thirty story shaft isn't enough to sell this point on it's own.

Thank you, Lucas. Thank you.

I bet it'll look GREAT on a T-shirt, too!

" Nooo!! "

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 5:48 PM

CAUSAL

Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
Im curious to see what's changed. I'll probably like some changes, and dislike others, and then move on.

Amen. My thoughts exactly.

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 10:19 PM

DJD

Whilst I agree that many artists continue to tamper with their work up to a point, those artists generally also produce new art. Lucas seems to be a one trick pony . His only option is to keep going back to that old trick and adjusting it. It's not as if he's making it better though...

The Directors Cuts of a number of films are better than the originals. The LotRs films, Kingdom of Heaven, Aliens, etc. Can anyone say the same of the Star Wars films?

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 11:04 PM

Hey DJD

Quote:
Whilst I agree that many artists continue to tamper with their work up to a point, those artists generally also produce new art. Lucas seems to be a one trick pony . His only option is to keep going back to that old trick and adjusting it. It's not as if he's making it better though...

Well that's a fair point, though I think many forget his pioneering work with sound design, for which cinema is all the better for. While not essentially art, it has to an extent allowed artistic consideration. Anyway I'm not trying to put a square peg in a round hole, you're right. He has seemingly dedicated his artistic endeavours to the one idea. However it is a great idea and seemingly an endless pool from which to draw from. Personally I'm hoping he gives Joe Johnston the go ahead to tell Han Chewie and Boba Fet's back story. Something that Johnston has been trying to persuade George to do for many years now.

Quote:
The Directors Cuts of a number of films are better than the originals. The LotRs films, Kingdom of Heaven, Aliens, etc. Can anyone say the same of the Star Wars films?

I've only seen the Aliens directors cut and I personally didn't think it was necessary. But I see your point.

George Lucas is now a much older man and probably battle weary. In his mind the changes are for the better. The conflict I believe lies in the fact that a sixy plus year old man is tweaking a twenty year old man's pet project. It's just George getting older. It's a little like having your grandad tell you what's cool.

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Thursday, September 1, 2011 11:16 PM

SIMONWHO

Actually, each time I read the thread title, I picture Joss watching Lucas from behind a curtain, going "He's losing his mind! And I'm reaping all the benefits."

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Friday, September 2, 2011 12:01 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
Actually, each time I read the thread title, I picture Joss watching Lucas from behind a curtain, going "He's losing his mind! And I'm reaping all the benefits."

Wedding Singer reference. Nice :D

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Friday, September 2, 2011 5:41 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by TheSomnambulist:

I've only seen the Aliens directors cut and I personally didn't think it was necessary. But I see your point.

really? I could see that with some of the extra colonist stuff, though I liked it - but the added subplot with Ripley's dead daughter adds SO much more weight to her drive to save Newt.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Friday, September 2, 2011 5:44 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by djd:
Whilst I agree that many artists continue to tamper with their work up to a point, those artists generally also produce new art. Lucas seems to be a one trick pony . His only option is to keep going back to that old trick and adjusting it. It's not as if he's making it better though...

Creating non-linear editing, helping create surround sound, creating several quantum leaps in production, forming freakin' Pixar, not to mention the new film he has coming in a couple months.... yeah, one trick.

Uninformed people are funny.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Friday, September 2, 2011 5:52 AM

DJD

Lol ! And rude people are hilarious aren't they? I'm well aware of GLs credits. I was talking about as a film maker and writer not as a technician and a businessman. I guess Howard the Duck is on your must-watch list? Oh, and as big old Indiana Jones fan, Lucas has done as much to stall and bugger-up that franchise than help it. I dare say that if were not for Speilberg we'd have cgi monkeys in Raiders by now....

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Friday, September 2, 2011 6:02 AM

Storymark wrote:

Quote:
really? I could see that with some of the extra colonist stuff, though I liked it - but the added subplot with Ripley's dead daughter adds SO much more weight to her drive to save Newt.

Yeah. I didn't think it was needed. Sledgehammer to crack a walnut.

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Friday, September 2, 2011 6:09 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by djd:
Lol ! And rude people are hilarious aren't they? I'm well aware of GLs credits. I was talking about as a film maker and writer not as a technician and a businessman. I guess Howard the Duck is on your must-watch list? Oh, and as big old Indiana Jones fan, Lucas has done as much to stall and bugger-up that franchise than help it. I dare say that if were not for Speilberg we'd have cgi monkeys in Raiders by now....

I was a bit rude, and was just coming back to delete that part (pointless now, I guess), so I appologize for that. Nonetheless, I stand by the rest.

You assumption about the Monkeys in Indy 4, for instance, is nothing but an assumption. Spielberg loves CGI just as much. Plus, if you look back at the story session notes from Raiders, when they were originally conceiving the character and his world - it was Spielberg who always had the strangest, most out-there suggestions, and it was Lucas who made a point of keeping the character grounded and believable. Adding Mutt to 4 was ALL Spielberg.

Insisting that everything goofy comes from Lucas is simply not factual.

Beyond that - he's the most powerful Director in Hollywood - if Spielberg didn't want the monkeys, there would be no monkeys, period.

Maybe you were aware of Lucas' other accomplishments, and intentionally left them out, but you've once again shown you are leaning more on assumption than fact.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Friday, September 2, 2011 6:10 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by TheSomnambulist:
Storymark wrote:
Quote:
really? I could see that with some of the extra colonist stuff, though I liked it - but the added subplot with Ripley's dead daughter adds SO much more weight to her drive to save Newt.

Yeah. I didn't think it was needed. Sledgehammer to crack a walnut.

Wow. Huh.... Couldn't disagree more. But okay...

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Friday, September 2, 2011 6:14 AM

OLDGUY

What Would Mal do ?

Quote:
Originally posted by ecgordon:
I'm sure I'm in the minority, but I was fed up with Star Wars in 1983 with the appearance of the Ewoks in RotJ. If he issued the first two films of the original trilogy on blu-ray, without the added scenes and FX, just remastering of the original prints, I'd buy them. Otherwise, I'm done with it.

Agreed.. I imagined quite a different story line..where Darth was the clone of Luke's father who was an outcast jedi who turned out to be bobbafet..given that bounty hunter was the only one slick enough to catch them to begin with and since he was hidden behind his helmit..it coulda been a great path to take...but ol George had to go try and sell some little kids on some teddy bears...wtf?

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Friday, September 2, 2011 6:15 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Oldguy:
Quote:
Originally posted by ecgordon:
I'm sure I'm in the minority, but I was fed up with Star Wars in 1983 with the appearance of the Ewoks in RotJ. If he issued the first two films of the original trilogy on blu-ray, without the added scenes and FX, just remastering of the original prints, I'd buy them. Otherwise, I'm done with it.

Agreed.. I imagined quite a different story line..where Darth was the clone of Luke's father who was an outcast jedi who turned out to be bobbafet..given that bounty hunter was the only one slick enough to catch them to begin with and since he was hidden behind his helmit..it coulda been a great path to take...but ol George had to go try and sell some little kids on some teddy bears...wtf?

....nevermind.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Friday, September 2, 2011 6:16 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by djd:
Lol ! And rude people are hilarious aren't they? I'm well aware of GLs credits. I was talking about as a film maker and writer not as a technician and a businessman. I guess Howard the Duck is on your must-watch list? Oh, and as big old Indiana Jones fan, Lucas has done as much to stall and bugger-up that franchise than help it. I dare say that if were not for Speilberg we'd have cgi monkeys in Raiders by now....

See this one confuses me. Lucas writes/directs Star Wars episodes I, II, III & IV and is slammed.

Lucas co-writes Indy I, II, III, & IV but Spielberg directs Indy I, II, III, & IV and yet Lucas gets slammed?

How's that work?

Surely some of the blame must go to Spielberg - if you're of the opinion that Crystal Skull was bad. You don't think there's a bias there? Not specifically from you DJD, but in general I mean.
Me I like Crystal skull - but I can see why it's not for everyone, but the vitriol lashed out solely against Lucas... That aint on.

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Friday, September 2, 2011 6:24 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by TheSomnambulist:
Quote:
Originally posted by djd:
Lol ! And rude people are hilarious aren't they? I'm well aware of GLs credits. I was talking about as a film maker and writer not as a technician and a businessman. I guess Howard the Duck is on your must-watch list? Oh, and as big old Indiana Jones fan, Lucas has done as much to stall and bugger-up that franchise than help it. I dare say that if were not for Speilberg we'd have cgi monkeys in Raiders by now....

See this one confuses me. Lucas writes/directs Star Wars episodes I, II, III & IV and is slammed.

Lucas co-writes Indy I, II, III, & IV but Spielberg directs Indy I, II, III, & IV and yet Lucas gets slammed?

How's that work?

Surely some of the blame must go to Spielberg - if you're of the opinion that Crystal Skull was bad. You don't think there's a bias there? Not specifically from you DJD, but in general I mean.
Me I like Crystal skull - but I can see why it's not for everyone, but the vitriol lashed out soleyl against Lucas... That's aint on.

Exactly.

When it comes down to it, unless it's a first timer, or maybe someone coming back from a huge flop - the director has final say on most things. And when it's freakin' Spielberg - he has final say on whatever the hell he wants.

And Indy was Lucas' idea in the first place - yet he only gets credit for what's bad. It's nonsensical, and just shows how biased and inaccurate fan-rage can be.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Friday, September 2, 2011 6:25 AM

Gorram double

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Friday, September 2, 2011 6:26 AM

Originally posted by Storymark:

Quote:
Wow. Huh.... Couldn't disagree more, who needs character arcs? But okay...

Ha, yeah we often disagree. I felt the Abyss was burdened with similar dead weight. Not sure why you make the leap that I don't appreciate character arcs (I take it that's the implication?). Did you think Ripley had no arc without that?

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Friday, September 2, 2011 6:29 AM

Doh! And now we agree on something. Don't I got egg on my face. Sorry about that Storymark.