Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
The assistance - while they wait at the border- should come from MEXICO. And if MEXICO doesn't want to provide them with temporary shelter, maybe they should have turned them back at their southern border. But Mexico apparently refuses to take any responsibility, because it prefers to encourage illegal emigration to the USA.

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What? We're not getting any help from Mexico on this??? Wait a sec, you don't suppose that has anything to do with our AssHat in Chief being a complete asshole to the Mexican President do ya? Naw... -GSTRING

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A Mexican Manual for Illegal Migrants Upsets Some in U.S.
The Mexican government drew fire from American advocates of tighter borders on Wednesday for publishing a pamphlet that instructs migrants how to safely enter the United States illegally and live there without being detected.

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Mexican president 'indignant' at U.S. deportations
Mexican President Enrique Pena Nieto said he is “indignant” at the United States’ deportation of Mexican migrants and described U.S. lawmakers as demonstrating a “lack of conscience” in failing to pass immigration reform. ["Reform" which would legalize everyone here, of course- SIGNY]

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The Mexican government drew fire from American advocates of tighter borders on Wednesday for publishing a pamphlet that instructs migrants how to safely enter the United States illegally and live there without being detected.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Quote:

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What? We're not getting any help from Mexico on this??? Wait a sec, you don't suppose that has anything to do with our AssHat in Chief being a complete asshole to the Mexican President do ya? Naw... -GSTRING

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Mexico has ALWAYS encouraged illegal emigration. It's been their policy since the 80s, at least. Even illegal immigrants acknowledge this.

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What? We're not getting any help from Mexico on this??? Wait a sec, you don't suppose that has anything to do with our AssHat in Chief being a complete asshole to the Mexican President do ya? Naw... -GSTRING

Mexico has ALWAYS encouraged illegal emigration. It's been their policy since the 80s, at least. Even illegal immigrants acknowledge this.- SIGNY

You dodged my question just like I said! Awesome! =GSTRING

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Quote:

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What? We're not getting any help from Mexico on this??? Wait a sec, you don't suppose that has anything to do with our AssHat in Chief being a complete asshole to the Mexican President do ya? Naw... -GSTRING

Mexico has ALWAYS encouraged illegal emigration. It's been their policy since the 80s, at least. Even illegal immigrants acknowledge this.- SIGNY

You dodged my question just like I said! Awesome! =GSTRING

---

Good grief, are you a mental midget?? Wait, don't answer that one.

The answer, implicit in my response is "NO". It has NOTHING to do with Trump because Mexico has been encouraging illegal emigration into the USA since at least 1990. They were pissed off at Bush, they were pissed off at Obama. Doesn't matter WHO is President, they want to make their poverty and unemployment OUR problem. Dood, you couldn't figure that out??

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Now, you didn't answer MY question, and I've only asked it about a half-dozen times: What is the cause of the poverty which is driving illegal immigration?

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How Mexico behaves toward our country has nothing to do with our president pissing them off?- GSTRING

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Nothing gets past you - I think that's because I really didn't feel like it.- GSTRING

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But a DNA test would sort that out pretty quickly.

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Originally posted by captaincrunch:

Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
The assistance - while they wait at the border- should come from MEXICO. And if MEXICO doesn't want to provide them with temporary shelter, maybe they should have turned them back at their southern border. But Mexico apparently refuses to take any responsibility, because it prefers to encourage illegal emigration to the USA.

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What? We're not getting any help from Mexico on this??? Wait a sec, you don't suppose that has anything to do with our AssHat in Chief being a complete asshole to the Mexican President do ya? Naw...

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Quote:

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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

Quote:

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The Mexican government drew fire from American advocates of tighter borders on Wednesday for publishing a pamphlet that instructs migrants how to safely enter the United States illegally and live there without being detected.

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Sounds a lot like the paperwork that WalMart gives all of its employees with all the steps necessary to set yourself up on government benefits while working there.

As bad as that sounds on one hand, I suppose it could be worse. You could work at K-Mart where they don't even give enough of a shit to tell you how to do it on the other hand.

I got 6 people on food stamps that weren't even aware they qualified when I worked there.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Mara Salvatrucha, also known as MS-13, is an international criminal gang that originated in Los Angeles, California, in the 1980s. The gang later spread to many parts of the continental United States, Canada, Mexico, and Central America, and is active in urban and suburban areas. Most members are of Central American origin, principally El Salvador.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Quote:

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What? We're not getting any help from Mexico on this??? Wait a sec, you don't suppose that has anything to do with our AssHat in Chief being a complete asshole to the Mexican President do ya? Naw... -GSTRING

---

Mexico has ALWAYS encouraged illegal emigration. It's been their policy since the 80s, at least. Even illegal immigrants acknowledge this.

This is from 2005

Quote:

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A Mexican Manual for Illegal Migrants Upsets Some in U.S.
The Mexican government drew fire from American advocates of tighter borders on Wednesday for publishing a pamphlet that instructs migrants how to safely enter the United States illegally and live there without being detected.

---

https://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/06/world/americas/a-mexican-manual-for
-illegal-migrants-upsets-some-in-us.html

This is from 2014

Quote:

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Mexican president 'indignant' at U.S. deportations
Mexican President Enrique Pena Nieto said he is “indignant” at the United States’ deportation of Mexican migrants and described U.S. lawmakers as demonstrating a “lack of conscience” in failing to pass immigration reform. ["Reform" which would legalize everyone here, of course- SIGNY]

---

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mexico-usa/mexican-president-indign
ant-at-u-s-deportations-idUSBREA1Q27H20140227


Good grief, you DO like to jump in in areas where you have no knowledge whatsoever!

Here, why don't you fill in some of those gaps and read this ...
http://picturethis.museumca.org/timeline/reagan-years-1980s/mexican-am
erican-culture/info
and this ...
https://www.thoughtco.com/illegal-immigration-explained-3325416

It might help you figure out what is causing at least some of the poverty down south which is driving illegal immigration.


-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

As long as you insist that everything is the Republicans'/ Democrats' fault, then you fail to grasp the REAL problem with American politics.

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

---

Quote:

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Originally posted by reaverfan:
And the hits just keep coming. Refute this, Nazi apologists:

The Trump administration changed its story on family separation no fewer than 14 times before ending the policy

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2018/06/20/the-trump-ad
ministration-changed-its-story-on-family-separation-no-fewer-than-14-times-before-ending-the-policy/?noredirect=on&utm_source=reddit.com&utm_term=.5b3234bac1fb

Washington Post. Hardly a "liberal rag."

Strange. If Obama's administration had done something so outrageous, you'd be calling for his head on a stick.

Trump does it, and you're STILL fellating him.

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Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
SHINY, where do you live? Do you live in Southern CA? Because I do, along with about 3 million of my favorite illegal aliens, and I can tell you that YES, ILLEGAL ALIENS TAKE AMERICAN JOBS.

What they do ... and believe me, I've had a first-hand view of the process ... is turn low-paid, low-skilled jobs into even LOWER-skilled, LOWER-paid jobs. Nannies who can't speak English to the charges or call 9-1-1 if necessary; construction workers who have no idea how to use anything more complicated than a shovel because... yanno ... English. So we have a bunch of half-assed work done by half-assed people whose only chip they can bring to the table is, yanno .... CHEAP AND EXPLOITABLE! So they drive wages down below what a citizen would accept, a citizen who would do a better job for more money.

These "static" comparisons don't capture the effect that massive numbers of illegal aliens have on an economy. If the person who did the paper REALLY wanted to find out the effect, they would have compared "who did what" between areas where there were a lot of illegal aliens (like here) versus where there are much fewer. But I don't think they wanted to do an honest job, so they did what they did.



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

As long as you insist that everything is the Republicans'/ Democrats' fault, then you fail to grasp the REAL problem with American politics.

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Quote:

---

Originally posted by reaverfan:
And the hits just keep coming. Refute this, Nazi apologists:

The Trump administration changed its story on family separation no fewer than 14 times before ending the policy

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2018/06/20/the-trump-ad
ministration-changed-its-story-on-family-separation-no-fewer-than-14-times-before-ending-the-policy/?noredirect=on&utm_source=reddit.com&utm_term=.5b3234bac1fb

Washington Post. Hardly a "liberal rag."

Strange. If Obama's administration had done something so outrageous, you'd be calling for his head on a stick.

Trump does it, and you're STILL fellating him.

---

You mistake my criticism of you with support of Trump!





-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

As long as you insist that everything is the Republicans'/ Democrats' fault, then you fail to grasp the REAL problem with American politics.

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

---

Quote:

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Originally posted by reaverfan:
Young Immigrants Held in a Virginia Detention Center Say They Were Abused By Guards

http://time.com/5318165/juvenile-immigrants-virginia-detention-abuse-s
henandoah/?utm_source=reddit.com

What is it with Republicans and abusing children? They can't seem to get enough!

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Last night Rachel Maddow finally took a break from her relentless warmongering toward Russia, Syria and North Korea to have a pretend cry about the plight of immigrant children on her hit MSNBC show.

It was arguably the climax of a loud nationwide outcry against a federal policy of separating parents from their children when they are arrested for illegally crossing the border from Mexico into the United States, and the following day President Trump signed an executive order suspending that policy while congress comes up with some less draconian legislation.

And of course the entire thing was phony from top to bottom. The policy Trump's political opponents have been blaming on the current administration was actually bipartisan and several administrations in the making, and as with many US policies simply grew progressively more depraved with each new president. The executive order leaves the debate over many, many immigration issues still unresolved, including the fact that it just means families will now be imprisoned together under Attorney General Jeff Sessions' new "zero tolerance policy", and the fact that thousands of families will still remain separated.

And of course the entire furor only became a mainstream issue because midterm elections are coming up and the "Russia, Russia, Russia" platform of the last year and a half hasn't exactly energized the Democratic party's base. And of course that soulless bitch Maddow, who will cheerfully help inflame tensions between nuclear powers in order to give her ratings a bump, was 100 percent acting throughout the entire scene.

But you know what? I'll take it.

I don't normally comment on US immigration policy. My haters are always whining that I, an Australian, focus so much on American politics, but believe it or not I do have a strict personal code for the sorts of things I do and do not write about. I focus on the US because it is clearly the focal point of the transnational power establishment which uses its military and economic might to bully the rest of the world into supporting omnicidal, ecocidal plutocratic agendas, but as a strong proponent of sovereignty I do try to stay in my area and only write about things which directly or indirectly impact my part of the world. I don't write about local US politics, I stay out of the gun control debate, and I don't tell people in another country what their immigration policy should be. Plus an Australian criticizing any other country for cruel immigration policy would be laughable.

That said, I think I can safely say from within my sovereign boundaries that if the Democratic Party were to spend spend June through November campaigning on immigrants' rights rather than on starting World War 3, the rest of the world will breathe a huge sigh of relief.

Trump-induced amnesia has erased much of the memory of this, but Democrats haven't always been so goddamn terrifying. They've always been phony, and they've always been the other half of America's oligarchic military-industrial complex problem, but before they lost their marbles in 2016 they did at least try to pretend to be vaguely progressive sometimes instead of basing their entire platform on attacking political opponents for trying to get along with Russia or North Korea. A reversion to the way things used to be, when Rachel Maddow was just a garden variety partisan hack instead of a psychotic amalgamation of all the worst aspects of Glenn Beck, Alex Jones and Joseph McCarthy, would be a welcome relief.

Immigration has been an on-again, off-again pet issue of the so-called "Resistance" since Trump took office, but only enough to score a few political points with a cutesy sound byte here and there. Never before has immigration policy reform been so aggressively and urgently shoved through with one voice as it was these last few days, in a way that couldn't possibly be ignored. It was the most galvanized the Democrats have been since 2016, and this, unlike the moronic strategy of fanning the flames of Russia hysteria and warmongering, is something that could actually energize the Democrats' progressive base.

Getting Trump to cave to pressure and sign an executive order is arguably the very first useful thing the "Resistance" has ever accomplished. More advocacy for the human rights of immigrants and less for nuclear war flirtation could help dig the donkey party out of the hole it's in.

Obviously this wouldn't even begin to address the massive, glaring problems that are plaguing the Democratic Party, who just overwhelmingly voted in favor of increased military spending while denying Americans the same basic social services that are accorded to everyone else in every other major country in the world. But hell, if you have a kid who's constantly beating up his sister and tormenting the dog, you want to give him a cuddle and some positive reinforcement when he does something nice for once.

Encouraging the Dems to go back to their pre-Trump levels of immorality and focus on things that human beings can get behind would benefit everyone, and giving them credit where credit is due when they accomplish something decent is probably a good idea. Whatever lures these lunatics away from the war drums and places emphasis on human rights over military violence, I support.

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Quote:

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Originally posted by reaverfan:
Migrant children say they've been forcibly drugged, handcuffed, and abused in US government detention

http://www.businessinsider.com/migrant-children-forcibly-drugged-abuse
d-in-us-government-detention-2018-6?utm_source=reddit.com

Fascists love this stuff. Real Americans don't.

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The complaints don't strictly relate to children who have been separated from their parents at the US border, but shed new light on the government's ability to care for these children.

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Shiloh is among 71 companies that receive funds from the federal government to house and supervise immigrant children deemed unaccompanied minors. ...

Shiloh already had a reputation for mistreating children. In December 2014, [UNDER OBAMA] Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee, D-Houston, called for Shiloh to be shut down, citing reports from the Houston Chronicle of “physical violence, unreasonable and excessive use of physical restraints, administering emergency medications without notice to governmental authorities, and several deaths of minor children while in custody,” she said in a statement.

But the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services [UNDER OBAMA] continued sending children and funds to Shiloh – a total of more than $19 million after the congresswoman called for its closure, according to federal payment records. ...

---

Quote:

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Originally posted by reaverfan:
You're still lying. We already proved you were lying. Why do you keep lying?

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Quote:

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A new report has found that the U.S. government has continued to place undocumented migrant children in shelters operated by private companies that were accused of endangering children over the year, including serious allegations of neglect and sexual and physical abuse. Among the accusations are several startling charges in a lawsuit against one operator of drugging migrant children with heavy antipsychotic medications that made them lethargic, physically incapacitated, and afraid.

Reveal, a publication from the Center for Investigative Reporting, and the Texas Tribune reported Tuesday that in documents for dozens of these private companies contracted to operate youth shelters for migrant children, state inspectors found serious problems with their record of care. But in almost all cases, the federal government continued to renew contracts.

The allegations date back more than a decade. While the recent influx of migrant children as a result of the Trump administration’s zero-tolerance policy has put a further strain on these facilities, increasing the likelihood that more children will be subject to neglect and abuse, the evidence implicates a persistent carelessness by the Health and Human Services Department even under the Obama administration.

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Quote:

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Get the facts before you try to blame everything on Obama (and, never, EVER, on your God, Trump)- HEYSTUPID

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
SHINY, where do you live? Do you live in Southern CA? Because I do, along with about 3 million of my favorite illegal aliens, and I can tell you that YES, ILLEGAL ALIENS TAKE AMERICAN JOBS.

What they do ... and believe me, I've had a first-hand view of the process ... is turn low-paid, low-skilled jobs into even LOWER-skilled, LOWER-paid jobs. Nannies who can't speak English to their charges or call 9-1-1 if necessary; construction workers who have no idea how to use anything more complicated than a shovel because... yanno ... English. So we have a bunch of half-assed work done by half-assed people whose only chip they can bring to the table is, yanno .... CHEAP AND EXPLOITABLE! So they drive wages down below what a citizen would accept, a citizen who would do a better job for more money.

These "static" comparisons don't capture the effect that massive numbers of illegal aliens have on an economy. If the person who did the paper REALLY wanted to find out the effect, they would have compared "who did what" between areas where there were a lot of illegal aliens (like here) versus where there are much fewer. But I don't think they wanted to do an honest job, so they did what they did.

---

Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
SHINY this got buried under REAVERFAN's endless posts about something stupid, but I wanted to make sure you didn't miss it

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Quote:

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Originally posted by HEYSTUPID:
ACLU OBTAINS DOCUMENTS SHOWING WIDESPREAD ABUSE OF CHILD IMMIGRANTS IN U.S. CUSTODY

https://www.aclu.org/news/aclu-obtains-documents-showing-widespread-ab
use-child-immigrants-us-custody

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Quote:

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New Report Is Based on Thousands of Government Documents Obtained Through the Freedom of Information Act That Detail Horrific Stories

The report is based on over 30,000 pages of documents dated between 2009 and 2014

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Quote:

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So HEYSTUPID, who was President then? Do you not even READ your own links?? Seriously, dood, what's up with that?

---

Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Quote:

---

Last night Rachel Maddow finally took a break from her relentless warmongering toward Russia, Syria and North Korea to have a pretend cry about the plight of immigrant children on her hit MSNBC show.

It was arguably the climax of a loud nationwide outcry against a federal policy of separating parents from their children when they are arrested for illegally crossing the border from Mexico into the United States, and the following day President Trump signed an executive order suspending that policy while congress comes up with some less draconian legislation.

And of course the entire thing was phony from top to bottom. The policy Trump's political opponents have been blaming on the current administration was actually bipartisan and several administrations in the making, and as with many US policies simply grew progressively more depraved with each new president. The executive order leaves the debate over many, many immigration issues still unresolved, including the fact that it just means families will now be imprisoned together under Attorney General Jeff Sessions' new "zero tolerance policy", and the fact that thousands of families will still remain separated.

And of course the entire furor only became a mainstream issue because midterm elections are coming up and the "Russia, Russia, Russia" platform of the last year and a half hasn't exactly energized the Democratic party's base. And of course that soulless bitch Maddow, who will cheerfully help inflame tensions between nuclear powers in order to give her ratings a bump, was 100 percent acting throughout the entire scene.

But you know what? I'll take it.

I don't normally comment on US immigration policy. My haters are always whining that I, an Australian, focus so much on American politics, but believe it or not I do have a strict personal code for the sorts of things I do and do not write about. I focus on the US because it is clearly the focal point of the transnational power establishment which uses its military and economic might to bully the rest of the world into supporting omnicidal, ecocidal plutocratic agendas, but as a strong proponent of sovereignty I do try to stay in my area and only write about things which directly or indirectly impact my part of the world. I don't write about local US politics, I stay out of the gun control debate, and I don't tell people in another country what their immigration policy should be. Plus an Australian criticizing any other country for cruel immigration policy would be laughable.

That said, I think I can safely say from within my sovereign boundaries that if the Democratic Party were to spend spend June through November campaigning on immigrants' rights rather than on starting World War 3, the rest of the world will breathe a huge sigh of relief.

Trump-induced amnesia has erased much of the memory of this, but Democrats haven't always been so goddamn terrifying. They've always been phony, and they've always been the other half of America's oligarchic military-industrial complex problem, but before they lost their marbles in 2016 they did at least try to pretend to be vaguely progressive sometimes instead of basing their entire platform on attacking political opponents for trying to get along with Russia or North Korea. A reversion to the way things used to be, when Rachel Maddow was just a garden variety partisan hack instead of a psychotic amalgamation of all the worst aspects of Glenn Beck, Alex Jones and Joseph McCarthy, would be a welcome relief.

Immigration has been an on-again, off-again pet issue of the so-called "Resistance" since Trump took office, but only enough to score a few political points with a cutesy sound byte here and there. Never before has immigration policy reform been so aggressively and urgently shoved through with one voice as it was these last few days, in a way that couldn't possibly be ignored. It was the most galvanized the Democrats have been since 2016, and this, unlike the moronic strategy of fanning the flames of Russia hysteria and warmongering, is something that could actually energize the Democrats' progressive base.

Getting Trump to cave to pressure and sign an executive order is arguably the very first useful thing the "Resistance" has ever accomplished. More advocacy for the human rights of immigrants and less for nuclear war flirtation could help dig the donkey party out of the hole it's in.

Obviously this wouldn't even begin to address the massive, glaring problems that are plaguing the Democratic Party, who just overwhelmingly voted in favor of increased military spending while denying Americans the same basic social services that are accorded to everyone else in every other major country in the world. But hell, if you have a kid who's constantly beating up his sister and tormenting the dog, you want to give him a cuddle and some positive reinforcement when he does something nice for once.

Encouraging the Dems to go back to their pre-Trump levels of immorality and focus on things that human beings can get behind would benefit everyone, and giving them credit where credit is due when they accomplish something decent is probably a good idea. Whatever lures these lunatics away from the war drums and places emphasis on human rights over military violence, I support.

---

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

As long as you insist that everything is the Republicans'/ Democrats' fault, then you fail to grasp the REAL problem with American politics.

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

---

Quote:

---

In the meantime, do you want to know how I know the whole RUSSIA!!! topic is going nowhere?

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Quote:

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My god, you guys really CAN be led around by the nose, can't you??? You have the attention span of a goldfish, and that's a insult to goldfish everywhere!

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Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
In the meantime, do you want to know how I know the whole RUSSIA!!! topic is going nowhere?

Because here you all are, spittle flying about separated families under Trump (when Obama actually separated MORE families) exactly when Horowitz is testifying about the FBI and DOJ.

My god, you guys really CAN be led around by the nose, can't you??? You have the attention span of a goldfish, and that's a insult to goldfish everywhere!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

As long as you insist that everything is the Republicans'/ Democrats' fault, then you fail to grasp the REAL problem with American politics.

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

---