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Originally posted by DesktopHippie:
How is kindly Agent whathisname? He hasn't been calling around to my house so much these days.

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http://www.unitednuclear.com

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Originally posted by SignyM:
Among industrialized nations, the USA crime rate sticks out like a sore thumb. What are we doing differently from them?

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Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
If he bugs ya just skim over the stuff and ignore it, but in truth if you're willing to wade through the sensationalism and melodrama, he does make some interesting points.

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Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
Prolly cause a lot of us don't find him offensive.

Overtly melodramatic and fulla sensationalism to a ridiculous degree ? sure.

Downright offensive ? rarely.

Incapable of rational thought or debate ? nope.

Remember, PN walked off with the win on the first Historical Trivia Challenge.

If he bugs ya just skim over the stuff and ignore it, but in truth if you're willing to wade through the sensationalism and melodrama, he does make some interesting points.

And scary that it may sound, on some of those wild allegations ? there's actually proof, which is downright scary - but there you have it.

If you wanna tag him with something, we could hit him up with "Official Tabloid Reporter", hehehe.

But really, I got no issue with him myself.

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Originally posted by rue:
Hi Desktop,

The reason I don't find PN offensive (even though his statements very much are) - is b/c he seems, well, one short of a full load. He could be standing on a street corner carrying a sign that says {the end is near}, or { John 3:16 } or some such.

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Originally posted by Fletch2:
The answer to the problem is licensing with stiff penalties for anyone found to have an unlicenced weapon and a sentence multiplier applied to any crime commited with the aid of a gun. The problem with this is that the gun lobby will fight it all the way because

1) In THEIR interpretation of the second ammendment, the one that believes the mention of a well regulated militia is additional to the right to bear arms and not part of it, ANY form of regulation is none constitutional

and

2) They fear that once the government has that power they can use it to submarine a complete ban by simply restricting the issuing of licences.

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A mandatory five-year prison term for using or carrying a firearm during a crime of violence or drug trafficking crime;
A mandatory fifteen-year prison term for felons in possession of a firearm who had three prior convictions for violent felonies or serious drug offenses;
A ten-year sentence enhancement for using a short-barreled rifle or shotgun, or a semiautomatic assault weapon, in a crime of violence or drug trafficking crime;
A thirty-year sentence enhancement for using a machine gun, destructive device, or firearm equipped with a silencer during a crime of violence or drug trafficking crime; and

A twenty-year prison term or life imprisonment for second or subsequent GCA offenses.

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Originally posted by SignyM:
He's willing to bring up and tackle some of the outrages that have been committed by government.

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Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
Hippie, I never said he wasn't offensive, I said that I rarely find him so, that's a different thing, and rarely doesn't mean never.

As for the accusations, yes, many of them seem to be ridiculous on the face, and even the ones where there is substantial evidence, he takes it to a ludicrous degree, sure.

Some of the stuff however, is addressed by no one else in any form, thus I am willing to tolerate him, gritting my teeth all the while.

Yes, there are times when he gets up my back too, never doubt it, and if want him flagged as such, by all means I am not debating your opinion on that - it's just that a lot of us see him as our pet version of the weekly world news and more amusing than directly offensive, is all.

I do however, feel the need to point out the dichotomy between your previous stance and statements on mental illness and your position here.

No offense whatsoever is meant by that, just that it'd be useful if you could clarify on that one a little bit, regarding an issue like this one.

-Frem

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As to trolls of the other type - trolls by avocation - it's too bad they just can't be automatically routed to troll country. Such is life.

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Developing a cohesive response takes a long time

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Originally posted by Fletch2:
Those are additions to sentences, in effect additional charges. What I am talking of is an actual multiplier, you serve twice the time if you use a gun. So say you rob a bank, carjack a getaway vehicle (without taking hostages) and flee. By your math you might get 10 years for the bank, 3 years for the car plus 5 years for the gun, total 18 years. I'm saying double the sentence for gun use or (10+3) x2 or 26 years.

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Originally posted by DesktopHippie:
I'm sorry, but if Kaneman gets an offensive tag then Piratenews should damn well get one too.

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Originally posted by FutureMrsFIllion:
Cho IS the bad guy. But society failed him in not getting him the help he so obviously needed. How did he fall thtrough the cracks and how do we prevent it in the future?

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Originally posted by SergeantX:

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Originally posted by FutureMrsFIllion:
Cho IS the bad guy. But society failed him in not getting him the help he so obviously needed. How did he fall thtrough the cracks and how do we prevent it in the future?

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Wow... to think I wasted so much typing when it could have been put so succinctly. Thanks! :)

SergeantX

"Dream a little dream or you can live a little dream. I'd rather live it, cause dreamers always chase but never get it." Aesop Rock

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Originally posted by FutureMrsFIllion:

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Originally posted by DesktopHippie:
I'm sorry, but if Kaneman gets an offensive tag then Piratenews should damn well get one too.

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DTH, you know I love you, but I have to disagree. PN seems to me, as to others, to be a brick short of a chimney. He reminds me of a homeless conspiracy theorist that I once knew. I ignore most of what he writes. KM on the other hand is very aware of what he/she is doing and does it deliberately. One does not know better and the other does. That is the difference.

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As for the original reason for this post, Cho IS the bad guy. But society failed him in not getting him the help he so obviously needed. How did he fall thtrough the cracks and how do we prevent it in the future?

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How did he fall thtrough the cracks and how do we prevent it in the future?

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Originally posted by DesktopHippie:
What stuck out for me was the outpatient service saying it isn't their job to police patients and make them attend therapy when it *is*. If someone is ordered to attend a clinic and doesn't show they have a duty to report it. They didn't. This is a horrible reminder of what happens when you focus on the numbers and not the individuals.

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Report: Cho Hired an Escort Before Rampage

Roanoke Woman Says She Told FBI Killer Was 'Dorky,' 'Timid' and a 'Little Pushy'

Seung-Hui Cho hired her to dance for him in a motel room one month before the massacre at Virginia Tech's campus, dancer Chastity Frye said in an on camera interview with a TV station in Roanoke, Va.

"He was so quiet. I really couldn't get much from him. He was so distant. He really didn't like to talk a lot," Frye said in the interview. "It seemed like he wasn't all there."

Frye said that a "creepy" Cho, 23, called the escort service she works for and hired her to meet him for one hour at a Roanoke motel, about a 30-minute drive from Virginia Tech's Blacksburg campus.

About 15 minutes into the performance for Cho, Frye said, it appeared that her client had no interest.

"I danced for a little while and I thought we were done because he got up and went to the restroom and began washing," said Frye, a white woman with blond hair.

Frye told WSLS that she told Cho she was going to leave, to which he responded that he had paid for a full hour and she had only performed 15 minutes.

When she resumed dancing, Frye said that Cho touched her and tried "to get on" her before she pushed him away. Cho then apparently respected her wishes.

Frye said she thought Cho looked familiar when she saw his face in the coverage of the Virginia Tech killings. Cho fatally shot 32 people and then himself on April 16.

She got a call from the FBI, which she said tracked her down through Cho's credit card receipts.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/VATech/story?id=3071730&page=1

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Originally posted by piratenews:
If this escort/stripper/prostitute is lying about sex, then she has zero credibility about Cho's real personality...

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Originally posted by SignyM:
Mental health issues revolve around two critical points: funding and involuntary commitment.

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Originally posted by SignyM:

It would also be useful to try and understand WHY we have so many pathologically violent people in our culture. If you look at Death Row prisoners, about half of them are brain damaged or mentally ill: fetal alcohol syndrome (FAS), in utero exposure to other drugs, childhood abuse, accidental head trauma, schizophrenia, mental retardation, severe depression.

I think it's perfectly useless- and therefore perfectly idiotic- to apply phrases like "evil" or "bad" to people who commit heinous crimes. It's about as useful as saying "It's the devil's work" and blowing holy smoke at them. When I first about heard about Andrea Yates - when everyone was gasping about what an evil mother she was- my first reaction was to wonder what the hell went wrong with her.

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Spring Break

Still, the two remained in jail while detectives quizzed a caretaker at the ranch. The caretaker readily named other members of the Hernandez drug syndicate as frequent visitors what was known as Rancho Santa Elena. Another one-time visitor was none other than Mark Kilroy, identified from a school photograph. In custody, Serafin Hernandez freely admitted participating in Kilroy’s abduction and murder--one of many committed over the past year or so at Rancho Santa Elena. The slayings were human sacrifices, he explained, executed to secure occult protection for various drug deals. “It’s our religion,” Hernandez explained. “Our voodoo.”

Hernandez identified the leader of his cult--El Padrino, the Godfather--as Adolfo de Jesus Constanzo, a master practitioner of the African magic called “palo mayombe.” It was Constanzo who ordered the slayings, Hernandez explained, and El Padrino who tortured and sodomized the victims prior to killing them and harvesting their organs for his ritual cauldron.

Police returned to the ranch with Hernandez in tow. He readily pointed out the cult’s private graveyard and then when asked, used a shovel to unearth the first of 12 bodies buried in a tidy row. All the victims were men. Some had been shot at close range and others hacked to death with a machete. One of the bodies was Mark Kilroy, his skull split open, his brain missing.

www.crimelibrary.com/serial_killers/weird/constanzo/1.html

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Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
The question is, what to do about it ?

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THE FUKIN NEWSZ 20 APR 2007

V Tech Headlies with Deek Jackson: Cho's MKULTRA brainchiped killing spree

www.surfingtheapocalypse.tv/satire.php

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VIDEO: Are YOU a Manchurian Candidate?

By Dr Nick Begich PhD, whose Congressman father was "disappeared" and assassinated during Watergate, along with Congressman Hale Boggs, who was on the Warren Magic Bullet Commission. Nick Begich's brother, Mark Begich, is the current mayor of Anchorage, Alaska.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2497840938718341112

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Begich

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"Mr. Chairman: In my letter to you of July 15, 1977, I reported our recent discovery of seven boxes of documents related to Project MKULTRA, a closely held CIA project conducted from 1953-1964. As you may recall, MKULTRA was an "umbrella project" under which certain sensitive subprojects were funded, involving among other things research on drugs and behavioral modification. During the Rockefeller Commission and Church Committee investigations in 1975, the cryptonym became publicly known when details of the drug-related death of Dr. Frank Olsen were publicized. In 1953 Dr. Olsen, a civilian employee of the Army at Fort Detrick, leaped to his death from a hotel room window in New York City about a week after having unwittingly consumed LSD administered to him as an experiment at a meeting of LSD researchers called by CIA. Most of what was known about the Agency's involvement with behavioral drugs during the investigations in 1975 was contained in a report on Project MKULTRA prepared by the Inspector General's office in 1963. As a result of that report's recommendations, unwitting testing of drugs on U.S. citizens was subsequently discontinued. The MKULTRA-related report was made available to the Church Committee investigators and to the staff of Senator Kennedy's Subcommittee on Health. Until the recent discovery, it was believed that all of the MKULTRA files dealing with behavioral modification had been destroyed in 1973 on the orders of the then retiring Chief of the Office of Technical Service, with the authorization of the DCI, as has been previously reported. Almost all of the people who had had any connection with the aspects of the project which interested Senate investigators in 1975 were no longer with the Agency at that time. Thus, there was little detailed knowledge of the MKULTRA subprojects available to CIA during the Church Committee investigations. The 1963 Inspector General report on MKULTRA made available to both the Church Committee and Senator Kennedy's Subcommittee mentions electro-shock and harassment substances (pp. 4, 16); covert testing on unwitting U.S. citizens (pp. 7, 10-12); the search for new materials through arrangements with specialists in universities, pharmaceutical houses, hospitals, state and federal institutions, and private research organizations (pp. 7, 9); and the fact that the Technical Service Division of CIA had initiated 144 subprojects related to the control of human behavior between 1953-1963 (p. 21)."
-Admiral Stansfield Turner, Director of Central Intelligence, U.S. Senate Hearing on MKULTRA, 1973
www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/history/e1950/mkultra/index.htm

"QKHILLTOP was a cryptonym assigned in 1954 to a project to study Chinese Communist brainwashing techniques and to develop interrogation techniques. Most of the early studies are believed to have been conducted by the Cornell University Medical School Human Ecology Study Programs. The effort was absorbed into the MKULTRA program and the QKHILLTOP cryptonym became obsolete."
-U.S. Senate Hearing on MKULTRA, Appendix C, QKHILLTOP DEFINITION, 1973
www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/history/e1950/mkultra/AppendixC.htm

"The concepts involved in manipulating behavior are found by many people both within and outside the Agency to be distasteful and unethical. Nevertheless, there have been major accomplishments both in research and operational employment. Over the ten-year life of the program many additional avenues to the control of human behavior have been designated under the MKULTRA charter, including radiation, electro-shock, and harassment substances. Some activities raise questions of legality implicit in the original charter. A final phase of the testing places the rights and interests of US citizens in jeopardy. Technical Services Division initiated a program for covert testing of materials on unwitting US citizens in 1955. TSD has pursued a philosophy of minimum documentation in keeping with the high sensitivity of the projects. Some files contained little or no data at all. There are just two individuals in TSD who have full knowledge of the MKULTRA program, and most of that knowledge is unrecorded."
-MEMORANDUM FOR: Director of Central Intelligence
FROM: CIA Inspector General, NB 108-113, 26 July 1963
www.wanttoknow.info/mindcontrol#_ednref13

"We need a program of psychosurgery for political control of our society. The purpose is physical control of the mind. Everyone who deviates from the given norm can be surgically mutilated. The individual may think that the most important reality is his own existence, but this is only his personal point of view. This lacks historical perspective. Man does not have the right to develop his own mind. This kind of liberal orientation has great appeal. We must electrically control the brain. Some day armies and generals will be controlled by electrical stimulation of the brain."
-Dr. Jose Delgado, Director of Neuropsychiatry, Yale University Medical School prof and CIA mind control scientist, Congressional Record, No 26, vol 118 February 24th, 1974

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