FFF.NET 2.0

The warm tones of FFF.NET 2.0

POSTED BY: HAKEN
UPDATED: Tuesday, July 31, 2012 03:12
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 9590
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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 1:44 AM

HAKEN

Likes to mess with stuffs.


Not exactly an update in terms of adding functions to the site, but I think it's worthwhile to point out that the colors of FFF.NET 2.0 will be different and more in line with the color palette of the 'Firefly' series itself.

Have a look.

http://beta.fireflyfans.net

Haken

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 1:55 AM

ECGORDON

There's no place I can be since I found Serenity.


Ooooh! Look at all the pretties.




wo men ren ran zai fei xing.

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 3:32 AM

SISTER


Haken; it looks fan(heh, heh)tastic!! Thank you so much for your hard work! LOVE the colors.

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 4:47 AM

PLATONIST


Warm and homey, like Firefly:)

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 5:17 AM

BYTEMITE


Ooh, yeah, that's nice looking.

Really the only thing I'd want is if some of black frames (are they frames, or is something else used? Anyway) were a paler colour. Black is kind of obvious for the workplace browsing, but I know some people like the black, so I wouldn't push for it.

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 7:19 AM

WINDIE


I like it............



Why have they taken the sky from ME

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 7:50 AM

ZEEK


Looks good to me. Thanks for all your hard work.

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 7:54 AM

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT


Looks pretty.

Is there a timeline for implementation? Soon? Little while? Long time?
Last I heard , you were gonna rebuild all ( or a lot, anyway.) of the code. Is that going to take a lot of time?

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 8:21 AM

SUASOR


Sweet!

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 8:40 AM

OUT2THEBLACK


Call me a traditionalist , but I like the old , cold BLACK...

I always felt that the colder colors of FFF.net were a good contrast for the cast/series photos from Firefly...

Not sure my oldish eyes can make the adjustment . That's a lot to ask , all at once...

Appreciate all your efforts , though , for keeping us flying !

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 8:56 AM

RAHLMACLAREN

"Damn yokels, can't even tell a transport ship ain't got no guns on it." - Jayne Cobb


I vote blue.

Blue is more calming, and I need calm if I'm going to be posting where possibly thousands of people are going to see it.

Also, I see myself hanging out more on the bridge than in the engine room.



--------------------------------------------------
Find here the Serenity you seek. -Tara Maclay

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 9:02 AM

HAKEN

Likes to mess with stuffs.


Quote:

Originally posted by out2theblack:
Call me a traditionalist , but I like the old , cold BLACK...

I always felt that the colder colors of FFF.net were a good contrast for the cast/series photos from Firefly...



I was inspired to make the change after re-watching the extras on the Firefly DVDs. There's a segment in there about the warm tones of Serenity and how they go from the warmness of the engine room to the coolness of the cockpit as one moves from one end of Serenity to the other.

While the blue has served the site well, I always felt the color was more Alliance than Serenity.

In terms of the dark background, I'll likely keep it that way. It's a personal preference since I like dark sites (also known nowadays as green sites).

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 3:36 PM

MAL4PREZ


My first thought on opening this thread: No! Don't change the colors! Then I saw it. mmmm. nice.

I do like the blue, but it's soothing to be in the nice warm firefly colors.

-----------------------------------------------
hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 5:16 PM

THATWEIRDGIRL


I get it. I like it.

Thanks for all your hard work, Haken.

---
Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?" Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
-- Charlie Brown
www.thatcostumegirl.com
www.thatweirdgirl.com

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 6:48 PM

SIGMANUNKI


Regarding the colour, I would go more brownish. Seems a little too red to me.


But, I have a suggestion about the new site. This site has run into performance problems before, mainly involving the DB. So, what I would suggest is to have two DBs. One being for active discussions defined as the top 100 threads in its category. The other DB is for the archive. So, once nightly, all the oldest threads get moved into the archive where no new posts are allowed.

The drawback is that there will be a few seconds of downtime nightly. The benefit is that the DB the site is running on (for active discussions) stays extremely small and as such, *much* faster. Thus, much more cycles available for actually running the site. There is also the side benefit that long old threads don't get brought up again. So, there will be some bandwidth savings as well. Etc.

At any rate, I think that if this site is still around in 10 years, the added performance would *far* out weigh the added development time.

----
I am on The Original List (twice). We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"

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Wednesday, January 20, 2010 2:01 AM

AVERYFINECOMPANION


Pretty!!

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Wednesday, January 20, 2010 2:14 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



Wow! It's like comin in from out in the black to a warm, cozy galley.

Mmmm... wife soup!





The T.Rex they call JANE!


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Wednesday, January 20, 2010 3:08 AM

TWO

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


beta.fireflyfans.net ought to be using the picture of the more highly evolved 2.0 Serenity. For a redesigned site, that would be better than the earliest, 1.0 version, now at the top of the page. To illustrate the difference, a picture...


This is what I mean:


Versus this:


I like this one with Serenity on the ground, with an outdoor bar on the right and freight on the left.
http://janjygiggins.deviantart.com/art/Serenity-Final-135787020


The Joss Whedon script for "Serenity", where Wash lives, is
Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/two

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Wednesday, January 20, 2010 4:15 AM

PHOENIXROSE

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.


Quote:

Originally posted by SigmaNunki:
Regarding the colour, I would go more brownish. Seems a little too red to me.


I agree on this. I do like the warmth.


Quote:

So, once nightly, all the oldest threads get moved into the archive where no new posts are allowed.

That would shut discussion down faster than full burn...

[/sig]

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Wednesday, January 20, 2010 4:30 AM

PIZMOBEACH

... fully loaded, safety off...


Quote:

Originally posted by RahlMaclaren:
I vote blue.

Blue is more calming, and I need calm if I'm going to be posting where possibly thousands of people are going to see it.

Also, I see myself hanging out more on the bridge than in the engine room.



I agree on all points. No other forum looks like this one, she's a beauty. Harden security and she'll run for years to come.

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.com

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Wednesday, January 20, 2010 6:06 PM

SIGMANUNKI


Quote:

Originally posted by PhoenixRose:

Quote:

So, once nightly, all the oldest threads get moved into the archive where no new posts are allowed.


That would shut discussion down faster than full burn...




No it wouldn't. Perhaps I didn't explain properly. The top 100 threads in each category would stay active. It's the rest that would be moved daily. So, if you clicked on 'General Discussions' (or any other category), then you would see, and be able to post in, 100 threads. Throughout the day, as people create new threads, there would be over 100 in the list. But, after the move, that number would be trimmed back to 100.

Now, if we consider how long it takes for a thread to get bumped off the top 100 in any given category, it would hardly "hut discussion down faster than full burn".

----
I am on The Original List (twice). We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"

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Wednesday, January 20, 2010 6:17 PM

TUJIAOZUO


Love the new pallet

Your Indian Pirate Lord,
Ash

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Wednesday, January 20, 2010 11:08 PM

HAKEN

Likes to mess with stuffs.


Quote:

Originally posted by two:
beta.fireflyfans.net ought to be using the picture of the more highly evolved 2.0 Serenity.



Yeah, looks great. The one I made was just something fast I came up with as a placeholder. I'm thinking that once the site is up and running, I'll just have several banners--possibly made by some of you--appear randomly.


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Thursday, January 21, 2010 12:15 AM

HAKEN

Likes to mess with stuffs.


Quote:

Originally posted by SigmaNunki:
But, I have a suggestion about the new site. This site has run into performance problems before, mainly involving the DB. So, what I would suggest is to have two DBs. One being for active discussions defined as the top 100 threads in its category. The other DB is for the archive.



Not that it's not a good idea, but the current DB is on a SQL server. If I were to archive, it would simply be to another table in the same database, and there would be little or no downtime associated with performing the task. In terms of performance, it's not going to be too noticeable. We will see though, once we switch over to the new version.





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Thursday, January 21, 2010 4:01 AM

COZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by Haken: We will see though, once we switch over to the new version.



Just wondering: it appears that much, if not all of the posts to this site from 2005 and back are gone. For those of us with the occasional inclination to the nostalgic, are you planning to resurrect the entirety of the DB on the new site? In other words, have you a plan for a complete FFFn archive?

It's not a deal-breaker or anything like that. Simply curious is all.

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Thursday, January 21, 2010 5:41 AM

SAB39


Quote:

Originally posted by two:
I like this one with Serenity on the ground, with an outdoor bar on the right and freight on the left.
http://janjygiggins.deviantart.com/art/Serenity-Final-135787020


Those are really pretty. I wish someone would put together a Serenity persona for Firefox 3.6 that comes out today. There are a couple already up - one with the logo on a black background and one with the cast - but neither really work very well in practice, because too much of the image is below the point that it's hidden by the browser tabs.

I'd love to be able to show off my browncoatiness every time I have a browser window open :)


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Thursday, January 21, 2010 6:52 AM

JAKE7


I'll miss the blue (but just because it's my favorite color)...however, I do like the look of the new site! Great job, Haken!

--------------
MAL: Everybody's makin' a fuss.
***********
"They just float out there, sending out raver breeding parties..."

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Thursday, January 21, 2010 11:08 AM

TWO

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by Haken:
Quote:

Originally posted by two:
beta.fireflyfans.net ought to be using the picture of the more highly evolved 2.0 Serenity.



Yeah, looks great. The one I made was just something fast I came up with as a placeholder. I'm thinking that once the site is up and running, I'll just have several banners--possibly made by some of you--appear randomly.


Four 1300×180 banners, same size as serenityback.jpg of beta.fireflyfans.net








Serenity 2.0
Right click the little box and "open image in a new tab" or "view image". You'll be redirected to a download page. I don't want to clutter this thread with a super wide image no one wants to see.


The Joss Whedon script for "Serenity", where Wash lives, is
Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/two

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Friday, January 22, 2010 6:23 AM

HAKEN

Likes to mess with stuffs.


Quote:

Originally posted by cozen:
Just wondering: it appears that much, if not all of the posts to this site from 2005 and back are gone.



They are still there. All 750,000+ posts and 40,000+ threads. I have posts going as far back as 2002. It's just that there's no easy way to get to them other than to randomly punch in thread numbers in the query string. Hopefully with the new version I'll have archival links that will at least get you in the ballpark of within a month of where you want to be.

Here's a random thread from way back when: http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=2&t=900




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Tuesday, January 26, 2010 7:21 PM

SIGMANUNKI


Quote:

Originally posted by Haken:

Not that it's not a good idea, but the current DB is on a SQL server. If I were to archive, it would simply be to another table in the same database, and there would be little or no downtime associated with performing the task. In terms of performance, it's not going to be too noticeable. We will see though, once we switch over to the new version.




Ah. I have a MySQL mindset. So, with that, having something in a separate DB, even on the same server, would mean a great deal in terms of performance. Shame really.

----
I am on The Original List (twice). We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"

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Tuesday, January 26, 2010 9:52 PM

HAKEN

Likes to mess with stuffs.


Quote:

Originally posted by SigmaNunki:
Ah. I have a MySQL mindset. So, with that, having something in a separate DB, even on the same server, would mean a great deal in terms of performance. Shame really.



I don't know if I would call it a shame to not do it. From a support standpoint, it's really more of a hassle for the minuscule amount of performance gain.

If I had the hardware resources, I would much rather go the clustering route, but FFF.NET can't sustain that financially at the moment.


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Tuesday, January 26, 2010 11:45 PM

MOOSE


Meh. I prefer the original colors.


But, I'm old and resistant to change...



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Sunday, January 31, 2010 1:30 AM

HAKEN

Likes to mess with stuffs.


Quote:

Originally posted by two:
Serenity 2.0
Right click the little box and "open image in a new tab" or "view image". You'll be redirected to a download page. I don't want to clutter this thread with a super wide image no one wants to see.



Hey, they look great on the beta site and changes every minute. The fireflyfans.net wording works better on the left than on the right due to the fluid layout of the site, so future ones should be on the left.

Other than that, if you want, you can sign it so that you get credit for the work. Use a smaller font and place it at lower left hand corner of the banner.

For anyone else interested in designing banners for FFF.NET 2.0, these are the specs:

1300x180 pixels
Should contain graphics related to Firefly.
"fireflyfans.net" wording on left side using papyrus font or something similar.
Credit yourself in smaller fonts at lower left corner of banner. Use "banner by your_name/handle" or similar wording.

Thanks for your hard work,
Haken

P.S. For those who missed the news, work on FFF.NET 2.0 ongoing. Here is the URL if you're interested in seeing how things are coming along.

http://beta.fireflyfans.net


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Sunday, January 31, 2010 2:47 PM

REDLAVA


It looks AWESOME!!!

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Sunday, January 31, 2010 9:33 PM

SIGMANUNKI


Quote:

Originally posted by Haken:

I don't know if I would call it a shame to not do it. From a support standpoint, it's really more of a hassle for the minuscule amount of performance gain.



With respect, it would take, at most, a couple hours to implement. That's hardly a lot of time, especially considering the total time to rewrite the site. Also, if one considers the difference in time to sort through a couple thousand records verses a million or more (we are talking another 10 years, yes), then the performance gained is hardly going to be "minuscule". Another site that does this is fairly well known i.e. Slashdot.

The real question here is not, would it improve performance, because that is clearly a yes. It's rather, would that improved performance matter?

If the site's traffic remains the same, I doubt that it will. But, that's not a "worse case." Say another movie (or something else) happens that would drive traffic here like the BDM. It's likely that the new site will suffer the same fate as this when the BDM came out (it will fall over).

Remember, in the software world things get slower, not faster. It just seems the opposite because the increase in G/CPU power is much faster than the increasing inefficiency of programmers. So, if you're keeping it on the same hardware...

At any rate, just pointing out something that would improve the site's performance. It's clearly up to you whether you think it'll matter enough to implement.

----
I am on The Original List (twice). We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"

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Friday, February 5, 2010 7:21 AM

TWO

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


A pair of banners for "Haken" to consider for http://beta.fireflyfans.net

Out in the Open by David Metlesits http://davemetlesits.deviantart.com/art/Out-in-the-open-152295764


Serenity - Coming Storm by Jacob Charles Dietz http://jacobcharlesdietz.deviantart.com/art/Serenity-Coming-Storm-1097
25926




The Joss Whedon script for "Serenity", where Wash lives, is
Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/two

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Friday, February 5, 2010 8:18 AM

SAB39


Quote:

Originally posted by SigmaNunki:
The real question here is not, would it improve performance, because that is clearly a yes.


That sounds like it should be intuitively true but it really isn't with a decent database system. The problem is that too many people are under the illusion that MySQL is a decent database system... including Slashdot.

If you have a decent database system and well-chosen indexes on your tables, there's no need to "sort through" anything to get the most recent posts, because they're organized correctly to begin with. If performance can be improved by putting stuff in a different file then *the database server does that for you transparently behind the scenes*. If you have to do extra work to migrate data back and forth, that can *hurt* performance just as easily as help it.

I work with SQL server and it does a decent job of this even with pretty big tables. Admittedly I don't think I have anything with as many records as FFF would have, but on the other hand I have done some pretty insane joins over tables with hundreds of thousands of rows and they work okay.

In my experience, the better way to get decent performance is to have a really really fast connection between webserver and database, and some in-memory caching of the results of recently-used queries.


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Wednesday, February 10, 2010 7:52 AM

TWO

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by Haken:
For anyone else interested in designing banners for FFF.NET 2.0, these are the specs:

1300x180 pixels
Should contain graphics related to Firefly.
"fireflyfans.net" wording on left side using papyrus font or something similar.
Credit yourself in smaller fonts at lower left[sic] RIGHT corner of banner. Use "banner by your_name/handle" or similar wording.

P.S. For those who missed the news, work on FFF.NET 2.0 ongoing. Here is the URL if you're interested in seeing how things are coming along.

http://beta.fireflyfans.net

The first banner is brand new. The next two are already used by http://beta.fireflyfans.net
The name of the model builder has been added in the lower right-hand corner. And the files are half the size of before.

Serenity by Simon “Digger2000” http://digger2000.deviantart.com/art/Serenity-106767557


Serenity, Big by Sean Patrick Kennedy Ser_big_3600x2450.jpg at www.seansgallery.com/newpics/


Serenity, Huge by Sean Patrick Kennedy serenityhuge2.jpg at www.seansgallery.com/newpics/


Serenity by Philip Boyes http://janjygiggins.deviantart.com/art/Serenity-Final-135787020


The Joss Whedon script for "Serenity", where Wash lives, is
Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/two

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Monday, February 15, 2010 3:45 AM

TWO

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by Haken:
For anyone else interested in designing banners for FFF.NET 2.0, these are the specs:

1300x180 pixels
Should contain graphics related to Firefly.
"fireflyfans.net" wording on left side using papyrus font or something similar.
Credit yourself in smaller fonts at lower left[sic] RIGHT corner of banner. Use "banner by your_name/handle" or similar wording.

P.S. For those who missed the news, work on FFF.NET 2.0 ongoing. Here is the URL if you're interested in seeing how things are coming along.

http://beta.fireflyfans.net

Beta banner made from Kristèle Pelland's "Big Damn Heroes" http://kristele.deviantart.com/gallery/#Everything-Joss-Whedon


The Joss Whedon script for "Serenity", where Wash lives, is
Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/two

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Thursday, February 18, 2010 4:24 PM

TRAVELER


Will probably go into culture shock when this goes on line, but will recover. Looks great.


http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=28764731
Traveler

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Friday, February 19, 2010 12:02 AM

SIGMANUNKI


Quote:

Originally posted by sab39:
Quote:

Originally posted by SigmaNunki:
The real question here is not, would it improve performance, because that is clearly a yes.



That sounds like it should be intuitively true but it really isn't with a decent database system. The problem is that too many people are under the illusion that MySQL is a decent database system... including Slashdot.




Right now, according to Haken, FFF.net has 3/4 of a million records. To think that accessing that, even with good indices, will take a good chunk of time longer than a DB with a couple thousand is pretty far out there.

Every DB has its critical number of records before it starts to slow down. MySQL is in the single digit millions (last time I checked, which was a while ago... and I forget which DB type it was...). Also, just lumping MySQL in one heap is somewhat dishonest as it has several different DB types.


Quote:

Originally posted by sab39:

If performance can be improved by putting stuff in a different file then *the database server does that for you transparently behind the scenes*. If you have to do extra work to migrate data back and forth, that can *hurt* performance just as easily as help it.




I said exactly nothing about moving stuff "back and forth." I suggest you re-read my post.


Quote:

Originally posted by sab39:

I work with SQL server and it does a decent job of this even with pretty big tables. Admittedly I don't think I have anything with as many records as FFF would have, but on the other hand I have done some pretty insane joins over tables with hundreds of thousands of rows and they work okay.




Haken has said recently that his SQL server was having problems with SELECT. So, things aren't running as smoothly as you think they are. In fact, SQL server has regularly been the source of problems here e.g. it couldn't handle the number of requests.

He also mentioned that he is going to throw better hardware at the problem when he gets the chance. I'd prefer a more elegant solution. But, that's just me and this ain't my site.


Quote:

Originally posted by sab39:

In my experience, the better way to get decent performance is to have a really really fast connection between webserver and database, and some in-memory caching of the results of recently-used queries.




As I recall, Haken mentioned that the DB and web server are on the same box. And even if they aren't, he's also stated that the site is run on older hardware. I don't know how much older (I still have a P166 lying around), but it's older.

I think you're forgetting that this is a home project and not a work one. Resources tend to not be as readily available at home.

----
I am on The Original List (twice). We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"

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Friday, February 19, 2010 12:31 PM

THESOMNAMBULIST


Brilliant work HAKEN. I think you're right to reflect the source material. It's harmonious. I never had issues with the old look particularly, but this is a great new angle.

Thanks


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Wednesday, April 21, 2010 2:07 AM

DEEPGIRL187


I wasn't sure about things when I first came on (what can I say, I'm a traditionalist ) but the more I look around, the more I like things. I think all the best things about the old site have been preserved here, and the colors really do give one a warm feeling.

**************************************************************************

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Saturday, May 1, 2010 9:32 AM

CLJOHNSTON108


The new site looks fantastic! Truly fits the spirit of the show.
My only concern is that, now that UBB tags are required for URLs, images and video (Hulu tag! Yay!!), are we gonna have to go through all our old posts and add the tags? A daunting task for me, as I'm a Link Whore!
But I love that we'll be able to attach links to text now! Saves so much room!

________________________

"Spry for a dead fella!"

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Saturday, May 1, 2010 10:11 AM

MALSNARA


Love the new colour scheme! I always thought the black and blue was a bit alliance-y. It will probably take me a goodly while to get used to the new layout though!

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Saturday, May 1, 2010 11:42 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Warm and shiny.

RWED MIA?

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Wednesday, May 12, 2010 3:12 AM

TWO

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


More banners for http://beta.fireflyfans.net GO AHEAD AND CLICK to see existing banners.

The Sky by David Metlesits http://davemetlesits.deviantart.com/art/The-sky-162576408



by Maarten Jacobi www.fireflyfans.net/sunroomitem.asp?i=5602


by Maarten Jacobi www.fireflyfans.net/sunroomitem.asp?i=4245


by Maarten Jacobi www.fireflyfans.net/sunroomitem.asp?i=6318


by Maarten Jacobi www.fireflyfans.net/sunroomitem.asp?i=5224

The Joss Whedon script for "Serenity", where Wash lives, is
Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/two

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Wednesday, May 12, 2010 7:42 AM

DMI

Expired, forgotten, spoiled rotten.


Those look absolutely excellent and the third one down matches the color scheme of the beta sight. Well done!

------------------------
I pray for one last landing,
on the globe that gave me birth.
Let me rest my eyes on the fleecy skies
and the cool, green hills of Earth.

http://www.blogiversity.org/blogs/dmi/default.aspx

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Thursday, May 13, 2010 9:38 AM

FLORALBUNNY


All warm and shiny.
And you're using my wallpaper.
Love that galley.


bun

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Sunday, May 16, 2010 8:21 AM

TWO

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Jayne is just too damn tall in a banner from Feb 15th that I made. His head gets cut-off by the “Sign Up | Log In” that is pasted over the upper corner of beta.fireflyfans.net/banners/banner_16.jpg

The original banner:


Below, I have redone that banner and put the shortest crew member in Jayne's place -- River.

The new and improved Beta banner is made from Kristèle Pelland's "Big Damn Heroes" http://kristele.deviantart.com/gallery/#Everything-Joss-Whedon


The Joss Whedon script for "Serenity", where Wash lives, is
Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/two

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