order of episodes by mderka

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

order of episodes

POSTED BY: MDERKA
UPDATED: Thursday, August 10, 2006 09:14
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Monday, August 7, 2006 5:40 PM

I really enjoyed the movie Serenity and recently got the Firefly complete series. My question is what order should I watch the episodes?

The DVDs have an order, but it doesn't follow the original air dates. Should I go by date, or how the DVD is laid out. Obviuosly on disc 1 the first episodes are important to watch first even though the air dates are later in the season.

Any advise?

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Monday, August 7, 2006 5:46 PM

HIEI

I'd say go by the DVDs it's the order of the series and it would make it easyer to understand. Besides that there are there episodes that didn't air originally but they put on after the DVDs came out.

"A man of honor, in a den of thieves."

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Monday, August 7, 2006 5:46 PM

FUTUREMRSFILLION

Watch them as they are on the DVD. They made more sense to me that way.

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Monday, August 7, 2006 5:50 PM

NOSADSEVEN

The order on the DVDs is the order Joss intended. FOX screwed around with it... airing the pilot last after already cancelling it. Other eps were switched around, preempted, just royally f-ed up. It's part of why you'll find so much bitterness here towards FOX.

Edited to add: And I envy you the whole series ahead... Do stop in and give your impressions as you go. We like to re-live that kind of thing!
~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Monday, August 7, 2006 5:55 PM

CAUSAL

As far as I'm aware, the only change to the disc order would be "Objects in Space" and THEN "The Message". "The Message" was shot last (and I remember reading somewhere that it was meant to be after OiS (plus there's a line in "The Message" that only makes sense if you watch OiS first). As well, I find "The Message" to be a more satisfying final episode.

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Monday, August 7, 2006 5:59 PM

KANEMAN

I agree with causal

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Monday, August 7, 2006 6:13 PM

WTE

Quote:
plus there's a line in "The Message" that only makes sense if you watch OiS first

Which line is this? I always watch The Message first, so I imagine I keep missing it.

HONKS

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Monday, August 7, 2006 6:18 PM

PURPLEBELLY

I think Whedon finds OiS a satisfying terminal episode because it establishes that River has found her power and is enabled by it - so ends the series on a positive statement. I found Firefly as an overseas broadcast - after cancellation but before spin-offs - and in that context the elegiac quality of The Message made it very poignant as a series finale.

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Monday, August 7, 2006 6:19 PM

NOSADSEVEN

Quote:
Originally posted by Causal:
As far as I'm aware, the only change to the disc order would be "Objects in Space" and THEN "The Message". "The Message" was shot last (and I remember reading somewhere that it was meant to be after OiS (plus there's a line in "The Message" that only makes sense if you watch OiS first). As well, I find "The Message" to be a more satisfying final episode.

Nevertheless, the DVD order is that which Joss wanted for the DVD set (and DVD viewers) (ETA: for the purposes Purplebelly cites above), "mind reading genius" continuity be damned.

~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ain't. We. Just.

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 2:06 AM

CAUSAL

Quote:
Originally posted by nosadseven:
Nevertheless, the DVD order is that which Joss wanted for the DVD set (and DVD viewers) (ETA: for the purposes Purplebelly cites above), "mind reading genius" continuity be damned.

Right. Because let's all be slavishly devoted to every little thing that Joss Whedon does. I'm talking series continuity and emotional satisfaction, and could really not care less about the order in which they appear on the DVD.

________________________________________________________________________
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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 2:14 AM

DESKTOPHIPPIE

*is slavishly devoted to every little thing Joss Whedon does*

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 4:58 AM

CYBERSNARK

Way I heard it, Joss switched around OiS and The Message only because the series was cancelled --he wanted the now-truncated series to have a self-contained arc. Thus, he ended with OiS, spotlighting River's development.

If the show had gone on, The Message would be placed after OiS, probably touching off the next "arc" of series (which, judging by "Dead or Alive," would've focused on the war coming back to haunt Mal).

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We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 5:28 AM

EMBERS

Quote:
Originally posted by Causal:
let's all be slavishly devoted to every little thing that Joss Whedon does. I'm talking series continuity and emotional satisfaction, and could really not care less about the order in which they appear on the DVD.

well I think it depends upone what gives you emotional satisfaction...
I believe that Joss said he picked 'OiS' for the last because he liked that it ended at a rest point, family formed and had a kind of emotional closure.

Obviously some people may disagree with that...
personally I find 'the Message' (ending with the funeral') to be kind of depressing - it doesn't help to know that the actors knew it was the end and their little family was breaking up.

And I don't think that agreeing w/Joss' POV is necessarily slavish,

**********************************************
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http://www.cafepress.com/embersartwork

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 5:53 AM

DARKFLY

Has to be the DVD order because the way FOX did it confused people and wasn't the Joss intended it to be.

----------------------------------------------------

Go to http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697 for more info!

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 6:54 AM

NOSADSEVEN

Quote:
Originally posted by Causal:
Quote:
Originally posted by nosadseven:
Nevertheless, the DVD order is that which Joss wanted for the DVD set (and DVD viewers) (ETA: for the purposes Purplebelly cites above), "mind reading genius" continuity be damned.

Right. Because let's all be slavishly devoted to every little thing that Joss Whedon does. I'm talking series continuity and emotional satisfaction, and could really not care less about the order in which they appear on the DVD.

That is your opinion, and I have no problem with it. I was simply presenting Joss's opinion. I can't help that it stays relevant.

I only replied to your previous post because it left the impression (likely unintentionally) that the DVD order was screwed around with by executives as the airing had been, and that the order was an error. I simply wanted to point out that it was a creative decision (albeit based on circumstances), as that would be pertinent information to anyone deciding what order to watch them in, as the original poster is.

~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ain't. We. Just.

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 8:52 AM

MDERKA

Thanks to all for your insight...didn't mean to start such a heated debate. I will continue to watch as the DVDs are laid out and will see when I get to the end about the final two episodes. I'm getting through about 2 episodes a night, but with Red Sox games on its a little tough (day game Sunday and day off yesterday allowed more watching of Firefly).

When all is through I will give you guys my opinion, but so far I think its great and am sorry I've been in the dark about this for the last 4 years.

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 8:56 AM

DESKTOPHIPPIE

This ain't heated. It's just midly warm

We're a passionate crowd here, and we like a good argument. Keeps us busy. I'm looking forward to hearing your thoughts on the show. What a joy it would be to see it for the first time again...

More signatures available at http://desktophippie.googlepages.com

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 9:47 AM

YINYANG

You were busy trying to get yourself lit on fire. It happens.

Quote:
This ain't heated. It's just midly warm

DesktopHippie is right. Heated is when people scream at each other that they're stupid, or infidels, and that they will burn in Hell. This is just child's play compared to that.

Oh, and I never noticed that "mind-reading genius line;" maybe I'll watch The Message last next time around, just to see how I like it.

---

Go to http://richlabonte.net/tvvote/ and vote Firefly!

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 10:05 AM

WHIMSICALNBRAINPAN

Go by the disc order. Fox really screwed by airing the show in the order they did.

"Well, here I am." http://whimsicalnbrainpan.blogspot.com/

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 10:06 AM

PURPLEBELLY

Not to give advice, but just offer my experience: being outside the US before the DVD publication, I had to pick up the episodes on Usenet ordered any-which-way. After the dozenth viewing, you quite forget the order in which you originally saw them

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 10:48 AM

ECGORDON

There's no place I can be since I found Serenity.

I think the continuity complaint between Objects in Space and The Message has been exagerrated. Yes, The Message was filmed later, but Jayne's line about "mind reading genius" does not have to refer back to what happened in OiS. From very early in the series there were numerable occasions when various crew members should have started thinking that River was a bit psychic.

In Bushwhacked, she talkes about "following the voices" when Simon asked why she was on the other ship.

In Shindig, she picks up on Badger's accent and the fact he was from Dyton Colony, and that he probably had spent less time in jail than he claimed.

Does anyone think that no one ever questioned Simon about why the hill folk were going to burn her at the stake? Just because something might have happened off screen does not mean we have to assume it never happened.

Jayne himself had to start wondering about her in "Ariel" when she made it known when the Hands of Blue men had arrived.

These are just a few examples, and I'm sure I could list others if I bothered to think about it longer.

It is my opinion Joss chose the dvd order because he had no assurance he would get another chance to tell anymore stories in the 'verse. OiS is a more satisfying end thematically, again IMO. And now that we know it was not the end, it made a better segue to the BDM since River was the major focus of both.

wo men ren ran zai fei xing.

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 11:57 AM

JOSSISAGOD

As I've heard it, the order on the DVDs is the order Joss wanted the episodes shown, of course, the Browncoats that watched them when that dumb@$$ company that is no longer named originally aired them saw them messed with. My point is this; watch the episodes the way they are listed on the DVD (NOT by the air dates!)and you'll have seen them in the correct order.

Edit: And Welcome to the 'Verse!
JOSSIS(Most Definitely)AGOD

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 12:18 PM

JOSSISAGOD

Quote:
Originally posted by yinyang:
Oh, and I never noticed that "mind-reading genius line;" maybe I'll watch The Message last next time around, just to see how I like it.

The "Mind readin' genius..." line makes more sense to me if I watch The Message last. But, that's just me.

JOSSIS(Most Definitely)AGOD

Self appointed Forsaken! Been on the list for a while now!

98% of teens have smoked pot, if you are one of the 2% that haven't, copy this into your signature.
"Look at me, I'm STUPID!" The Doctor.

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 5:05 PM

SPODWO

I just watched them all for the first time this last weekend after seeing "Serenity" the movie on Satellite. In retrospect - I did find OIS to be more of a fitting placement at the end of the DVD set. I don't think of the DVD set as the end of the story since "Serenity" the movie comes into play. I find the ship board life and the "planet" in hand to be more symbolic of hope and the crew settling in ready for the next adventure...which invariably does come.

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 6:37 PM

YINYANG

You were busy trying to get yourself lit on fire. It happens.

Quote:
In Shindig, she picks up on Badger's accent and the fact he was from Dyton Colony, and that he probably had spent less time in jail than he claimed.

Wasn't it Titan Colony? Or were my captions just wrong?

Sorry to be nitpicky!

---

Go to http://richlabonte.net/tvvote/ and vote Firefly!

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 6:59 PM

JUTIN

I don't get the fact that The Message should be viewed after Objects In Space... River had told Simon that Jayne snitched on them on Ariel... is "I can kill you with my brian" scene in one of the final two episodes?

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 7:41 PM

ECGORDON

There's no place I can be since I found Serenity.

Quote:
Originally posted by yinyang:
Quote:
In Shindig, she picks up on Badger's accent and the fact he was from Dyton Colony, and that he probably had spent less time in jail than he claimed.

Wasn't it Titan Colony? Or were my captions just wrong?

Sorry to be nitpicky!

---

Go to http://richlabonte.net/tvvote/ and vote Firefly!

The dvd captions are wrong. It was Dyton Colony in the original script - http://average-bear.com/firefly/103.html

wo men ren ran zai fei xing.

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Tuesday, August 8, 2006 8:06 PM

NOSADSEVEN

Quote:
Originally posted by ecgordon:
Quote:
Originally posted by yinyang:
Wasn't it Titan Colony? Or were my captions just wrong?

The dvd captions are wrong. It was Dyton Colony in the original script - http://average-bear.com/firefly/103.html

And of course, that's a whole 'nother thread...

"You're a rabbit, Mal!"

~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ain't. We. Just.

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Wednesday, August 9, 2006 7:20 AM

KINGOFALLLONDINUM

New to the forum here. And again, let me say what a great site this is. Very cool to interact with some other fans.

I've thought about the order too. And I've always wondered why The Message was shot last, but wasn't the last episode on the DVD set.

And totally see why Jayne's line about mind reading genius in The Message makes more sense coming after Objects in Space.

IMO though, the order of the DVD's works best.

The Message comes right after Trash and that works because at the start of The Message, Mal is having trouble unloading the Lassiter. Which they just stole in Trash. It also refers to Inara's involvement in the Trash caper.

Another point is Heart of Gold ends with Inara saying she is leaving. Well, the start of OIS picks up on that withe her and Mal discussing it.

Of course, it could be that the end of OIS has made Inara decide not to leave as she feels more a part of "the family" and the opening of the Message works because she has decided to stay.

I don't know. I can see it either way. But for me it just works better that these things are picked up on immediately.

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Wednesday, August 9, 2006 8:19 AM

RIMGIRL

As a new recruit, I watched the episodes in DVD order and then the movie. I, too, thought that the Message made a better final episode (see thread "What scene made you fall in love?"). However, I see Joss' point in the commentary of OiS, that he liked the long tracking shot that establishes the linkages between the Firefly community after so much dissent in earlier episodes.

I just found the final cut on Jubal Early to be quite disturbing for the very last of the show, especially compared to the lovely freeze on Mal in Message.

Still, I also agree with a previous poster; I've watched all of them so many times in all sorts of orders that ultimately it makes no difference. And I'm so glad that Browncoats can disagree without it becoming personal or flamey.
____________________________________

You're on my crew. Why are we still talking about this?

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Wednesday, August 9, 2006 8:23 AM

ECGORDON

There's no place I can be since I found Serenity.

Quote:
And I'm so glad that Browncoats can disagree without it becoming personal or flamey.

Obviously, you never visit the Real World Event Discussion forum.

wo men ren ran zai fei xing.

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Wednesday, August 9, 2006 8:29 AM

ALLISA

I would have to say that after River tells him she can "kill him with her brain" which I believe was in Trash (? correct me if I'm wrong please) Jayne might finally have caught a clue lol

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Thursday, August 10, 2006 9:14 AM

CYBERSNARK

Personally, I kinda like the idea that Jayne figured out River's secret, but nobody paid any attention to him just 'cause. . . well, he's Jayne.

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We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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